300 H&H vs. 30-06 vs. .338

16 October 2005, 19:18

I have seen a lot of pre-64 M70s chambered in 300 H&H. I know nothing about this cartridge. Will someone please explain where the 300 H&H fits into the food chain? How does it compare to a 30-06 and a .338?

Thank you,

Doublegun

16 October 2005, 19:26

Mark Dobrenski

double-IMO it is basically like an 06 Improved or what the current buzz of magnums is today the 300 WSM.

Just my thoughts

Mark D

16 October 2005, 19:29

p dog shooter

It well kill anything the 06 or the 338 well. Shoots a bit faster with the same bullet wieghts as the 06.

16 October 2005, 19:49

belaw

I think of the 300 H&H as falling between the 30-06 and 300 Win Mag. Great cartridge!

16 October 2005, 19:56

Doublegun

So, if my primary rifles are a .30-06 and a .375, a 300 H&H is not really going to give me anything.

Some have suggested to me that with a .30-06 and a .375 I'll never need another rifle. I have being practical. Maybe I should get a .338 to fill whatever gap there may be.

16 October 2005, 20:04

sierra2

The .300 H&H is only of interest today if you are trying to fine tune your range and power. It is good for a +400 foot pounds muzzle energy over the .30-06. The .300 H&H is an accurate load, but if you are using a .375 H&H class rifle successfully, there is little need to acquire a .300 H&H. I am learning to use a .300 H&H strictly because my arthritis limits the recoil I can take at the bench. On the other hand, don't sell the .30-06 short. It will reach out and touch animals at adequate ranges too. If you do want an intermediate rifle, the .338 Winchester is an excellent choice, imho.
LLS

16 October 2005, 20:09

invader66

quote:
Originally posted by Doublegun:
So, if my primary rifles are a .30-06 and a .375, a 300 H&H is not really going to give me anything.

Some have suggested to me that with a .30-06 and a .375 I'll never need another rifle. I have being practical. Maybe I should get a .338 to fill whatever gap there may be.

Don't tell my wife

but no you don't. Mabey a 22 rf. I know more than 1 person who have hunted
the whole world with just those 2. I have more but those would be the last 2 to go.

16 October 2005, 20:19

ALF

16 October 2005, 20:35

Doublegun

quote:
Originally posted by ALF:
still earns respect from those who appreciate the finer aspects of nostalgia

Now you have done it - brought up nostalgia. Unfortunately for me, I am a hopeless romantic and nostalgia is just the type of reason I would buy a 300 H&H.

16 October 2005, 20:38

Doublegun

quote:
Originally posted by invader66:
quote:
Originally posted by Doublegun:
So, if my primary rifles are a .30-06 and a .375, a 300 H&H is not really going to give me anything.

Some have suggested to me that with a .30-06 and a .375 I'll never need another rifle. I have being practical. Maybe I should get a .338 to fill whatever gap there may be.

Don't tell my wife but no you don't. Mabey a 22 rf. I know more than 1 person who have hunted
the whole world with just those 2. I have more but those would be the last 2 to go.

Just for the record, I do have more rifles in my safe than a 30-06 and a .375 but those are my two primary NP rifles, not counting a couple of 30-30's, .308 and 6mm's.

16 October 2005, 20:39

Thomas Jones

The 300 H&H is just a cool caretridge ! I gave up on trying to fill a nich in my battery or any of that, I just decide do I like it ? can I afford it ? and if I decide to get rid of it, how much if any hit will I take ? If its a Pre 64 model 70 you are not really spending much money unless you really got took on price. You could allways resell it for a good buck. The .338 is a great cartridge for north american and for affrican plains game too.
about the only thing i would do with a .338 and not with a 300 H&H is grizzly...tj3006

16 October 2005, 20:59

Roland1

quote:
Originally posted by Doublegun:
I have seen a lot of pre-64 M70s chambered in 300 H&H. I know nothing about this cartridge. Will someone please explain where the 300 H&H fits into the food chain? How does it compare to a 30-06 and a .338?

Thank you,

Doublegun

Doublegun,

The .338 is to close to the .375 and the 300 H&H can't do more than 3006 - No need for another rifle, you have the ultimate combo

Maybe a 30-378 for very long shots zero at 300 Yards â€“ -7 at 400 yards â€“ 3500 Feet per second with a 180 grain Barnes TSX

hmmm I tell the wife.

