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I was thinking more along the lines of poor substitute for the 8mm Rem Mag. probably more velocity and less pressure. If you want an 8mm, get an 8mm. NOT a 325. same measurement, yes, but the 325 is NOT an 8mm mag. | |||
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The 325 WSM is a short action substitute for the .338-06. The .358 compares to the .35 Whelen, and how about the .350 Rem Mag thats available again. They are short mediums if thats what you want. Performance wise I think they get out-classed and may fail because of it. If it's hyped up and advertised it will make a bigger impression. It's marketing that will make it. Many others prove my point. The 8mm RM works very well but is rare at best. The .243W made it big while the 6mmR is better. The .250 Savage and .257 Roberts are great but not loaded to their potential and they suffered. The .25-06 is still popular and barely has an advantage. The 280R, or 7mm Express, or is it a .280 again? Great rifle for all around, better than any .270 yet not popular. The .222 and .222 Mag were both icredible little varmit rounds but fell because the military adopted the .223! What about the Remington SAUM's? Where'd they go? Was the idea a bad one? Marketing will determine the success. Nate | |||
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I think it's an abandoned orphan. Sure, it'll have a cult following like anything obscure, but does it REALLY do anything the Rem350Mag or 338-06A-Square or any of several others can't do as well if not better? Frankly I'd get a 338RemMag as there is a FAR better selection of bullets available in .338dia. And for the record the 338-06 is not ....entirely.... a wildcatting proposition. Correctly headstamped factory brass is available from A-square as they chamber factory rifles for that caliber (or atleast they did) and the brass is made for them by Norma. I Believe you can also buy a Weatherby Mk5 factory chambered in 338-06. The fact that you cannot get factory Remington brass for a 338-06 is one of the reasons why if anyone aske me to choose between a 338-06 and a 35whelen I'd go with the 35whelen even though there is a better selevtion of bullets avaiable for the .338.... Though considering that Nosler Partitions and Barnes X bullets are available for both pretty much covers the need for bullets for either choice... Though I will say that the larger bore diameter gives the 35Whelen a slight edge with 225gr bullets, I doubt that the sectional density difference is going to have any material effect on terminal performance. AllanD If I provoke you into thinking then I've done my good deed for the day! Those who manage to provoke themselves into other activities have only themselves to blame. *We Band of 45-70er's* 35 year Life Member of the NRA NRA Life Member since 1984 | |||
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A-squares 338-06 brass is not made my Norma. Where do you get your info from? | |||
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the Weatherby boxed 338-06 is supposed to have been made by Norma. I read that somewhere... Where? don't remember. AD If I provoke you into thinking then I've done my good deed for the day! Those who manage to provoke themselves into other activities have only themselves to blame. *We Band of 45-70er's* 35 year Life Member of the NRA NRA Life Member since 1984 | |||
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I've just bought a 325 Montana was trawling the threads to get more info and found this gem. Good thing you didn't take a bet DGR, neither Winchester or the 325 are dead.. | |||
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Late to the game. FWIW, I like the 325 WSM. But I like a lot of different chamberings between .17 &.45 cals. I've owned at least two different rifles in all the WSMs. Mostly Kimbers with an ocasional Sako and Browning High Wall thrown in. At present I only own a 325 WSM, of all the WSM chamberings. Others have come and gone. I'll probably keep the 325. I like it. I label myself as a "short range meat hunter". Most of the shots I take are 200 yds. and under. I can load a 8mm 180 gr. Nosler ballistic tip over 62 gr. of W760 (Nosler's minimal load) and get 2,850 FPS +/- with relatively mild recoil. I've found a MV of 2800 fps or less does much less meat damage that 3000 fps Plus. The 180 gr. ballistic tip and the 200 gr. accubond have good sectional density and ballistic co-efficient. Its been my experience that with this.........  one gets plenty of penetration, hole going in and out. No problem finding a blood trail. In fact my Nosler Model 48 has become my go to hog slayer for late evening hunts. It puts them down. Should I have to track, usually no problem.   entry  exit. I've taken Axis deer  and Whitetail deer  I'm not saying it's the best thing since sliced bread, nor is it better than........ It does work, and is plenty accurate in a decent shooter. As an aside, I drew a cow elk tag in Co. I plan to take the 325 WSM loaded with 200 gr. Accubonds at +/-2800 fps. I think it should work fine out to say 400 yds or so. Best GWB | |||
