30-06 with 200 gr Nosler or 338-06 with 210 gr Nosler

This came to me again with all the talk about the 338-06. A lot of folks I know rave about how good the 338-06 is with the 210 gr Nosler Partition. Can someone explain to me why this is so superior to a 30-06 with the 200 gr Nosler Partition.

I have used both at one time or another and have decided it is foolish to step over the 30-06 with 200 grainers for a 338-06 with a 210. What are you thoughts?

The '06Spr is "better" because you can pretty much buy fodder for it in every "ammo store" on earth. Just look at these: ...270, .280, 7x64, 7x57, .30-06, 7mmRemMag,....You are pretty much seeing the "SAME" cartridge! The difference can be seen by looking at cartridge families (ie. small, medium, big bore). Obviously .22 is not same as .500Nitro.

The 30-06 has a better sectional density, better ballistic coefficient, and can be pushed faster with the same amount of powder.

Sounds like the edge goes to the 30-06!


Without guns we are subjects or victims, with guns we are citizens

I shoot exactly that combo, a 210grNP @ 2750fps. I dont' hunt w/ an 06, my son does, although I load 180grNPs for his. I just think the slightly larger bullet hits just a bit harder up close, say under 200yds. Realistically, there really isn't much diff. You can drive a .308/200gr @ 2650fps (you have to use long bbls. or push a 200gr 06 hard to get much more) or the .338/210 @ 2750fps. Either will kill well, for bigger animals, I like the bigger hole, I can jump up to a 250gr @ 2450fps for really big animals & it's just not a .30-06.
BTW, I don't shoot factory ammo in anything so it's never really been an issue.

fredj338

Your ballistics are pretty close with what I was able to get although I only got about 2700 fps out of my 338-06 with a 22 inch barrel and the 210. I also have one 30-06 that has a 24 inch barrel that will break 2700 fps with the 200 gr Nosler regularly, but maybe that is a fast barrel. I actually feel the 225 grain bullet, either Hornady or Nosler depending on what I was hunting, was the optimum in the 338-06 I had, but I never see folks talk much of using it. It seems that the 210 grainer is the bullet of choice for most. This has always been a puzzle to me.

Lets put this in another comparison only with bigger brothers.
Would you consider the 338 Mag with a 210 grain Nosler partition superior to the 300 Win Mag with a 200 grain Partition bullet? I surely wouldn't and would be surprised if many folks would, yet to me it is about the same as comparing the 338-06 and the 30-06 to me.

How about the 358 WCF shooting the 225gr Sierra? Packy

quote:

Originally posted by Idared:
30-06 with 200 gr Nosler or 338-06 with 210 gr Nosler

This came to me again with all the talk about the 338-06. A lot of folks I know rave about how good the 338-06 is with the 210 gr Nosler Partition. Can someone explain to me why this is so superior to a 30-06 with the 200 gr Nosler Partition.

I have used both at one time or another and have decided it is foolish to step over the 30-06 with 200 grainers for a 338-06 with a 210. What are you thoughts?
The '06Spr is "better" because you can pretty much buy fodder for it in every "ammo store" on earth. Just look at these: ...270, .280, 7x64, 7x57, .30-06, 7mmRemMag,....You are pretty much seeing the "SAME" cartridge! The difference can be seen by looking at cartridge families (ie. small, medium, big bore). Obviously .22 is not same as .500Nitro

I don't think the .338/'06 with a 210-grain bullet is better. It may make a slightly larger wound channel, perhaps.

As to the suposed "advantage" as regards ammuniton, it is true that one can find .30/'06 ammo everywhere, but this is only an advantage to people who don't insist on using ammo they have loaded themselves.

Whenever I go hunting, I take not only my rifles, but the required amount of appropriate ammo also.....

Were I to use a .338/'06, I suspect I'd use at least a 250-grain bullet in it, and I believe there is only one 250-grain .398" bullet still being made, unless Barnes has discontinued it like they have a number of the old Barnes Originals.

