I just have to wonder: If you put a .277 150-grain Partition or TSX in the same spot as a .284 160-grain Partition or TSX, and within 200 fps of each other, would the hunt end the same?

I'm guessing yes it would.

...as long as both impact velocities are sufficient for proper expansion.

its really unfair..270win Vs 7mmRem.

The contest should have been .270wea Vs 7mmRem! The 270 wea wins in all bulletsweigts up to 180 grain..Basta Finito!

quote:

Originally posted by Reloader:
I currently own two 270 Wins and 3 7RMs. I prefer the 7RMs over the 270s, but they both work on small critters at close range. I get 3100-3125 in the 7RM with 150s, the 270s are good for ~ 2850 with 150s. Inside of 250 yds, that's not much of a difference, but when you shoot 300-400, it's enough difference for me to pick the 7RM in many applications.

It's really not an apples to apples comparison and will give a debate from now on. Sort of like the debates that the 30-06 is equal to the 300WM, 308 to the 30-06, or the 7-08 to the 280. There is indeed a difference in all of them, but the difference doesn't really apply to most hunters as most game is killed at less than 200 yards.

If you intend to shoot at extended distances or larger game is on the menu, the 7RM will be a more suitable cart IMO.

That is a very good response. Within 250 yards you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. The matter of fact .270 is easier to shoot and cost less.

Over 250 yards, I would pick 300WM over the 7mm as you have more options for heavier bullets. This is just me.

The bottom line is that it depends on what you want your rifle to do.

quote:

Originally posted by jens poulsen:
its really unfair..270win Vs 7mmRem.

The contest should have been .270wea Vs 7mmRem! The 270 wea wins in all bulletsweigts up to 180 grain..Basta Finito!

I agree - even the 270 wsm will give the 7m mag a run for its money!

I prefer the long neck of the .270 Winchester for reloading.

quote:

Originally posted by Jerry Eden:
TJ'S kinda right on this one for the average guy, I guess. In my case however, I have shot several elk with the 270 Winchester, and NOT with what you would call a "Premium Bullet", and the results have been nothing less than spectacular!! Bang/flop on all of them. My son has shot several with the 270 Winchester as well, same result. Now the caveot, all of the shots were under or about 200 yds, and all the shots were placed, EXACTLY where intended. I don't have much patience for the arguments that you need more powder, or a bigger bullet, just in case you make a mistake. Don't make one!

Is it possible, that most, (and this is just a comment not based on anything other than my experiences) shooters who use the 270 might be a little more practiced with their rifles, and therefore because of less recoil etc, they are better shots, with their rigs?

Jerry

Messr. Eden...

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree here. Unfortunately, not all of us are capable of placing our shots EXACTLY where we intend to everytime, even within 200 yards. Also, unpredictable and/or unavoidable variables can at times affect shot placement within 200 yards and even more so afterwords. (e.g. animal moving after shot fired, gust of wind, imperfect round, meteorite falling to earth etc.).

You may not have mcuh patience for the approach that bigger and faster can be advantagous, but I believe there is at least some validity to this conclusion. For one, no amount of practice is ever going to eleminate all mistakes or misfortunes. In said circumstances, bigger holes and higher velocities do make a difference in that they equate to bloodier animals. The more the animal bleeds on an imperfect hit (not really sure what a perfect shot is), the easier it is to track/find... also more humane to dispatch of animal as quickly as possible.

That said, I'm not sure that there is really that significant of a difference between these two particular rounds within 200 yards. Even so, I would rather make an imperfect shot on a grizzly with a .458 than a .22. Like golf, hunting is often a game of misses.

Regarding your other conclusion...Do you also find that in your experience 6.5mm, 257, 243, etc. shooters are more practiced than 270 shooters?

It seems someone on the other side of the fence could just as subjectively draw the opposite conclusion (i.e. the inexperienced stick with the pee shooters). In my most humble of opinions, the more "practiced" shooters and hunters are literally the more practised shooters and hunters.

