I plan next year to get a new rifle. I plan to make an elk hunt in the next couple of years. I had planned to go next year but due to a car wreck and having to replace a vehicle it has been postponed so now i have a little more time to decide what i want. I was having a hard time deciding between 300wm and 300wsm. The things i wanted was stainless and a laminated stock with no blind floorplate. i would prefer a mag but a hinged floorplate is acceptable. something else i would like to have is a user friendly adjustable trigger. the only rifle that i have found that fits those things is the ruger hawkeye sporter. and that rifle is not offered in wsm. so what do most think of these rifles? are there any common problems with them? are they fairly good shooters or tend to need some work?

Be patient and look for a good used Sauer 200/202. Have never had one that would not shoot MOA and there is no finer action for the money.
I would go with the 300WM...all you will need...classic elk cartridge...find ammo anywhere.

I believe the new Winchester M-70 fits your description...except for the laminated stock....they do have a synthetic however.

Either the WSM or Win Mag will serve you well.

i have a model 70 ultimate shadow in 270wsm and i hate that gun. blind mag and just a week or 2 ago the extractor broke. ive been unhappy with this rifle from the get go. mounted a leupold 4-12x40 on it and the didn't have enough adjustment in it. had to shim the rear sope base to get the scope on target. so at this point i just have a bad taste in my mouth for the model 70 and don't know if i can get it out.

as for the saur i actually passed one up about 2 months ago brand new in the box for $900 in 300win mag.

I would tend to agree with vapodog. I have a new Winchester Model 70 Extreme Weather, and I am really happy with it. Composit stock, easily adjustable trigger, great fit and feel, and it comes in 300 WSM for sure. I'm not sure if they offer it in 300 Win Mag. I would fondle a few of them before I shelled out the money, but from my experience, you would be well served, and have something to be really proud of.

Sorry to here about the troubles sks. Have you sent it back to Winchester etc?

quote:

Originally posted by tc98:
I would tend to agree with vapodog. I have a new Winchester Model 70 Extreme Weather, and I am really happy with it. Composit stock, easily adjustable trigger, great fit and feel, and it comes in 300 WSM for sure. I'm not sure if they offer it in 300 Win Mag. I would fondle a few of them before I shelled out the money, but from my experience, you would be well served, and have something to be really proud of.

Sorry to here about the troubles sks. Have you sent it back to Winchester etc?

no didn't send it back. my dad actually originally purchased the gun when the wsm's came out. we mounted the scope and he never did much else with it. he passed it to me last year and i sold my 270 win with plans to get a 300 then just didn't happen.

as for the ruger i take it ya'll don't like them? this is the one im looking at. http://www.ruger.com/products/...pecSheets/17193.html

No, it's not that I don't like the Ruger, just like the Winchester better. The new Win. Extreme Weather is built in the North Carolina Plant, and is built to the pre 64 specs. Great action, and great feel, adjustable trigger. The Ruger looks nice imo. I would certainly look at other options though. Seems you have some time to really think this thing over, and handle some guns. Find the one that just feels like home. Win., Savage, Rem., Ruger, and if you don't mind a used gun, and are wanting to stay within a specific budget, look for a used Sako 75, or 85. If you haven't seen them, you should also check out the Tikka. Great gun and very reasonable price. Good Luck

SKS, look around at the Sako 75's or 85's. You can probably find the 75's NIB still on Gunbroker or somewhere like Able Ammo, but they will definitely have 85's. They are really fine rifles, triggers are great, and reasonably easy to adjust (allen wrench through the mag well).
They both have the best detachable box mag system there is IMO, and they are METAL. I always buy an extra mag, and BTW haven't ever lost one--guess I should say YET just for good Karma...They come with and MOA accuracy guarantee, and several versions, the Grey Wolf version is laminated and stainless, I have several, including one in 300 WSM, and it shoots great and feeds flawlessly. I had a 75 in the Walnut/Blued (hunter model) in 300 Win Mag, and it was a great shooter, but it was hijacked by a hunting buddy, and I really prefered the beltless short fat cases at the time, so I just let him have it...I still prefer the beltless cases, just a personal thing, now I'm on a Dakota cartridge kick, man they bring some thump and speed in similar lenght actions!

I think a Sako 85 in the Grey Wolf would ring your bell!

