The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Medium Bore Rifles 338 ULTRA or 375 H&H for GrizzleyGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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| one of us |
Which rifle would be best to take hunting Grizzley. | ||
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| <9.3x62> |
I'd prefer a 35 Whelen or 9.3x62, but of the two you mentioned, the 375 in a heartbeat. Ultra mags...  | ||
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| Moderator |
.375H&H. Your guide will not, should not allow you to take 200yd. shots on a grizzly, so you don't need all the extra velocity of the .338 RUM (which is a fine cartridge, too). Use a 300gr. Swift A-Frame, NorthFork, Trophy Bonded BearCalaw, Nosler Partition, or Barnes 'X'. George  | |||
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| one of us |
The person I know who is currently living and has shot the greatest number of Grizzlies, 51, uses a .35WAI in a fairly light custom Mauser actioned rifle. I prefer the 9.3x62 and am building one up on a Brno ZG-47 action with a 23" bbl. I used a .375 H&H P-64 for years in Grizzly country, but, it is a heavy rifle to pack around and the 9.3 or .35W will do the same job at realistic Grizzly ranges; this means no shots at over 125 yds. The Ultragag is not a practical Grizzly rifle, IMHO, due to severe recoil and I do not trust that rebated rim. | |||
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Moderator |
I'll just echo Georges comments, but I'd choose a 270 gr @ 2700. __________________________________________________ The AR series of rounds, ridding the world of 7mm rem mags, one gun at a time. | |||
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One of Us |
three-seven-five......easy one. /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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| one of us |
I don't know about the 375 but my hunting partner hammered a 9' brown with a 338 Ultra using 225 bear claws this year.25 yards 338 ultra one shot = very dead bear. | |||
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| one of us |
.375 H&H - 300 grain Nosler Partition - 260 Grain Accubond Roland | |||
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| one of us |
Bears are soft by dangerous game standards, so penetration is not as important as say on a Buffalo.... I would prefer the 375 H&H with a 270 gr. bullet such as a Woodliegh or Northfork for bears or just a standard .338 is a better choice for Griz..for Alaskan brown bear the 375 gets the nod over a 338 Win. I suppose, but not by much... For Mountain Grizzley a 30-06 with 180 gr. Noslers is plenty of gun... Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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one of us |
See below. Sarge Holland's .375: One Planet, One Rifle . . . for one hundred years! | |||
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| One of Us |
Beyond a shadow of a doubt it would be the .375 H&H a much more practical round IMHO | |||
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| One of Us |
Ammunition availability for the Holland & Holland compared to the 338 RUM is waaay better ANYWHWERE IN THE WORLD, especially in Africa(or Alaska for the sake of conversation). That being said, the availibility of ammunition is a big factor when you get to where you are going to hunt, and your personal ammunition isn't for whatever reason. Not to mention the thought of pounding a bear with those fat 300 grainers is pretty cool. Check out GS custom bullets flat points. | |||
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| one of us |
Thanks guys for the info. Good Hunting to ya | |||
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one of us |
You didn't define whether or not you are hunting Brown bears, or Grizzlies. If you are hunting Grizzlies, you don't need a 375 H&H. They aren't that big, and I would echo Ray's response, a 30-06 with a 180 grain Nosler would do fine. For Grizzlies, not Brown bears, the 300 Win Mag or the 338 Win Mag are both perfect for the job. I'd use 180 grain bullets in the 300, and 210's or 225's in the 338. A Brown bear is a much larger animal, and for that bear I would use at the least a 338 loaded with 250's, or more likely a 375 H&H. | |||
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| <allen day> |
I agree with those comments. For interior grizzlies, you don't need a .375 H&H, and for hunting these bears up in the mountains, most .375s are too damn heavy to carry around, as is the ammunition, and they're heavy in the scabbard as well and harder on the horse, too. When I hunted grizzly before with the .375 H&H, it was not because I felt the need to use that cartridge, it was because that particular RIFLE was (and remains) ultra-reliable, and was just begging to go hunting. In retrospect, I wish I would have taken my .300 Win. or .338 Win. instead. My next interior grizzly hunt will be conducted with my 8.5 lb. .338 Win. Mag with a 24" barrel. My previous comments apply to this cartridge as well: If you can't kill ANY grizzly that walks this earth with a .338 Win. and premium bullets, you're not going to kill him with anything else.......... AD | ||
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| One Of Us |
quote: How would you feel about hunting interior Grizzly with a .300 Win. Mag. using 200gr. TBBCs or 200gr. Swift-A-Frames, if you only had a choice betwen it and a .375 H&H ? Big Thanks. | |||
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| <allen day> |
I would feel just fine about taking a .300 Win. with either 180 gr. or 200 gr. bullets for grizzly, and in fact I have up in Alaska. These bears aren't bullet-proof......... AD | ||
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| one of us |