Success and good hunting,

Roland

16 October 2005, 21:10

Savage99

I have an old M70 in 300 H&H just because. It's a heavy rifle and cool to look at and talk about. Besides that I would take a 308 or 30-06 Featherweight over it seven days a week.

The rifle is more important than the cartridge. If you have a 338 that you like then your all set.

If you can handle a rifle that comes back quick read up on what Allen Day bought.

https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tp.../691108633#691108633

16 October 2005, 22:05

jorge

If you handload, the 300 H&H is the equal of the 300 Win Mag with the added advantage of easier extraction due to the tapered case. Factory loads are purposely downloaded to about 2880 with 180gr bullets. Handloading can easily exceed 3000 fps which is significant over the 06 and in my expericne the 300s hammer animals with greater authority than the 06. jorge

16 October 2005, 23:26

vapodog

quote:
Some have suggested to me that with a .30-06 and a .375 I'll never need another rifle. I have being practical.

I'd say that about sums it up.....

However let me say that the .300 H&H is with a 200 grain bullet what the .30-06 is with a 165 grain bullet.

The question is???????...do you need the bigger bullet?

In all honesty, the .30-06 will do what the .300 H&H will do and if you truly need more that's what the .375 H&H is for.

16 October 2005, 23:52

Buster

The question should not be do you need a .300H&H, but do you want a .300H&H? I can't think of a better combination than the .300H&H teamed with a .375H&H. If you handload, the .300H&H will do alot more than the .30-06, especially with heavier bullets, which is why you shoot a magnum in the first place.

The .300H&H in a Pre-64 Model 70 is plain and simple a great package!

16 October 2005, 23:58

ALF

17 October 2005, 08:37

sierra2

Finally seem to have gotten my .300 H&H working today, and the performance was such that I can see why you might want one. Four consecutive half inch groups at one hundred yards. Only two shot groups because I had loaded for pressure and the chronograph, 67.0 thru 69.0 grains of H4831sc with 180 grain Nosler Partitions. Think I am sticking at 68.5 grains which is giving me 2800 fps on the nose. That is 300 foot pounds more muzzle energy than the .30-06, not a huge increase, but it is there. Now why else would anyone want a .300 H&H, except that it is "there" and it shoots well? (And it is pretty)

LLS

17 October 2005, 12:32

Tex21

I like classic cartridges and think the 300 H&H has a lot of panache. That's enough reasoning to make me want one!

Besides gentlemen, we're gun guys. Who said anything about practicality?

17 October 2005, 21:17

Vladimir

Count me in as a lover of the 300 H&H too. Mine is a 1962 Browning Safari grade. The older I get the more I find I'm moving to the old standards. Basically, I'm to the point now that any rifle or cartridge newer than the 60's or 70's just doesn't do it for me.

Speaking of the 300 cartridges - anyone know where there is any unprimed brass? From what I gather, Winchester didn't run any this year and the supply has pretty much dried up.

Vlad

17 October 2005, 21:38

BFaucett

Lock Stock and Barrel is showing Win .300 H&H brass in stock (as of the date of this posting).

http://www.lockstock.com/

-Bob F.

17 October 2005, 21:43

Riodot

Forget the word "need". The 375H&H/300H&H pair is nostalgia at it's finest. Someday I hope to pair those two up myself.

For some strange reason I want to hunt with a caliber that is older than me and none of my buddies hunt with. They are always ribbing me about hunting with antiques(old SxS shotguns, old mausers, etc.)

I love to have them ask "what antique are ya shootin now?" and when I show them, they look puzzled and say "what's that?". It's great fun on a hunting trip.

The heck with "need", if it interests you, get that pre-64 model 70.

17 October 2005, 22:33

Doublegun

quote:
Originally posted by Riodot:
Forget the word "need". The 375H&H/300H&H pair is nostalgia at it's finest. Someday I hope to pair those two up myself.

For some strange reason I want to hunt with a caliber that is older than me and none of my buddies hunt with. They are always ribbing me about hunting with antiques(old SxS shotguns, old mausers, etc.)