I'm a Remington man myself but then you're gonna have to pay a whole $25-50 to get the trigger adjusted. Aside from that, my experiences have been with the .300WM and you'll find nothing to complain about with that cartridge. Plenty of store ammo, accurate, etc.

quote:

Originally posted by JonP:
Be patient and look for a good used Sauer 200/202. Have never had one that would not shoot MOA and there is no finer action for the money.
I would go with the 300WM...all you will need...classic elk cartridge...find ammo anywhere.

I agree, the 200/202 is as fine a weapon as one can ask for and can be found from time to time at a deal. Every Sauer that I have shot was a one-holer. My 308 and 9.3x62 is a awesomely accurate weapon--and smooth to boot!!!

How about a Remington model 700 CDL SF in 300 WSM also it has there adjustable trigger the X-Mark pro trigger also Remington has a rebate goin on now until next year

My own taste would be tradition wood M70. Too bad about your M70, quality might have slipped prior to plant shutdown and move?

For modern (or another option) ,the Savage has gotten a good reputation with the dealers around here. I never owned one but, When I asked in the small bore forum the savage got the most recommendations.

They have lots of 30 RSM offerings in both synthetic and laminate. More models than you can shake a stick at. Reasonable 7 more/less lbs weight and all with hi-teck accu_triggers. Detachable magazines too! Price right.

http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/models/

Besides the hunter series, you might look over the weather warrior line.

I'm in agreement with the Win. Extreme Weather. I just got one and think it'll work out just fine. If memory serves, it comes not only in .300 WSM but .300 WM as well.
I know you mentioned a laminated stock. My .338 mag. is a Ruger stainless with their laminated stock. I like the rifle - it's plenty accurate for me however, FYI, the rifle becomes a bit slippery to hold when wearing gloves. Something I think you might want to consider.
I do know I wouldn't recommend a Kimber Montana POS.
Good luck & have fun looking.
Bear in Fairbanks

My brother has a ruger hawkeye in 30 06 and he loves it i`ve shot it to its great. I am a 300 wm fan but I do think wsm is just as good

Cooper - They have a 300 magnum coming out this winter.

Sincerely,
Thomas

First off is your idea of what type of rifle more you want more important or the cartrigde it is chambered in?

If you go with a Remington Mountain LSS you get the rifle you want but you don't get the cartridge choices. It is the rifle you want with a floor plate, laminated stock, and stainless steel. However, it is only chambered in 7mm-08, .270, .280, and .30-06 and IMO all would work just fine on elk but I'd probably go with the 06.

If you have to have one of the magnums I'd go with a M70 FWT in .300 WSM. Nice light rifle that is easy to carry in the mountains and has plenty of power for elk. Doesn't have a laminated stock but does come with a floor plate and can be had in stainless.

SKS, just to pick nits, your Model 70 is not an Ultimate Shadow, if it has a blind mag. The Ultimate Shadows were a Classic action rifle with the floorplate. The blind mag model you have is probably the Super Shadow, which was a CRPF with a blind mag, commonly sold at WalMart for $399.99, with a scope.

I shoot several Model 70 Classics and love them, but the new FN70's look like a great rifle, and I wouldn't hesitate to get one of those.

tikka or sako a7 both are excellent rifles

JonP's recommendation is excellent. Smoothest action ever and extremely accurate. I have a slightly used one in .300win mag which I am willing to part with. PM me if you are interested. It's a real honey. Mike

One more vote for the sauer 202! (210) 377-2527 Ext. 2 ask for Lee.

quote:

Originally posted by mudstud:
SKS, just to pick nits, your Model 70 is not an Ultimate Shadow, if it has a blind mag. The Ultimate Shadows were a Classic action rifle with the floorplate. The blind mag model you have is probably the Super Shadow, which was a CRPF with a blind mag, commonly sold at WalMart for $399.99, with a scope.


I shoot several Model 70 Classics and love them, but the new FN70's look like a great rifle, and I wouldn't hesitate to get one of those.

im not sure what model it is i just looked them up online and found one that looked identical with the overmolded stock and assumed that it was that model. i think the rifle was bought at academy but definatly didn't come with a scope and cost more than $399.

thanks for the opinions guys. ive got several more models to check out now. i actually really like the looks of the savage and it has everything i want but its on the heavy side at 10lbs so probably 11 or so loaded and scoped. http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/models/

quote:

Originally posted by sksshooter:


as for the ruger i take it ya'll don't like them? this is the one im looking at. http://www.ruger.com/products/...pecSheets/17193.html

Give me six weeks & I'll get back to you on that, as there's a new & unused .270 awaiting my presence in the US for deer hunting in November - exactly as depicted in stainless steel & laminate, only it's left handed.
They were on sale for $560 recently, so check on Gun Genie to see if what caliber you're after is on offer.