P.S. I am aware that shot placement and bullet construction are king, but I feel confident that most everyone on this forum has heard that said, or at least read it here, a thousand times... whoops, I guess I just said it anyways.

I shot my Bore with my 7mm Mag running across a field. I used the 160 bullet.

I wouldn't use my 270 Win for that. Thats how I feel about it.

.284" - .277" = .007"

If you "split a hair" it's about .007" each half.

I'm a died in the wool .270 slut. That may influence my opinion that the 7rem mag is the most over rated cartridge out there! I generally don't split hairs over cartridges. In reality one can group a half dozen cartridges together in the spectrum and find no real advantage or disadvantage. It's mostly nit picking paper ballistics that are the basis for argument and I don't hunt paper. Shoot what turns your crank and since it's what you shoot it's damn right the best thing since sliced bread.

quote:

Originally posted by Indy:
You can usually get five .270 rounds in your magazine. With a 7mm, it's mostly three.

Two more than I usually need, and I like having a little longer point-blank range...I'll stick with my 7mm.

I've had 2 .270's, now in possession of our sons, and currently have a .300 Win Mag. I've loaded the .270 with 130g going out the tube at 3100 and the .300Win Mag with 180g out the tube at 3050 and for deer out to 400 yards I could not tell the difference in performance.

For elk at extended ranges, I like the .300 Win Mag for a little extra margin.

I would think that whichever suits your fancy is the one for you.

Maki

I only hunt deer with the 270. For Moose and Elk it's my 300 win Mag(hence the name) but I only hunt then in B.C. (hence the name). There is just more game here and the license issues now that I don't live in Sask.

quote:

Originally posted by fredj338:
...I have no use for the 270, never armed to it. ...So for me, it's a 280....

Are you serious? Geez, that's mighty particular of you! Those two chamberings are about as close as they get to one another...

Go with the 7MM just because of the much larger bullet choices. The 280 Rem. or the 7MM mag. depending on the rifle configuration. The 280 in a short, light mountain rifle or the 7mm Mag. in something like a Rem. Sendro. The 280 has much less recoil compared to the small velocity loss.

Just MHO........Tom

The 7mm Rem Mag is eclipsed by the .30 Mags. I think the better comparison with the .270 Win is better done with a .264 Win Mag rather than the 7mm Rem Mag. I personally think the .264 Win Mag and .270 Win are essentially equivalent with the .264 Win Mag having somewhat better ballistics due to higher BC bullets.

I bought a 7mm Rem Mag barreled action and took it apart to make a .458 AR. Frankly a good use of such a rifle. I bought a .270 FN commercial barreled action in .270 Win as well as a Mark X barreled action in .264 Win Mag to take apart to make bigger bores. Both shot so well I was embarrassed to take them apart.

I have not been impressed by the terminal (impact) characteristics of the .270 Win ... even on small Texas deer. It does kill, but I hate to trackup deer that have gone 50 to 100 yards into deep snake country.

quote:

I hate to trackup deer that have gone 50 to 100 yards into deep snake country.

Deep snake country! That's a new one on me.

The more snakes you run into, the more belts and hatbands you can make.

Rojelio

Jack O'Conner was quite adamant that his .270s have 22" barrels. He was also happy with the Featherweight...Now you can have a rifle made with a smaller magazine, making the rifle even lighter.
The kind of people here would want to shoot as much as possible, so shooting a 7Mag as light as a .270 could be made could cause a shooter to have fun with fewer rounds. A 7Mag with a 22" tube would lose enough velocity that there is less reason to use it over a .270.
The reason there less variations of bullets for the .270...Ya don't need as many, IMHO.
Have fun,
Gene

I think there are both good and bad in each cartridge. The 7mm has a broader bullet selection over the .270. Both could be used to kill the same animals but the 7MM with it's heavier bullets might work better for say Elk, Moose, and Bear. For deer it might be argued that the 7MM is a bit to much gun for deer sized game unless you are out west where a longer shot might present it's self.

