quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
Total funding not to exceed $2,500 including optics and it's to be capable of shooting 500 yards with a minimum of 1,300 FT-LB energy at the 500 yard mark.

You can buy a rifle and alter it as the budget is sufficient to allow that.

So....what:
1. cartridge is it chambered for?
2. manufacturer you are buying?
3. optics are added?
4. After market stock wanted
5. Bipod?
6. Barrel length
7. stainless/blued
8. wood/synthetic
9. Iron sights as well as a scope?
10. other

- Winchester Model 70 Extreme in 338wm $1079.95
- Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40 with the RZ600 reticle $689.95
- TPS rings $125.00
- NFW70LA Win 70 LA-2pc, 20 moa $151.00
- Sling made up at the local saddle shop $40.00
- Uncle Mike's sling swivels $11.99

Total - $2097.93

2100 dollars and I have enough left over to buy a few boxes of shells.

These elk rifles have killed a lot of elk over the years. The whole lot of them didn’t cost 2500 bucks. Only one of them uses a belted cartridge.

quote:

Originally posted by MickinColo:
These elk rifles have killed a lot of elk over the years. The whole lot of them didn’t cost 2500 bucks. Only one of them uses a belted cartridge.

Mick, I see you're an equal opportunity rifle buyer.....a Savage, a Remington, a Winchester and a Ruger. Do they ever fight?.....

The rifles all belong to long time hunting friends, my wife and me.

The No. 1 belongs to me, there should be no surprise about that. The 88 belongs to my wife.

I use an old Ruger 7mm rem mag that has had a trigger job, glass bedding, and custom muzzle brake with a Zeiss conquest 3x9 that shoots 150 gr. tipped Barnes quite well. With 62.6 grains of IMR 4350 it meets your 500 yard requirements and will perform well enough to kill a bull at 500 yards. But slightly over 300 is what it has done twice so far.

Starting from scratch I'd either go with the Browning synthetic stainless in 325 WSM or a Weatherby 340 in the same synthetic/stainless either one with a Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14. You might be better off spending money accurizing , developing loads, and practicing at your 500 yard distance than spending extra money on the rifle /scope.

I've tried bipods but prefer to go prone off of a backpack or other field rest, iron sights won't allow me to comfortably shoot 500 yards, but might be nice if you broke your scope on the trip - I take a back-up rifle instead.

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:
Ruger MKII stainless syt stock 338WM leupold 2.5x8 with long range reticle. Use the rest to glass bed it free float the barrel. Buy reloading supplies to paractice with.

+1 I bought one of those old SS Rugers with the skeletonized plastic stocks.

An Elk's "boiler room" is pretty large, so I figured I didn't need MOA accuracy and I wouldn't shoot beyond 300 yards or so anyhow. So I decided I wouldn't accurize.

But I did want really, really reliable glass. Hence the old Leupold 2.5 - 8 VX-III (though not with long range reticle), and I wanted SS and ugly plastic because it would be almost impervious to the weather. Or so I reasoned.

Imagine my delight when my rig shot sub MOA with 225 gr. Hornady Interlocks. And it doesn't shoot much worse with other bullets.

I totally love this rig . . . I'm really confident with it in my hands.

First, I've only been elk hunting twice. Both times in Hells Canyon, ID, (packed in on mules). I've only shot one elk and it was with a browning A-bolt in 7mmag. I have sold the gun and moved on to different things. Having said that, I am not the worlds foremost Elk expert, but I do have some practical experience in some of the most rugged and steep mountains.

The next time I will take the rifle that I used in Africa, with different optics.

1. .338 Win Mag. I'm getting a honest 3,000 fps out of it with a 27" barrel.
2. Sako L61R, Krieger barrel
3. Schmidt and Bender, something smaller than my current 3.5x12x50
4. Walnut
5. I've never needed one
6. 27" Krieger #5 taper
7. blued
8. English walnut
9. NECG, I love having backup sights
10. I think you can go with any off the shelf rifle in just about any modern cartridge, they'll all shoot just fine. Spend your money on good german optics and mount them on whatever kind of rifle you can afford afterward. The optics will make a bigger difference than the brand of gun especially in low light.

