I'm still in debate about what rifle to buy for my ibex hunt. I'm going to go with the 300 win mag caliber. I am looking at both the ruger and the m70 in their S/S. What have been you guys' experience with the accuracy of the S/S rugers. I'm leaning towards the S/S with the iron sights. The sights have no practical use for me, but they look good. I plan to restock the rifle with wood to achieve a modern rifle with a classic look. So are they accurate or should I get the m70? Thanks for the input.

Own both a 338WM in an older tang safety Model 77 and a controlled round feed stainless/composite(boat paddle)Model 77 in 7MM RM. Both rifles shoot very well - under 3/4" for 3 shot groups with the right load. The trigger on the older Ruger is great, the newer one took some work to lighten the pull. I did glass bed the action and the chamber area of the stock on the 338, plus free floated the barrel - but I do that on every wood stock rifle I have. I do like the new model 70's as well but have never owned one - but they have a nice look and feel and most owners seem to report good results - some change out the extractor to a more durable machined unit.

I'm snake bit when it comes to Rugers I owned a RSI .270 once that grouped about 3"@100yds on good days so I traded it in for SS 77 in .243 that would do about 4" on good days. All the usual tricks were tried, different scopes, ammo, bedding, pressure points,screw tension. I've talked to so many people that get great accuracy out of there Ruger's, but for me it wasn't ment to be



I've alway's had great luck with Winchester's, but I'm sure someone will chime in with a story just the opposite of mine.



Best of luck with what ever you choose.



Terry

I only have one ruger . Its is about 3 or 4 year old model m77 markII. It is the Stainless lamminated stock model in .270. I put a timney on it and bedded the action / floated barrel. It shoots very well 1/2", 3/4" at 100 yds.

have blued/wood 30-06 from '96 shoots as well as my varmit guns.

I've got a stainless laminate in 30/06,that is real accurate. The problem is it misfires occasionally. The inside of the bolt looks like a highschool welding shop project and literally gouges the sides of the firing pin. Ruger says its just great.

There have got to be accurate Rugers out there, as others here have pointed out. I've owned 4 or 5 over the years, but all were what I would consider below average. They don't live here anymore.

I have a ruger and it shoots well. But I put alot of time and money and dirty language to make it shoot well ! I have 3 model 70 classics. an 06 shoots real well, a .338 win, it shoots prety well but not great, and a 7mmSTW that is simply a tack driver. Its all hit and miss. If you can find a 300 win in a cz Thats what I would choose but the winchesters have been good to me...tj3006

My son has a MKII in .30-06, SS w/ laminated stock. I did all of his load dev. & it is a 1MOA rifle w/ several loads & only a bit more w/ several factory loads. The only thing I did to it was recoil pad & new trigger. I would by another.

I've owned a couple of rugers in the past (they're not with me anymore either). I could hit the inside of a barn with them if the doors were closed, but not much better. Accuracy's not their strong point. Come to think of it, they really don't have any strong points other than they are cheap.

Under an inch with anything I have fed it so far. Only work is to the trigger and from 7x57 to 7x57AI.

Iron sights are only available on Win M70 classic stainless in 375 H&H. Not available in stainless in any calibers on Ruger M77

I have three rugers; all 77 MKII's. The first is an rsi in 06' it never shot worth shit until I took a dremmel to the nose cap and gave the barrel some room to breath. now it shoots just over an inch. #2 is a 257bob that shoots under half out of the box with hornady custom 115grn ammo; so no sense fooling with handloads. #3 is a .264 winnie that was rough at first but now clover leafs at 100yds with 140hornadys and a whole bunch 7828. I guess my experience with rugers is on par with the myraid of other rifles I've owned. Some were great; some not so great .

BTW my brother's 77 .270 won't shoot for crap no matter what we do to it; even sent it back to be worked on by the company. Funny thing is; they say its ok shooting groups 3" @ 100yds
turfman

I have owned several Ruger M77s and been around a scad more of them and NONE of them were MOA guns with any ammo/scope combination.

The EXCEPTION for Ruger rifles has been strictly limited to their heavy barrel varmit class rifles. I've had .22/250, 220 Swift and .308 and all of them were shooters.

But I'm about burned out on Ruger accuracy. I don't know how a company can build such a fine looking rifle that shoots so poorly.

I must be really lucky then. I only own one Ruger centerfire. It's the FUGLY all weather with boat paddle stock, SS action in .223. It shoots 5/8" groups with the Winchester white box 45 grainers. I couldn't be happier as it is a nice walking varminter. I only got it because Wallyworld let it go for less than $300. It was someone's custom order and they never picked it up.