I have owned a Browning A-bolt hunter in 7mm mag and was only able to kill one deer with it prior to moving back to Indiana where you were not allowed to hunt deer with a rifle. I sold the rifle to buy a few guns that I could hunt with back there.
When I was able to move back out west I listend to several people and went with the 300WM and used it for a few years. I still own it and it's a very nice rifle just to heavy to pack around. I wanted a light rifle and was looking at the Encore at in synthetic weighing a little over 6 pounds. No one chambered for the WSM and I couldn't find a .270 Weatherby so I started looking at the .280AI and went with that. I like the bullet selection that the 7mm offers vs the .277 caliber. And comparing ballistics the 280 AI and .270WSM are very close.

If i'm going with a .277-.284 bullet: 7mm Rem. Mag.

If i'm going with an 06 based case, might as well use the real thing: 30-06

I normally use 27-7mms as all around deer/medium game rounds. In this arena, the 7mm Mag does not have any advantage in my opinion except possibly at very extreme range. The 7mms only really start having an advantage on heavier game with the 175 gr bullets and the 7Mag can push this bullet fast to make it a good all round/long range load as well. However, if I am shooting bullets in this range and dealing with the heavier recoil I also prefer to step up in caliber to .30. I don't understand the comment on compressed loads for the .270 as there are plenty of powders that give top velocity without compressed loads.

Lou

I shoot a 270 Winchester. I don't think in terms of velocity with 140 grain bullets that there is anything a 22" barrel 7mm Remington Magnum can do that a 24" barrel 270 Winchester can't do...but if I had a choice would shoot a 24" barrel 280 Remington.

Why? Because the great advantage any 7mm has over any 270 is the easy availability of inexpensive 160, 165 and 175 grain bullets.

Now if I'm shooting deer then that is not a problem. But if I'm wanting to shoot EUROPEAN wild boar then I welcome that extra weight.

However, as some would argue, why not just get a 30-06 to get that higher end 160 to 180 grain weight advantage?

These threads are hilarious.
Just in the wind as far as I'm concerned.

If I need more than my a 270, I would go bigger than a 7mm mag.

If I would ever need less than a 7mm mag, I would go smaller than a 270.

The 7 mag was designed for guys who want to THINK they are are shooting a big gun, but can't really handle them.

How's that for

Truly 6 of one half dozen the other.


I personally grew up witha 270 so I didn't see a need for a 7mag. For every arguement for, there is one against on either cartridge.

quote:

Originally posted by SDhunter:
These threads are hilarious.
Just in the wind as far as I'm concerned.

If I need more than my a 270, I would go bigger than a 7mm mag.

If I would ever need less than a 7mm mag, I would go smaller than a 270.

The 7 mag was designed for guys who want to THINK they are are shooting a big gun, but can't really handle them.

How's that for

Truly 6 of one half dozen the other.


I personally grew up witha 270 so I didn't see a need for a 7mag. For every arguement for, there is one against on either cartridge.

Well said. If a deer runs from a 270 Win. shot, it was either a bad shot or a lousy bullet. Most hunters,not all, who travel alot to hunt do not reload. They use factory ammo and they believe the advertised velocities. I am currently getting and EASY 3050fps. plus with 140gr. bullets in my 270's. I am pretty certain I can get 3000fps. with 150 grainers, no problem.
A friend of mine guided on the King Ranch for, I think appox. 7 years. He told me that he and the other guides cringed every time a client showed up with a 7MM mag. He said it almost guarenteed a wounded deer and a late night search. Not because the gun couldn't kill, but because the hunters believed all the hype of the cartridge's killing power and trajectory/velocity, not to mention the extra recoil with no real added benefit. I am not saying the cartridge isn't any good, just saying it way over rated unless it is reloaded to the top end of the spectrum.

Gosh I love the internet, after so many years of membership in hunting forums one hears the same thing over and over again…Hence the tired old retread, now on its last legs and using a walker in its old age due to its pathetic and poor knees...go with the 7mm because there are more bullets available for it. So what I say! So there are not enough .277 caliber bullets to kill anything from Aardvarks to antelope?

