I am playing with replacing some older rifle scopes on a group of core rifles. These rifles are all keepers in .270 Win, .264 Win, .416 Rigby, .300 Wea, and .300H&H.
Other rifles that I have recently scoped have Leupold VariX3 2.5-8x36, Leupold VariX3 3.5-10x40, Schmidt & Bender Zenith 1.5-6x42 and a Schmidt & Bender Zenith 3-12X50 illuminated.
The scopes that I have interest in and am looking at but have no experience with are the Swarovski Z6 1.7-10x42, Leupold VX5-HD 2-10X42, Schmidt & Bender Klassik 3-10x42, Swarovski Z3 3-10X42, Schmidt & Bender 1-8x24 illuminated.
I am not really sold on the illuminated scopes for all around hunting and shooting.
Any of you have in the field experience with any of the scope models I am looking at. Any of the above mentioned scopes cause you any problems?
Some of the other scopes I had serious interest in had mounting problems with the mounting area to short for a lot of my rifles and not really interested in picatinny type mounts.

Swarowskis are very good. So are Zeiss. I find the schmidt heavy! Illumiated reticules are great for low light shooting.

Leupold!

Leupold!

Any of the major European makers.

The Germans make excellent sco-es.

Their problem is complicating them.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Leupold!

Leupold!

+1

I have Weaver, Burris, Leupold and Ziess. The last several have been Ziess. When I studied in the Biology and Chemistry fields we all fought for the Ziess microscopes because of their clarity. When I could to afford them they became my go to scopes. Good Shooting.

I like the Leupold 2.5-8x36 for close range calibers, and the Leupold 4.5-14x50 on the longer-range rifles.

I have Leupold scopes on 6 of my hunting rifles.

I especially like the CDS turrets, and 5 of those scopes have that option.

I also like the 30 mm tube with side focus, and I have those scopes on my 2 main hunting rifles.

All of these scopes have 40 mm Objective lenses,

Two of these scopes are 3-9x,

Three are 4.5-14x,

And one is 6-18x

I have a few of the Swarovski Z6 1.7-10x42 Plex reticles, non-illuminated. These have seen only a bit of range time. Though I have done a lot of peering through them in lower light. To my eyes, non-scientific, I like the scope. The low end field of view is a plus for my uses. The Plex reticle also does well in the lower light. The first generation of Plex reticles in these scopes were much too thin for my liking.
I have some Schmidt & Bender Zenith 1.1-4x24’s with FD7 reticles. I really like these. Another favorite S&B is the Stratos 1.5-8x42 FD4, after having the illumination control changed to the Zenith rotary type. I have one on a 375 Ruger and had another on a 416 Ruger for a year or two.

I consider the Swarovski 1.7-10x42 with the Plex reticle, a scope that I could use on a wide variety of rifles and hunting circumstances. The same can be said for the S&B 1.5-8x42 with the FD4. The illuminated reticle does have some advantage for me in the near dark.

quote:

Originally posted by 4WD:
I am playing with replacing some older rifle scopes on a group of core rifles. These rifles are all keepers in .270 Win, .264 Win, .416 Rigby, .300 Wea, and .300H&H.
Other rifles that I have recently scoped have Leupold VariX3 2.5-8x36, Leupold VariX3 3.5-10x40, Schmidt & Bender Zenith 1.5-6x42 and a Schmidt & Bender Zenith 3-12X50 illuminated.
The scopes that I have interest in and am looking at but have no experience with are the Swarovski Z6 1.7-10x42, Leupold VX5-HD 2-10X42, Schmidt & Bender Klassik 3-10x42, Swarovski Z3 3-10X42, Schmidt & Bender 1-8x24 illuminated.
I am not really sold on the illuminated scopes for all around hunting and shooting.
Any of you have in the field experience with any of the scope models I am looking at. Any of the above mentioned scopes cause you any problems?
Some of the other scopes I had serious interest in had mounting problems with the mounting area to short for a lot of my rifles and not really interested in picatinny type mounts.