For 500 yard shots I'd want a 7mag or 338 win mag. I don't care about weight as much as most people on the forums, I like a heavier gun, I'm in excellent shape and if I'm concerned about the extra couple of pounds, I'll carry less of something else. I like heavy guns with long barrels for balance, steadiness and recoil reduction. I used to have a 300 wby in a plastic stocked M700 and it would knock your fillings lose. When the time comes to pull the trigger, I don't want to be concerned with recoil. I've shot game with my 338 and I can watch the gun recoil through my scope and come back down on the animal and watch to see it's reaction of the hit (much like a varmint rifle). For me, the advantages of a heavier gun with a longer barrel far outweigh the benefits of a short, light hunting rifle, but that's just me and everyone is different and has different needs.

What's Vapo's ultimate hunting rig?

If I knew that all elk would have to be shot at 500 yards, I would use a Ruger No1 in .416 Rigby with a Leopold 3X9. I would shoot 325gr Barnes bullets. I imagine that I would have about $1,800 tied up and with the other $700 I would hire someone to hike out 500 yards and bring my elk back to the truck.

quote:

What's Vapo's ultimate hunting rig?

I've scrutinized everything from .280 Remington to .375 H&H and all of them have their benefits.

My .280 is a M-98 lightweight and shoots quite well.....It's a candidate but I just keep thinking I need a bit more bullet weight. I was looking at using the 175 grain bullets in the .280 but have since discovered that the 160 accubond arrives at 500 yards with more energy!

I looked at the .30-06 and with the 200 grain accubond it's a definite candidate.

I have a .300 H&H Rem 721 but don't like the weight and barrel length.....but other than that it's a real winner...Very accurate! I've considered removing the barrel and installing a #2 contour 24" barrel in 8mm Rem Mag or 7mm STW or even .300 weatherby. I just don't like messing with an old reliable workhorse!

I have a .338-06 in the making and this is looking like a real winner as the recoil may be quite different from the .338 Magnums. Both the .338 Magnum and the .375 H&H are more than I want to shoot....although I'm not adverse to it.

I looked at the .358 Norma and wildcats in .35 caliber....all are great rounds but I'm now thinking we're looking at something between .284 and .338 as a matter of practicality.

I'm amazed at the number of times the .338 is mentioned in this thread.....so many folks can't be wrong I think.

I got some great advice on this thread so far.....the Stoney Creek target knobs are a great idea....

Your point about recoil from the fast .300 Weatherby is good advice....I shoot a gun better if the recoil isn't punishing....that trigger squeeze takes more discipline if it's going to smack me. I can do it but would rather avoid it.

If I was sure that a 400 yard gun is all that I would ever use I'd go to the .280 Remington and never look back. It can carry a lot of energy out to that range.

The idea of shooting an elk at extended distances aqnd then having to find a blood trail and find it isn't at all appealing. Especially when I'm packing the meat and antlers out by human transport!

The one we packed out this fall was close to half a mile....and uphill....both ways!

I was dearly impressed with the performance of my .35 Whelen and 225 grain partition.....no trailing at all. One could do much worse by staying with it!....it's recoil isn't bad at all.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
[QUOTE]I was dearly impressed with the performance of my .35 Whelen and 225 grain partition.....no trailing at all. One could do much worse by staying with it!....it's recoil isn't bad at all.

I love my Whelen too. I may do some culling this year but it aint goin nowhere.. I find that the amount of recoil is as strong as a 300 mag but it isnt as sharp. I prefer the push of the bigger bore and out to 250 + yds the results are superb.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
[QUOTE]

I looked at the .30-06 and with the 200 grain accubond it's a definite candidate.

