Hi, views needed please.

Looking for new U.S. made medium bore, quality, factory rifle. Narrowed it down to the Cooper Custom Classic or the Dakota.

All views are very welcome but experienced owners veiws particularly appriciated.

Thanks,

C.B.Bear

Sir,

I have had the pleasure of enjoying numerous Coopers in Classic, Varmint, Montana Varmint and Varmint extreme in cals between 17 and 30. I have found the fit, finish and accuracy to be excellent. Of the dozen I've owned, all would meet or exceed their accuracy guarantee. I typically buy used at +/- 60% of MSRP. I've not owned Dakotas, but from a price standpoint, (and I stand to be corrected), you will pay 2 to 6 times more for a Dakota than a Cooper. I typically do not buy custom rifles. I've owned numerous factory Weatherby, Kimber, Browning, Remington, Winchester, Savage, Sako and Ruger rifles. For my money, Cooper's are the best value in a factory rifle out there. Especially if you're looking at sub calibers. Also, the custom classic can be had in the model 21,22, 38, 52, 54, and 56, which will take you from 17 ackley hornet to 375 H*H, single shot or repeater.

My favorite of the stock styles is the Jackson Game.


Cooper Model 52, Jackson Game, 25-06

But the Varmint Extremes aren't too shabby either


Cooper, Model 22, Varmint Extreme, 308 Winchester

The Classics and Custom Classics make excellent "carry rifles", or as I tend to call them,"walking varminters"


Cooper model 21 Classic, 20 Tactical


Best

GWB

I've had a Dakota Alpine (classic english walnut stock w/ blind magazine & ebony fore-end tip) 243 since 1991 and I've been very pleased. It is reliable, reasonably light weight, accurate and good looking. Killed a number of antelope, prairie dogs and rock chucks with it. It is not available for sale or trade...

Seems one of each. Thank you for taking the trouble to post the pics Geedubya.

I was thinking the larger medium bore, 280AI, 30/06. The Cooper 56 with good wood, etc. is not a light gun, probably nearly 9lb with a good scope, a good weight for me in these calibres. I want this as my "go to" rifle.

Coopers are cheaper, perhaps the difference is in the action, but I don't need controlled feed for non DRG use. Any one think the Dakota is worth the extra?

Thank you, C.B.Bear.

Suggest you consider Dakota in 9.3x62 or 35
Whelen for a med. bore. With a 9.3 you can hunt most places in Africa too. I have a Dakota African Traveler (takedown) in 416 Rigby. Great Buffalo rifle. Not for sale. Was made before Dakota sold out to "the group" Excellent quality, tack
driver for a bigger bore. Check with Cooper to
see if they will chamber one of these rounds,
they make great rifles also.

Good Shooting

Tetonka
DRSS

The choice would be easy for me. The man in charge of Cooper donated to the Obama campaign so I would never consider buying a Cooper.

now there is a valid reason......I guess we will all resort to riding horses then, because they aren't built by a liberal supporting union.

Anyhow......For calibers up to the model 52 calibers (30-06 base), I wouldn't hesitate to say Cooper. I have not tried the 56 yet (belted mags). I'm not really a fan of belted mags, and am hoping they will bring out a short mag or beltless mag line at least.

Dakota has priced themselves out of the realm of many buyers, especially with the quality of Cooper for the money.

if i were to spend that much i believe i'd go the custom route

quote:

Originally posted by Grumulkin:
The choice would be easy for me. The man in charge of Cooper donated to the Obama campaign so I would never consider buying a Cooper.

He WAS in charge, name was Dan Cooper. He is no longer associated with the commpany, He sold out after he got all of the adverse publicity.

I am a current XCooper dealer, email me if you like for a quote.
Jkob60@msn.com

Jim

I believe the Coopers are more purpose-built for accuracy than the Dakotas, so for a distance rifle in a medium caliber, I'd go with a Cooper. But in large African calibers, the Dakota has "ambiance" of the safari.

