I am buying a new rifle for my young daughter she will be nine .She has been shooting her 223 since she was seven .7mm 08 is the caliber but the rifle is making me nuts .I wanted the model seven youth but my dad says to stick with a 22 inch model .Know i am looking at the mountain rifle , Tikka T3 , and the new Savage model 16 with the accu brake ,And cutting the winner down to around 12 3/4 or so with a good recoil pad Am I nuts .

Woodie

I hope you handload because the 7mm-08 kicks quite a bit with full power loads.

Woodie,
I recommend you get the youth model 7 Remington in 308. Why? I have shot several model 7 Remingtons in 308, my wife and I have used them for many years. At nine she needs a short light rifle [I like them too ]. Remington and Federal both offer LOW RECOIL loads for deer hunting. The Rem Mod 7 in 308 and the low recoil loads are a perfect match.
I would mount a low power scope or a variable in the 1.5x5 power range as some new shooters have trouble finding the game if the scope power is too high.

7mm -08 is going to be a handfull for a 9 year old. Having been through this with my now 18 year old son. Any adult sized bolt action with a cut off stock is going to be very hard to handle. Will not balance, lots of weight on the forend. If it's light enough for a 9 year old to hold the 7-08 will pack a punch.
A muzzle break is a very bad idea - too much noise. I tried to cut down a Parker Hale 243 Win. - Ended up changing out the stock, new bolt handle and cutting the barrel to 20 ". By the time I got it all done he was ready for full size gun. - He picked a Browning A Bolt II composite stalker in 7-08 and loves it.

If I had to do it again, A NEF handy rifle or TC Encore in 243 Win or 260 Rem or even 30-30 with a compact 4X scope. Then at 14 years or so get your Model 7 or another barrel for the Encore.

Good luck

I second what NE said. First of all you can take advantage of the factory low recoil loads. When she becomes older and can adjust better to the recoil, she not only has a great white tail gun, but something with which she can hunt larger game as well.

I am a big fan of the 250-3000 for youngsters but to tell the truth I don't know if you can get it in a factory youth rifle anymore. Probably a rebarrel job on a 22-250. OTOH, a 22-250 with premium bullets is a substantial step up from a 223 and isnb't hard to find.

quote:

Originally posted by woodie:
I am buying a new rifle for my young daughter she will be nine .She has been shooting her 223 since she was seven .7mm 08 is the caliber but the rifle is making me nuts .I wanted the model seven youth but my dad says to stick with a 22 inch model .Know i am looking at the mountain rifle , Tikka T3 , and the new Savage model 16 with the accu brake ,And cutting the winner down to around 12 3/4 or so with a good recoil pad Am I nuts .

Woodie

Your dad probably has some good reasons for his advice to you. Why not discuss it with him and see what you come up with? He just might surprise you.

I think a 18-20" barrel will be fine in a 7mm-08 or similar caliber. I've got a Ruger 77 RSI in 308 and a Dumoulin in 338 both with short barrels. The 338 has a little muzzle blast but the 308 is just fine. I've used it with new shooters to get them used to high power rifles without getting to much on the "high" side.

I also agree with one of the previous posts, seriously consider something in .308, or any other cartridge offered with the reduced recoil rounds. If you don't handload this makes them a real winner for kids or adults who can't take much recoil.

I've been teaching a friends 9 year old son to shoot recently, he shot a 54 in a sporting clays shoot last Saturday, after only a month of training. He's shooting a youth model single shot 20 gauge with no ill effects. I've also had him shooting my SKS off a bench (It's too heavy for him to hand hold), and next up is the Ruger in .308 with reduced handloads.

If a shooter can handle a 308, they can handle a 7mm-08!

These are very similar and you can get bullets that are very close in weight for either of these!

If you have the 7mm-08 in mind, stick with it!
If you can reduce the loads in a 308, it can also be done with the 7mm-08!

I would suggest that you go ahead and get the M-7 Youth and put a recoil pad on it, as your daughter grows and needs a full size rifle, just put a thicker recoil pad on it, to make the stock the same length as a regular M-7!

My wife and I each have an M-7. Mine is a 7mm-08 and hers is a .308. Reason being, she wanted the newer one! We have both hunted with each of the rifles, there's not a hill-of-beans difference in them!

Chuck, if they can handle a 308 WITH LOW RECOIL loads, that doesn't mean they will be able to handle full-house 7-08 loads.

It's all in the balance and leverage. You need to get the weight closer to the shooter. Instead of taking the 2" off the barrel, I'd take it off the action. A single action like the handi-rifle might just be the ticket. You can trade it on a real gun when she grows up.

Both my young-uns graduated from their Chipmunk to a Savage 223 with a "cadet" stock. It is still really far to unwieldy for them (at 11 and 12) to shoot well off-hand. Supported, they are both deadly with it. They now each have 270's, and again, they are too big for off-hand shooting, but for supported shots, they are managing well. With reduced loads.

If I had to do it over again, the handi-rifle would be high on the list for a first rifle. FWIW, Dutch.

I'd like to second the .308 Model 7 with light loads, however the premium pick would be a Model 7 in .260. With 120 grain bullets, recoil would be practically nill. The 7mm-08 is a handload only proposition for light loads, the .260 comes by them naturally, and they are sold especially for the .308 by at least two ammo companies. A plus for the .308 is that as your daughter grows, there is an abundance of cheap practice ammo to be had.