You mentioned the S&B 1-8x24. I do not have any straight tubes in the 8x range. I have a Leica Magnus 1-6.3x24 with the illuminated L4. This is a definite favorite scope, currently on a 416 Ruger. I have an unmounted Swarovski 1-6x24 illuminated #4 which seems like a good scope. I have a couple of the EE versions presently on 458 Lott’s.

Swarovski Z-5s. Most of my regular hunting rifles carry them, along with custom dial up turrets ordered from Outdoorsman's in Phoenix. I have other Swarovski's-a couple of illuminated ones and a Z-3-for certain other big game rifles. And, then there's the rest of my rifles-a vast majority of them carry Leupolds.

Flavour of my month at the moment is a Meopta R2,1.7-10x42. Crystal clear glass.
A long time favourite is an old Zeiss Diavari in 3-9x36. A true classic.

quote:

Originally posted by surefire7:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Leupold!

Leupold!

+1

2.5-8 for best all-around

I agree with that; VX-3 2.5X8 Leupold. Although I have several mounted I do have a Kahles for my 1903 Mannlicher in keeping with classic.

Overwhelmingly Leupold. Favorite is Vari-X3 1" 4.5x14×40 AO. I have that model on 4 Sakos, all of my other Sakos wear Leupold. Save 1 that has a Meopta. Next would be the 2.5x8 , then a couple w/ 6.5x20.

Caveat being, I haven't bought any new model leupolds for some time. I watch the gently used market, same as goes with my A- series Sakos.

I love the 3.5 x 10 with CDS or not depending on YOUR application. Nice 1' tube scope!

I love the VX-5 3-15 30mm tube with CDS. It's a larger scope and not right for all applications but I have 3 on rifles with various chamberings. It's a helluva fine scope all the way around.

While I have bigger and smaller, these two cover a huge range of applications.

Zeke

Leupold 4x either FX or old M8. Unfortunately Leupold seems to disagree. AT least they still make the 2.5.

I like to keep things simple. My favorite deer rifle is a Model 70 in 270 Winchester with a Leupold M8 6X. Rainy day rifle is a Kimber Montana in .257 Roberts with a VX3 2.5-8, usually set on 6X.

quote:

Favorite is Vari-X3 1" 4.5x14×40 AO.

For my Leupolds, that is my choice as well.

All my hunting rifles wear Swarovski. None better IMO

I put Leopold VR-R 2-7 Firedot scopes on my kids rifles and a VX-R 3-9 on my Ruger 77MKII 270. They are some of the best Leopold has ever made IMO
Several VX-3 scopes on other rifles with no complaints.

I've got a SWFA Ultralite 2.5-10 on my Barrett Fieldcraft 270 and absolutely love it.

I have several Trijicon scopes which are slowly replacing my Leopold VX-III's. The Accupoint 3-9 green is my all around favorite. The 2.5-12 is outstanding and better to my eyes than the Leopold 4.5-14 that it replaced. I recently put a Tenmile 6-24 on my 8 twist Tikka 223. Brilliant optics and competes on an even field with Nightforce it replaced at 2X the price point.

Ive got a couple Swarovski scopes which have great clarity and brightness, but only so-so mechanics.

I've got two old steel tube Weaver's that just won't die.

I've got Trijicon MRO's on the house rifles and a MRO HD w/ 3x magnifier on my truck gun.

Then there's Captain Indestructible, the ELCAN 1/4 on my SCAR. When I have to work around unfriendly's, this is my go-to.

Still lots of LOVE for Leupold and especially the older model Vari X 3 2.5-8 X36. I really like that scope too and have two on lighter weight rifles. Not sure why Leupold changed up one of their flagship models. On the lookout for a couple more of those older model 2.5-8x36.

Thought there would be more comments and LOVE on Swarovski’s Z6 1.7-10x42. That scope is the favorite of several top rifle builders I know.
The Swarovski Z3 (3-9X36 and 3-10x40) also seems to be pretty popular in the non magnum 270/30.06 class rifles. I love the 4A reticle and the Z3 is one of the few scopes that has it. I think the Z3 3-10X40 4A would be a great choice for a vintage L61 Sako .270.
The Swarovski Z6 1.7-10X42 will probably be the best option on the Simillion/Echols rifle chambered for the short throat .300 Weatherby.