I've got a Cooper Jackson Hunter in 25-06. Its everything Cooper says it is. However, the safety is small, and for me hard to operate under stress with gloves. I have to know the shot is coming. The only other thing I don't like about it, is the magazine feed. Never had problems with it, just prefer floorplates. These are personal quirks, and may mean nothing to you. Cooper makes a damn fine rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim Kobe:
He WAS in charge, name was Dan Cooper. He is no longer associated with the commpany, He sold out after he got all of the adverse publicity.

So you really believe he is no longer in charge?

I don't.

quote:

Originally posted by Ken Cline:
now there is a valid reason......I guess we will all resort to riding horses then, because they aren't built by a liberal supporting union.

I would agree with you in part. Sometimes you don't have a choice. When I do have a choice I don't patronize persons/companies/organizations that aren't pro Second Amendment.

The reason I would never buy a vehicle from one local Chevrolet dealers is his no concealed weapons sign on the door.

Grumulkin,
I had hoped that this thread would not devolve, but I see my hope was in vain.
So, with respect, here is a repost .......


From time to time this same topic comes up.

I have posted a version of what I am typing several times over the last couple of years.

I am about as conservative in my politics, world view and religion as a fellow can get.

When all this broke several years ago I sent an e-mail to Dan Cooper personally as well as to the company and followed up with phone calls telling them how disappointed I was that Dan was supporting Obama. I have never bought a new Cooper and probably never will. However, I'm 59 and have never bought a new car. For me it is a matter of economics. I like to buy first class top quality items at good value.

Now having said that, rifles are inanimate objects. They are neither good nor evil.
If I buy one from another American citizen, it is a used rifle. Even if it bears the name Cooper, it puts no $ in Dan Cooper's pocket (should he still be involved with the company).

Another thought that I have expressed numerous times. Think back over the last century. Our country has been involved in wars and conflicts with Germany, Italy, USSR, China Japan, Korea, in which American service men and women have been killed. What was it, something like 18 of the hijackers on the planes on 9/11 were Saudis.
How many of the guys here that will berate you for buying a Cooper have never used petroleum products refined from Saudi crude. Wonder if any of them buy any electronics or autos made in China or Japan, any cars, optics or crystal made in Germany or Austria. For that matter if you purchase any thing that originates from any of the aforementioned former adversaries you are directly contributing to the economies of countries that have been responsible for the loss of many more Americans lives than Dan Cooper.
I say to single out a rifle such as a Cooper for such opprobrium is hypocritical.
Do what you want. Don't buy a Cooper, that leaves more for me!

Best
GWB



Some of my Coopers, all bought at +/- 60% of retail from a US citizen/gunowner.

I have a Dakota 76 in 7 Rem Mag. It works well & I am happy to own it..I bought it used but VG condition at a fair price.

quote:

Originally posted by Geedubya:

Another thought that I have expressed numerous times. Think back over the last century. Our country has been involved in wars and conflicts with Germany, Italy, USSR, China Japan, Korea, in which American service men and women have been killed. What was it, something like 18 of the hijackers on the planes on 9/11 were Saudis.
How many of the guys here that will berate you for buying a Cooper have never used petroleum products refined from Saudi crude. Wonder if any of them buy any electronics or autos made in China or Japan, any cars, optics or crystal made in Germany or Austria. For that matter if you purchase any thing that originates from any of the aforementioned former adversaries you are directly contributing to the economies of countries that have been responsible for the loss of many more Americans lives than Dan Cooper.
I say to single out a rifle such as a Cooper for such opprobrium is hypocritical.
Do what you want. Don't buy a Cooper, that leaves more for me!

Best
GWB

Respectfully I disagree with your assertion. There is worlds of difference between the actions of Saudi born terrorists and the actions of the government and businesses of Saudi Arabia. Same with German, Japan, China etc.

Dan Cooper at least at the time of his "transgression" WAS Cooper Firearms. It's not clear that he really is fully disassociated from them. Also he is/was a gun owning American citizen whose source of income is derived from the very people under attack by the Obama administration.

I do agree with your thoughts on used Coopers.

You really have to wonder; what possible benefit did Dan Cooper think could come from his actions?

Howard,
I hear ya', and thanks for the tone of your reply.


