I am broke. Every month it is the same, pay my bills, eat, pay some of God's bills etc. and it is pay cheque to pay cheque every month and probably always will be. So with that said I am now forced to use 1 gun for everything from antelope to moose and elk.

Currently a nice Abolt .270 Win. is filling that bill for me but I have had a nice offer to sell it and am choosing which caliber to go with for my new 1 gun arsenal.

Anyways, I was just looking at Chucks site and read this rant on using magnum calibers for smaller game:

http://www.chuckhawks.com/cannons_field.htm

I have to partly agree with him and partly disagree. I partly agree because generally a .300 magnum or .338 magnum will be more difficult to shoot as well as a .270 or 25/06 but I disagree based on projectile ballistics with todays modern bullets. Yes, using a 338 a few years ago with a soft lead bullet will really mutilate an antelope but todays modern bullets do not explode into basketball size holes but expand very controlled and retain virtually 100% of their weight. So yes Chuck, you have a bit of a rant for guys who can afford many rifles but choose to overgun antelope but for us 1 gun shooters and todays modern bullets, being a bit conservative and carrying some extra firepower doesn't hurt.

So with that said, what is THE best caliber for a 1 gun arsenal for North America? Well, because I have spent too many hours meditating on it and searching and researching the topic, these are my conclusions:

1) I forgot about obscure calibers like many wildcat's, or less popular calibers like the .280 Rem. or .338 Fed, or the .338-06. The reason is because it is difficult to find a gun chambered in them for one thing. Remember, running a 1 gun arsenal means running on a budget, hence the need for a cheap gun. Also, it can be very difficult to find ammo for these calibers and the reloading dies are very expensive for these calibers.

So, that really narrowed it down to 3 choices for a rifle purchase that will be used for filling my freezer, year after year.

- 7mm Rem. Magnum
- 30/06
- 300 Win. Mag

The gun decided on is the Mossberg 4X4 synthetic
stainless:

http://www.shootingtimes.com/longgun_reviews/mossberg4x4_061907/

Looks like the 30/06 or 300 mag might be my best choice.

The 270 is great! Why change?
Regards, Keith

Have you considered a Savage or maybe even the new Marlin? Both can be had cheap depending on the model, and especially with the Savage you can upgrade your rifle, and change barrels all by yourself. You could have a 243 or 260, 7mm-08 for smaller game, and a 308 or 338 Federal for larger game and use just 308 brass. You can get factory take off barrels very cheap if you don't need target grade accuracy.

Of your three choices, I'd go with the 30-06 and not look back. Its track record speaks for itself.

Best price on ammo of the three, and you'll find it just about everywhere.

Good luck, btw.

'06. Of the three choices, '06 wins.

Short of a Grizzly, you'd be well armed for anythng. And with a Grizz, it's still doable.

honestly if it were me, and I were looking at game the size of deer and antelope on the small end and elk and moose on the big end then I would go with the 300. especially if you can shoot a bit and the thought of a 400 yard shot does not scare you.
You mention antelope so you might be a western hunter, where mule deer and prairie goats can often make you stretch yourself.

The 06 is a great round, less expensive ammo and certainly capable of handling all that your mentioned.
But think of the 300 as a super 06.
If you can handle the little more recoil it jsut does everything that the 06 can but better.

Now if you plan to shoot a lot, and perhaps use it as a varmint rig then an 06 is a handier less expensive way to go.
But if like most guys who are working their tails off you won't have time to do much plinking around anyway.
In that case I would definately go for the 300.
Shoot it enough to stay connected with it, load it with lighter faster sleek wind cutting bullets for antelope and deer.
And heavier bone breakers for moose and elk.

I have shot both a LOT and while I love my 06's, for getting serious a 300 is a great round.
Many might say that there is nothing that a 300 can do that an 06 can't and they are right up to a point.
But if you handload and are not afraid of the top of the manual loadings the 300 is a lot more horse.

I wouldn't buy any gun at all. If you can't afford a quality gun then work, Save, work, Save, work, Save until you can. The new Marlin, the package Savages, all are compromises. For the money you could get a good used JC Higgins on an FN action and have a gun to last a lifetime. Wait, work and Save.

If you need to hunt for meat, borrow a gun.

For your purposes: 30-06.

Keep the 270 and go spend your time contemplating something else like finding a job that pays more. If you can't afford a quality rifle, you probably can't afford to hunt elk or moose.

The 270 will work fine for every critter you mentioned. I owned an A Bolt composite Stalker that shot like nobody's business. However to answer your question, I'd go with the 7mm Rem mag. Lou

Dr. Lou nailed it, for a 10X.
He's right on.