Probably going to put on a Leupold HD5 2-10X42 on the pre 64 Mod 70 .264 Win.

Lots of great options for the DGR in the 1-6x24 and 1-8x24 straight tube scopes .
Leica Magnus illuminated, Swarovski Z6i and Schmidt&Bender Exos 1-8X24 all seem pretty equal quality wise but will go with the Schmidt & Bender due to the smaller ocular eye piece and the 8X power.

10X is about max power for me to be able to hold steady for longer in the field shots up to practiced 500 meters. Many new scopes are way over 10X power. I also prefer my scopes to have a 40-44MM max objectives since I do a lot of horseback hunting with a rifle scabbard, although I have a couple 50MM objective illuminated scopes that are great for certain conditions.

I have had great experiences (quality and ruggedness) with Leica scopes in the past, the new Leica Amplus 6 scopes look rugged and can’t say enough about Leica glass. I have experience only with the Zeiss Diavari scopes and the quality is great. Not up to speed on their new models .

Still looking for field experiences from hunters who have used the Schmidt&Bender Klassik 3-10x42, not much out there on that model scope.

I look forward to you evaluation of the S&B Exos 1-8x24. I am a straight tube fan and had considered this scope. I realize that I give up some low light performance to the larger objectives of equal quality lens / coatings. But, for my shorter range usage, I am satisfied with the 6x on top end. I actually would be satisfied with 5x.

I have Lots Of Like for the Swarovski Z6, 1.7-10x42. The first generation of Plex reticles, were piss poor for low light use to my eyes. And I think this stigma is still floating around out. Ironically, I found out first hand Twice. I purchased 2ea Demo Swarovski 1.7-10x42 Plex scopes from 2 different dealers, at different times. When they arrived, Surprise!! They were the first generation Plex. The difference was startling obvious. Both incidents were within the past 2 years. I was surprised these 1st generations were still out there in the market place.
Being a non-turret twister / 300 yards and under shooter, this scope fits my all-around-use scope idea. The substantial low end field of view was its primary attraction.
The S&B Stratos 1.5-8x42 FD4, after having the illumination control replaced with the rotary type; is another favorite. Its low end field of view is a big plus to me. It and the Swarovski 1.7-10x42mm are my picks of what I own for lower light do-all-scopes.

I absolutely agree the larger than 42mm objectives have their place. I seldom use them. I have some 50mm’s, that I really don’t use. Though if situation dictated it, I would use a 56mm. The 42mm’s have been sufficient thus far.

I left Leupold decades ago. But I do have a HD5 1-5x24 Duplex that I bought for a decent price. I have it mounted but unused. I will say, from informal comparisons with other upper end 24mm objectives, “the view” is very good to my eye. Plenty good for my use of a straight tube.

The Leica Magnus 1-6.3x24 may be my favorite. If the L4 reticle was more like a Zeiss or S&B #4 or even the FD7 in the S&B 1.1-4x24, the Leica would be near-perfect to me.
All reticles are definitely not the same, even in the same manufacture’s scope lines. There was a Definite Difference between the S&B Zenith 1.1-4x24 FD7 and the S&B Stratos 1.1-5x24 FD7.
Enough difference that the Stratos now has a FD4 reticle.

quote:

Originally posted by 4WD:
Still lots of LOVE for Leupold and especially the older model Vari X 3 2.5-8 X36. I really like that scope too and have two on lighter weight rifles. Not sure why Leupold changed up one of their flagship models. On the lookout for a couple more of those older model 2.5-8x36.