The testing on MY 06 showed that it was far more efficent with a 180 gn slug then the bigger 200 and if your talking big yds (at least with my rig) the 180 would easily arrive with the most energy. This was across the board, more efficent than the 165 grainers as well.

I'm not sure how much more velocity the 7mag has over the 280. FWIW, I shot my elk with 160 grain accubonds and it passed all the way through, probably 150 yards. The 7mag is a pup to shoot, it's very managable and the terminal perfomance is as good as any. If you're looking for something just a bit more than the 280, I would seriously look at the 7mag or even the .284 Winchester.

quote:

Originally posted by Wstrnhuntr:
I love my Whelen too. I may do some culling this year but it aint goin nowhere.. I find that the amount of recoil is as strong as a 300 mag but it isnt as sharp. I prefer the push of the bigger bore and out to 250 + yds the results are superb.

I resisted the .35 Whelen for years assuming it had some kind of a rainbow like trajectory. I read so many posts here about the .35 Whelen and the 9.3 X 62 (sister cartridge) that I built one....actually one of each.....Man was I wrong.....that Whelen is a great long range killer. It'll stand along the .30-06 and throw a quite a bit larger bullet to boot. It's a keeper here for sure!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

Originally posted by Wstrnhuntr:
I love my Whelen too. I may do some culling this year but it aint goin nowhere.. I find that the amount of recoil is as strong as a 300 mag but it isnt as sharp. I prefer the push of the bigger bore and out to 250 + yds the results are superb.

I resisted the .35 Whelen for years assuming it had some kind of a rainbow like trajectory. I read so many posts here about the .35 Whelen and the 9.3 X 62 (sister cartridge) that I built one....actually one of each.....Man was I wrong.....that Whelen is a great long range killer. It'll stand along the .30-06 and throw a quite a bit larger bullet to boot. It's a keeper here for sure!

Yes sir! Elk are big targets and doping 12-15 inches for distance @ 300 yds is not a difficult task. Anymore it seems like 6 inches of drop @ 300 is considered a rainbow trajectory.. Thats OK. Seein that stuff makes me giggle..

quote:

Originally posted by Gerry:
That's the way I'd go so I'd just pull out my Blaser R93 in 300 Weatherby Magnum and take the 375H&H barrel along just in case the plan changes from wide open mountain spaces to thick timber.

Interesting. Why would you feel the need to change barrels?

My rebored Rem M700 338-06 in its takeoff McM KS stock, Talley lights, Leupold 2.5-8X, Uncle Mike's slings and the my 225 gr Accubond load that goes 2660 fps. It goes 7# 3 oz and shoots that load frighteningly accurate. A lot less than your $$ limit too.

I built just such a rifle last fall in 300 H&H:
pre 64 M70 300 H&H action
lilja ss #2 barrel @ 24.5"
legend stock
talley lwts
swaro AV 3-10x42
180 TTSX
weighs 7lbs 10 oz. and worked great on last years hunt.

I have my answer to your question. My Dad built it along with a few more that are very dear to me.

Model 98/.338-06 AI
Blued barrel, 24" (premium) mines a medium.
Walnut Stock (premium) w/ mahogany forend cap, and grip cap
Timney trigger
Leupold VX III 3.5X10 BC reticle
Decelerator Pad
Nosler Accubond 180 gr.

Should be just what the doctor ordered!

Have you decided on anything yet?

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

What's Vapo's ultimate hunting rig?

I'm amazed at the number of times the .338 is mentioned in this thread.....so many folks can't be wrong I think.

Of course no opinion is wrong.... but I'm wondering how many of these 338 fans have been elk hunting or been elk hunting a lot. Growing up in N Idaho I seldom saw one used, in fact the rifles I generally saw look more like MikinColo's collection. Lots of 06's, 270's 7 and 300 mags, but I cannot remember a single 338 used except one of my "friends" in high school who had a sick fascination with big exit wounds.