Don

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Lou:
Keep the 270 and go spend your time contemplating something else like finding a job that pays more. If you can't afford a quality rifle, you probably can't afford to hunt elk or moose.

quote:

I am broke. Every month it is the same, pay my bills, eat, pay some of God's bills etc. and it is pay cheque to pay cheque every month and probably always will be. So with that said I am now forced to use 1 gun for everything from antelope to moose and elk

As long as you accept this it will be true. Quit trying to trade your .270 and start trading your attitude.

Personally, I do not like the 270 or the 30-06, and have never owned one.

Realistically, from all the folks I have hunted around, and all the game I have seen killed with the two rounds, the only reason I could see giving up the 270 for the '06, is a larger selection of bullet grain weights.

To me, trading off or getting rid of a rifle you already have and are comfortable with, is like throwing the baby out with the bath water.

If selling the gun will bring you in some cash and getting a new rifle rig won't use up all or most of that cash, then by all means sell, and get another 270, or go with the '06. JMO.

quote:

1) I forgot about obscure calibers like many wildcat's, or less popular calibers like the .280 Rem. or .338 Fed, or the .338-06. The reason is because it is difficult to find a gun chambered in them for one thing. Remember, running a 1 gun arsenal means running on a budget, hence the need for a cheap gun. Also, it can be very difficult to find ammo for these calibers and the reloading dies are very expensive for these calibers.So, that really narrowed it down to 3 choices for a rifle purchase that will be used for filling my freezer, year after year. - 7mm Rem. Magnum- 30/06- 300 Win. MagThe gun decided on is the Mossberg 4X4 syntheticstainless:http://www.shootingtimes.com/longgun_reviews/mossberg4x4_061907/Looks like the 30/06 or 300 mag might be my best choice.

I agree with your decision to avoid wildcats and obscure calibres. I also applaud your decision on synthetic and stainless. As for calibre for a one gun battery, my vote goes to the 30-06, and I'll go one further, a 30-06 with 180 gr. bullets. I'm not basing that on theories or gun writers, I'm basing that on forty years experience, over half of that in Canada's far north. There is nothing in North America including grizzly that the 30-06 can't handle. Unless you plan on moving to Alaska, the 30-06 will serve you fine. It has the most choices of components, factory ammo can be found anywhere even in obscure places, and it won't beat you up when you pull the trigger. I've spent plenty of time with magnums, particularly the .338 WM which I love, but when all is said and done the 30-06 would have done fine.

As for choice of rifle, I've been in your spot. I've been at both ends of the financial scale and I'll give you my two cents based on that. For many years I used Remington products until synthetic stainless rifles hit the market and I bought my first Savage. Now with the exception of two Remingtons, all my rifles are Savage. They are one of the best for out of the box accuracy, they are reliable and tough as nails in all climates and their service is top rate, and they've been around for a long time. I can afford more expensive rifles, but since I look at rifles as tools, I like using a product I can depend on.

Whatever you decide, remember to enjoy yourself. I have one final comment for the brainless twit that said if you can't afford a better rifle, then stay home. That poster should be ashamed of himself, this guy deserves to hunt like everybody else, and how dare you look down your pompous nose at another hunter.

Let me get this straight. You have a Browning A bolt 270 that you like, and because someone else wants it, you are willing to sell it and buy a lesser quality gun.

DON'T DO IT!!!!!

I am an avid gun trader, but I will never back up on quality. In MY OPINION, Mossberg, Marlin, and Savage are lesser guns to what you already have.

If the 270 has been working, keep shooting it.

Keep the 270!!!!!!!!

Cobra is correct.
One gun 30/06.
One bullet 180 grains.
This has worked for me for everything from Marmots and Coyotes, to Antelope and Deer, Mountain Goats, Bighorn Sheep and Elk.
It would work and has for many folks on all sizes of bears too.
Shoot whatever brand is cheap (Win silver or white box) and accurate for the deer and antelope and shoot a little better bullet if you wish for the elk, moose and large bears (although Rem core locked and Win power points have and still do kill lots and lots of animals the world over every year.), problem solved.

I too would probably avoid the Mossberg and Savages and find a used quality rifle that will hold its value.
But if you go with a new rifle stainless/synthetic is a no frills alternative for a durable rifle.
I also think that your .270 will suit you fine for all but the big bears. Many people kill elk and moose with .270's and I would not hesitate to keep it if you like it.
Look at the circles you've got me talking in!