On the other hand, if your budget allows, a Kimber 84 in any of .260 Rem, 7mm-08, or .308 would put a light compact rifle in her hands - with a 22 inch tube to boot. You cannot appreciate this rifle until you've held it in your hands. I would take off the factory stock and replace it with suitably short version (perhaps a synthetic) - please don't have her shooting with an ill fitted stock.

Woodie,

I have a walnut stocked Remington Seven in 260 if you think your daughter might like a 6.5mm bore.

A rifle chambered for the 260Rem. or 6.5x55 Swede would be a good choice. Before I'd pick a 7mm-08, I'd go with the 308Win. As noted, there are reduced loads available for the 308, from both Remington & Federal.
Another option that comes to mind is the Ruger Ultra-Lite (20"barrel) in 257Roberts. Very mild recoil, and plenty effective for deer hunting.

9 year old? I second the .257 and if you load a 120 gr. bullet at 2600 fps it will get the job done. roger

I went through the same process with both of my daughters and they picked the Encore rifle based on feel and ergonomics. Since i handload, we got it in 270 and they shot the 130 grain BTs at 2700 fps with a smile. The rifle is 6.5 lbs and 38 inches long with a 24 inch bbl. Load is 36.5 grs XMP5744 for 2750 fps and 13.6 FP of free recoil...a couple of FP less than the 260 and a dead ringer for the 243 with 100 gr factory loads.

As they get older, i can just adjust the loads...there is always an accurate loads at every level with the 270.

Its just personal preference, but i have learned to appreciate the utility of a quality single shot for youth hunting and shooting. Quick follow up shots are not, or should not, be the issue and there is no way to get the compact handling qualities of a single shot in a bolt rifle without getting the bbl very short and dealing with more muzzle blast then they need to.

We recently ordered an M7 youth in 7mm-08 for my wife. The youth model synthetic does come with a recoil pad, but I'd be wary of that caliber for a 9 year old. I have an M7 laminated stock in 7mm-08 myself, and because of the light weight, the recoil is stout. I let my wife try it before we ordered hers, and she's pretty tolerant of recoil, but said she wouldn't want much more. I might suggest a .243 as well, unless you're planning on really down-loading the 7/08 for her.

Oh, I forgot to mention, I don't think you'd have a problem with a 20" tube, as you should lose only around 50-75 fps, while saving some weight. I wouldn't limit myself that way. If you're looking for a light rifle, look for a light rifle!

Woodie,

I've been thinking (always dangerous) about what Trigger said and why not a Marlin in 30-30 with a low power variable scope? I think they used to make a shorter youth model but I can't remember for sure. The recoil should (I think) be okay, besides I think a lever gun would be something a kid would think is really cool. Not a bad deer cartridge either.

It would be ideal of course if she could try a couple of shots out of whatever caliber you are thinking of getting before you commit funds...

Hope that helps.

Roi

They're not real plentiful anymore, but one of the 700's, BDL, stainless, DM chambered in .260Remington, 24" barrel(nobody does them like this anymore!!!!) with the synthetic stock is about as balanced a rifle as a kid could shoot!!! Or an adult for that matter!!! The rifles were light, and with the extra barrel length, balanced extremely well and when I and a friend sat down at the bench with his son's Model 7 SS, Synthetic in 7mm-08 and my daughters .260, 700 DM with the 24" barrel, he couldn't beleive the difference!!! Neither could the kids!!! My daughter now has 3 good bucks(2, 8's 0ver 17" and a 12 that is (271 yards, 197 yards, and Daddy called her one in, 27 yards!!! She has yet to see a deer take astep after the trigger pull!!!! The load I've used for her is 43.00 grains of VARGET and the 100 grain Nosler Balistic Tips. The .260 is a kid's and small stature person's dream!!! GHD

I have a little 6 X 45 that my kid used and it's light....extremely low recoil and kills deer very well.....food for thought....built on a mini mauser action

quote:

Originally posted by Dutch:
Chuck, if they can handle a 308 WITH LOW RECOIL loads, that doesn't mean they will be able to handle full-house 7-08 loads.

Dutch; I wasn't implying that! I was meerly saying that if you can reduce the load in a 308, that you can reduce the load in a 7mm-08! I didn't know that factory, reduced loads were available! Good idea!

Woodie; I think your Dad wants you to stick with the longer barreled rifle for safety reasons! The longer the barrel, the less likely you are to accidently point it at yourself!

woodie, Have your daughter try out(hold) the youth and regular model 7, she'll probably like the youth better, load it up with 39-40.5grs. of RE15 or Varget with a 139 Hornady SP, 9 1/2 primers,(these loads would be similer to the reduced loads Remington is putting out for the 308) and have her shoot it, my son was 9 when he first shot my S/S 708 with full power loads, (and he wasn't very big at the time), he didn't have any problems with it, other than it was a bit too long in the LOP area. That being said, I see the youth model 7 has a 12 3/8th LOP, and that should work just right for your girl. And btw, 40.5grs. Varget w/139 Hornady is the load I used for a buddy with his mdel 7 and the first 3 shots went .505" @100yds. Jay

My son, who is big for his age, did not warm up to his 7mm-08 with 20†barrel until he was 11-1/2 years old (after he outgrew the youth stock), and that’s with a combination of Decelerator pad, PAST recoil shield, and light loads. At 12-1/2, he still is shooting slightly downloaded ammo. YMMV