My understanding (novice, I'm a far cry from a gunsmith) is that one of the perceived advantages of the WSM cartriges was that they could be utilized in short action rifles. However, I am currently intent on buying a Tikka T3 lite in 270wsm and I understand that the rifle is built on a long action. Does this negate a significant advantage of the WSM cartrige or is it irrelevant due to the Tikka's light weight regardless of action length? Excuse me if this is a dumb question.

Using a long action for a short-action round negates the supposed advantage of the WSMs.

If you're going to use a long action, get a .270 Win. and re-chamber to the .270 Ackley Improved. which will give the same velocities as the .270WSM.

You can still use (less expensive) factory .270 Win. ammo in a pinch.

George

The long-action doesn't negate the fact that the 270 WSM all things being equal is about 200fps faster with the same bullets as the 270 Winchester. It may also be slightly more inherantly accurate. The 270 ACK Improved may be a great round if you like wildcats but I personally don't like having to fireform brass etc. I don't like having to shoot 100rds to have 100 rounds of brass. The 270 WSM is becoming popular enough that you can find ammo in a lot of Walmarts.
Also anytime you make a rifle into a non-standard caliber it can make them very hard to sell. I think that the 270 WSM is the best of the new short mags and highly in demand right now and so would hold it's value far better than a lot of other calibers.
A hunting buddy had a T-3 in 270 WSM and absolutely loved it. I bet you will too........DJ

If performance is what your after, I would just get a 270 Weatherby Magnum. It will out-shoot either of the cart. mentioned and has a much better action. Since you are faced w/ the long action vs. short action problem, I would just get a 270 win. You will be able to get a better deal on a 270 win, it will hold more shells in the mag., 270 win shells are easier to find (and cheaper too), and the 270 WSM will just edge the 270 win ballisticaly.

If cost is not an object get a 270 Weatherby for around $800, and if it is, you will be far better served w/ the 270 win.


Good Luck!

Reloader

nvrnuf,

If it's the Tikka 270 WSM you want then get it. The rifle does not cost all that much and there are many good reports on them.

As to the weight and action length it will not matter much and at that price range if it's a shooter then the deal will be win-win.

The 270 WSM is more powerful than the 270 Win and in general a very good idea. The Weatherby 270 has had over a half century to make it and it never got going. Besides it's a belted round and thats no advantage whatsoever in such case.

Savage99, I dont see where you come up w/ the statement "Weatherby just never got it going." Down here Weatherby is Top-of-the-Line. I have shot some very, very impressive 200-300 yard groups w/ a Weatherby rifle and as far as I am concerned, you cant get a better action.

They are very popular in the southern US.

Reloader

GeorgeS,



Belted cartridges are a disadvantage if the case is a bottleneck with an adequate shoulder. We have gone over this here and I have posted facts, references and drawings. Others have posted only opinions. You are entitled to your opinion but until you post some fact it's just an opinion.



Reloader,



The 270 Weatherby is what I mean. The cartridge has been around since 1943 and was never popular nor well distributed. Weatherby rifles are liked by some and I have owned one. I like other rifles and cartridges better.

Savage 99, please define fact. Please define opinion. Then please tell us how your apparently factual opinions are different than anyone elses. Other than the fact they have no personal experience as the basis of their formation.

Chuck

The belt may be redundant on a case with an 'adequate' shoulder, but it is not a disadvantage. You may lose a round of magazine capacity sometimes, but that will be true of any case without a lot of taper (like the WSMs), e.g., magazine capacity of a typical .270Win. is 4; typical .270WSM is 3; a typical .270Wby. holds 3 rounds.

I don't recall seeing any facts presented to the contrary, by your or anyone else. Perhaps your well-known distaste for belted magnums has colored your judgment.


IMO, the major reason the Weatherby rounds did not 'get going' in terms of market penetration is that they were not chambered in low- and middle-priced rifles. Few casual shooters/hunters were going to drop $1000 on a Weatherby or Sako when they could buy two or three Remingtons or Rugers for that amount. Other reasons included cost of factory ammunition (until Remington began loading for it), and reports of excessive recoil.

However, Roy Weatherby wasn't trying to market to the masses; he used the 'Weatherby mystique' to try to sell to the heavy hitter - the rich, the famous, the hunter who traveled to exotic places and hunted big game.

