Hi Guys

I know this has probably been discussed before but I'm thinking of building a new rifle. It will be used for majority of plains game as well as leopard. Now the fun part is deciding which calibre to get? I'm leaning towards any of the 300's but not sure which one to get. Any advice will be appreciated

Good hunting
MD

A 300 Magnum is a good idea for plains game but not for the leopard ! The leopard is a big game ! There are enough wounded animals in the bush !

More versatile is the 375 H&H or better a .416 caliber ! For a medium bore rifle a 8x57IS or a 9,3x62 is a good choice .

The 300 win mag has the biggest selection of factory loads. If you reload brass is cheaper and easy to find. If you want more velocity then go with a 300 RUM. I would also go with a 26 inch barrel in whatever one you chose.

I am sure either will stop a leopard with a good shot.

BigB

I love my 300 WSM and my 325 WSM. They will kill any plains game and leopard as well.

quote:

Originally posted by grandveneur:
A 300 Magnum is a good idea for plains game but not for the leopard ! The leopard is a big game ! There are enough wounded animals in the bush !

More versatile is the 375 H&H or better a .416 caliber ! For a medium bore rifle a 8x57IS or a 9,3x62 is a good choice .

Hi there

Leopards aren't very tough... A good soft from a high velocity will shut their lights out completely. When we guide for leopard we prefer a client to use a like a 300 win mag.

I was looking real hard at the 300 h&h. Ammo and brass is readily available... Any thought?

There are no flies on the 300 H&H. Lots of history and performance.

It does require a longer action, or more work to a Mauser to fit.

What action are you looking at using?

Jeremy

I like the 338wm.

quote:

Originally posted by Rub Line:
I like the 338wm.

I did look at it but I felt its just a bit big

quote:

Originally posted by Rub Line:
I like the 338wm.

Ditto.

nothing wrong with a 300 win mag

Nothing wrong with a .300 H&H or 300 Win Mag, but the .338 really gets their attention. The 300 mags extend the range over a 30/06, but don't really kill noticeably better. The .338WM is a noticeable step up in killing power, and with 200 or 210 bullets doesn't give up anything to the 300 mags in long range ability.

Another vote for the .338 Win Mag. I've shot everything from Impala to Eland with mine on 8 trips to Africa. It's my go to gun for plains game. I shoot handloads using the 225 Gr. Nosler Partition at 2830 fps. I haven't shot any Leopards, but I'm wouldn't hesitate to use this combination for Mr. Spots.

The 300 is ideal for Leopard BUT I prefer the 9.3x62 (or the other two similar 9.3's).
It is an almost perfect PG rifle for 90% of PG hunting and works fine on the likes of Buffalo and I would even use it on Bull Elephant if needed.

I could have my video of the 300WM shooting my leopard in a couple of weeks.You will see how nice it works.

If you are leaning towards the H&H I don't think you will be disappointed. There may be some slight advantage to the WM and a bit more to the 338 but for PG and leopard IMHO the 300H&H will serve you well.

With proper bullets, I believe any current .300 Mag chambering is fully adequate for any leopard that ever has lived or will live.

Maybe not fully adequate for all possible shots on Eland, but then an Eland is many times larger than the biggest leopard.

I would go for the 9.3X62. You will get ammo anywhere in africa, it is flat shooting out to 250 meters & adequate for DG in a crunch. It is easy to shoot and is an awesome round on the kind of game you mention.

quote:

Originally posted by MD375:
I was looking real hard at the 300 h&h. Ammo and brass is readily available... Any thought?

.300 H&H is about the only .300 magnum I'd really like to own.

300 H & H is definitly the sexiest of the bunch and more than adequate for your needs w/ todays bullets. Action choice needs to be addressed as it is long.
The 338 WM is probably a better choice. Easy to get good ammo or handload. Not punishing to shoot and hits hard. A draft horse instead of a race horse.

quote:

Originally posted by aliveincc:
300 H & H is definitly the sexiest of the bunch and more than adequate for your needs w/ todays bullets. Action choice needs to be addressed as it is long.
.

+1

.300 Win Mag or .300 H&H, and you simply can't go wrong.

Of the 3 I have had the .300 Win Mag and still have a .300 Weatherby. No flies on either of those, and no flies on the .300 H&H.

With brass available I think the .300 H&H would be the better option, with the .300 Win Mag in second place. I like the .300 Weatherby, but in reality it is not that much better than the .300 Win Mag, and neither are that much better than the .300 H&H.