Thought there would be more comments and LOVE on Swarovski’s Z6 1.7-10x42. That scope is the favorite of several top rifle builders I know.
The Swarovski Z3 (3-9X36 and 3-10x40) also seems to be pretty popular in the non magnum 270/30.06 class rifles. I love the 4A reticle and the Z3 is one of the few scopes that has it. I think the Z3 3-10X40 4A would be a great choice for a vintage L61 Sako .270.
The Swarovski Z6 1.7-10X42 will probably be the best option on the Simillion/Echols rifle chambered for the short throat .300 Weatherby.

Probably going to put on a Leupold HD5 2-10X42 on the pre 64 Mod 70 .264 Win.

Lots of great options for the DGR in the 1-6x24 and 1-8x24 straight tube scopes .
Leica Magnus illuminated, Swarovski Z6i and Schmidt&Bender Exos 1-8X24 all seem pretty equal quality wise but will go with the Schmidt & Bender due to the smaller ocular eye piece and the 8X power.

10X is about max power for me to be able to hold steady for longer in the field shots up to practiced 500 meters. Many new scopes are way over 10X power. I also prefer my scopes to have a 40-44MM max objectives since I do a lot of horseback hunting with a rifle scabbard, although I have a couple 50MM objective illuminated scopes that are great for certain conditions.

I have had great experiences (quality and ruggedness) with Leica scopes in the past, the new Leica Amplus 6 scopes look rugged and can’t say enough about Leica glass. I have experience only with the Zeiss Diavari scopes and the quality is great. Not up to speed on their new models .

Still looking for field experiences from hunters who have used the Schmidt&Bender Klassik 3-10x42, not much out there on that model scope.

I have a Swarovski Z3 1.7-10 and I would have one on all my rifles if money were no object. Mine has a German #4 reticle which is my favorite.

I own a S&B Klassik Illuminated in 3-12x50 and its also an excellent scope in every regard. The adjustments are metric...which is annoying when you are sighting in. But you can work through it. Also illuminated which I like.

I have several Trijicon Accupoints and they are superb...looking to buy a 1-6 right now.

I have 6 Burris scopes on rifles right now...all the same model. Veracity 2-10x42 with a 30mm tube. You can get these from Natchez shooters supply for about $350 right now and they are normally a $700 scope--Burris's flagship hunting line. The clarity is superb. The mechanics are superb. The eye box is generous. Only complaint is its a tad heavy. Its not a Swarovski or a S&B. But it will compete very well with the Leupold VX5 line and that's saying something.

I have an assortment of Nightforce, Leupold etc. I love the VX3 2.5-8X36 but find the mounting options limited because of the geometry especially on standard and magnum rifles...you just can't get the eyepiece back enough for my tastes when the thing is on 8 power--even with extended rings. So my version of that scope sits on a short action featherweight.

I have all makes dating from the mid 60s. Mostly Leupold though. At least 30 of them and many more passed through.
I also have Swarovski, Zeiss and Steiner.
NOT worth the exorbitant prices they get now; I see minimum pricing of $2000. Whilst they are certainly clear and well made, not worth those prices.
I also have WW2 Sniper scopes, German, US, and Russian. Primitive by our standards now. Even cheap scopes now will out perform those.
I actually just got some Bushnell Engage 30mm scopes made in Korea last week. German reticle with red dot in the center. I'm going to try them out; seem well built and very clear.

Zeiss Conquest 3x9 and 4.5-14
Nikon Monarch 2-7
Nikon EFR 3-9?
Leupold EFR

I recently purchased a new Steyr CLII in .30-06. Went on line to get reviews on the best new scopes on the market. Leupold was always #1, but #2 was mostly Hawke. I had never even heard of them. So I called them up, talked to their marketing manager, great warranty, and just looks great. So I ordered a 3x9x40 with illuminated reticle ( in both green and red as well as non illumated, all mil dot. Mounted and bore sighted. And it is just fantastic. All this for the huge price of $179. I figured at that price and the great warranty I could just send it back. Not going anywhere.

