The eyepiece is too big on the new Weaver! The old Weaver 4X has a 1.375 diameter eyepiece and the newer one has a 1.5". Upon closer inspection the bolt just clears on the old scope using the orginal mounts. A Lyman 4X All American is 1.45" so that will not clear. Leupolds and other newer scopes are about 1.55" in diameter.

So I am going to put the old scope back on. It seems that the ring will take another bend.

I was after a better scope as the old Weaver K-4 in the first picture showed severe parallax at 100 yds. On top of that it has a dent on an adjustment cap and it's old. I took it outside and there is not much if any parallax at infinity.

I am still after another better scope but I will keep these original mounts. They are a significant part of the fun of it all.

This a little off topic, but the ZKK actions have been discussed already so I didn't break the ice.

First is I just found a ZKK-600, with the straight trigger. Is there an easy trigger change to covert this to a curved bow type? I called Timney, no luck.

Second question any ideas on where to find scope mounts for one of these? What are my options? My smith seems to think he can get them out of Germany, but a domestic source would be preferable.

Still stumbling along on this and trying to get information together.

Leupold, Talley and B-Square-Lynx make mounts to fit the new CZ 500 series, these will fit ZKKs, 21s and ZG-47s. The Brno rings themselves are solid, cheap and will fit all of the above.

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Here is a Brno 21h that I just aquired. The mount is of particular interest. It has 1" rings and seems adjustable for windage, has substaintial anchors to the dovetailed receiver bridges and in general is about as complicated as an aircraft carrier.





Very interesting.

Alf, Fla3006 and Kurtc

Quoting Alf:

"Small round ring Mauser action likely derived from the Jelen Mauser based on the military Model 33 Mauser action. "

I have seen references to this "Jelen" mauser, such as in Ludwig Olsens's book, but never a detailed description of it.

Could you guys fill in the missing history on this variation please. Anybody ever seen one?

Of interrest is that the 21 and 22 both came in carbine length and rifle length barrels for what its worth..Some years ago I sold a 21 carbine, 7x57 in 19.5" length, that was fully engraved by Kornbrath. sold it to a collector, it was indeed a nice gun....I sold another in 7x64 and one in 6.5x57 in carbine Manlicher form, both very rare...I have had a lot of them in 7 and 8x57 in both rifle and Manlicher. I saw one at the Walley Bienfield in Manlicher form in 9.3x62, priced and claimed to be original for a very hefty price indeed..It looked real to me and I have heard tell some others were made in various calibers unknown to me...I couldn't find one in 9.3, nor could I afford one if I did, so I modified one to the exact specs using the original hardware on a shot out 8x57, its just a jewell of a gun.

They are certainly the finest crafted commercially produced rifle in history IMO...

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Kurt and Alf, The no giude rib bolts were mostly if not all of them on the round receiver rifles. Probably half of these had the bridge slotted for the guide rib.. I slotted the bridge on at least 3 of them and fitted VZ 24 bolts to them. The "flat" underside of the receiver milling is of interest because it is to the German war time specs for the Mod '98 large ring. Not a continuous flat surface but relieved in the Mag box area and between the tang screw boss and roll surface for the trigger.. Many, but not all of them. The attractively shaped flat bolt handle was welded on. When asked to alter the handle for the round knob type to clear scope American style, I sawed these off to preserve as much of the handle and found that the square handle root was drilled and tapped with the tap drill hole depth about even with the cylindrical surface of the bolt. When I used one of the cut off handles for someone who wanted that kind I found that they had drilled the preshaped handle blank for a standard metric flat head screw- an M5- size- aligned it properly and for the technology of the time Heli-arc welded around the edges and then welded in the screw head and surround. There was strong evidence that these were mostly hand shaped with files rather than being milled inasmuch as the handle root tapered narrower at the top as it came up to meet the handle and had no cutting tool marks.
These -20 &- 21's bear the distinctive tool mark signatures of the same 3 places where at least the G/33 receivers were made Uharsky Brod(?)ie. Brno, Vsetin, and Straconice. Late '44 and 1945 bolt bodies for the Reich were made without the guide rib at many plants to include one or some in occupied Czechoslovakia. There is no doubt that they used left over partial or started materials to make these rifles. The Zg 47's had a lot of the war time type bolt bodies where there are 2 grooves at the joining of the guide rib with the bolt body. Some precise cutter making and sharpening was eliminated there. The original procedure was two matching cutters a right and left hand, which straddled the bolt body and cut the bolt diameter to each side and there was a 6 mm space between them. The sides of the "wheel cutters" facing each other cut the side faces of the rib. The grooved at the side rib version used one cutter with a clearance notch in center which milled a partial diameter of about.704". This was easy to center on the part. The sides of the rib were milled with a pair of side cutting "wheel cutters" which were standard angle form cutters and used a spacer between them to achieve the rib width. Most of the wartime bolts done this way seem to have come from Bystrica in Slovakia. Allegedly a ZB plant after 1936.

The ZG 47 early production used identical receiver underside milling to wartime with the "stepped bottom". This is to include the trigger sear lug being a straight projection, not rounded but with 45 degree corners. Those toward the end of production often have the familiar mauser prewar rounded form sear lug and standard flat underside.

The stories from escapees during the cold war, were to the effect that CZ plants had tooling and spares for the small thread receiver from VZ 32 tooling and G33 production. Some of the fixturing had to be different as well as the procedures for making a strong receiver ring section at the"C" ring barrel thread interface and thus projected from that , 20's and 21's were made at the CZ plant (s). Conversely the ZG's were alleged to be made by ZB. Further stories were to the effect that the ZKK's were made by CZ and that when the m 21 parts were used up and tooling in need of replacement. I still want to buy into that. My Continental arms lists call the'21 series the model 621.

What did they make at Janecek and Vejprty?

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Gentlemen,

What scope do you suggest for the factory mount as shown above? One of the mounting problems is that the distance from the front ring to the express sight is only 2 5/8" and many objective bells flare out way too early. One scope that will fit is the old Weaver K-4. I have a like new one and I could remove the eyepiece and slide one unbent ring over that end. I have bent one ring open already.

The Kahles ah 2-7 is too short in the body between the objective and the power ring. This distance must be at least 4 1/8". I am not going to give up on the factory mount as it's just too interesting.

I have seen a sister rifle at a dealer with a Leu 1.5X5-20mm and the objective just about makes it out of the front ring as the scope is a little too short. The gold ring is obscured for instance. Scopes without objectives have never appealed to me but I could accept one that fit.



The looks of this rifle are important to me. That's what I got it for and I would rather not modify it.

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