Here are pics of Snowman's 9x57 guild rifle:





Sweet!

Cool!

I built my own 9X57 using a .358 bbl and I like it very much. However, it'll never have the cool factor this one has!

Not sure if I should post this here or on the original thread. Anyway I had 70 some rds that were loaded by the previous owner and I had 20 rds of new Rem 8x57 brass necked up. After bore sighting the rifle I shot a number of rds that were loaded by the previous owner. A mix of 158 gr jacketed pistol bullets, some 260 gr cast bullets and 250 gr Hawk jacketed bullets. The initial rds fired @ 30 yds and the 158 and 260 gr bullets grouped surprisingly close to together. Around 1 in @ 30 yds. Then moved out to 100 yds and tried the 220 Speer bullets loaded with 3031. Started with 40 grs of 3031 and the 220 Speer. This is a very low pressure load and barely fireforms the neck and shoulder area. These 40 gr loads grouped into about 1 1/2 inches @ 100 yds. I think the re-crowning of the barrel was a good idea. Ladder loads up to 45 grs of 3031 show no signs of pressure on the primers. POI has moved up about 2 inches from 40 thru 45 grs. Will update everyone after the next trip to the range.

quote:

Will update everyone after the next trip to the range.

Please do! I have worked up two very satisfactory loads, one jacketed and one cast, but I am open to other possibilities. There is so little load data for the 9X57, either old or new, that every person's experiences is valuable.

BTW, have you slugged the barrel on that jewel?

my understanding is, the commercial actions did not have the thumb cutout for a charger.

quote:

Originally posted by nanuk-O-dah-Nort:
my understanding is, the commercial actions did not have the thumb cutout for a charger.

The vast majority (well over 99%) of commercial Mauser actions made before WWII have a thumb cut. Virtually all had a charger as well. Snowman's rifle does not seem to have a commercial sporting action, based on other reasons, but it is no less a fine rifle.

Made another trip to the range. Loaded some more rounds with 8x57 Rem cases, 220 Speer bullets and IMR 3031. Started @ 45 grs and worked up to 47 grs.At 47 grs the cases fireform perfectly. POI has moved up a couple inches from 45 grs. 47 grs is grouping about 1 inch @ 100 yds with that old Bausch & Lomb 2-7 scope on . Not bad for an old rifle like this. Irreguardless if it was a commercial action or came out of a military armory . With the Mauser banner on the front receiver ring its obvious who made the action. When Mauser stopped producing actions with the thumb slot I do not know. Apparently FN lost the thumb slot in the late 40's or early 1950s
I don't think I'm likely going to improve the accuracy much from the 47 grs 3031/220 Speer so I may stop there. Would like to try this on a deer this fall.
Picked up around 100 rds of 9x57 rds formed from 06 cases and loaded with cast bullets. After I get those all fireformed and annealed I may try some 250 gr loads. Will let you know how that goes.

Your rifle's action is commercial in a sense. I believe its from K98 style battle rifle made to fill a contract with perhaps China or who knows. The action was made by Oberndorf Mauser, and is no different than an action that would have been used on one of their commercial sporters. You've got a fine looking and fine shooting rifle all the way around! I'm very jealous!

I just did some research. I believe that is a Chinese contract action, based on the Chinese Nationalist sunburst stamps. Like I said, the action is not different than a commercial sporter action, except the shape of the trigger guard bow.

Thanks for that Matt. Another piece of the puzzle.

quote:

Originally posted by ColoradoMatt:
I just did some research. I believe that is a Chinese contract action, based on the Chinese Nationalist sunburst stamps. Like I said, the action is not different than a commercial sporter action, except the shape of the trigger guard bow.

Matt In your research did you find any information reguarding approx. when Mauser might have filled a contract for China ?? The only number stamped on the action other than the serial # is a 29 under the sun on the left side of the action. Could that be referring to 1929 ? Again Thanks for your help.

I'm not sure. I'll ask around on a couple of military 98 forums, and see what I can find out. I think these rifles were probably made in the early 30's. Your rifles action could have come from an original Chinese contract rifle. However, I wonder if it's possible that the action came from a production overrun. I'm also curious to know if Mauser applied the sunburst stamps, or if the Chinese did it. Mauser usually applied such stamps.

No need for any Mauser forum; just ask me; the Chinese contract was delivered in the mid 1930s; to 1938; the Standard Modell was developed in 1933 to compete with the FN and CZ "standard model" rifles being sold world wide. (Made on Mauser equipment that they had to surrender per the Versailles treaty.) Remember, Germany was not allowed to make or export military rifles per the Versailles Treaty, but when the Nazis came in in 1933 Hitler ignored that. No one was going to stop them. From 1933 to 1938, the Mauser work force alone went from 1400 to 8300 workers. Standard Modells were made for literally every country in the world, including the US; the ReichsPost, the ReichsBahn, and other customers. In 1934, the first 98K was built for the German Army, which was just a slightly modified Standard Modell. The "alternate" Standard Modell of 1934 has all the features of the 98k of the same year.
And by 1938, Germany was well on it's way to full wartime production, and as promised, everyone had a job.
I have examples of all these, and in fact, all, 98ks.

Matt & DPCD Thanks for that info. dpcd the sun or sunburst stamp can be seen in the pics that Matt posted for me. Are those stamps consistant with other actions you have seen from the Chinese contracts ?? Assuming it was produced in the early to mid 1930's the steel would be quite hard compared to earlier 98 actions. No I have no intention of increasing pressures in this old rifle.

I should have just asked Tom. No one really knows mausers better.

I was offered one of these chinese "k98" rifles just last week, for a very good price, but I passed, as it was a little too rough and has no provenance on the left wall. The seller said he built a 416 Taylor on one with no issues. The 416 Taylor operates at up to about 63k psi. If I'm not mistaken, the 416 Taylor was submitted to SAAMI, by A- Square, several years ago. The Oberndorf contract mausers from this era are usually plenty hard. Vz24's are, on average, the hardest, and the best option for higher pressures, but it never hurts to have an actions hardness tested. Most folks have no issues, as long as they don't get crazy. While I would personaly keep that rifle just the way it is and shoot pretty standard loads, it could likely be rechambered to a Whelen or Whelen improved with no issues other than possibly needing some feed tweaking. However, there is absolutely no animal in North America that I would feel under gunned facing with a good 9x57 load.

Matt The 3031 loads I listed above are as hot as I intend to go. 45 grs and down don't even blow out the shoulder nice and sharp so I would think pressure is quite low (under 40K). POI moved up slightly with 46 and again with 47 grs. Groups shrank to just under 1 in with 47 grs. From data I have that should be in the 45K psi range and the 220 gr bullets should be close to 2400 fps.As you have indicated that should be lots of stopping for most North American situations. Will have to drag the chronograph to the range sometime soon to confirm this. This action is quite smooth so I suspect the gunsmith would have smoothed the action up a bit. Certainly better than an action that went the full military route. I have no intention of re-chambering or re-barreling. Its nice to know you have a strong, hard action even though I have no intention of pushing it pressure wise.

Started some testing with the 200 gr Hornady spire pts. Groups are not as tight as the 220 gr Speer groups. However there is a couple loads that have the same POI as the 220 's do. Will play with them some more. Next will be some 250 gr loads. Just to see what they will do. I'm thinking this old rifle is going to see a steady diet of the 220 Speer's, it shoots them that well.