I'd probably go with a CZ if I wanted a medium bore that shoots.

z1r - Yes sir, I think you can count yourself one of the lucky ones. But the above criticisms of Ruger rifles hardly means they aren't good hunting rifles. How many of us can shoot a 1/2 group off hand out on a real hunt? With all the stress and strain of real world shooting, probably none of us are capable of less than 2" anyway.

The only Ruger I've ever had that was just a total POS was the last one I tried in .257 Roberts. This gun came out of the box trying to blow itself up........literally! Factory ammo would lock up the bolt, blow the primer and ruin the case........first shot.

I loaded some ammo DOWN well below maximum, miked evrything and tried it. Almost the same result, about one out of three would lock the gun up! Pressure was incredible on everything. I thought for a bit that Ruger must have given me a .243 barrel chambered for .257 but it was indeed a .25 barrel.

A friend told me he didn't care as he was going to rechamber the thing, so I took a hit on this rifle and let him have the damn thing. I've been pissed at Ruger ever since.

By the way, I called Ruger about the rifle and they weren't real excited about my problem and suggested in a round about way that I was having halucinations...but I could ship it back for them to look at if I just really wanted to play that game.

I doubt I'll ever buy another Ruger anything.

First of all I don�t care for plastic stocks or shinny barrels bit I do like Ruger rifles. The first thing to do with a new Ruger M77 is throw away that �lawyer� trigger(and don't watch where you throw it) and install a Timney adjustable one. Bedding the action helps but so it does on Winchesters. Rugers are a strong, solid action that will serve you well over the years. Get the Ruger and don�t look back. Lawdog

If you shoot right handed,there just isn't any reason to buy a piece of shit ruger. By the time you buy and install or smith the trigger,you've already spent more on the ruger,then you could have bought a good winchester or remington for. The M70 lt can be had new in the same price range as the M77 and you end up with a good trigger and proven rifle.


Ruger won't stand behind their product,as long as it shoots minute of hay bale size groups. The limited run of .35whelens that ruger had a few years ago,experienced the same misfires that my rifle did and ruger did little about it. I've seen a recently produced M77VT that would barely group under 4inches at 100 yards and ruger sent it back saying it was within their guidelines. Bill Ruger even felt that 3moa at 100 in a hunting rifle was good enough and publicly stated so on more then one occasion

I had an older 257 roberts that shot patterns, not groups. I let it go. My current Mark II in 6.5x55 shoots .75" and under with nearly any handload you feed it. It's bedded/floated w/Timney trigger installed.

I currently own 3 Ruger Mark IIs and (1) # 1 single shot. All will shoot at minute of angle other than my Manlicher stocked 243. It is a 1.5" gun. They have all been reliable. The quality is good. They have all shot better than most of my Winchester model 70s ( I have had some real bad luck with the new CRF actions, one in 06 would not do better than 3-4" at 100 yards )

The statement about the cost of a new trigger included in the price of a Ruger is a good reason to go ahead and get the slightly more expensive model 70 if you are realy being thrifty with your money.
Plus your getting a model 70 . I was thinking of getting another ruger in 338mag , but actually the winchester is a better value when you consider the price of a timney needed for the Ruger

The only Ruger CF rifle I've ever had was a limited edition M-77 Mk II in 35 Whelen. It had a trigger like a Glock and it missed fire. I posted about it on another board and found that several other people had the same problem. They also said that Ruger was a real pain in the ass to deal with on getting it fixed -- general disbelief in the problem, 6-month waits to get rifles back, offers to replace the 35 Whelen with a new rifle in a standard caliber, sending it back several times and still not getting the problem fixed, etc.

Rather than risk dealing with Ruger, I took my rifle to Jim Cloward in Seattle. He had seen the problem before and fixed it with an extra-power mainspring. He also did a trigger job that was so crisp that it felt much lighter than it really was. It cost $45, a lot less than a Timney. The total cost was under $100. I figure I would have spent at least that much on shipping, phone calls, antacids and pure vexation, so I guess it was a bargain.

After that, it shot about 1 MOA with handloads or Federal's 225-gr. Trophy Bonded load. That was with a 4x Leupold and a standard duplex reticle. The Ruger .35 Whelen is a light rifle with a very stiff stock and a sorry excuse for a recoil pad, and kicks accordingly. I don't do well with recoil, and I suspect that a better shot than me probably would have had better results.

