Between these two non-premiums, which typically holds together better on game? I am especially interested in comparing the flat-base Spire Hornadys vs. the flat-base Speers in .277 and .308 caliber. What have you guys experienced. I hunt mostly white-tail but happen upon hogs occasionally.

1. Which holds together better?
2. Which tend to be more accurate on average?
3. How would the Hot-Core compare to the more expensive Interbond?

I have shot a lot of Hornadys but have no experience with Speers.

Thanks,
Mark in GA

Mark,

I notice you refer to Hornady "interlocks" and "interbonds"...Are these the same or two different types of bullet????

With regards the Speer Hotcores, I use the 150grn .308 Spire points in my Sako.

They work great on our smaller deer, but on our Red deer I found they seldom exited and tend to break up badly. The Reds ranged in weight from 120lb to 170lb dressed out. I never lost any of the deer, but I do think there must be a better bullet for the job..

In the search for something "better", I tried some 165 gr Hornady SPBT Interlocks, but I have not had much luck finding a load that produces decent groups as yet.

Regards,

Pete

I've had poor experience with Speer HotCor compared to Hornady Interlocks, as far as accuracy goes in two different 6.5X55 rifles in handloads. The Interlocks (129g SP) average under an inch at 100 yards, while the HotCor (140g) average closer to two inches (three separate lots).

I weighed and measured all 100 of each box a couple of months ago. Speer weight varied a grain, and Hornady's measured significantly less, 0.3g, IIRC.

I then measured all 100 from base to ogive, using a Stony Point Cartridge Comparator, and the results were even more startling. The measurements varied for the Speer from 0.729" to 0.743", a significant 0.014" variance when trying to set a "jump to lands" distance. Hornady max variance was 0.006" variance, compared to 140g Nosler Partition at 0.001".

I then measured the Overall Length, and things cleared up a little. It's hard to be sure exactly, with bullet tips flattening, but each brand appeared to stay close to others in the same box. So, if the OAL remains the same, and the weight varies, where is the extra weight stored? It's stored in the varying ogive length, and that explains its lack of accuracy in my rifle.

Oddly, some Federal factory loads use HotCor and perform excellently. Maybe they get a more accurate run of bullets.

I would expect both to perform adequately on deer and hogs, but I think I'd give the edge to Hornady, however slight.

HotCor bullets are not bonded core; their performance is not based upon lead "melting" into the jacket material. They perform well due to the lack of a flux that's applied to the lead for ease of manufacturing; the lead doesn't slip in the jacket as easily. Bonded core will likely hold its jacket better than other bullets, but likely won't do as well there as partition or solid copper bullets. "Interlocks" are a mechanical lock rather than a chemical ("bonded") lock.

Jaywalker

Jaywalker, thanks for that posting.. for years i have used the speer 145gr flat base in my 7x57 and about 2 years accuracy went to hell so i changed to 154 round noses. I'm going to put the measure on what's left of the box & post it.

I HAVE killed deer with seer, sierra, hornady and nosler bullets..I have recovered very few bullets from the 1st 3..so i just use what's most accurate in the rifle i', using.. last yr a 35 whelrn with 225 sierra, a 308 with speer 150's. and a 25'06 with 120 partations..

Jaywalker,

Thank you for your very interesting post.

Weidmannsheil

I have shot them all in various calibers through the years. For a while I was nothing but Nosler, but then they decided to cut their count to 50 and charge almost the same I went to Hornady. It took very little to treak them into the small groups that I shoot now. I would not hesitate to shoot the Hornadys over the Speers. I have not had a rifle yet that would not shoot the hornady in one weight or another. The speers however have been another story. When they did shoot they shot well , but I just never gave them as much time due to the inconsistancies.

Both should hold up well on the game your lookin at, and at standard velocities you shouldn't need the bonded cores. Even on hogs up to over 250 the standard soft points will get the job done.