You and whatever you shoot with it won 't be able to tell the difference between the 3. JMO

A 300 winchester mag would be a great choice, but my personal preference is the 338 win mag. I think the 338 may be the ultimate, "one gun for everything" caliber. I typically shoot 225 grain bullets in my 338 and 180s in my 300 win. Of note, I do not think the recoil from a 338 is any worse than the 300, and in fact the felt recoil seems to be less. I can assure you it is significantly less recoil than my 300 rem ultra mag!

Really, there is nothing you can't shoot effectively with a 338. I've shot game as small as klipspringer and as large as a kodiak bear with it, and it dispatched all of them efficiently. I do think a 338 has a noticably bigger impact upon an animal, than does any 300. I love to elk hunt, and anyone who hunts elk know that a big bull is a tough animal, as tough as any PG in Africa. It is nice to see a big bull simply fold up on the spot and collapse right there when properly shot with a 338. Of the elk I've killed, the only ones that have collapsed in place were all shot with a 338. The others, shot with either a 270, 30-06 or 300 mag, all traveled at least a short distance after being shot. Where legal, I would not hesitate to shoot a cape buffalo with a 338, using heavier bullets of course.

As far as the comment about a 300 not being enough for a leopard... BS! I've only shot 2 leopards, the first with a 300 winchester shooting a 180 gr nosler partition. DRT!, he fell from the limb upside down and limp, hit the ground like a sack of potatoes and never twitched. Shot my other one with the 338 and 225 grain trophy bonded bearclaws. That combo did a very quick number on that big kitty. Either will work fine, as would a 30-06 or even a 270 for a leopard over bait. If hunting leopard over bait, I would not hesitate to use a 270 with 150 grain noslers.

quote:

Really, there is nothing you can't shoot effectively with a 338.

The same thing can be said about the .375 H&H. The OP wasn't asking about such things, he was asking about .30 caliber magnums.

Not .338's/9.3x62's/.35 Whelens/9.3x74R's or .375 H&H's, but .30 calibers.

OP:

quote:

I know this has probably been discussed before but I'm thinking of building a new rifle. It will be used for majority of plains game as well as leopard. Now the fun part is deciding which calibre to get? I'm leaning towards any of the 300's but not sure which one to get. Any advice will be appreciated

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:

quote:

Really, there is nothing you can't shoot effectively with a 338.

The same thing can be said about the .375 H&H. The OP wasn't asking about such things, he was asking about .30 caliber magnums.

Not .338's/9.3x62's/.35 Whelens/9.3x74R's or .375 H&H's, but .30 calibers.

OP:

quote:

I know this has probably been discussed before but I'm thinking of building a new rifle. It will be used for majority of plains game as well as leopard. Now the fun part is deciding which calibre to get? I'm leaning towards any of the 300's but not sure which one to get. Any advice will be appreciated

Jeez, Crazy, sorry to have upset your apple cart. The OP said he was "leaning toward any of the 300s but not sure which one to get and that any advice would be appreciated". I apologize that trying to offer some advice, which the OP requested, got your panties in such a wad, especially since I also referenced a couple different 300s. SHEESH!

md375: If you said what action your are planning to use I missed it. Regardless, don't put any of the belted .30 magnums in a magazine of less than "full length" (around 3.6"). The .300 Winchester has been made on lots of actions with only 3.35" magazines, but that crowds it a great deal -- and such magazines are totally inadequate for the longer .300 H&H. By far my personal preference for any of these cartridges would be an L61R Sako (or one of its latter-day successors).

I own both a .300 Winchester and a .300 H&H (in virtually identical rifles). The H&H happens to be my favored of the two, largely because it happens to be more consistently accurate and provides velocities virtually the same as the Winchester round. The Winchester version may be the more practical, however. You should be happy with either. Chambering for a larger case like the Ultramag or the preposterous .300-.378 is a fool's errand which will result in only more muzzle blast and recoil at the expense of barrel life and ammunition economy. Loaded to the same pressures, these mega rounds will only give you an additional 200 fps or so and that boost is only marginally useful for (theoretically) extending the range, not better terminal performance at normal ranges.

By the way, not having hunted, much less shot, leopard, you can exclude me from the category of "expert" on the matter. But I do know that a large one will weigh around 175 pounds (and most are somewhat smaller) and that mammalian flesh is mammalian flesh. A broadly-expanding soft point from a medium-bore rifle like a .30 magnum should be much more quickly lethal on the relatively small animals than a heavy caliber like a .375 or .458. I'd much prefer hunting leopard with my .270 whitetail loads than with a 510 grain .458.