Edit: I just looked & the model you linked to IS on sale, with some dealers offering it for under $600.
Sale finishes the end of October & there are three left for delivery to dealers in .300WM

+1 on 300WM. I am seeing to many bad things happen with the short fatties!

quote:

Originally posted by Captain Finlander:
+1 on 300WM. I am seeing to many bad things happen with the short fatties!

What sort of things?
Do you have an example?
Four out of the six of us who hunt elk together use the .300WSM with no issues as to performance or safety & I've never heard anything to the contrary, though I'm not saying there haven't been examples, as there are with any cartridge.

Win or ruger.

If you look around the used market, you CAN find a SS/Lam 300 WSM in a Ruger. They DID make them, just stopped before their own short mag came out.

Not sure about the lam stock, but a Browning A or X Bolt fits all your other requirements and is available in the WSM/Win.

As stated previously, sounds like you have the cheaper model of M70 Shadow, and most likely produced near the closing of the New Haven plant. More then a few people have had problems with late model M70's. The new SC stuff is supposed to be top quality.

There is also the Sako 75/85, has everything you're looking for, but at a higher price.

Oh, Kimber as well.


Been hearing lots of bad stuff about the short fatties lately? Bah, hogwash. People are hearing the same tired generalizations that have been going around since they first came out. Short mag problems, stem from gun manufacturers doing the me-too thing and shoving the WSM's in any available short action. Browning and Winchester modified their actions to function properly. Sure there have been a few lemons, but those happen in 257 Rob, 270, 30-06 and any other standard just as often. People just take more notice when its something for them to jump all over, usually with no experience.

I have had shorts, in the proper rifle they work just fine. Never ONCE had a feeding issue, accuracy issue, ammo availability issue or anything in mine. Wish I still had my A-bolt 300wsm bought in 2002, sold it for reasons other then anything to do with its form and function.

Well maybe something boring and easy to carry like a 30-06 mod. 760 or 7600 with a 18" barrel.
Let's face it you're going to go out, shoot an elk with one shot and that's it. The 30-06 will do that, and that shorty rifle won't tire you out. roger

If I was looking for a rifle exactly like you describe, I would go with a new FN Model 70 in 300WSM. The 300 WSM has less recoil than the 300 WM, and falls between the 30-06 and the 300 Win Mag in performance, so there's more than enough horsepower for Elk.

My new rifle is a Heym SR 21 Classic Cal. 8x68S. I can advice Heym guns. They are very well made and accurate........I love my gun.....

Sks what is your budget?,... that alone will narrow your search down,...Rugers are notorious for having heavy triggers,...don't know about the Hawkeye line which supposely have improved triggers over the MKII's

All recommendations are solid it depends on what YOU prefer go and handle as many as possible and that should help,...for me it just makes me want more rifles!

Another option get a stainless synthetic and put a boyds laminate on it. http://www.boydsgunstocks.com/

im trying to keep it to no more than 1k for the rifle and i already have my scope picked out and that will be in the 6-700 pending pricing when i do make the purchase. im trying to keep the total under 2k for rifle/glass/mounts.

there is actually a really nice rifle for sale locally that im trying my best not to jump on its a model 70 coyote in 300wsm. it is everythin i want laminate stock, stainless, doesn't have a box mag but does have the drop floor plate and has a decent scope on it not exactly what i want but probably sufficient. nikon monarch 4-12x40 and the dude wants $750 less than 100 done the pipe. im just hesitant to go with the model 70 even though everyone swears by them i just haven't liked mine as well. i may go ahead and jump on it though if the guy will work a partial trade for another rifle i have.

I think the Tikka and Sako a7 are pretty good bang for your buck and would fit the budget, both are known to be accurate rifles.