George

Hey George,

I wish I could put three in my WSM magazine. It will only hold two.

Reloader

nvrnuf,

I don't see the T3 with it's std length action as either an advantage OR disadvantage to you.

Lot's of popular opinions,old wives tales and just plain misinformation out there regarding everything from primers,to powders,actions,barrels,stocks,etc,etc. Some of it valid,a lot of it questionable.

Many are of the opinion that a short action is advantageous as it allows QUICKER manipulation of the bolt versus a longer action. I've owned/do own, a few true magnum length actions and have never found this to be a problem. I can work the bolt on a .416 just as efficiently as one of my little Sako Vixen .222's.

BUT lets compare say a short/long rem 700 action. I can lean towards the idea that the short action will be stiffer,hence more stable than the longer action. SO.....if all other factors such as bedding,nut behind the gun, etc are equal. The short action may shoot microscopically more accurate. Will it matter in the field? IMHO.... NO

A long action will allow one to seat bullets out a bit longer too. So lets say that you can pick up a few extra percent of case capacity by seating the bullet out farther with your long action. Lets say you pick up 2% more capacity. Cut that in half; 1%. Multiply that by your present velocity. Lets say your shooting 130's and getting 3000 fps. So seating out may allow you 30 extra feet per second. Worth it? A moot factor IMHO.

Buy your T3, enjoy IT and the neat little .270 WSM cartridge.

FN in MT

Funny, I loaded a 416 rem (it has a belt right?) once or twice and it seemed to hold down 4. Didn't have a belly eigther, I looked.

Chuck

Chuck Nelson,

It seems that you are on the side of just expressing opinion. What you should do is to read the links that I posted. When you have done so then come back and rebut them on the basis of fact.

Perhaps you could do some measuring of fired vrs new cases in the various chambering systems. Something interesting like that where we can learn.

nrnuf:

There is a big advantage to having the longer action with the WSM cartridge. As is the case with most short actions, if one uses them for hunting, the bullets must be seated so deep as to negate any advantage over say, the standard 270 etc. The old 284 Winchester is a great example, it was supposed to equal the 270 velocities in a short action but, the bullets had to be seated so deeply the case capacity was reduced enough so as to make that an impossibility.

I don't know what all the hub bub is about short actions anway, buy the rifle you like and enjoy it.

Jerry

Reloader, why dow you want more than 3 bullets. Are you wanting to kill them dead dead, or really dead?

What if you need to engage multiple targets?

George

Nvrnuf, you hit the nail right on the head. I've handled the T3 stainless light in 300 WSM & you would not want it any lighter. Especially in any of the WSMs - they are still Magnums! The weight difference is particulary noticeable if you compare it with a M70 WSM Stainless say.

So the only disadvantage would be in the bolt stroke. Something like 1/2 inch or less which is nothing. I am not sure but I would think they would have shortened the bolt throw by relocation of the bolt stop. In which case you don't have any difference.

I don't know that the T3 is my cup of tea. But the bolt operation is certainly slick & the price is pretty good. If you like it I wouldn't let the longer bolt put you off.

Regards
JohnT

NVRNF

I have just bought a 300wsm in the t3. Forget about the fact that the action is one length only in the t3 regardless of caliber.

If you can find a smoother action ANYWHERE I will be surprised - long or short action.

The other point - my 300wsm feeds faultlessley, all 3 rounds from the synthetic mag - more than one can say for any other rifle chambered in the short mags except maybe the Kimbers?

For the money you cannot beat them and by the way I was pleasantly surprised how mild the recoil was from my 300. A 270wsm should be no problem at all.

Good luck. By the way, check out the prices of the brass/facory ammo of the the 270 Weatherby Mag versus 270wsm. I know which I would buy from a practical point of view.

Big country,

I only need one, I was just stating mine only holds two in the clip.

Reloader

Reloader, I know I am just razzin you a bit.

I don't know about the Tikka, BUT I rebarreled a Remington 700 magnum long action with a .270 WSM with the bullets seated out and we could never get it to feed properly. Most of the time it would not feed even one round from the magazine. I changed out the magazine box with one recommended for the ultra mags and that did not work either. I pulled the barrel and put my .375 Ackley Imp. back on it. Be sure to check to see if you have feeding issues before you buy it.

Sambubba