MD375,

I've owned and shot the 308, 30-06, 300 Win Mag, 300 WSM, 300 RUM and 300 H & H Mag. They all work. Hard to say which one was my favorite. I killed more stuff with the 300 WSM. However, I particularly liked that rifle, consequently I used it the most. Am working with the 308 Win. and 300 H & H now.

Although not new, I enjoyed this article in regard to what the author terms the most versatile 300.

http://www.reloadersnest.com/a...le_300hh_oct2803.asp

Perhaps, more than is required, I'm working up loads with 200 grain accubonds in the H & H for some of our Texas porkers

Best

GWB

If you are a hand loader, either a 300 or a .338 Ruger Compact Magnum. You have to handle one of these little guns to see how well they behave in your hands. Think light and handy.

For me it would all depend on what weights of bullets I wanted to use. The 300 Win does a scosh better with 150 to 180 grain bullets velocity wise while the 300 H&H will give a little more velocity with 200 and 220 grain bullets. The heavy bullets have to be seated deeply into the short necked Win case cutting case capacity.

465H&H

quote:

Originally posted by Nakihunter:
I would go for the 9.3X62. You will get ammo anywhere in africa, it is flat shooting out to 250 meters & adequate for DG in a crunch. It is easy to shoot and is an awesome round on the kind of game you mention.

I'm with you though with the 9.3mm 250 Accubond running 2500-2600 fps and a bc (.494) right between the Nosler 165 (.475) and 180 (.507) Accubonds is more akin to a 308 Win for ballistics and I would dare say most would agree that's more of a 400-500 yd proposition for PG; though not at that range for Leopard.

Alan

In re-reading your original question, I note you already live in Africa, and that you plan on "building" your rifle, not just "buying" it. To me, that suggests some more possibilities and comments.

First, it means to me that you are not stuck with having to choose from commercial rifles or chamberings available in the nearest stores, and that you won't have to worry about bringing either the rifle or wildcat cartridges through Customs, IF you choose to opt for a wildcat.

You might not wish to take the "wildcat" option as there are other downsides such as lack of available factory ammo, but that is another topic.

Anyway, if I was in your situation I would think a bit about choosing either a .30/.338 Magnum, or a .308 Norma Magnum. They are not identical, but in many of the less carefully spec'd older custom rifles built in the U.S. in the early 1960s, ammo for either would work in the other and the performance of both is virtually identical whether or not the cartridges will interchange in a given rifle.

In the 1960s, many folks chose the .30/.338 over the .300 Win Mag for these reasons:

1. The .30/.338 and .308 Norma Mag have a longer neck than the .300 Winchester, making it more practical to handload heavy bullets in the round (IF one wants to use heavier bullets occasionally). (Many folks felt the two rounds to be what Winchester SHOULD have introduced rather than the one it did field in the marketplace.)

2. Velocity difference between the .30/.338 and the .300 Win Mag is not enough different to make any noticeable variance in killing power.

3. Brass for the .300/.338 or .308 Norma Mag is dead easy to make from 7 m/m Rem Mag, .300 Win, .300 H&H, .375 H&H, .358 Norma Mag, or other belted mag donor stock. Being able to transform all those other cases can be handy in country where any one particular brass may sometimes be hard to come by.

4. The .30/.338 or 308 Norma Mag is (are?) a true short magnum round(s), which means it is easy to load either one so that it will fit well in a .30-06 length magazine, even with heavy bullets.

This is not speculation or theory on my part. I currently own rifles in .300 H&H, .30/.338, .300 Win Mag, and .300 Wby Mag, and have owned other .300 Mag variants as well. I've loaded, shot, and hunted with all of them for many years.


FOR YOUR STATED USE, I would select either the .300 Win Mag, or the .30/.338 wildcat (or .308 Norma) magnum. Either will do very well what you need to be done, ammo for the .300 Win Mag will pass through Customs without trouble if you hunt in other countries, and .300 Win ammo is pretty commonly available in gun shops world wide.

The two I would NOT select for your use would be the .300 H&H and the .300 Wby. Both are excellent performers, but they have the downsides of requiring longer magazines (which may entail added cost), and having fewer potential donor cases from which they can be made if things get really tight.

