Anyone built one latley?

I have 3 actions that I am considering using. Sauer 80 in 300 Win, Weatherby MkV in 270 Weatherby, and Ruger M77R in 30-06.

Might build 2, not sure.

The .358 Norma is immensely powerful and just like a .375 H&H or .375 Ruger sitting at the bench.

Just about any practical use for one is preempted by building one of the .375s.....and the .375s are legal for African DG.

If the .358 Norma could muster legal distinction it has a chance of stealing a lot of popularity from the big .375s.....and double as a North American big game cartridge.

quote:

.358 Norma?... Anyone built one latley?

NO and for the above reason.....it should be a lot more popular.....but it's not.

Some might about weather it's legal on dangerous game in Africa, but I am not one of them as I have other rifles for that.

I have lusted after a Schultz and Larsen 358 Norma every since I read an article in Hatari Times years ago.

Great stuff.

D99 I built one about 30 years ago on a P-14 action. If you are going to build one I would suggest going with a full length action so you can seat some of those heavy bullets out and not compromise powder capacity. Also stay with the 1 in 12 twist so you can handle the heavy bullets. Quite a rifle

I used to lust for a .358 NM in a Schultz & Larsen factory-built rifle too. Then I bought one at a Calgary gun show. Can't recall whether it was a M65-DL or a M68-DL, but anyway, it was the only S&L I ever had which I didn't like.

My 1903 Springfield converson to the same cartridge was a much nicer handling and more accurate shooting rifle. I sold it after I found the S&L, but always later wished I hadn't.

So...if I was going to own another one now, I would take a standard-length action in a rifle I already have and like the feel of, and change it to a .358 NM, rather than look for another factory-built one.

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
I used to lust for a .358 NM in a Schultz & Larsen factory-built rifle too. Then I bought one at a Calgary gun show. Can't recall whether it was a M65-DL or a M68-DL, but anyway, it was the only S&L I ever had which I didn't like.

My 1903 Springfield converson to the same cartridge was a much nicer handling and more accurate shooting rifle. I had sold it when I found the S&L, but always afterwards wished I hadn't.

So...if I was going to own another one now, I would take a standard-length action in a rifle I already have and like the feel of, and change it to a .358 NM, rather than look for another factory-built one.

My Brother has an '03 Springfield in 358Norma.
Nicely done by J.W.VanPatten

Very nice rifle, but it could be in a better piece of wood...

There is nothing "special" about the cartridge
to justify the rediculous price of brass to load for it.

There are distinct reasons why the 358 languishes in his safe while his McMillan stocked Winchester M70 in 338Mag gets to come out and play.

Yeah, it's "different" but "different" isn't "better".

AD

It is a great performer, especially with 280 grain Swift and 310 grain Weldcore
I prefer it over the 338 Win mag but that's me
It is longer than the 338 so reloading it with 338 brass will leave you short necked, it will lengthen over time. 300 win mag. is maybe a better solution. Fireform with the cheapest 358 158 grains bullets.

quote:

Originally posted by snowman:
D99 I built one about 30 years ago on a P-14 action. If you are going to build one I would suggest going with a full length action so you can seat some of those heavy bullets out and not compromise powder capacity. Also stay with the 1 in 12 twist so you can handle the heavy bullets. Quite a rifle

I have a 358 Norma that has languished in my gun cabinet for years, also some 310gr Woodleighs, both softnoses & FMJs. Pulled it out & checked the twist last night, 1:12. yeah, I really must get A into G & work up some loads with those bullets, never know when I might trip over a really angry possum in the shrubs outside.
Steve

The Norma is one of my favorites, my second one is pictured below.

While one would be hard pressed to make any rational argument that it offered any significant increase in performance over the 338 Win Mag (or vise-versa) I am convinced that the larger frontal diameter does make a difference on game. Even though I can't back it up scientifically, I'm sticking to my story.

Norma brass is very good and lasts forever at reasonable pressures, but if brass cost is an issue, brass can easily be made from 338 Win mag (or 300 Win Mag, or 7mm Rem Mag) brass.

There are very few beasts astride the earth that I would think twice about tipping over with a 250gr Partition over H4350.

Nice rifle Cas, I like that.

Love that stock, is it a Bansner?

Thanks. Actually it is a Brown Precision stock.

quote:

Originally posted by D99:
Anyone built one latley?

I have 3 actions that I am considering using. Sauer 80 in 300 Win, Weatherby MkV in 270 Weatherby, and Ruger M77R in 30-06.

Might build 2, not sure.

Why bother? The thing was "dead" even before .375 Ruger came out.

By that logic, only the 223 Remington, 30-06 Springfield, and 375 Ruger should ever sell. Everything else is a waste.

Hell, taken further, the 375 Ruger should have never been brought out, as the 375 H&H worked just fine.

Damn, before rifles were invented, people were killing everything that walked with sharp sticks, so maybe we should just get rid of all guns since sticks work just fine.

quote:

Originally posted by D99:
Anyone built one latley?