I am a hardcore Hotcor fan and also like the Hornady interlok. I give the Speer bullets and edge in penetration weight for weight but feel rifles are individuals as to which bullet they shoot more accuratly. Hornady bullets seem to open more quickly and wider losing more weight than the Speer Hotcor which gives deeper penetration on average. Hornady bullets I have used on game are the .243 100 BTSP, the 140 grain .264, 130 and 150 grain .270 flat base interloks, 150 and 180 grain .308, 139 and 175 grain .284 flat base interlok and the 350 grain .458 RN interlok. These mostly on deer and hogs with one elk thrown in to the 150 grain .270 bullet. The Speer bullets used are the 160 grain Speer .284, 150, 180 and 200 grain .308 and the 150 grain .277 bullet. These I mostly used on elk with the exception of the 150 .308 bullet as it is a favorite deer bullet in my 308 and 30-06. If I had to chose one brand over the other it would be Speer but I sure would miss the interloks.

quote:

1. Which holds together better?
2. Which tend to be more accurate on average?
3. How would the Hot-Core compare to the more expensive Interbond?

1. This may vary between the two depending on the caliber and bullet weight. The only way to know for sure is to shoot the same weights you are interested in, into the same media at the same velocity.

2. In my experience Hornady.

3. The bonding process is completely different between the two, with the Interbond being the only truly "bonded" bullet of the two.

I can't say about the interbond but rest assured the heavier Speers hold together well enough for any use, specifically the 200 grain Hotcor Spitzer and this has proven to be a very accurate bullet out of my rifles. I think it depends on what you want in a bullet but both these brands make fine loads for any type of hunting .

quote:

Originally posted by Pete E:
Mark,

I notice you refer to Hornady "interlocks" and "interbonds"...Are these the same or two different types of bullet????
.............<snip>........

Regards,
Pete

Pete,

The Interbond is Hornady's new bonded core bullet. The Interlock is their standard cup-and-core bullet that they have been selling for years.

Here's a PDF file about the Interbond:
http://www.hornady.com/media/InterBond_Bullets.pdf

-Bob F.

I had been using mostly Speer bullets when I was a teen reloading on my Dad's dime. They shot ok and great in an '06 but fell apart on deer. Deer aren't that tough. I got my Dad to switch to 180gr for the '06 and they were better, quite possibly due to the lower velocity and greater mass.
That was 20 years ago and I have only bought one bullet type from them since. The 52gr. .224" with the large HP kills coyotes very quick out of my mini-14 and so I use them.
For bigger game I will use Hornady or Sierra's before Speers for deer and elk if I'm using standard construction bullets. I think the Hornady Interlok is way under rated. I have had great results with the Sierra's in spite of the bad press they get, including complete pass throughs on mule deer with 140gr out of a 7mm RM. I think it's more critical to match the weight to the bullet with consideration for the animal hunted. For instance, the Speer bullets I had been using in the '06 were coming apart. I stepped up from 165gr to 180 for deer, and from 180gr to 200gr for elk. I load for a specific game animal or situation often, and will have several rifles and loads to choose from every year for what I'm hunting. I have my favorites, but for deer I lean to the .257 cal and when carrying tags for more than one species I go for the biggest of them and plan my load around that.
The best thing to do is to trap and compare bullets fired from your rifle at a "normal" distance. I was in a pinch once with my 7mm and tried some factory 150gr & 175gr Winchester ammo. I was actually pretty impressed. The heavier for caliber bullets of standard construction work very well from what I've seen. The lighter bullets are the ones where people have the most trouble.

Here is the touchy subject when things go wild. Many believe in premium bullets only. I have used them and found them to be good to great depending on the situation. That's a whole different topic that's been thrashed several times here.

I have been using the Hornady Spire Point (now the Interlock version) for years. I mostly use them to work up loads because they shoot well, and are inexpensive. The design of this bullet has the least shank surface area, and this translates to advantages in exterior ballistics.

I have used the Speer Grand Slam for hunting, but only used their .224" bullet in the hot core line.

I get weight retentions in the 70s% range with the Interlock.

jim

If you would shoot a premium bullet then you wouldn't have to worry about such trivia...The cost of a bullet on a expensive hunting trip, even the cost of gas in of little importance...If everyone would use premiums then we wouldn't have to discuss bullet failure..

For deer the Hornady Interlock is an excellent bullet. The speers grand slam is another good one. Never used a hotcore so can't really say..sorry.

I personally prefer Nosler for my hunting needs at the time being. Personally a few more dollars spent is really a drop in the bucket what I spend each year pursuing my passion.

The problem I have is that I use my .308win for a variety of deer and need one bullet that will do it all...