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Well, it was about six years ago that I posted on this thread. Now the 325 is the only wsm I own and I own two, both in Kimbers, one Montana the other standard. I have not sold off any standard magnums to make room for the 325, but I do like the round and it is the caliber I find myself reaching for more than any of my others. ____________________________________________ "Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett. | |||
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I think to answer the OP question: Yes, its a tad bit overkill for white tail deer. Really, anything over a 7mm-08 is a waste of energy with well placed shots. In terms of practical accuracy, its the gun and not so much the cartridge that's the determining factor. That being said, shoot what you like. You will always have individuals that will ether extol or demote the virtues of any particular chambering. Take it with a grain of salt. Big game shot with a 325WSM will be killed just as dead as any 338 or 8mm mags provided you do your part. "though the will of the majority is in all cases to prevail, that will to be rightful must be reasonable; that the minority possess their equal rights, which equal law must protect, and to violate would be oppression." ---Thomas Jefferson | |||
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factory ammo is getting harder to find and less choices than a few years ago. That is unfortunate. It this keeps up, the non-handloader will go elsewhere. | |||
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I just recently acquired a slightly used Win 70 in 325WSM. In fact it had only two rounds shot thru it and the young man said it kicked too hard. I loaded 180gr TSX's and 200gr Woodleighs and both shot sub 1" at 100yds. I thought the recoil was no different than my 300WSM's. | |||
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From my point of wiew there is only one interesting 8mm "magnum" - and that is the 8x68S. Perfect case design, smooth feeding, and an aura of class... It pushes the 220grs Woodleigh at 2850 fps from my 26inch barrel, and has a trajectory as flat as a 300 mag. M | |||
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So let's see...the 30-06 is one of the most useful all around cartridges...but is a little light on the big stuff... A 338WM is a really useful cartridge but a little heavy for the lighter stuff... The 325 WSM splits the difference but is "no good"...  Let's see a .323 200 grn bullet with an SD of .274 with an MV around 2800 FPS...yeah that will never work Bullet Selection: Barnes 160, 180, 200 Hornady 150, 175, 195 IL Nosler 200 in Partition & AB Swift A Frames 200 & 220 Sierra 175 and 200 Nosler 180 BT I think Midway lists 30...probably won't be able to find one that shoots well in your rifle. Mike Legistine actu? Quid scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Ed, that's a very similar story to my Montana, buyer did one trip to the range, fired less than a box of ammo, brought it straight back and traded it. I'm planning on running the 180TSX, what powder are you using? Mike, you can add the 180gr E tip to that list of bullets as well, and you're right it's a calibre with a poor list of bullet choices..   John | |||
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I like the .325WSM for most everything. I've got the Browning A bolt Stainless Stalker. So far it's taken coyote, antelope, mule deer, whitetail deer, and elk. A doctor friend of mine has the Kimber Montana and likes it as well. Neither of us find the recoil objectionable. It doesn't recoil like the .505 Gibbs. Having laid in a supply of 300 rounds of brass apiece, we are GTG. I plan on taking it as my main rifle for plains game with my Ruger #1 in .338 Winchester as back up. JOE MACK aka The .41FAN HAVE MORE FUN AND GET THE JOB DONE WITH A .41 I am the punishment of God… If you had not committed great sins, God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you. (GENGHIS KHAN) | |||
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It's funny that some people claim you are over gunned for whitetail. Dead is dead. Hunt with what you want. Just last night, my friend told me I was going to be over gunned this season because I wanted to use my 7-08 for deer and hog. He's seen my 257R work really well. It sounded like he was trying to talk himself in to using a 223 this year so my 7-08 became a cannon. | |||