All Leupolds, from the 2.5X Leupold Alaskan, 3X M8, and my all time favorite the std 4X...I also have a number of 2X7S, 3x9s, and 2.5 X 8s...in my desk draws in the shop...I switch them out from time to time..Nothing larger than my 3x9s, Im a hunter and see no need for more power, if that..I like the 2.5x8x36 on my 220 Swift..I have no need for more than my 4Xs on big game rifles..Speaking for myself only in a world of 16x24s and such..

That said, were I shooting a big bolt gun such as the 458 Lott and up, Id go with the 2.5 light wt. as it can handle recoil while the rest are rattling like a bb in a box car by the time you have shot them 50 to 250 times..I proved that to myself some years ago..

I get claims to the otherwise from the boys with gun cabnets and closet queens!!

As you may have noticed, I think the basic concept of constantly centred reticles makes virtually all modern scopes since Pecar closed junk, no matter how good their lenses might be.

So, don't update, go back, and look for a good Zeiss or Hensoldt Diavari 1.5-6x, from before 1975, or other reticle-movement scopes by Swarovski, Nickel, Kahles, Pecar, Unertl, Leupold etc, or a Bausch & Lomb Custom set-up.

all Leupolds: 2-7x and 2 1/2-8x

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
As you may have noticed, I think the basic concept of constantly centred reticles makes virtually all modern scopes since Pecar closed junk, no matter how good their lenses might be.

So, don't update, go back, and look for a good Zeiss or Hensoldt Diavari 1.5-6x, from before 1975, or other reticle-movement scopes by

Swarovski, Nickel, Kahles, Pecar, Unertl, Leupold etc, or a Bausch & Lomb Custom set-up.

SMan338:

Really??????
So you are saying any of us who hunt with a scope that is NOT 45 years old , that all of are scopes are junk???
What are you smoking????

4WD

Hard to beat the Leupold 6X36mmm. They are very reliable, nicely sized and wonderfully clear. Sometimes "simpler can be better". Their tube length is also just about ideal to mount on any rifle/scope mount combination. I'm disappointed that Leupold chose to discontinue them.

Top tier - blaser 2.8-20 50mm (but $4k complex scope)

Second - Swarovski z6i & s&b ( this one https://www.eurooptic.com/schm...ted-rifle-scope.aspx)

Third - Swarovski z5 and z3

Then - Leupold vx 6, Leica er5

Only scopes I am buying now are Swarovski z5 5-25 - can dial it down for hunting or dial it up for target and maybe if S&B is on sale around $1k.

Mike

I've replaced most of my Leupolds with Trijicons. Good glass, great illumination without batteries.

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:
I've replaced most of my Leupolds with Trijicons. Good glass, great illumination without batteries.

Trijicon are excellent glass and the illumination lasts much longer than the 10 year window.

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by 4WD:

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
As you may have noticed, I think the basic concept of constantly centred reticles makes virtually all modern scopes since Pecar closed junk, no matter how good their lenses might be.

So, don't update, go back, and look for a good Zeiss or Hensoldt Diavari 1.5-6x, from before 1975, or other reticle-movement scopes by

Swarovski, Nickel, Kahles, Pecar, Unertl, Leupold etc, or a Bausch & Lomb Custom set-up.

SMan338:

Really??????
So you are saying any of us who hunt with a scope that is NOT 45 years old , that all of are scopes are junk???
What are you smoking????

4WD

Not smoking anything, buddy. Your scopes are ok if the rifle doesn't kick too much and you don't mind swapping field of view for bulk and/or tunnel vision.

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:

quote:

Originally posted by 4WD:

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
As you may have noticed, I think the basic concept of constantly centred reticles makes virtually all modern scopes since Pecar closed junk, no matter how good their lenses might be.

So, don't update, go back, and look for a good Zeiss or Hensoldt Diavari 1.5-6x, from before 1975, or other reticle-movement scopes by

Swarovski, Nickel, Kahles, Pecar, Unertl, Leupold etc, or a Bausch & Lomb Custom set-up.

SMan338:

Really??????
So you are saying any of us who hunt with a scope that is NOT 45 years old , that all of are scopes are junk???
What are you smoking????