Like you, I also wondered what he was thinking. Many times, even as an adult I don't always think through to the ultimate consequences of my actions. Dan Cooper may be a liberal. He may suffer from white guilt. Some folks that are good business folk don't think in terms of politics or religion. He probably did not consider the shitstorm that would envelop.

IIRC, he made the contributions in his name, not in the name of Cooper Arms. Although I do realize that actions have consequences and that life ain't fair, I hate to see folk that have nothing to do with a mans free expression penalized for his choices.



100 yds.


200 yds.


A two fer. Gotta luv the 130 Gr. Accubonds. yum-yum, pork chops. ( Model 22, Montana Varminter, 6.5 x 284)

Best

GWB

gotta ask i need, make that want, atop notch coyote rifle for walking and calling what cooper would u recommend?

used of course

Howard, I hesitate to make recommendations. I would want to know whether you were a reloader, what kind of country you'd be hunting in, and whether you're thinking of a dedicated coyote rig or a general purpose rifle, whether you'd be shooting over bags or off stix. Hunting day and/or night.
Many folk these days are using an AR style rifle, short fast twist barrel that offer excellent accuracy and the ability to make quick follow up shots. They also feature the ability to easily add attachments such as lights or lasers.

Where I hunt, most varmints are called in close, usually 30 to 50 yds. I find rifles such as the Cooper Classic balance well when employing shooting stix. I can take a foxpro caller, hand/mouth calls, fold up stool, pack and stix and strike out, make several stands.
Over the last several years, the Model 21 in Tactical 20 (that was pictured in my first post on this thread) has been the varminter I tend to always grab. I load a 40 gr. v-max at about 3,750 +. It will kill hogs and deer with careful shot placement and is devestating on varmints. However, it would not be my choice if I were in the business of keeping pelts.

The Coopers in the varmint calibers are pretty much all single shot. You'd have to go up to the model 54 to get a repeater. That typically means a 6mm at minimun. A 243, 250 Savage or even a 257 Roberts could be had in a "Classic" repeater
A 243 with a 62 gr. Barnes VG would clock at 3,600 fps or better. An 85 gr. TSX out of same would do 3,200 fps and you could kill deer and hogs. The only problem with the newer "repeater" models is that it is hard to find them "cheap".
PM me if you'd care to discuss this further.

Best

GWB

Being that you are considering a Cooper leads me to believe you do not put great emphasis on control round feed.
I might suggest an alternative that could save you a bunch of money and possibly acquire as good or higher quality rifle.
You want a medium bore?
Would you consider a 30-06? If so there is a brand new Sako L61R Finnbear on Guns International. Probably made 30 years ago.
IMHO it has the most precision action ever offered on a production gun. It has a Zeiss scope on it for $1,200.00.
If you want to customize with your own stick of wood in the future, you can have that done for less than the difference you are talking about in initial price and have a better stock built to your specifications.
Food for thought...
I might buy the rifle today.

Thinks guys. Bout 5 min after I posted I remembered that the Coopers are single shots.

Guess I will stick with me CZ 527.

They used to be, but the new models are magazine fed repeaters. 52, 54, and 56

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C..._Firearms_of_Montana

quote:

Political donation controversy

On October 27, 2008 a USA Today article featuring executives supporting Barack Obama for president was published naming Dan Cooper as a financial supporter of the campaign.[11] Scandal soon erupted across gun-related web forums and blogs when it was made public that Dan Cooper supported a pro-gun control Presidential candidate and had donated several thousand dollars to his campaign. Gun owners and blogs reacted to the news calling for a boycott of his company.[1]

By October 28, 2008 Cooper Firearms released a message on their website, noting that the company itself had not contributed in any fashion, and clarifying Cooper's contributions. [12]

On October 29, 2008 Cooper Firearms updated the message on their website indicating the board of directors asked Dan Cooper to step down as CEO of the company.[13]

In an October 30, 2008 article from USA Today Dan Cooper confirmed that he did indeed resign as CEO.[1] In the same article the governor of Montana, Brian Schweitzer said he was disturbed by the backlash.[1] Bob Ricker, executive director of the American Hunters and Shooters Association, called it "McCarthyism at its worst" noting that "If you're a gun owner, but you have a contrary view to some of these wackos, they will go out and try to destroy you."[1]

It was Dan Cooper that made the donation not Cooper Firearms.