I've seen cow elk killed with 243's, 7mm-08's, and 50 cal round balls. I think theres a perception that you need a big bore (someone even mentioned 4.16!) for elk, but thats mostly wishful thinking. Anyhting more than a 30 cal magnum is just unnecessary muzzle energy, muzzle blast and recoil.

quote:

Originally posted by Wayfaring Stranger:

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

What's Vapo's ultimate hunting rig?

I'm amazed at the number of times the .338 is mentioned in this thread.....so many folks can't be wrong I think.

Of course no opinion is wrong.... but I'm wondering how many of these 338 fans have been elk hunting or been elk hunting a lot. Growing up in N Idaho I seldom saw one used, in fact the rifles I generally saw look more like MikinColo's collection. Lots of 06's, 270's 7 and 300 mags, but I cannot remember a single 338 used except one of my "friends" in high school who had a sick fascination with big exit wounds.

I've seen cow elk killed with 243's, 7mm-08's, and 50 cal round balls. I think theres a perception that you need a big bore (someone even mentioned 4.16!) for elk, but thats mostly wishful thinking. Anyhting more than a 30 cal magnum is just unnecessary muzzle energy, muzzle blast and recoil.

Just trying to stay within the question.

The gun I own that I would probably carry is either a Kimber Montana 300 WSM or Cooper, Jackson Game .280 AI. Would shoot my Model 98 if it were a situation that wouldn't be carrying it all day.

500 yards and energy requirments add to this equation.

A friend keeps his Wyoming ranch freezers filled with "brainers" and his favorite truck gun...218 Bee. Funny eh? A recent experience.. had the chance to shoot a new otu of the box Sako85 in their 370SakoMag (9.3x66) Very impressive accuracy (one ragged hole). Equal numbers to 375H&H with the kick of a 35Whelen ! Benifit? You now have a gun suitable for big bear and many African species as many territories have lowered min.cal. to include 9.2 and up. I've heard all the caliber stories and frankly I'd like to think I could use my 6.5 Swede for elk but this 9.3 pretty much takes tracking game after the trigger is pulled out of the equasion. just sayin'

quote:

Originally posted by nosualc:
I'll play. I built mine, almost with the same goals:

1) .338-06AI. With a 225gr accubond @2600 fps. Exceeds your ft-lb req. by a fair margin at 500 yds. decent BC.
2) Used Sako 85 grey wolf .25-06 donor
3) Zeiss Conquest 3.5-10 (used, NIB), duplex reticle
4) Factory stock (pillar bedded)
5) I have one, don't know if I'll use it
6) 24" Krieger barrel
7) stainless
8) laminated
9) no iron sights

caveat - If I was really planning on 500yd shots I'd feel more comfortable with MOA reticle and a bit more magnification.

-nosualc

Hey you copying me !!! GREAT CHOICE !!

I built my 338-06AI in 2008 from a new Sako m75 Greywolf 25-06, with new PacNor supermatch grade stainless barrel fluted and cut to 24". Shoots 22g Accubonds and TTSX's superbly!!

As for the main reason of the post in a factory rifle.

1. 300WM or 338WM
2. Sako model 75 is my choice but m85 will do
3. Leupold VX2 4-12x40 LR Duplex or VX3 3.5-10x40 or 4.5-14x40 BC reticle with Sako Optilock ring mounts or Optilock rings and bases setup.
4. Macmillan Edge if I had to choose one-but I like the m75 synthetic stock(grey with black rubber inlays).
5. No Bipod
6. 24"
7. Stainless - maybe powdercoat it if you like.
8. Synthetic or go Greywolf (laminate)
9. The Sako m85 kodiak will be the rifle for this choice.

Here are my two.