ON the other hand you can have bragging rights with the 7mm mag, you can say “I hunt with a magnum” and that right there is just your ticket! So to answer the original question just entering the woods with said "magnum" may cause smaller deer to fall over and die on the spot from the mere thought of it, huge animals may expire if it is merely pointed in their direction which is good because you cannot hit anything with it due to the nice flinch you have developed...so no the .270 Winchester is simply not as good.

Twere me and buying a rifle I would go with the 7 mag, it’s a typical American choice! Sort of like the triple Baconator at Wendy’s, you don’t need it, its going to produce a plug in your left coronary artery in a few years, but when you sit down and hold that huge pile of fat in your hands, you just have to know that other folks are wishing they had one! Forget those puzzy piker’s with chicken (270 win) sandwiches…

If practicality or common sense had anything to do with it, the 280 (or maybe even the 7/08) would have put the 270 and the 7 mag out of business a long time ago.

KB

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
I just have to wonder: If you put a .277 150-grain Partition or TSX in the same spot as a .284 160-grain Partition or TSX, and within 200 fps of each other, would the hunt end the same?

Every time

I had both rifles and you could always do what I did. When I felt I needed something bigger than the .270 Win, I grabbed my 7mm RM and had ToomanyTools make it a .375 Ruger. Now I got everything covered!

Let's change gears for a moment...

While I love to ruminate on what bullet, how fast, how far, what to push it with, yada yada yada...

More and more I'm coming to believe that it really doesn't matter what I'm throwing, as much as whether I'm throwing it where I want it.

I know, I know...bigger and faster give a greater margin of error on poor shots...to a point.

But why not slow down and take a better shot - even if it means passing on an animal?

Get one good bullet in the heart/lungs, and it really doesn't matter whether it's big or small - you'll have a dead animal in short order. True, it might not fall over drt, but if a person has any woodsense about 'em, you won't have to look far.

Wayne Van Zwoll once commented that one could hunt elk (yes, even elk) with a properly placed .257 Bob , and I think that what kind of rifle (quality & fits me) married to good accuracy are far more important than whether it begins as a 308 or a 708, a 270 or 280 or 30-06, a 7 mag or a 300 mag.

Until I start shooting big bears, I think any of the above are just 6 of one, half dozen of the next.

But it is fun to ruminate, isn't it?

friar

quote:

Originally posted by friarmeier:
Let's change gears for a moment...

While I love to ruminate on what bullet, how fast, how far, what to push it with, yada yada yada...

More and more I'm coming to believe that it really doesn't matter what I'm throwing, as much as whether I'm throwing it where I want it.

I know, I know...bigger and faster give a greater margin of error on poor shots...to a point.

But why not slow down and take a better shot - even if it means passing on an animal?

Get one good bullet in the heart/lungs, and it really doesn't matter whether it's big or small - you'll have a dead animal in short order. True, it might not fall over drt, but if a person has any woodsense about 'em, you won't have to look far.

Wayne Van Zwoll once commented that one could hunt elk (yes, even elk) with a properly placed .257 Bob , and I think that what kind of rifle (quality & fits me) married to good accuracy are far more important than whether it begins as a 308 or a 708, a 270 or 280 or 30-06, a 7 mag or a 300 mag.

Until I start shooting big bears, I think any of the above are just 6 of one, half dozen of the next.

But it is fun to ruminate, isn't it?

friar

Here's a great post!

Had and killed with both. No difference in killing power. The 270 was my first big game rifle and I kept two of them and sold the 7Mag. 270 is so easy to load for and I'm not going to be shooting over 250 yds at any game either way. Now if I were only able to have one deer rifle, the 270 probably would not be my first choice.

quote:

the 280 (or maybe even the 7/08) would have put the 270 and the 7 mag

A couple of more cartridges that fit into the 6 of one, 1/2 dozen other argument.

I think of the 7mm/08 as a short 270. Had I started hunting with any of the above cartridges 30 years ago, that is what I would probably be shooting today.

I am personally biased, as I do not like any cartridge that has a belt on it. I know there is no rational reasoning behind my disdain, but that's my opinion and I'm sticking to it. It's my hunting season and I can use whatever I like.