I wonder, GeeDubya, did you ever get a response to any of your inquiries on the matter?

Gentlemen.

I opened this thread to ask which of two products was the better – and that was it! How it degenerated into this political bitching is quite beyond me.

However, I would remind all on this forum that currently American forces are fighting and dying all over the world in the defence and promotion of democracy. Democracy which the entire western world, led by America, enjoys. The last presidential election was “free and fair” and the Democrats won. They won because more people wanted Obama as president than they did McCain. That's democracy! So, when someone posts for advice on a product I suggest that in the interest of all, both Republicans and Democrats, you respect the thread and keep the political bitching for the “Political” section of this forum which Saeed has been good enough to offer you for this very purpose.

To those of you who had the courtesy not to contaminate this post with your own political moans and groans, I would like to sincerely thank for the views and advice. I’m probably going to choose the Cooper.

As for who is your President, frankly I don’t really mind – I’m British! Which presumably is why I thought I was posting, clearly mistakenly, on a solely rifle forum.

Perhaps a moderator would care to comment.

C.B.Bear.

quote:

Originally posted by C.B. Bear:
Gentlemen.

I’m probably going to choose the Cooper.


C.B.Bear.

I've not been disappointed with mine.

Best

GWB

I have both and tend to agree with Biebs first post...

For a general purpose hunting rifle or safari rifle I prefer the traditional safety and magazine setup of the Dakota. If I was looking for a super accurate "beanfield" gun or dedicated antelope rifle, I would go with a Cooper.

The price of Dakotas has become an issue. I bought mine in 2001 and while inflation is a factor, the current prices feel like too much to me.

Biebs - there are Cooper repeaters out there (54) in .22-250 and .220 Swift.

Oops, meant Howard, not Biebs on the repeater comment...

I would consider some of the Sako models as well. I just got a Sako Bavarian in 308 and I really like it. I have Dakotas but I think they are becoming over priced. Although they shoot, I'm not a big fan of the Cooper bolt handle appearance and bottom metal. There are some very attractive Dakota model 97s floating around that might be a viable option at a more reasonable price. Do a search on Guns America for Dakota and some 97s will pop up.

quote:

Originally posted by LJS:
I would consider some of the Sako models as well. I just got a Sako Bavarian in 308 and I really like it.

I am thinking my next purchase of a quality firearm may just be the Sako Bavarian Carbine, chambered in 308 Win. I've had a couple of the full stocked CZ's. The Merkels are quite a bit more. I've had excellent luck with Sakos and do like the set trigger.

GWB

I love my Cooper it is 223 but is one fine gun and shoots damn well.
Would buy another in a heart beat.

I can only commet on cooper since I don't have a Dakota. I really really like my cooper. It is a repeating model in a 338-06. It will shoot .5 groups with 210gr TTSX if I can go my part. It is my go to rifle. I have shot moose and black bears with it. All where one shot kills.

I tell folks, "I'm a short range meat hunter". Having said that, I am very particular about shot placement. Knowing where the bullet should impact, is important to me. Consequently, from time to time I go to the range and pull the trigger a few times, just to make sure. What's the old saying, "when you know you know, and you know you know, confidence replaces fear".
Although not all groups are from "medium bore rifles, all the groups are from Coopers that I hunt with and IIRC, that is the subject of this thread.

Best

GWB


Cooper Model 38 Classic, 17 Hebee


Cooper Model 21, Varminter 17 Mach IV


Cooper model 21, Varminter, 20 Vartarg,


Cooper Model 21 Classic, Tactical 20


Cooper Model 38 Classic 22 Hornet


Cooper model Varmint Extreme, 22-250


Cooper model 22, Montana Varminter 6.5 x 284


Cooper Model 22, Montana Varminter, 7mm-08, 200 yds.


Cooper Model 22, Varmint Extreme, 308 Winchester,