I love to have them ask "what antique are ya shootin now?" and when I show them, they look puzzled and say "what's that?". It's great fun on a hunting trip.

The heck with "need", if it interests you, get that pre-64 model 70.

I hear you, brother. I hunt a lot of grouse and one of my favorite guns is a 16 ga DH with 30" damascus barrels, made in 1891. My other Parkers date from 1889, 1918 and 1920. Got to love an old gun.

The 300 H&H sounds like it would be a heck of a round for elk or Aftican plains game. How hard is it to find ammo? I do not reload (at least not yet).

18 October 2005, 00:07

CanadianLefty

quote:
Originally posted by Doublegun:
How hard is it to find ammo? I do not reload (at least not yet).

In Canada, 2 out of the 5 major gun stores have them BUT probably only 1 out of 10 smaller shops would have any in stock. Further, factory ammo is limited in bullet and weight choices, you gotta either buy what they stock or special order. In the U.S., ammo is more available from the major retailers, but again, the mom and pop stores don't bother to carry any for lack of demand.

18 October 2005, 01:31

Vladimir

B Faucett,

Thanks for the Lock Stock website information. They are a new one to me - placed my order for the 300 brass.

Thanks again.

Vlad

18 October 2005, 05:11

sierra2

quote:
Originally posted by Vladimir:
Vlad,

Midway has Winchester .300 H&H brass. That is where I am buying mine.
LLS

Count me in as a lover of the 300 H&H too. Mine is a 1962 Browning Safari grade. The older I get the more I find I'm moving to the old standards. Basically, I'm to the point now that any rifle or cartridge newer than the 60's or 70's just doesn't do it for me.

Speaking of the 300 cartridges - anyone know where there is any unprimed brass? From what I gather, Winchester didn't run any this year and the supply has pretty much dried up.

Vlad

18 October 2005, 05:14

sierra2

quote:
Originally posted by Doublegun:
It is a pain to find .300 H&H ammo at the moment (18 Oct 2005) and it is expensive when you find it too. Hamdloading seems to be the best route, being less expensive even after the work up stage than paying 40-45 dollars per box for Winchester or Federal/Hornaday ammo.
LLS

quote:
Originally posted by Riodot:
Forget the word "need". The 375H&H/300H&H pair is nostalgia at it's finest. Someday I hope to pair those two up myself.

For some strange reason I want to hunt with a caliber that is older than me and none of my buddies hunt with. They are always ribbing me about hunting with antiques(old SxS shotguns, old mausers, etc.)

I love to have them ask "what antique are ya shootin now?" and when I show them, they look puzzled and say "what's that?". It's great fun on a hunting trip.

The heck with "need", if it interests you, get that pre-64 model 70.

I hear you, brother. I hunt a lot of grouse and one of my favorite guns is a 16 ga DH with 30" damascus barrels, made in 1891. My other Parkers date from 1889, 1918 and 1920. Got to love an old gun.

The 300 H&H sounds like it would be a heck of a round for elk or Aftican plains game. How hard is it to find ammo? I do not reload (at least not yet).

18 October 2005, 15:41

jorge

Sierra2: at 2800 fps, you are way short of exploting the cartridge's potential. I can get to 3000 fps with zero pressure signs and 180 Partitions. You should carefully try and work that fine cartridge up to it's full potential as I can easily get 2750 out of my 06 and 180s. jorge

18 October 2005, 21:58

Strawboss

I cannot think of a finer battery of rifles than the .300 & .375 Holland and Holland Magnums. Also, if there is a slicker feeding cartridge than the .300 H&H, I don't know what it might be. This cartridge is almost effortless to cycle in a bolt action. It does very well with 200 gr. bullets and for some reason doesn't seem to kick quite as hard as the other .30 magnums. It is a fine old cartridge and under rated IMHO.

18 October 2005, 23:14

Doublegun

Thank you all for the education on the 300H&H. So, for an intrim caliber, between the 30-06 and the .375, there is really nothing lost if I go with a 300 H&H over a .338?