I have 3 actions that I am considering using. Sauer 80 in 300 Win, Weatherby MkV in 270 Weatherby, and Ruger M77R in 30-06.

Might build 2, not sure.

On re-reading your original post, I think of your three actions I would use the Sauer Model 80. Normally I would prefer the Ruger, but I conjecture the Model 80 has just about a perfect magazine for the .358 NM in terms of length, feeding, etc, as is.

One of the interesting things about the cartridge is that people seem to either love it or hate it.

As a good example of that, yesterday I dug out an old U.S.Forest Service report wherein they tested a large variety of cartridges and rifles to be used as "Kodiak Bear Guns" in coastal Alaska. (They had just instituted a rule which required one member of every work party to be armed with a "bear" rifle, and found that their newer, "more ecologically friendly", employees were actually more afraid of their current .375 H&H rifles firing Winchester 300 gr.bullets than of the bears!!). Anyway, they rated the .458 Winchester as most effective, the .460 Weatherby as 2nd most effective, the .375 H&H as 3rd most effective, and the .338 Winchester as 4th most effective. The .358 Norma Mag got short-shrift and a ranking as 20th most effective.

I hasten to add that even the most nieve of readers could pick a jillion holes in the presumptions on which the ratings were based. Even a quick scan of the study showed that the Norma bullet they tested (not the cartridge, just the bullet) accounted for most of the dismal showing, together with the cost of the factory ammo.

Personally I always found the round to be a very effective one, and like it very much. But then that just reflects MY prejudices....

BTW,though the round may be minutely longer-cased than the .338, quite effective .358 NM ammo can be made from .338 Win Mag cases, and with the factory spec chamber, either one can be fired interchangeably in it with no ill effects. Still another option is .shortened 375 H&H brass. That's what I used to make mine from, as I had lots of it.

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:


I hasten to add that even the most nieve of readers could pick a jillion holes in the presumptions on which the ratings were based. Even a quick scan of the study showed that the Norma bullet they tested (not the cartridge, just the bullet) accounted for most of the dismal showing, together with the cost of the factory ammo.

Personally I always found the round to be a very effective one, and like it very much. But then that just reflects MY prejudices....

The bullets in older 358 Norma were their Alaska bullet which might well have been OK when launched at modest velocities but at 358 Norma speeds tended to perform unreliably from all the reports I've seen. Their latest catalogue shows them as being loaded with the Oryx bullet which should be up to it, TSXs, Woodleighs or A-Frames would be even better to my way of thinking.
Steve

Steve,

That's pretty much how I see it. Though Swifts are much easier for me to get than your semi-local Woodleighs.

I just purchased a 358 Norma built on a Sako L61R action and custom wood stock. The rifle is in 98% minor defects in the stock which I,m working on now to correct.I love the 358 cal. I have four a 358 STA and two 358/300 Imp. Ultra Mags. Great round and seems to be gaining some head way in the (I want area).Looking forward to loading up some ammo for this one and taken it to the bench.

Hoeram

quote:

Originally posted by Shinzo:
The bullets in older 358 Norma were their Alaska bullet which might well have been OK when launched at modest velocities but at 358 Norma speeds tended to perform unreliably from all the reports I've seen. Their latest catalogue shows them as being loaded with the Oryx bullet which should be up to it, TSXs, Woodleighs or A-Frames would be even better to my way of thinking.
Steve

Yes, their original factory bullets tended to blow-up on impact pretty frequently. On the other hand, I used plain old cup'n core 275 grain bullets handloaded in mine, and they worked very well.

The Forest Service tested the more fragile Norma bullets and got poor penetration combined with grenade-like fragmenting. Then rather than recognizing it was a "bullet" problem, they condemned the whole cartridge. Too bad. With that size of potential contract a bunch of companies would have been willing to load danged near any bullet they wanted. They might even have been able to get Nosler to make a nice 265 grain Partition for it.....



Not on topic exactly, but in the .338 Win Mag, they found both the 200 grain Power Point and the short-lived 300 grain load then available to far outperform the the Winchester 250 grain ammo in the .338....(in all areas, penetration, expansion, weight retention %, etc.) Might be something in that finding which could be useful in looking at .358 Norma Mag loads as well?

No need for overpriced Norma ammo. Try these:

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/index.php?cPath=63

Cheaper and made in the USA.

I was thinking the heavy swifts as well.

Anyone use them?

The double tap is more expensive than Norma.

I have had a few Colt Sauers, which is very similar or identical to your Sauer 80. I think that would be the cat's meow, but if I remember correctly changing barrels isn't straight forward. There's a lot of fancy machining involved and it would get very pricey if you could find someone to do it. Perhaps I am thinking of the Sauer 202. If I am wrong, please correct me because I would rebarrel a 458 that I have to 358 Norma in a heart beat. Lou

No your right it requires a machine shop and time. I won't be the one doing it. Probably Shilen, Hart, or Pacnor. Price is about $650 plus whatever it cost to get it blued or teflon.

You can get a cheaper barrel, but it will be a cheaper barrel.

I wish the Sauer 202 was available in that caliber.