I shoot an a7 in 300wsm and have not had any problems yet with it, recoil is quite substantial though in such a light rifle. I have found the recoil and muzzle blast of the 300wsm to be more violent than the 300wm, and ammo more expensive and less available, if I was buying it over again I would go with the 300 Win Mag.

quote:

Originally posted by sksshooter:
im trying to keep it to no more than 1k for the rifle and i already have my scope picked out and that will be in the 6-700 pending pricing when i do make the purchase. im trying to keep the total under 2k for rifle/glass/mounts.

there is actually a really nice rifle for sale locally that im trying my best not to jump on its a model 70 coyote in 300wsm. it is everythin i want laminate stock, stainless, doesn't have a box mag but does have the drop floor plate and has a decent scope on it not exactly what i want but probably sufficient. nikon monarch 4-12x40 and the dude wants $750 less than 100 done the pipe. im just hesitant to go with the model 70 even though everyone swears by them i just haven't liked mine as well. i may go ahead and jump on it though if the guy will work a partial trade for another rifle i have.

I have a bunch of Winchesters and don't know what problems you speak of. All of mine and my brothers are fine rifles. The "Coyote" however is a bit heavy and the stock is kinda big and clunky for my tastes but I happen to like light mountain rifles (featherweights, Lightweights) so if it feels right to you get it.
Good luck in your quest.!

quote:

Originally posted by sksshooter:
im trying to keep it to no more than 1k for the rifle and i already have my scope picked out and that will be in the 6-700 pending pricing when i do make the purchase. im trying to keep the total under 2k for rifle/glass/mounts.

there is actually a really nice rifle for sale locally that im trying my best not to jump on its a model 70 coyote in 300wsm. it is everythin i want laminate stock, stainless, doesn't have a box mag but does have the drop floor plate and has a decent scope on it not exactly what i want but probably sufficient. nikon monarch 4-12x40 and the dude wants $750 less than 100 done the pipe. im just hesitant to go with the model 70 even though everyone swears by them i just haven't liked mine as well. i may go ahead and jump on it though if the guy will work a partial trade for another rifle i have.

Remember, I have the Sauer 202 .300win mag, only 10 rounds fired from it, with Burris Signature 3x9x40 already mounted for only $2000, entire package. And you get a Sauer 202. The rifle is one of the best bolt guns ever. So what if the stock is wood. Beat it up if you want, nobody and no animal will care. But you'll still have a Sauer 202. Just thinking, again. Mike

I"ve had very good luck with the CZ-USA rifles I've bought over the last 4 years. Caliber selection is limited, but they must have something to meet your wants.

SKS, with a 2k budget, you could buy the Winchester coyote, sell the Monarch, and mount it with a Leupold Mk4, with a TMR and M1 knobs.

You asked for opinions and mine is you're looking to spend 3 or four times the money for a scope and a rifle than you need to do.
With a mod. 200 Stevens and a 4 x BSA scope you could get the job done nicely.JMHO roger

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:
You asked for opinions and mine is you're looking to spend 3 or four times the money for a scope and a rifle than you need to do.
With a mod. 200 Stevens and a 4 x BSA scope you could get the job done nicely.JMHO roger

i could paint my face and go out there with a spear and get the job done like they did before we had guns but what is the fun in that. i have guns that i could kill an elk with fine but i just want a new gun. a cheap stevens is not what i want ive got cheaper guns that go bang and kill things fine but i want something specific that will last me for a long time to come and be plenty adequate for anything i ever plan to hunt.

i may have ask the question wrong originally but i know what features i want on a gun which are
stainless
laminate (although i am starting to wonder after some of the things ive read about laminate warping in humid climates)
box or minimum hinged floor plate
a reliable and preferably easily adjustable trigger

ive recieved some very good suggestions so far and now have several rifles to go look at a little closer and narrow down which one i really like. so far ive not been one to sale my guns i pretty much keep what i get so this gun is something i plan to keep and hunt with for many years to come. so i would like to make sure i get exactly what i want now so i don't have to buy again in a few years because i settled on something.

A Tikka 300WSM T3 L in SS new runs about $660. Not Lamo. but every thing else. I have only heard good things on them out of the box.

The Sako 75/85 is hard to beat if you can afford one. I would prefer the 300 WM over any WSM offering for elk, but that is primarily due to my preference for heavy bullets. In 180 or 200g bullets the 300WM is far better--and I don't use a 300 mag for 150s!

Cheers,

Dan