4WD

Not smoking anything, buddy. Your scopes are ok if the rifle doesn't kick too much and you don't mind swapping field of view for bulk and/or tunnel vision.

Sambarman 338 -
Really???
Really surprised no one else responded to your wild ass comments. I personally do not know one hunter in the USA , Canada, Germany, or elsewhere who buys into what you are saying , or who seeks out a 45++ year old scope to install on their modern hunting rifles in today’s world. NOT ONE HUNTER. Where is your hunting experience??? You are telling us you (we) , should rely on your recommended 45++ year old scopes instead of a modern Zeiss, Schmidt Bender, Leupold, Swarovski, for a Marco Polo hunt, a 21 day mixed bag hunt in BC ,the Yukon, Alaska, African hunting, a elephant hunt, lion , leopard, Buffalo ??? Please enlighten us and tell us more, and give us the names and stories of yours , and your current hunting circle who are hunting the world using your advice of these magnificent 45++ year old scopes you speak of.
4WD

quote:

Originally posted by KY Nimrod:

I have 6 Burris scopes on rifles right now...all the same model. Veracity 2-10x42 with a 30mm tube. You can get these from Natchez shooters supply for about $350 right now and they are normally a $700 scope--Burris's flagship hunting line. The clarity is superb. The mechanics are superb. The eye box is generous. Only complaint is its a tad heavy. Its not a Swarovski or a S&B. But it will compete very well with the Leupold VX5 line and that's saying something.

I bought one last night at my LGS at same price. I agree with you on all points, price sealed the deal. I normally look for lightly used Leupolds, but the word is out...

I use 2-10 scopes .. good for almost any real world application. The Veracity is a good one... I like the Steiner too.

Love my Leupolds for set and forget sights.
Have 2x7, 2.5x8 3x9, 3.5x10's and 4.5x14 30mm ao on several different rigs.

On rifles that I want to shoot out to extended ranges or adjust for poi on smaller targets (thinking .17HMR) I run either 6x or 3x9 SWFA MQ scopes.

The SWFA's are so simple to use. Any caliber, any load. Measure the bullet impact on target with the reticle, adjust turret and your spot on.

I use the 3x9 SWFA's on a .223, a 6.5CM and a 7mm-08. Shoot steel to 500 yards ( as far as my range will allow ). Range, twist, shoot, hit....simple and very effective.

I have to agree with dpcd on cost/value on the Leupolds vs expensive top end European scopes. I have looked through my buddies Swarovski scope, and I see the slightly better clarity and light transmission. It's there. But as dpcd said, and I agree, it's not worth the cost, especially for the hunting that I do. I should state that I don't hunt at night, and 95% of my hunting is in bright light. I have never hunted late or early enough where I could not see in my Leupolds, so maybe I am prejudiced in that respect.

For the money, the Leupold 1.5-5, 2.5-8, 3.5-10, plus my newly found DG scope, the Leupold 2.5 compact, have all the light/clarity for my hunting that I need.

Most of these scopes have come to me for free through Cabelas points. Many I have bought in the $275-$300 range (all VXIII, VX3, or VX3i) used (or even NIB) off the internet or gun shows. Even though I can see the difference in a Leupold vs Swarovski scope for example, it sure isn't worth the 6x or 8x more money to ME.

The difference to my eyes between the two, are not even 2x better. We may be talking the difference between 95% transmission vs. 97 or maybe even 98% transmission.

This is no knock on the high end European glass, and all of my binoculars are Swarovskis, but for scopes, Leupolds seem to serve me quite well.

Having said all this, I recognize we are all individuals with different eyesights and bank accounts, so God bless you on your choice.

One last thing. Again, for ME, the weight of the Leupolds seem lighter than the Euros, and I highly value this property when I mount them on a carrying rifle. Also, the average Euros seem longer than the average Leupold on the same power scopes.

To sum up my observations, Leupolds are:

1) lighter
2) shorter
3) cheaper
4) great free lifetime warranty.

and plenty good enough for my style of hunting and hunting hours.

YMMV