8X57 with 200gr Nosler.

quote:

Originally posted by Idared:
fredj338

Your ballistics are pretty close with what I was able to get although I only got about 2700 fps out of my 338-06 with a 22 inch barrel and the 210. I also have one 30-06 that has a 24 inch barrel that will break 2700 fps with the 200 gr Nosler regularly, but maybe that is a fast barrel. I actually feel the 225 grain bullet, either Hornady or Nosler depending on what I was hunting, was the optimum in the 338-06 I had, but I never see folks talk much of using it. It seems that the 210 grainer is the bullet of choice for most. This has always been a puzzle to me.

Lets put this in another comparison only with bigger brothers.
Would you consider the 338 Mag with a 210 grain Nosler partition superior to the 300 Win Mag with a 200 grain Partition bullet? I surely wouldn't and would be surprised if many folks would, yet to me it is about the same as comparing the 338-06 and the 30-06 to me.

I feel the same that the 225 gr. was the optimum bullet in the 338-06 case. Not sure why the 210 has caught on so much but what I find even more puzzling is why anyone would want a 210 gr. bullet in the 338 WM.

The 338-06 with 210 Noslers is NOT superior to the 30-06 with 200 gr. Noslers. In fact, the 30-06 with today's 200 gr. Nosler Partitions is superior. You get better SD & BC, and with today's powders you can get an honest 2700 fps. out of a 22" bbl. with the '06.

Not to mention the fact that you can go lighter with 150, 165, and 180 gr. bullets for 90% of the rest of your hunting.

There was a time when the 200 gr. Nosler option wasn't so great for the 30-06, but in recent years Nosler has greatly streamlined this bullet and enhanced its long-range capabilities considerably.

The truth is, the origianl 30-06 is a better, more versatile cartridge than the 338-06 could ever be, and necking the origianl up to 338 represents one step forward and two back......

AD

Oh Boy. Yes the .30-06 with the 200 grain bullet is better, and while we are talking handloads, you had better consider the .30-06 with 220 grain slugs too!!! That's a real killer. (Took all of my choice plains game with it in Africa, one shot and down they went) The .30-06 with heavy bullets is top notch!!!

LLS

06 wins again.
The reason to go to a 338/06 or 35 Whelen, which I shoot and have had wonderful success with, is 250gr. or larger bullets at say 2400 to 2500 fps. For lighter bullets at higher velocity a 270 works very well. The obvious choice for the "one rifle guy" is the 06 which will cover both ends of the 06 case family pretty well. (I wonder why....)

I've taken this a bit further and will be trying out a 9.3x62 for future elk and African hunts. I will use 286gr or heavier, bullets. The reason is I want a larger slug, again if I were to use 235gr bullets in a 9.3, why not just use 200 or 220 in an 06. This does give a greater difference than the orginal 06 vs. 338/06 question but I would be surprised if it were all that significant.

In the real world small combined velocity and weight differences (10 to 20 grains and less than 200 fps) are not that critical if the game is shot at moderate hunting distances, say less than 250 yds.

I am a big 338 calibre fan, however, if I were a betting man, and I'm not, I'd bet my lunch money on the -06. Half the .30 calibre bullets available were intended to be used in the venerable -06, not so with the 338.
In the 338 you have the perfect medium bore big game calibre, and bullets that for the most part, were intended to be used in the 338 Winchester. Slowing them down a bit with the smaller case doesn't make them ineffective, rather it just shortens their effective range. This was never the case with the Whelen or the 9.3, but I believe it to be with 338.
It's kind of like putting a big block chevy into a Kenworth instead of a 3406 Cat, both have 425 horses, but only one will do the job right.