In the long run, ANY .300 magnum will do just fine for Leopard (and other thin-skinned generally sub-750 pound PG and DG up through lion..lion with premium bullets and selected shots), but those are the two I would choose between...the .300 Win Mag and the .30/.338 Mag.

Have fun selecting, building, AND USING your new rifle!

I have not hunted Africa so I am reading this more with interest than to contribute. However, I saw mention of the .300 Weatherby. What many do not realize is that you can shoot .300 H&H ammo in it with good results. I have done this myself. I just thought it was worthy to bring up. By the way, I am a 300H&H user of many years and it is my favorite cartridge.

quote:

Jeez, Crazy, sorry to have upset your apple cart. The OP said he was "leaning toward any of the 300s but not sure which one to get and that any advice would be appreciated". I apologize that trying to offer some advice, which the OP requested, got your panties in such a wad, especially since I also referenced a couple different 300s. SHEESH!

Wew, you really take this stuff serious don't you!!!! The OP said he was leaning toward one of the .30 mags., I guess I just took that to mean he was wanting advice on which .30 Mag., not which caliber is someone else's choice. Dude get a life. I made an assumption based on the question in the OP.

If I would have assumed that the mention of choosing between various .30 mags. was just on the part of the person asking the question, and felt that he needed to know my favorite I would have suggested the .35 Whelen or the .375 H&H. Since the person was asking about .30 Mags, I just gave my opinion on the .30 mags. and the fact that he had put parameters on the question.

Have a Good Day.

quote:

Originally posted by Crazyhorseconsulting:

quote:

Jeez, Crazy, sorry to have upset your apple cart. The OP said he was "leaning toward any of the 300s but not sure which one to get and that any advice would be appreciated". I apologize that trying to offer some advice, which the OP requested, got your panties in such a wad, especially since I also referenced a couple different 300s. SHEESH!

Wew, you really take this stuff serious don't you!!!! The OP said he was leaning toward one of the .30 mags., I guess I just took that to mean he was wanting advice on which .30 Mag., not which caliber is someone else's choice. Dude get a life. I made an assumption based on the question in the OP.

If I would have assumed that the mention of choosing between various .30 mags. was just on the part of the person asking the question, and felt that he needed to know my favorite I would have suggested the .35 Whelen or the .375 H&H. Since the person was asking about .30 Mags, I just gave my opinion on the .30 mags. and the fact that he had put parameters on the question.

Have a Good Day.

No, not that serious. I just had a short fuse for criticism at the moment, as I was having a very public debate with an idiot (not you, not suggesting you're an idiot at all) over on a high school sports website. I didn't, and don't, think the criticism was warranted, but hey, it's the internet and we are all 'experts' on here, aren't we. No worries on my part.

BTW, I started another thread asking about advice on building a nice single shot. The 35 Whelen is one of the calibers I'm interested in, but nobody said anything about it on there. I'd appreciate your thoughts on it, and if you'd send them privately, we won't pollute this thread.

I took a .338 WM on my plains game safari, and it was perfect. Zebras are tough, my 225 grain ttsx dropped it drt. All animals were down where they stood.
Remember, in Africa there are a LOT of predators/scavengers, so you can't let an animal sit in the bush overnight and come back the next day to track it. There won't be anything left. Jackals, hyenas, etc.
Don't risk a $2,000 + trophy fee on that eland. Bigger IS better.

quote:

(not you, not suggesting you're an idiot at all)

No, I am an idiot and do say things all to often without thinking how what I am saying is coming across.

Keeping pollution to a minimum, I like the .35 Whelen and if you handload/reload you can get really great performance out of it.

Sorry for my other comments.

If I was doing a 30 cal...I'd do a 300 H&H very classic and the thing will feed like greasy pig at a county fair.

I sure like a 338 win mag, but the more and more I shoot...I find that I used my 338 less and less, and my 375 ultra and 9.3x62 more and more.

I sure miss my 8x68S...and if brass was more avl. I'd look at getting another---that leaves the 8mm mag...if only it had the bullet selection of the 30's....

300 H&H for classic sex appeal
338 win mag for the practical person in all of us.
8mm mag just because!
Or--- the 300 Weatherby or Ultra mag for all rolled up in one!!!

See I can't make my mind up either!!!

Have fun with your pick!!!

Ed

What do you have now? Do you need to fill an existing gap? Replace something? Or is this a new rifle just 'cuz you need a new rifle?

LWD