What I mean is
1. keep your existing rifle, if you must sell then
2. get a 30/06, used nice quality, if you must own new
3. Synthetic/stainless is very utilitarian and durable.
Have fun with your decision.

I doubt you will ever notice the difference in effect on game between any of the calibers you mentioned. Use good bullets and practice and you will do fine. A little optimism about your prospects wouldn't hurt though.

No way would I even consider a Mossberg with incidents like this happening:

https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/...=847103388#847103388

Keep the Browning or save up until you can buy a decent quality rifle.

Corey,
Work on changing your job and doing what you feel is right, it will come right even if not at first. Spend wisely. I have been a student/river and bush 'bum' for years and have done fine on small income. Don't be a 'thoughtless consumer'. Only buy stuff if you absolutley MUST own it, otherwise you will live for your possessions, look around there are people paying for crap they never really needed....


I echo the rest, keep the .270 and from your list the .30-06 is the obvious choice. Oh yes, i would not trade an A-Bolt for a Mossberg!

If you have a 270 and you like it, I wouldn't change.

If I was going to have one gun.
I think I would go with a Savage in 30-06. Be sure to get QD scope mount.
With this setup you could re-barrel to 270 or 22-250 if you think you need to.

I think you should keep the .270. But if you have already made the decision to sell, go with a 30-06. It will handle the larger game without the recoil of the 300WM. Savage sells a solid gun or you can get a new Remington 700 stainless for under $550.

Buy a 7RM and don't look back. It's all a man would ever need in NA. Good trajectory, many diff bullet choices, easy to find components for reloading, ammo available just about anywhere if you don't handload, low recoil, plenty of energy for big game, etc, etc.

Guess you can't tell what my favorite cart is

I own many diff rifles for various carts and one of my 3 7RMs finds my hand for just about every trip.

Good Luck

Reloader

quote:

Originally posted by ar corey:
I am broke. Every month it is the same, pay my bills, eat, pay some of God's bills etc. and it is pay cheque to pay cheque every month and probably always will be. So with that said I am now forced to use 1 gun for everything from antelope to moose and elk.

Currently a nice Abolt .270 Win. is filling that bill for me but I have had a nice offer to sell it and am choosing which caliber to go with for my new 1 gun arsenal.

As was said above the problem here is your attitude. As long as you keep this attitude just like you said it will probably always be that way.. How do I know because at one time I use to subscribe to your line of thinking.. Then I finally woke up.. I decided I didn't want someone to tell me how much money I was going to make, or how many vactaion days I could have a year, etc. etc. I decided I wanted to be the one who decided how much money I wanted to make etc. etc. It is possible that I could die broke it is always possible.. and if for some reason it did happen that way which I doubt it will.. At least I will be able to say I tried.
You see there is a difference in being broke and being poor.. Poor is a state of mind, broke is a state of being.. A poor person will always be poor, just because a person is broke today doesn't mean they will be broke tomorrow.. However the atttitude you are displaying is a poor person's state of mind. You say "it is pay cheque to pay cheque every month and probably always will be" If you think like that do you expect it to change.. Stop saying negative things like I can't afford it etc. etc. etc. and ask yourself "how can I afford it". When you say I can't afford it that is narrow minded and you no longer have to think.. If you ask yourself "how can I afford it" That opens up your mind, it makes you think.

quote:

Oregon45: you could get a good used JC Higgins on an FN action and have a gun to last a lifetime

Ditto.

The smartest and least expensive thing to do is keep the 270

My best hunting buddy has taken 23 elk, 2 moose, 1 brown bear, 1 grizzly bear, several mule deer and whitetails, 1 mountain goat and one Dall sheep - all with a pre-Garcia Sako in .270 using 150 grain Nosler Partitions.

I would keep the .270 if I were you.

quote:

Originally posted by bucko:
then I would go with the 300. especially if you can shoot a bit and the thought of a 400 yard shot does not scare you.

Actually the appeal of the .300 magnum is partly so I don't shoot very often. I have shot that caliber before and the recoil will certainly make me want to shoot less and that can be a good thing because a $30.00 a pound for powder, it can add up. You see, I live on a farm and can shoot at 300-500 yards easily by taking 50 steps off my door step. I can shoot pretty much very evening or morning if the weather permits so buying a gun that deters me from wanting to shoot it alot, can be a bonus. .270 and 30/06 recoil is not a problem but the 300 mag recoil isn't pleasant.



If you can handle the little more recoil it jsut does everything that the 06 can but better.