Id, I have always thought the 225gr bullets would be the perfect match for the .338-06. Problem w/ my rifle, it just won't shoot small enough groups w/ any 225gr load I have tried. 200gr & 250gr, wonderfull accuracy, shot many sub MOA groups using them. The 210grNP though works so well @ .338-06 vel. The bullet is designed for the 3000fps speeds of the mag & just kills way beyond it's paper numbers. In fact, the bullet is a bit too hard when you get out beyon 300yds, penetrates great but expands much less.
I think the same about the .338-06 vs .30-06 & the .338wm vs .300wm, up close, I think the bigger bullets just hit harder, bigger bullets, bigger holes. Whne you start getting beyond 250-300yds the .30/200gr may have an edge, but? I like the .34 bore, .308 may rule the versatility crowd, but the .34 bores just get it done a wee bit better.
BTW, I want to see the load that gets a 200gr bullet out of a 22" bbl. 06 @ an honest 2700fps , maybe 2600fps+ but? As far as 220gr, yeah if you plan on hunting under 200yds all of the time, I'll bet they are effective.

BTW, I want to see the load that gets a 200gr bullet out of a 22" bbl. 06 @ an honest 2700fps , maybe 2600fps+ but?

Fred

Not sure if you were talking and waving your finger at me, but here is what I wrote :

I also have one 30-06 that has a 24 inch barrel that will break 2700 fps with the 200 gr Nosler regularly, but maybe that is a fast barrel.

I agree with you completely that an honest 2700 would be mighty tough to get in a 22 inch barrel.

BTW, what twist is your 338-06? Mine was 1 in 10 inches. I have often wondered if maybe a bit slower twist would shoot the lighter bullets better than the 1 in 10 inches most folks use.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by fredj338:

BTW, I want to see the load that gets a 200gr bullet out of a 22" bbl. 06 @ an honest 2700fps , maybe 2600fps+ but?

QUOTE]

Sauer lightweight 30-06 22" barrel

200 gr Accubond 61 gr RL22 2713 fps
200 gr Nosler Partition 56.5 gr IMR4831 2710 fps

All day long no pressure signs


Without guns we are subjects or victims, with guns we are citizens

ID, mine is also 1-10, the finger waqgging is because most factory 06 come w/ 22" bbl. & inspite of woods' (hope those are chronographed vel.) Sauer, I don't think it can be done on the avg. My son's Ruger gets 2750fps w/ 61gr RL22 & a 180gr NP, so I need more proof. Seafire gets some crazy vel. form his .338-06 that I can't touch. Ray A. gets more powder into a .404jeff case than I can, etc., but every rifle is different. Regardless, there is no way you get me to shoot an 06 over my beloved .338-06, just aint gonna happen. Now let's talk about how much better my .280 is than a .270.

Now let's talk about how much better my .280 is than a .270.

Fred

That will be a real tough one to get past me because several 280s were deemed expendable by myself.
Undoubtedly you feel the same way about the 270.

I got rid of my 285 OKH, 7mm Express and two 280s and now only have my 7X57(275 Rigby). A 7mm Mag left in the process also. My 275 Rigby pushes the Nosler 150 gr Solid Base or Partition at 2850 fps all day any day from a 22 inch barrel so I just didn't feel I needed any other rifle that shot .284 caliber bullets. My step up from a 150 gr bullet is either a 180 gr or 200 gr Nosler in the 30-06. I also only shoot 130 gr Noslers, either Solid Base or Partition in my 270.

I still have one 270 left on a pre-64 as I feel everyone should have a 270 on a model 70, a 7X57 on a 98 Mauser, and a 30-06 on a Springfield 1903.

Nah, it's a joke . I have always been blah, blah on the .270 . I think it's because all of my uncles & cousins have one & it's "the rifle". So I choose to shoot things that are a bit different:
.260ai
.280
7mmDakota
.338-06
.338x74Keith
.404 jeffery
You see, it's a sickness.

Fred

Almost as bad

221
6X45
6,5X55
270 Win
275 Rigby
30 Govt 06
338 Win
9X57
375X64

The 338 is actually more desireable for the rifle it is rather than the caliber. It just happens to be chambered in 338.

I was thinking of barreling a old rifle in 338-06 , so I studyed and compared the balistics and versitality of a 30-06 and a 338-06 and decided against a 338-06.