About 20 years ago, an American hunter was hunting Grizzlies near Bella Coola, B.C. a traditional trophy Bear area. I have lived there, bushwhacked around there and all up and down the B.C. coast and will simply say that there are HUGE M.f.'ing Grizzlies there! This gentleman had his trusty .300 Win. with his 180 NP handloads and shot what became and remained the #1 Grizzly for several years.....with one shot. As Allen says, these Bears are not bulletproof and a good .300 or .338 Mag. with appropriate bullets will kill ANY Grizzly stone dead, right now. A bigger rifle is all well and good, until you try to pack a 10-11 lb. rifle, your daypack and so forth up a slide choked with Buckbrush and Devil's Club, not fun! I can see a reason for a working guide to use a heavy rifle such as a .416 to finish off wounded Bears, but, for most of us, the reasonable weight and recoil of the .300 or .338 will allow us to put one good bullet where it matters, then the wounded, dangerous Bear is not an issue. I am not especially recoil sensitive, but, I hate packing really humoungous rifles in tough country and I have been around quite a few Grizzlies, the two cartridges mentioned above will and have done the job, every time, at least that I have seen. | |||
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| one of us |
My brother Scott and his partner hunted a bear a couple of years ago that is in the book at 26 1/16". The bear was huge, squaring almost 9 feet. If I remember right it was like 8' 10" square. That is one HUGE interior bear, in this case a tundra grizzly. That bear was killed by Joe Small with 2 shots from a 300 Weatherby Ultra Light, shooting 180 grain Noslers. The 300 magnums and the 338's are perfect Grizzly guns in my book. The bear is listed in the Boone and Crockett records book, page 483, hunter Joseph Small, owner Scott C. Babcock. Rank number 8 for the 25th Big Game Awards Period. I think it's top 100 all-time. | |||
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| one of us |
Allen, Are you going to hunt on the Seward Peninsula? Nice bears coming out of there right now. | |||
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| One of Us |
But keep in mind a couple of things in relation to interior grizzly bears: You will read all sort of stories about the "smaller" grizzly bears in the interior of Alaska, and you can believe those if you wish, as long as you believe that brown bears are seldom smaller than 9'. However, there are not too many hunters dropping over 9" brown bears all the time. a. A few years ago, someone I know from Anchorage killed a 9'4" grizzly not too far from Fairbanks. The bear made it to the record book. He told me that he had been looking for a huge bear he had seen before, but this one he had to kill when it charged. He shot it a couple of times with his .375 H&h and 300-grain bullets. b. I have seen huge grizzly bears in the interior, near some lakes salmon swim through to the spawning streams that flow into them. I am talking about HUGE grizzly bears, as big as their bigger brother. So if you come to Alaska thinking that interior grizzly are much smaller, keep in mind that "by average" it's true, but all depends on what those "smaller" grizzly bears feed on. Finally, the most popular cartridges in Alaska are the .30-06, .300WM. and .338WM, period. A .375 H&H is plenty, but a .416 with heavier bullets is best for any grizzly or brown. A .338RUM with 275-grain A-frame bullets should be outstanding, too. | |||
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| one of us |
I saw that picture of that Grizzley about a year ago where the man shot it with a 30/06. It was [I think he said] over 9' long. Its head made about 24" to 30" across maybe bigger. That was one big Grizzley bear. | |||
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| one of us |
I took my 91/2 ft Brown Bear with a .300 Win mag with a 200 grain Nosler Partition bullet at 2900 fps. That experience taught me I need something larger and my next trip for Moose in Grizzly country saw me with a .340 Wby and a 250 grain Nosler Partition Gold bullet at 3000 fps. My last trip for Caribou and Wolfe in Brown Bear country and all subsequent trips will be with one of my .358 STA's. One shoots a 270 grain North Fork at 2850 fps and the other shoots the same bullet at 2950 fps. I cannot argue with either the Ultra or .375, but my STA's beats both for my use.  Good shootingphurley | |||
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| One of Us |
quote: Most bears killed by Alaska hunters drop to all around cartridges such as those three I listed. The problem when you see a grizzly nearby is that it makes you think about bigger guns. But a cool-headed hunter with an relatively small gun and bullet combination, often succeeds dropping any bear. | |||
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| one of us |
I hunt the open tundra with a Weatherby 338-378 with 250 gr Nosler Partitions.The 338 ultra mag can be loaded to within 200 fps of the 338-378 Weatherby.I use a 416 Rem mag in the thick stuff wit h 410 gr Woodleigh bullets.I had my 338 win mag last year when three grizzleys came up at dark.I felt a little undergunned.The 338 win mag is the smallest gun I will even fool with for Grizzleys with 250 gr bullets.If I had my 338-378 when I saw those three bears I would have shot one but I didnt and think around 200 yards to 150 yards is as far as I will shoot a griz with a 338 win mag.I would shoot one out to 350 yards with the 338-378.I trust my 416 rem mag as my tent gun and in the thickets by the river ,where I hunt. | |||
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| one of us |