19 October 2005, 07:08

Woodjack

DoubleGun,

300H&H is irreplaceable as a Fine classic round, picture it in a Hagn Singleshot English stalking Rifle configuration and you will know what I mean (7x57 would be nice too!)
However the .338win has that ability to handle those 300gn Woodleighs,that Ray Atkinson finds so devastating.He states on this forum that it kills buff every bit as well as a 300gn 375.
All depends what rifle your building.As much as I like the .300H&H,The .338 is super verastile. 210gn for plains game,300gn for the big stuff, without dissapointment.
In fact if I was Honest with myself all I would need is a 6.5x55 and a .338win Mag. A 160gn 6.5 is very much like a 300gn.338 pill in the way it penetrates and kills all out of proportion to what one immagines.But I see nothing wrong with having .300H&H gracfully standing inbetween them in the safe. There would be days that taking a classic out,would give me so much pleasure.

19 October 2005, 08:39

LE270

quote:
Originally posted by Doublegun:

Some have suggested to me that with a .30-06 and a .375 I'll never need another rifle.

I think you also need a 22-250. With those three you are ready for everything in the world that is huntable with a rifle.

20 October 2005, 22:58

Paul H

quote:
Originally posted by Doublegun:
So, if my primary rifles are a .30-06 and a .375, a 300 H&H is not really going to give me anything.

Some have suggested to me that with a .30-06 and a .375 I'll never need another rifle. I have being practical. Maybe I should get a .338 to fill whatever gap there may be.

True enough, but a 300 H&H is a better companion with a 375, and a 338 makes a nice big brother for an -06.

I could be content with a 338 win mag for NA hunting, but what fun would that be

20 October 2005, 23:53

KWard

My trusty pair is a .300H&H and a .375H&H. The .300 is a winchester 70 and the .375 is a whitworth mauser. great pair

21 October 2005, 08:21

a_dalimata

the pair of rifles that i hunt with is an 1886 EL 45-70 and a pre-64 300 H&H . dont need anything else . ive been using the 200 grn Speer grandslam just shy of 2900 fps . been working with the 200 gr barnes triple shock and have been very imprested . the 300 h&h handles the heaveier boolits just as good or better than the 300 winny .

21 October 2005, 23:48

JBD

If you are talking "need" then you have it all covered with that 30-06 and .375. So what? What did "need" ever have to do with a decision to buy another rifle. The .300 H&H is about as cool as they come and a .338 Win. Mag. is also a fantastic performer. The thing I really like about the .338 over the .375 is that the rifles are usually substantially lighter in weight. Get 'em all!

26 October 2005, 04:57

CanadianLefty

I haven't found the powder or water case capacity of the 300 H&H. Would someone please post it here?

Thanks

27 October 2005, 23:47

Atkinson

Many here do not understand nor have any experience with the 300 H&H or do not own a chrongraph....

Where it shines is with 200 gr. bullets, those bullets take up too much powder space in the 300 Win. and others to work through short actions....

The 300 H&H will push a 200 gr. bullet faster than any of the 300s other than the 300 Wby which beats it my about 100 FPS, I can live with that...

The long sloping 300 H&H case does stretch a bit and thats its weakness if you want to call it that, I don't....I like that torpedo as it feeds and extracts like no other round ever developed, slicker n snot!

I will always have my old M-70 and its a beat up old gun with my first custom stock and with many rounds through its washed out tube, but it still prints an tidy 1/2 inch group with about any load, but mostly I just use 200 gr. Noslers and a cup full of old surplus 4831 froma SS container that once had 150 lbs, in it and its now down to about 30 lbs, army stuff.......

BTW, I would not part with my .338 or my .375 H&H...

28 October 2005, 11:25

ALF

28 October 2005, 17:43

jens poulsen

My .300 H&H shoots 14,2 gram(220 grain) bullets at 870 M/sec(2854 Ft/sec). Yes it`s a stiff load, but I`ve no signs of too much pressure. My load is: Winchester brass
Norma MRP Powder 65 grain
Hornady RN 220 grain
Fed 215 primer
OAL 91mm
Mayby the winnie is more powerfull, I can`t say? My Mauser is barreled by 24" shilen(new).

I am looking forward though to get my bulletswage stuff from Martin Potts(did you hear that Martin?)and I besides my .333 Jeffery project, 250Grain bullets for my .300H&H will come up next!