1. Factory Sako m75ss rifle in 300WM I bought new in 1997, fluted the barrel-flutes teflon coated, installed muzzle break (wish I never did but very accuate rifle-overall barrel length is still 24"), Leupold Vari-X III 3.5-10x40 mounted in Sako Opitlock rings and bases. Shoots 180gr Accubonds under 0.5" groups @ 100 metres.


2. Built in fall of 2008, Sako m75 Greywolf 338-06 Ackley Improved. New PacNor supermatch grade stainless #5 barrel , fluted (all barrel work done by the gunsmith-rifle weighs in same as a factory Sako m75 Greywolf 300WM or 338WM), Leupold VX3 3.-10x40 scope mounted in the Sako Optilock ringmounts. The receiver, trigger guard, rings, barrel and bottom of the magazne are powdercoated to match the scope (gunmetal grey). Shoots 225gr Accubonds and TTSX's at 0.6" groups right now-still tweaking load.



Seen a Sako m75ss 300RUM factory rifle for sale a while back either in Guns America or Gun Broker site. This would be great with 200gr Accubonds or TTSX's.

I'm thinking ofa 330 Dakota built off a Sako m75 action with a MacMillan stock as another project.

quote:

Originally posted by Mighty Peace:

Hey you copying me !!! GREAT CHOICE !!

Yep, I was walking down the "what should I build" path a couple years ago here on AR, and based on all the opinions I read, I ended up unashamedly copying you. I told you I was going to do it!

-nosualc

Anything less, caliber-wise, than a .416 Rem Mag shows a total disrespect for the animal and is nothing less than an unethical stunt. All one has to do is look at the math and see this is the minimum that the Government should permit to be used. Simple.....

quote:

Originally posted by TEANCUM:
Anything less, caliber-wise, than a .416 Rem Mag shows a total disrespect for the animal and is nothing less than an unethical stunt. All one has to do is look at the math and see this is the minimum that the Government should permit to be used. Simple.....

Excellent Idea Teancum! I see you’re starting to come around.

300 Win Mag...180 grain....still the classic...never shot an elk but I've shot red deer in Europe with it...a Sauer 202 sold on Gunbroker for 1500 and you can put all the scope you'll ever need on the gun inside your budget.

Of course there's always this.......

quote:

Originally posted by Oddbod:
Of course there's always this.......

Been there....got one....mine is 2 7/8" bore

I suppose we need to move this to the big bore forum now!

used model 70 stainless in 06, 2-8 vx3. 300 in reloading supplies and a better pair of boots so you can get closer. all in way under 2500

I have killed Elk with a .270 WSM, three different .300 Winnys, .338 Lapua, .340 Wby, two different .358 STA's. Pick your poison. I consider my .358 STA Model 70 Winchester the ultimate Elk rifle with a 250 grain North Fork at 3000 fps, topped with a 4.5X14 Leupold Vari-X III. Good shooting.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
Wow, I'm amazed....it's overwhelming for the .338 caliber......and the Magnum first.

The world is full of people who have only thought about elk hunting or have only shot one or two, yet have an opinion based on too much Craig Boddington toilet-side reading and little else...

Remington 700Ti in 300RSAUM topped with Talley QR mounts and a Leupold VX-3 in 2.5-8x scope. I'd go with te Talleys so that I can have a back-up scope pre-sighted in "just in case" or one of different magnification range for different situations or game.

Builder? Remington Custom Shop

Model? Alaskan Wilderness Rifle

Chambering? 338RUM

whatever is left of the $2500 on a 4-12 Leupold
and a set of Double Dovetail rings and bases.

That's it.

Failing that a used R700AWR in another long magnum chambering and have V.P. precision replace the barrel with a Lilja .338 barrel medium heavy contour, chambered for 338RUM

I've found that however much I might get winded and shakey climing some damned hill at 8000ft I shake LESS
with a heavier barrel than a lighter barrel.

And frankly if I need to shave a couple pounds off of something it won't be the rifle but off ME by cutting out cheese burgers.



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