Have a decision to make. I have a line on a model 70 crf in 300 win (boring) and I'm thinking of filling a hole. Already have 30/06 and 375H&H. Which way do I go 416 taylor, because bigger is better, or 358 norma mag because it is in between. Both have thier advantages, and disadvantages. 416, bigger. 358, pistol bullets for fun. Any sugestions?
Posts: 496 | Location: ME | Registered: 08 May 2003
I would either go for the .416 or even a .404 Jeffery would be nice, or I would go bigger again and do a .458 Lott. Infact you would ahve the perfect combo of rifles in your.
30/06 .375 H&H .458 Lott
Posts: 7505 | Location: Australia | Registered: 22 May 2002
from my research 358 norma magnum is the same basic concept as the 416 taylor, 338 or 300 win mag necked up to 35 cal. so I can keep the action length as is. havnt thought about the 404 jeffery, but as a non-belted mag arent you stuck with correct brass? ( no necking 338 or 300 which I have a lot if?)
Posts: 496 | Location: ME | Registered: 08 May 2003
Since I'm sure that your M70 .300 WM is a STANDARD length action, let's keep it chambered for standard length rounds.
Having said that, I have had a .416 Taylor and truely love the round. I have a donor rifle that will be another .416 Taylor in the future.
I have never had a .358 NM but I am a 35 caliber nut.....that would be a pretty neat project too.
The question I have to ask though: Do you have a 'true' big-bore? I personally believe that big bores start at .400" even though everyone else throws the .375 H&H in the big-bore category. The .416 Taylor as an 'Honest' big-bore!
I guess you just need to decide what the main purpose of this rifle will be. I have an original Husqvarna Mauser in .358 Norma and absolutely love it. This cartridge in this particular rifle is supremely accurate and it is a fairly flexible cartridge. You can hypothetically load it with anything from lightweight .357 pistol bullets up to the heavy 310 gr. Woodleighs and shoot anything from woodchucks to Alaskan brownies with it. I don't own a .416 Taylor but I do own a .411 KDF, the same cartridge other than the slight difference in bullet diameter. I have been known to carry it in the deer woods but it's at its best against big mean beasties. Either cartridge will be a great addition to your battery, just figure out what you want it to accomplish most.
Quote: Have a decision to make. I have a line on a model 70 crf in 300 win (boring) and I'm thinking of filling a hole.
Well
those damn decisions, again
I would choose a 358 Norma or a 338 win. If you want a 416 why not choose the remington or the sexy Rigby. A 416 taylor is for sure a nice cartridge, but if you are selling the rifle it will not bring very much money back. The cartridge is a wildcat and John Doe does not always handload, which will exclude a few potential clients.
A 358 or 338 is a great second rifle for a safari were a 404 or 416 is the big brother
As much as I like the 338 idea, my thoughts were that if I am going to spend the time and money I would do somthing different. I can go to a have a dozen places locally and buy a 338 model 70, but whats the fun in that? If I need ammo availability I'll take the 06, (one of these days I'll have to do a survey of how many hunters in the field have some 06 ammo in the truck). This is more a want than a need I kind of like the idea of different. BTW I am kinda leaning towards the Norma, can anybody talk me out of it? thanks for the great input guys
Posts: 496 | Location: ME | Registered: 08 May 2003
I have a feeling that this descision is more about want than a need. Nothing at all wrong with that, probably what 80% of rifle purchases including 90% of mine were based on.
If this is the case then just go with your gut and get the Norma, if within a year you havn't shook the idea of the 416 Taylor or find you have a real need for one then go for it.
I suspect you have the same ilness as most of us and will end up with both eventualy
Posts: 231 | Location: West Virginia | Registered: 22 December 2003
I've never owned one, but I've always thought that the .358 Norma would be a very satisfying cartridge to work with and use for some very serious hunting purposes. I like big medium bores such as the .338 Win. and .375 H&H anyway, and the .358 Norma has always struck me as sort of an ideal in-between choice, especially as an elk, moose, and bear rifle, plus African plainsgame and cats.
Back in 1973, Bob Brister wrote at length (favorably and convincingly) about the .358 Norma in "Field & Stream". To this day, this was the best .358 Norma article I've ever read, and Brister used the cartridge extensively on game himself. No idle speculation from that man. He liked the .358 Norma in the role of a cutdown, lightweight .375 H&H (performing most of the same tasks in pretty-much the same manner), and if I recall he even used 300 gr. bullets in it with impressive results.
He made one caution that's worth addressing: Norma engineers built this cartridge around the concept of a bit of freebore, and (at least back then) .358 Norma factory ammo was loaded accordingly, thus to higher pressures. Gunsmiths were advised as to the correct amount of freebore to employ, etc. I'd enquire about this if I wanted to have a .358 Norma built.....
As to the .416 Taylor, I'm sure it's a fine cartridge, but the .416 Remington will do all that it will do and then some.
I had a .358 Norma years ago ('17 Enfield sporter) and would surely like another .358 Norma today. AD's comments about freebore are right on point and shouldn't be ignored. One of my best friends has not one but two .358 Norma's. The only pressure signs he's ever had came from factory ammo. His rifles are throated to accept the 280 gr Swift bullets seated to just below the base of the cartridge neck making his loads longer than the factory offerring with a 250 gr. bullet. Still, torch off a factory load and we expect hard bolt lift and a touch of brass flowing back into the ejector hole (Rem 700's). The chronograph results with my friends loads won't be quoted here because you wouldn't believe them and they're apparently not nearly as hot as factory loads. RL19 has been the best powder so far with IMR4350 coming a close second. It's been a fine elk and moose getter. Ed
Sorry idahoelk101, no voice of reason from me. "Sense" has no place on this forum. That's what the wives are for.
I'm playing with a future 358 Norma project as well. I've thought about a Savage to start with, doesn't have to be pretty. Or MRC, or whatever I can find in S/S and Lefty.
I'm recommending the Norma for you now. Then later you can make a bigger jump, skipping the Taylor, to a 416Rem or maybe a 458.
Good luck with your decision.
Posts: 557 | Location: Various... | Registered: 29 December 2002
Quote: Since I'm sure that your M70 .300 WM is a STANDARD length action, let's keep it chambered for standard length rounds.
Well, if it's modern production, it's a long action with a spacer in the mag. Next to nothing in parts and a little rail work and it'll handle the 300 Weatherby, 338 Weatherby, 358 STA, 416 Rem, 458 Lott, even the 470 Capstick....
Hope that helps your decision making!
Posts: 2000 | Location: Beaverton OR | Registered: 19 December 2002
You have an '06 and 375 H&H. I think that I would try to fill the gaps in the collection. My opinion is to either chamber the rifle in 338 WM (a good medium) or the 458 WM. The 358 NM will do the same thing the 375 does, but the 375 will do it better. The 416 is too close to the 375 (though the 416 is better), I would would go up to the 458 WM. For some reason that cartridge gets a lot of bad press on these pages and the 458 Lott is the wonder child. But the 458 WM has power to spare on big game, and has for many decades. Just my thoughts, BigBullet
Posts: 1224 | Location: Lorraine, NY New York's little piece of frozen tundra | Registered: 05 July 2003
I would go with the taylor your 375 is to close to the 358. Every body should have a big bore just for the fun of it.
