My father-in-law is coming up from Missouri this year for the Wisconsin deer season. He has 2 rifles and he is trying to decide which to bring along. He has an 1892 Springfield in 30-40 Krag and an original German production 1898 Mauser in 8mm. He'd like to know which would be the better choice for hunting whitetails. He would be shooting factory loaded ammo if that makes a difference.

If anyone has any practical experience with these cartridges on deer or anything else, the info would be appreciated.

My grandfather and I have taken dozens of whitetails with these calibers. My preference is the Rem 170 grain Core Loct in the 8mm. The 30/40 is ok too but I can't remember what ammo worked the best, if there is even a selection of factory ammo for this caliber.

Tupac plagiarizes Nietchze too!

Trail - Both rifles would work fine. The 30/40 Krag is basically just a goofy looking /06.

My concern is with the factory ammo side of your question. I don't recall the last box of factory 30/40 Krag I've seen and 8mm isn't on the shelf just any place either.

Also, the factory used to really load the 8mm down below it's potential and as far as I know still does. Probably the same with the Krag.

Whatever he brings, he needs to be familiar and competent with the rifle...AND he better make sure he has found some ammunition. There are a lot of places he would be S.O.L. looking for factory ammo in either caliber. Probably the 8mm will be most plentiful.

Yada yada about the quote. I'm sorry if I'm not old enough or educated enough to know all my German philosophers. You stick with yours and I'll stick with mine.

I'd suggest the one he shoots the best, both are good whitetail calibers...

Trailblazer, speaking of factory ammo only, the 8X57 and .30-40 are equals as both are underloaded by factories. Remember, they are oldies. The problem: you can't buy that stuff just any 'ol place.
However, if you're a handloader the 8 is the way to go as most 8m/m's(those with the .323" bbl) will easily digest a stout load. Any old Craig with its single locking lug is out of the equation for warm reloads, and only a handful of newer .30-40's are out there that will stand the added pressures.

Packrat
For deer I wouldn't want a heavier load than the factory stuff. The 8mm Rem 170 grain Core Loct is just the right speed and bullet construction for deer from point blank to 200 yards.

As a person who owns and shoots both, and have hunted a lot in Northern Wisconsin, either round is competent for deer. Both are 200 yd rounds, even if factory downloaded.

So they have the needed range for Wisconsin whitetails, and both have more than enough bullet weight. I have my doubts about 150 grain loads in the 8mm, but this is based on the bias of 170 and 175 grain bullets I have used.

The Krag is going to be more accurate with heavier bullets, based on having a long throat if it is in a military barrel. The Krag does well with a 180 grain RN or a 220 grain round nose. I don't hand load either cartridge to their full potential at all, and they will do the job at 200 yds.

Good luck on the hunt.

You can buy 30/40 Krag ammo, Remington still loads it and Winchester makes brass. Follow loading manuals and you'll be good. I want to get one this summer on my C&R. I nice original, not the carbine'ed ones.

That would be a coin toss for me. Which rifle does he like best? Bring that one.

Nitroman:

What is a C&R? I have seen that term several times lately, and am not familar with it.

Sure it is something simple, that I can't figure out. So what else is new?

C&R = Curio & Relic (firearms license)

It's an "03" license which allows you to purchase, sell, or trade to enhance a collection.

You can not "deal" firearms as a business (01 license is required).

The .30/40 is underloaded in factory ammo, IF you have a Ruger No. 3!! If you are shooting a U.S. Krag, it is NOT underloaded! It fires a 180-grain spitzer at around 2460 FPS. The 8mm is severely underloaded in U.S. ammo, peak allowable SAAMI pressures being around 37K PSI, while in Germany, it is loaded to over 50,000.

I recommend using European ammo in the 8mm, in which case it would be better than a Krag with U.S factory ammo. Both, however, are very adequate for deer/black bear with U.S. factory ammo!

Eldeguello, you mean the Ruger can be loaded to 2460. Factory does not go that fast.
Just want to clear that up.
Pecos45, the 30-40 is not a funny looking 30-06. It is closer to the .303 British. It is way behind an '06.
I am really nit-piky this morning.
Mikelravy, 200 yards is point blank range, which is defined as the range a bullet does not deviate more than 3.5" from line of sight (Sierra).

Atkinson gave you the best advice.

If possible, have him get several boxes of factory loads for each rifle, then take each to a rifle range and shoot it for awhile -- preferably both rifles at the same range trip so he can do a side by side comparison. Also if possible, he should handle each rifle and carry it for awhile to see which handles and carries best for him. Have him choose the rifle that he most enjoys shooting or that gives him the best results. No deer in the world will be able to tell the difference when hit properly with either of these.

[ 11-05-2003, 18:19: Message edited by: LE270 ]