I am not prejudiced against people who like belted magnums, unless they have the ego magnumania trip to go with it.

quote:

ON the other hand you can have bragging rights with the 7mm mag, you can say “I hunt with a magnum” and that right there is just your ticket!

Damn, all I hunt with is a lousy little .257 Roberts. I guess I better buy up some Extenz male enhancement or something...

The problem I have with the .270 Winnie is that it doesn't really do anything that a .257 Bob does except give a bit more range. And the problem I have with the 7mm RMag is that I have no need for a 400 yard gun.

Both are great cartridges - and aside from the need to be a bit different I really see little difference in any of them compared to the venerable '06.

And I really, really HATE the thought of owning an '06. Don't ask me why. I just do.

And damned if the '06 isn't likely to be my next gun.

quote:

Originally posted by friarmeier:
Let's change gears for a moment...

While I love to ruminate on what bullet, how fast, how far, what to push it with, yada yada yada...

More and more I'm coming to believe that it really doesn't matter what I'm throwing, as much as whether I'm throwing it where I want it.

I know, I know...bigger and faster give a greater margin of error on poor shots...to a point.

But why not slow down and take a better shot - even if it means passing on an animal?

Get one good bullet in the heart/lungs, and it really doesn't matter whether it's big or small - you'll have a dead animal in short order. True, it might not fall over drt, but if a person has any woodsense about 'em, you won't have to look far.

Wayne Van Zwoll once commented that one could hunt elk (yes, even elk) with a properly placed .257 Bob , and I think that what kind of rifle (quality & fits me) married to good accuracy are far more important than whether it begins as a 308 or a 708, a 270 or 280 or 30-06, a 7 mag or a 300 mag.

Until I start shooting big bears, I think any of the above are just 6 of one, half dozen of the next.

But it is fun to ruminate, isn't it?

friar

And THAT is a great post. I shoulda just finished reading the thread before posting...

quote:

Originally posted by rnovi:

quote:

ON the other hand you can have bragging rights with the 7mm mag, you can say “I hunt with a magnum” and that right there is just your ticket!

Damn, all I hunt with is a lousy little .257 Roberts. I guess I better buy up some Extenz male enhancement or something...

The problem I have with the .270 Winnie is that it doesn't really do anything that a .257 Bob does except give a bit more range. And the problem I have with the 7mm RMag is that I have no need for a 400 yard gun.

Both are great cartridges - and aside from the need to be a bit different I really see little difference in any of them compared to the venerable '06.

And I really, really HATE the thought of owning an '06. Don't ask me why. I just do.

And damned if the '06 isn't likely to be my next gun.

I bought me a Roberts to try this year as well mostly to burn a bit less powder and maybe kick a bit less. I am not a 30-06 fan either. I think I would like to try a 9.3 x 62 so I will just jump over the Aught-6.

The 270 Win Mag is close to the 30-06 only it shoots a smaller bullet. If I had a choice I would choise the 30-06.

what ever floats your personal boat, I just cannot warm up to the aught 6, too many folks that shoot them where I hunt, folks that don't practice, cannot shoot their Rem 7400 Jam masters, and generally wound a deer or two not finding it. Besides everyone knows the .270 win with a 130 cup and core at 3000 kills deer better!

AR,

My dad killed over 22 elk w a 270 using nosler partitions from 1948 to ealry 1960's then switched to a 300 weatherby and got over 50 total.

(The good old days).

I have used both 270 and 7mm and seen alot of game taken w 30-06.

Biggest difference is that you can hold the 270 lightly and the 7mm is a magnum and you need to hold more firmly which may affect your ability w offhand shots on moving game.

I still use a pre 64 26 inch stainless barrel 7mm remington w 160 nosler accubond or NF at 3050 fps.

Its more than you need for deer and not enough for elk unless you blast the heart into shreds within 100 yds.

A 7mm ackley improved will probably be better than either one.

Get the 270.

Use more gun for larger game.

Andy

I use my .270 Win with 130 grn bullets

I use my 7 RM with 160 grn bullets

So in my case it is apples/oranges