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My thoughts exactly.   | |||
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Johnfox--I am loading RL17 witht he 180gr TSX's and IMR4350 with the 200gr Woodleighs. | |||
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Wait....weren't all the WSM's supposed to be dead relics and ancient artifacts by now anyways? If you think every possible niche has been filled already, thank a wildcatter! | |||
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For the exact same reasons that most people prefer .338 caliber over .358 (better SD, BC and bullet selection), most people should prefer the 300 WSM over the 325. I don't! I have a 35 Whelen AI, not a 338-06. Never forget that the bigger bullet ALWAYS gives more to push on for greater velocity, and ALWAYS makes a bigger hole in the game. The 325 over the 308 is 10% bigger in cross sectional area. Like me with my 35 Whelen or Joe Mack with his 41 magnum, the 325 WSM may be a cartridge for someone who likes "different." But that SURE does not mean it can't bring the goods! | |||
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My entry into the 8mm arena is a Tikka T3 Stainless Sporter in 8x57 which I should have in a couple of weeks. To me an intersting mix of a very old cartridge in a modern rifle! Looking forward to it! | |||
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Thanks Ed. | |||
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The 325 WSM is an answer to a question no one is asking. | |||
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Many thanks for your insight Brad.....that applies to many cartridges in use around the globe, but thankfully it doesn't stop people from using and enjoying them. | |||
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Other than the 270 Win in 1925, and the 308 Win, the 338 WM, and the 223....everything else has been redundant. Mike Legistine actu? Quid scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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The 325 was a brain-fart extraordinaire from Olin. That it wasn't at least a .338 or .358 is one of the great mysteries. 8mm is so close to .308 as to be indistinguishable in the field, yet bullet availability is limited. The excellent 300 WSM was already firmly established and available world-wide. The selection of .308 bullets is vast. If a 30 cal 180 at 2,950 or a 200 at 2,800 can't do it, I'm mystified how the 8mm WSM will change the outcome, except it kicks more and is less available. The 8mm WSM is the answer to a question no one was asking... because at the time most of us were expecting and hoping for a .338 WSM. Like I said, brain fart. Obviously some love metric designations so the 8mm is for them. I prefer North American calibers  | |||
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Not quite yet..The ol´.333Jeffery sits in its ol´rockingchair spilling beer, laughing at these new magic magnums..  DRSS: HQ Scandinavia. Chapters in Sweden & Norway | |||
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Wonder if someone would start a thread on Terminal Velocity vs. Terminal Flatulence what kind of disscussion would entail. Probably not much different than this one. Then one could go on a rant about the different types and best production methods...........  GWB | |||
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If ya don't like a cartridge --then don't use it. No need to get insulting  SSR | |||
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I currently have two .325 WSM's, the latest being an MG Arms Ultralight. I have killed a lot of game in North America and in Africa with it, and quite handily I might add.  Same can also be said of my .300 WSM. | |||
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And to add insult to injury, Ruger came out with a great case in the 375Ruger, but did not develop that into the natural 338 Ruger with a 340 Weatherby capacity, but answered another unasked question with the 338RCM, essentially duplicating 338-06 ballistics when they could have improved on the 338WinMag. In the meantime, I'm happy with the 338WinMag. It's an absolutely great cartridge and certainly in the tradition of efficient, powerful chamberings. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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Tanzan: I disagree with you about the .338 RCM. I have had several .338 Win Mags. I also have a 340 Weatherby and I used to have a 35 Whelen. However, I can tell you that I much prefer my little wood stock .338 RCM with a 20 inch barrel over them all. It's a fantastic cartridge and it makes up into a really neat little compact package. Think of it as a light and handy .338/06. I have been shooting 225 grain Hornady Spire Points at 2600 fps but am thinking about switching to 185 grain TSX bullets. Now that we have the .338 RCM, I can't see why anyone would go through the trouble of building a .338/06. Just my two cents. Dave DRSS Chapuis 9.3X74 Chapuis "Jungle" .375 FL Krieghoff 500/.416 NE Krieghoff 500 NE "Git as close as y can laddie an then git ten yards closer" "If the biggest, baddest animals on the planet are on the menu, and you'd rather pay a taxidermist than a mortician, consider the 500 NE as the last word in life insurance." Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading (8th Edition). | |||
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I agree with Dave. The 338 RCM is a very nice round. I thought I bought a new one cheap on gunbroker but they lied and told me it was out of stock and would call me when they found one. I was pissed so I told them forget it. The 338 RCM in that compact package is a great combo. I ended up buying the original short mag. I found a used Ruger 350 Rem Mag at a good price. | |||
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Tikka T3 Lite in 338Win weighs 6 3/8 lbs and has a 24inch barrel according to Tikka website. Probably could be a little lively but much less than 8 pounds and I don't think Tikka break the bank either. And can get in left or right handed model "Science only goes so far then God takes over." | |||
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Jarrod is correct. I have had both the Tikka Hunter (wood) in 338Wm and Tikka Lite (synth.) in 338 Wm. They were both under 7.5 pounds even after adding the scope (Nikon Monarach 2-8, Nikon Prostaff 3-9). "Lively"? it depends. My 110 pound wife said that they jumped a little when she shot them. They were accurate and easy to carry with a very manageable recoil. One caveat: the Tikka aluminum scope rings are not up to the job. The retaining pin of one set broke through the side of the base. Tikka replaced them quickly and for free, but for hunting and in a situation with only one rifle some Warne steel rings should be used. Here is a picture of the aluminum rings after some 225 grain and 300 grain loads.  Holding the front ring where the pin has pulled out of the back  Viewed from the bottom to show the angle of the pin sticking out the back This is not advised for a happy hunt. Back to the thread. The 338RCM would not have this problem since Ruger rings are about as tough as they get. The Ruger Compact Magnum, though, is a very specialized round where a person would be satisfied with only 338-06 ballistics in a package with a short length of pull, shorter than a Tikka, for example. Of ocurse, the Ruger would provide a 'controlled-feed', always something to consider if around dangerous game. PS for Dave: I agree with you on the 338-06. I can't imagine why anyone would go to the trouble of building a 338-06 now that we have the 338RugCM. But coming up with less than the 338 WinM is not very attractive in my eyes. I like the extra 150 fps. On the other hand, I wouldn't have been very impressed with the 308 when it was brought out to replace the 30-06, either. A good round? Yes, but specialized for smaller packages. Adoption by the military and cheap rounds and cheap brass is what makes the 308 a great round. Ang ignoring that 150 fps. I could live with that if I needed a small package. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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I'd give the 325 WSM a try. Hell, there are many rounds out there that I would love to give a go. Is it an answer to a question no one asked? I don't care. The market will sort that out. However, the 325 is still here more than 6 years after this thread began. My next rifle will likely be a 300 WSM or a 280 AI. Why? Why not? I won't be selling my 300 WM or my 30-06 as they both have done their part when I've done mine. Do I need a 300 WSM or 280 AI? Absolutely not. Will I buy them? Absolutely! Oh, and there will still be a slot in the safe for a 325 should the whim strike. The early 21st Century is a pretty fun time to be a hunter and shooter in the U.S. | |||
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I have toyed with the idea of a 325 WSM for a while. Just haven't come across the right deal yet. Always hope to find a Browning Micro on sale....did once, passed on it, stupid choice! If you think every possible niche has been filled already, thank a wildcatter! | |||
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