Now if you plan to shoot a lot, and perhaps use it as a varmint rig then an 06 is a handier less expensive way to go.
But if like most guys who are working their tails off you won't have time to do much plinking around anyway.
In that case I would definately go for the 300.
Shoot it enough to stay connected with it, load it with lighter faster sleek wind cutting bullets for antelope and deer.
And heavier bone breakers for moose and elk.

I have shot both a LOT and while I love my 06's, for getting serious a 300 is a great round.
Many might say that there is nothing that a 300 can do that an 06 can't and they are right up to a point.
But if you handload and are not afraid of the top of the manual loadings the 300 is a lot more horse.[/QUOTE]

quote:

Originally posted by Dr. Lou:
Keep the 270 and go spend your time contemplating something else like finding a job that pays more. If you can't afford a quality rifle, you probably can't afford to hunt elk or moose.

In Saskatchewan Canada where I live, affording an elk or moose hunt involves getting into my truck, driving 12 miles to buy a license, then another 40 miles into the bush.

Please define quality rifle?

Sub MOA? 6.5 pounds? Designer brand barrel or stock? A trigger with no creep?

I can spend $400 on that Mossberg, hand lap the barrel myself for free, take the creep out of the trigger myself for free, glass bed it myself for a few dollars and tweak my handloads to probably get it shooting MOA or better. Using that gun to shoot myself an elk, moose and deer every year will meet every "quality" I need.

quote:

Originally posted by Snellstrom:
Cobra is correct.
One gun 30/06.
One bullet 180 grains.
This has worked for me for everything from Marmots and Coyotes, to Antelope and Deer, Mountain Goats, Bighorn Sheep and Elk.
It would work and has for many folks on all sizes of bears too.
Shoot whatever brand is cheap (Win silver or white box) and accurate for the deer and antelope and shoot a little better bullet if you wish for the elk, moose and large bears (although Rem core locked and Win power points have and still do kill lots and lots of animals the world over every year.), problem solved.

If I go with the 30/06 or .300 mag. it will be 180 Barnes TSX's for everything. I dislike lead bullets for the mess they make. I never liked the idea of perhaps consuming traces of lead and that is part of the reason I like the Barnes bullets so much.

Thanks for the replies and after reading them all I have decided to keep my .270. After reading about the Mossberg safety issues, no way. I was really liking the idea of shooting perhaps a 30/06 and 180 grain bullets in case I ever ran into a bear in the bush. I have no problems with 140 gr. Barnes for moose and elk.

It is actually a wonderful Medallion model and the Limbsaver recoil pad allows wonderful shooting and looks great. Spending $7.00 on some varnish remover and $5.00 on some Tru-Oil and $5.00 on some fine grit sandpaper really turns the Medallion into a beauty. I never understood why Browning would put such a shiny, scratchable finish on a gun. I have always liked the hand rubbed oil finish like the Kimber's:

http://www.kimberamerica.com/rifles/8400/8400_superamerica/


Not very difficult to do. The varnish remover is a little offensive.


Cor

I'm working to this aim myself I would prefer a 280 Remington as actually I think that had it come out before the 270 Winchester O'Connor would have proclaimed IT the IDEAL CALIBRE. In pratical terms it can do everything that the 30-06 can - with 175 grain bullets - yet handles better its "classic" payload of a 140 or 150 grain bullet better than the 30-06.

And who really today uses the 220 grain "pill" in a 30-06?

However this being England I've got a BRNO ZKK600 in 270 Winchester and a Zeiss 6x 'scope. Gun has midsight and the famous flip-up peep sight on the receiver.

It will and does handle everything I am every likely to shoot. Its only drawback it isn't 7mm to satisfy the German hunting laws. But its GREAT for France for boar with a 150 grain bullet. I tried 140 grain and like it but I agree that 150 grain really makes the 270 "sing".

And 160 grain would be really interesting...

I have a 270 Win. that I put a Burris Scope on and that rifle will shoot to 600yds with the 130gr bullets.

If your shooting 100 yd's or less the rest of your life it's 45-70..
If you Dream of other Places then it's 7mm Rem. Mag.
AK

Dr.Lou Been there on the meager side when raising 6 kids. Take what you got and make it work. The .270 is a great start. Roger

Nothing wrong with the .270, use it if you got it and it'll take all the deer/moose/elk in the field if you do your part.

I would not trade/sell a nice-shooting A-Bolt for one of those Mossberg guns, I'd steer clear of them altogether. Keep the Browning. I own one in 7mm RM and it's about the most accurate rifle I've got.

Arcorey:

Thanks for allowing me to qualify my response. For the majority of AR members an elk or moose hunt costs much more than $50. Personally, a do-it-yourself hunt for elk or moose will still cost several thousand dollars. But we wouldn't know that because you don't say where you live, or that you just have to drive a couple miles.