On the other hand, you could easily spend that much getting a M-70 to run right, too. I guess the moral of the story is whatever you buy will have risks, and you should allow a year or so to work up loads and sort out problems before you take it on an expensive hunt. Anyway, that's one of my rationalizations for buying rifles for Africa when I know I won't get there for several more years.

Hope this helps, Okie John

Okie,

I went through the same thing with my Ruger MkII .35, except Ruger turned mine around in 5 weeks with a new barrel. They swiped my 'tuned' factory trigger, replacing it with the standard factory model. My buddy at the gunshop swapped the stock for me. Now it shoots 1" groups and I really like my American Safari Rifle.... Take a look..

I have also had the action, barrel, and scope rings matte blued since this photo was taken...

I must have been lucky - I've owned several Ruger 77's over the 20 or so years, one in 6mmRem, and a few in 25-06. All of these were tang safety models, and all were sub MOA rifles after bedding the action and floating the barrel.

Bought a 77MkII stainless/laminate in 270 back in late 2000, and was horrified - 3" groups were teh order of the day, and the best I could do with handloads was 2"!!!

Floated the barrel, bedded the action, put a Timney on it, got the action screw tensions just right (learnt that from my previous Rugers), and after a bit of work with handloads, half inch groups (5 shots) are now the norm. It even puts 110 and 130g bullets into the same point of impact at 50, 100, 150, and 200 yards (dunno how, but I've got the targets to prove it!! Doesn't matter whether the barrel's hot or cold, don't have to wait between shots for the barrel to cool (brother, does it get HOT after 5 quick shots)!!

I'm a happy camper!! I think that it takes a while for a rifle to 'settle in', and to 'wear' into itself.

The only rifle I've EVER owned that was sub MOA literally right out of the box, is my son's CZ 457 American in 223. It was MOA with factory food, and with handloads it is sometimes hard to believe that all five shots hit the target!! That rifle hasn't been touched, and God help anyone who does!!

I'm not knocking anybody, but I have mates who have had just as many problems with their Win 70's and Rem 700's, less hassles with older Sako's newer CZ's seem to pretty good, but a bit rough and FUGGLY. Maybe it's like when you buy a lemon of a car - not only do you start to see all the faults, but there are plenty of people out there who will reinforce your misery, not from actual experience, but thru hearsay. I know a few guys who 'know' that Rugers are shit, but they've never owned one, and regard me as just lucky!!

In order of experience:

#3 - restocked by Fajen, otherwise unmodified, .22 Hornet. Sub-MOA
#1AB- 7x57, good tight groups for a turkey choked 12 Gauge, sold, rebarreled w/Shilen 28" in 7x57AI and Keplinger Trigger, forend mod. Sub-MOA shooter
#1B- .22Hornet, after F.E. Mod, replaced trigger and reamed to K-Hornet, Sub-MOA
#1B- .257 Bob. As with Hornet for modification except original chamber. Will NOT shoot 100-120 gr bullets less than 3" consistantly. WILL shoot 75VMAX and 85BT's sub-MOA.
77- .358 Win. Sub-MOA out of the box w/ 200 gr. Win. ST's. Fouls horribly, still shoots all weight bullets.
77 MkII 7x64 Brenneke. Who Knows?

Oh yeah, a 3 screw .44 Mag that shot 180 gr. into very small wads at 50 yds. and nothing else. 3 .22 autos that were mediocre, as was the GP100 in .357. All gone and I don't miss them.

My first rifle was a Ruger M77 (tang safety) in .270 Winchester. I bought it when I was 16 years old. Because I couldn't afford a scope on a lawnmower's wages I shot it until I went to college using the open sights. Thinking back I know I shot some awesome groups with those sights. I started reloading by the time I was 17 and fed that baby 130 gr Nosler Solid base bullets. In college the gun was mated to a scope but pretty much was ignored in favor of beer and babes and fraternity stuff...not to mention those troublesome classes.. After college it was shipped to me in Germany as soon as I found out I could get a German hunting license and hunt big game almost year round. About that time I also can say I bloomed into a full blown gun nut. I really started playing with the Ruger and found I had a real shooter...5 shots into about 3/4 maybe 5/8 inch. I killed Red Stag, Dozens of Roe Deer, maybe a dozen boar, a chamois and a mouflon with it. It was the only rifle I used for three years. 25 years later it still sits in my safe and still shoots better than more than most of the 30 or so rifles in my safe.
Like rifles from many makers, I've owned Ruger's that were superb and a few that left you disappointed. I've owned Winchesters, Remingtons and even Sakos with similar problems. I will say that my personal experience with Ruger's customer service has been excellent. In both instances where I shipped guns they were helpful, fixed the guns right, and prompt...less than 4 weeks door to door. I've had some like Remington take 4 months...
I owned a Ruger MkII in .338 that was scary 5 shot cloverleaf accurate. So much so that I had it restocked in some beautiful english walnut. First trip to the range I was sighting it in next to a stock broker I knew. He saw my groups and the stock (ex-Jager employee did the work) and offered me three times what I had in the gun and work. He was going elk hunting in a few weeks and his rifle was giving him headaches... He got his elk that year...