My primary quarry are Roe and Muntjac and a muntjac might only dress out at 15lb while a roe might be around 28lb...I need a bullet that will open on these, but not cause too much meat damage so no balistic tip types..

On the upper end of the scale, while out stalking roe, I might just happen on a Red deer which dress out at between 100lb and 200lb...

The Spper 150grn Hotcores have been a good compromise for me in the past and are accurate in my rifle, but I always wonder if there isn't a better alternative..

Regards,

Pete

Hornady Interlock is perhaps the most used bullet in Norway in cal 30-06 and 308win.Norma load them and named the ammunition "Norma Elite". It's cheap and the choice for the common hunter. Those who are really interested in hunting don't like them at all. They think Interlock fragment too easy, at least on red deer and moose. Speer Hot-Cor is not very common here. In tests I have seen Interlock often get a little bit more retained weight, but Hot Cor often get better penetration., because a less expanded diameter. If you read Hornady and Speer's information about these bullets this is very normal, I think.

Interlock loaded in Norma's Elite ammunition is very accurate normally.

I'm a Nosler fan and have been for years. Sierra is a good bullet too, and in my experience shoots to the same point of impact as does the partition.
But when I don't use the above mentioned, I do use the Hornady. The interlock (non-bonded) is a good and tough bullet.
I have never been a Speer fan. I thought the 70 grain 22 was the cat's meow way back when...that was until I discovered Nosler's 22 calibre solid base. I've never looked back.
When I run into a rifle that refuses to shoot SBT bullets, I will often use a Hornady flat base. I think they are good, and they work for me.

I am having great luck with the Hornaday 150 grain spbt interlocks in my 7.5x55 Swiss. Very accurate and I feel confident they will work fine for the whitetails I hunt. I am a Nosler BT fan but the hornadays are really grouping good in these rifles. I would say they will work good in the .308 also as the ballistics are close. I do plan to try Serris gamemasters also. no Speer bullets for me.

Well I like the 130 gr Speer Sp in the 270. Just the right kind of construction for Pronghorn and a Mules ribs. I shot a lot of white tails with that bullet and the hornaday version. Never recoverd any bullets so I don't know about the shape they were in, I do know that they had provided several tons of vensison for my freezer over the years. The speer shoots pretty close to were the partition that I zeroed in my rifle with to make for good pratice, I made on of the longest shots of my hunting life with a 130 gr Speer SP on a Mule Deer out in Jordan Montana some years back. For some reason, Nosler Partitions were in short supply that year. Nobody could get bullets for handloading.

For hunting Deer Hornady bullets work fine. I have alway used Hornady bullets. Now they have improved they have the bonding core. I'm going Black Bear hunting in Canada in Aug and am going to shoot my bear with a Hornady interlock
bullet. So I think hornady bullets are good enought for boars also. Been shooting them for about 35 or 40 years along with Rem. Speer and Serria. Only hunted with Hornady Bullets and Nosler bullets.

I have also thought about going to the 154 gr. interbond(not interlock) for an all purpose round. It isn't uncommon to be hunting in an area that could have either an elk or large mulie. This bullet might be a good choice.

IF you mean Hornady Interlocks, since these bullets are both plain "cup and draw" types, I doubt if there's a dimes worth of difference between them. I would not expect that little "interlock" extrusion to do much to keep the core and jacket together at high impact velocities, nor is the Speer built to do this either. Speer just pours a melted core into the jackets before swaging them. There is no bonding of core to jacket in either of these bullets.

If you want bonded-core performance, you have to use a bonded bullet. The Hornady Interbonds ARE, but the Interlocks are NOT - they're two different kinds of bullets.

quote:

I have shot them all in various calibers through the years. For a while I was nothing but Nosler, but then they decided to cut their count to 50 and charge almost the same I went to Hornady.

Nosler Partition jacket bullets have ALWAYS come in boxes of 50, at about the sme price you'd pay for a 100-count box of any ordinary bullets, like Speer, Sierra, or Hornady!

While the cores in Speer Hotcor bullets are not technically bonded to the jackets I have noticed that Speers have heavier jackets than Hornady and the cores adhere to the jackets with some tenacity. I have also recovere Hornady bullets that hit shoulders at high velocity and remained relatively intact.