To me a quality rifle is not one bought as a compromise based on current finances - especially if you already own a nice rifle. It's a rifle that exudes pride of ownership while meeting my performance standards. Granted quality is subjective, but I don't believe in settling for the first thing I can afford, unless it's truly the rifle I want. If the rifle that floats my boat requires me to save a little then that's what I would do. Lou

I'm squarely in the 30-06 camp, a FN Mauser in particular. It is the original 1 gun arsenal with a proven track record speaking for itself. That said, I also agree with those advising you wait until such time as finances improve. No sense sacrificing for something you'll not be happy with forever.

Back about 1970, I had just remarried a lovely woman who just happened to have three kids. I was recently divorces with tons of bills, mine and those racked up by the ex-wife. A very nice gun collection had to be sold off to pay off the scumbag lawyers. Then, add a move out of California because of the increasing anti-gun bullshit and you can damn well see that times was tough. It took a couple of years before I ended up with a decent job that promised good pay raises. Even so, it was three years before I could replace the only rifle I was able to keep, a well butchered up 1903A3 Springfield 30-06 I'd gotten in a trade. That rifle is long gone these days, but if I end up in that kind of a situation moneywise, I'll keep my J.C. Higgins M50 30-06 that sits in a Butler Creek stock and never look back. My load? Any 180 gr. bullet that will do 2700 FPS from the muzzle and stay within 1.5" at 100 yards. Most loads I've tried stay withing one inch, but I'm realistic about accuracy for big game. Scope is an old all steel Weaver from El paso. Not the brightest scope around but it's rugged and has great eye relief, something that's sacrificed in today's scopes in order to make then brighter. That's the kind of package that has worked for me for close to 50 years. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
I shoot the .270 as well but stick to the 150 gr. Speer Hot-cores. FWIW, there's way too much fuss and BS on lead these days. For big game, stick to a heavier bullet. If you hunt birds, odds are you've swallowed a pellet or three. They'll just pass on through. Shouldn't hurt you a bit. While bullet fragments are a given, especially with the lighter and faster bullets, most of the time I've found the bits and pieces in the bloodshot meat that gets thrown out anyway. Where lead from bullets is a real hazard is when it gets that white powdery coating on the bullets' exposed lead. That's lead oxide and can be absorbed through the skin. Very nasty stuff. Lead fragments from bullets though will usually pass though in your stools. Just in case, drink orange juice. Ity helps the body dispose of lead. I've been casting bulelts for 54 years and am an OJ junkie from long before that. I get my lead level blood derum level checked every year because of all the heavy exposure to lead though my casting. The levels are perfectly normal and have been since I started testing about ten years ago.
So, is lead hazardous? Sure, but the fuss and shitstorm put out by people with an agenda is way out of proportion to the actual danger.
I don't use overpriced premium bullets because frankly, for what I hunt they are not necessary. Deer ain't armor plated. Someone asked if anyone still used 220 gr. bullets in the 30-06. I do under certain curcumstances and I sometimes use them in a .308 Win. Just because I can't push them to 3000 FPS does not mean they're not useful. I remember the late Finn Aagaard doing an article in I believe RIFLE Magazine where he culled some deer using a 30-06 and IIRC, 220 gr. Sierras in his handloads. Seemed to me they did a right nice job. JMHO.
Paul B.

I have never owned or desired to own a 270, and it is not on my list of guns to buy ever, but why if you have a 270 that you like, and shoots well would you get rid of it? If your finances are such I doubt very much that a grizzly bear is in your near future, And that is about all I would feel uneasy about taking the 270 to hunt in th USA or Canada ! Would it kill it, sure, but any thing that starts with 338 or larger would be my first choice.

I've hunted deer a lot with .270, 7mm Mag and 30'06. I use the .270 all the time now unless I expect to shoot over 300 yrd.s. If your A-Bolt shoots like every one I've ever seen it will fill the freezer forever without the higher recoil and/or ammo prices of the other three. If you just have to have more gun I'd go with the 30'06. The ammo is available everywhere and you can mail order factory loaded ammo with bullets from reduced-recoil 130 gr.s (good enough for most eastern whitetail) thru 200 or 220 gr.s. for something that might eat you. Unless you're shooting a very long way 7mm Mag wouldn't offer any real advantage over a .270 for deer. A hunting buddy of mine always uses a 300 Win Mag for whitetail and I've seen a shoulder shot ruin 1/3 of the meat. I'd keep the .270.