Ruger will make a lemon from time to time like anyone.

I don't like to knock a particular rifle. Anyone can produce a lemon. It just seems maybe Ruger has more than its fair share. I know Rugers have improved since they started making their own barrels, and that's certainly a step in the right direction. Somehow I'm still shy of them in terms of accuracy. Maybe that'll change also. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

Best 100 yard groups I've produced off the bench with my tang safety M77 .30-06 I could just cover with my hand. I wear size 8 gloves. (About 4x6" groups.)

Mini-14? Getting a hit or two on paper at 100 yards is good. It's great fun for blasting cans around at 20-50 yards, though.

Rugers sure are pretty rifles.

Man..... All this talk about bad shooting new rifles . I have a 104year old swedish mauser that shoots 1/2" groups.

I'm a big fan of both the M70 and the 77, having some of both. I've found that both shoot well, and both might need some work to shoot well. Most of the 77s I've had or worked on would shoot, some right out of the box (maby 40%), the rest would shoot if tweaked. The Winchester seems to shoot decent right out of the box, and even better tweaked. I wouldn't want to be without either, so it's a toss up. I will tell you this, I have an Ultra Light .308 Ruger that is one of the handiest little rifles I've ever used. My neighbor liked it so much, he tried to trade me out of it several times. The most recent time he offered me a Sako Finnlight for it, giving me the opportunity to try the Sako before I traded. Well I tried the Sako, and it's nice as h**l, but I kept the Ruger. Call me crazy, but I really like that little gun, and not even a Sako will get it from me.

I've got to try free floating my M77's barrel and see what that'll do. The action bedding seems to be snug and even, but the barrel bears on one side of the stock channel and not the other. The wood likely warped after it was shaped. The zero changes dramatically from one trip to the range to the next. (Like a foot at 100 yards.)

Hello GSPZ,

I also have a very accurate M96 Mauser, but Ruger didn't make it. When I was younger, several times I heard Ruger referred to as "the home of the 12.95 barrel." Recently Ruger has started making their own barrels, and that should really help matters. The odd Ruger shoots very well, but most don't I'm afraid. If you have one for heavens sake keep it. I've always been scared off of Ruger because of the barrels. I'd love to see a steady improvement in their accuracy level. Merely one shooter's opinion. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

My wife bought me a 77MKII at an NRA dinner that was a stainless 30-06 in the wood stock (which I replaced with a boyd laminate) I broke the barrel in correctly while shooting some core-lokt pills for that express purpose. It was about a 1moa gun. I then tried federal premium 150gr NBT's and it cloverleafed all three (sub .5moa). I have worked up 125gr NBT's over N140, and same thing, .5moa!! I never figured this thing would shoot well,...but I kept her after those range sessions. Guess I got lucky.

Well I probly have the most Rugers in my house out of all these posts that I've read. Right now as I speak we have a .22-250 Target, .243 Win S/S, I had a 25/06 Rem S/S, 30/06 Rem S/S, 2 300 Win Mags, one was mine, other is my dads. I have gotten all these to shoot out of the box with just trigger work. Maybe I have gotten lucky, but I use to believe that Ruger was the best money could buy. They are cheap and from my experiences, they are all accurate. With minimal load development, I have not had any trouble getting 3/4" at 100 yards from any of the rifles above with several differnt bullets. I like to tink around with all sorts of weights for the caliber. I stoped buying Rugers because they were barrel heavy and if you want to sell, there resale value is not as good as Rem or Win. I since have bought a Rem LSS 300 RUM and a Win classic 25-06. Both of these rifles have proven to be more accurate and consistent then the Rugers, out of the box and with my handloads. Still, I love Rugers and they will always have a place in my closet!

My Bwana Companion has one of the SS Boat paddle Rugers in 338 winmag and he says he'd get rid of it except he can take it in any weather, throw it around and not hurt the stock and shoot 2" groups at 300 yds.
Last time we were in RSA he got a really nice waterbuck at 350 yds (laser measured). It was right at dark and he was coming in to his ewes. He took the shot because it was the only one he'd get on that big boy. By the time we got to him it was too dark to see.