Ray ----- I agree with you completely, in normal circumstances the three you listed will suffice. My experience was not normal. ----- We stalked my Bear for 45 minutes crawling up a Salmon stream, it was standing when we spotted it therefore we were focused on it. Upon reaching 90 yards I shot it as it was standing facing us, dropping it with one shot from the .300 Win mag and a 200 grain Nosler Partition. It made a roar when falling and landed with a thud easily heard from our distance. Immediately three more Bears stood up to see what the noise was, they were in side streams and within 40 to 20 yards respectively. The guide said G.D. shoot Bears. There was me, another hunter(licensed), my brother-in-law (only acting as a backup gun)and the guide, who was also licensed for a Bear. They shot two other Bears, both 71/2 to 8 footers. The fourth Bear left with gusto, throwing sod in the air behind him and pounding the ground as he left. The noise of all this from the roars, screams, shots, was tremendous, and something I will never forget, and still hear sometimes. My Bear never moved a muscle but it took 5 shots for one Bear and 4 shots to anchor the other Bear from .375 and .300. A cool young guide and good shooting saved the day. ----- This was my first Bear hunt and I found out that things don't always happen according to plans when Dangerous game is hunted. My brother-in-law shot a charging Brown at 40 yards with a 30-06 pump, downing it with two shots to the head. Another buddy shot a Brown three times with a 7mm Rem and three times with a .44 mag pistol with the Bear stopping at 7 steps, and the .44's penetrating only the hide and fat. All this happening before my next trip to Brown Bear country. I decided that the only thing I could control is the weapon I carry, and practice enough to shoot it instinctively. Good shooting.phurley | |||
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| One of Us |
Personally, I don't think any 30 caliber makes for a "good" bear gun. Begin with 32 caliber and go from there. The older I get the more rifle weight and handling make a difference. I use a 358 Norma w/250 or 280 grain Swifts. The 375 is excellent, no doubt, but HEAVY. And you can count on walking, crawling, sliding more than you ever dreamed possible. Just my .02 | |||
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| One of Us |
In the early '80's there was a guy near Anchorage who was moose hunting. He tied his boat to some trees on shore, walked on a trail looking for moose, and came upon four grizzlies feeding on a moose carcass. He was carrying a .338WM, loaded with factory ammo/250-grain NOS bullets. Three of the bears charged, and the fourth ran. He killed the three bears during the charge. He shot one of the bears to turn it or slow it down, and that was the last one he killed later. Somehow he managed to reload one round, and used it to shoot the last bear on the head at point blank. The bear dropped by his feet. According to F&G, the hunter fired five rounds within 11 seconds or so. The story was published on the local paper back then. | |||
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| one of us |
Ray ----- Wow, what a story. I would hope I could fire my first four rounds fairly quickly and accurately, but at reloading time I might get a bad case of fumble fingers with Bears that close. Remembering what we went through with our encounter makes me appreciate what that dude did even more.   Good shooting.phurley | |||
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| <allen day> |
Man, that's some story! What amazes me is how cool the shooter was, and how quickly and accurately he used his rifle in the clutch. This is a hunter I'd like to meet. Lots of guys (cast of thousands) can keep their head level and their shots true off the bench or on whitetails off of some tower stand, but the guys who can perform the way this man did in the face of dangerous game are extremely few and very far between.... AD | ||
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| one of us |
They both are totally adequate for Grizzly. Use the one you feel most comfortable with i personally would go with the 338 but thats me good luck on your hunt regardless of what you take. Hunting its not a Hobby its My Way of Life!!! | |||
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| One of Us |
Allen Day: The story was also published in a book titled "Some Bears Kill" by Larry Kaniut. According to the story, the guy was originally from Florida, and later moved to Alaska. But he was very proficient with the gun he used in FL, and continued practicing with his .338. There was a guide called Bud Kunckle (I am not sure about the last name's spelling). Anyways, Bud was from Fairbanks, I believe, and he guided clients to the ice packs of the North to hunt polar bears long ago when it was legal. He backed his clients with a .375 H&H, but his favorite rifle was a .30-06. One day, he was somewhere near a cabin, and besides him was a younger guy with a movie camera I think. Bud shot a grizzly with his .30-06, and then waited about one hour before tracking it to let it "stiffen-up" a little. They both left after the bear, and by the time they saw it it was very close and on a full charge. Bud stopped and killed the bear, while the other guy took pictures. The bear dropped just in front of Bud before it died. According to those who knew Bud, he was the coolest guy around, completely unafraid of anything. | |||
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| new member |
For inland grizz I like the choice of a .33 with 225 grain Barnes XLC. Coastal Browns get the 375 H&H with a 270 grain Barnes XLC. | |||
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one of us |
There are many great cartridges that would work well for grizzly, but of the two you mentioned I would take the 375 and not look back. **************** NRA Life Benefactor Member | |||
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| new member |
I use a 338/06 for both black bear and interior grizzly. In my neck of the woods the interior grizzlies are not big by trophy standards but I give them plenty of respect. I have not succeded in getting my grizzly draw yet but I am hopeful this is the year! I have always been taught to use one gun and one load so I would choose the gun you shoot the best. | |||
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