In this day of inflation related to oil prices, and harm to the general economy as a consequence, prices at one of Oregon's biggest gun shows is showing marked deflation this weekend. Prices at the Roseburg Gun Club Show are distinctly DOWN, and many good items which here-to-fore were not appearing on the gun show market are now being put up for sale by owners who are feeling the pinch of higher prices in non-discretionary areas.

As an example, here are excerpts from a peronal message I sent to an Idaho rifleman friend earlier today:

" Went to the gun show today. Took $8,000 cash, just in case. Bought NOTHING, not even a cup of coffee. Felt like a damned miser, as there were a number of temptations, but I did not yield. Am going back tomorrow... You can sure tell the economy is in the tank. There were a LOT of good buys there.

For instance there were three Mannlicher Schoenauers I wouldn't mind at all having. One, a properly stamped Stoeger import from the '50s was the nicest; .270 Winchester chambering, in about 96-98% condition, with an older B&L scope in the proper Austrian mount, single-set trigger, $850. Another in .250-3000 Savage, ditto scope and mount, not quite as good condition, $550. The third was a plain vanilla 1903 6.5x54, some kind of cheapo scope, $465."

There were also many decent Mauser sporters available from $300 to $400. Brand new Ruger Hawkeyes at about dealer cost or lower, and many, many Winchester lever guns at attractive prices ($275 to $350).

I don't know if this is a one-time thing or the start of a trend, but it spells danger for the big makers who keep raising their prices. It is hard to envision their high priced products selling well when one can buy quality older guns at prices not seen for the last 5-10 years.

I have noticed more and more good deals lately too. It is a good time to have some extra toy money around.

I haven't noticed any real values at the gun shows in my area yet. The dealers here still think their guns are made of gold & what you have is junk.

D,

Being in LA also, that is exactly what I have seen here for years. I also noticed over the years many dealers having minimal turnover of inventory, due to their pricing.

Dallas has the Market Hall show next weekend, may try seeing it, will be interesting to see pricing there.

A dealer is the last place to look for a deal.

quote:

D,

Being in LA also, that is exactly what I have seen here for years. I also noticed over the years many dealers having minimal turnover of inventory, due to their pricing.

It is so bad that I can walk down the isles & not look up from the table & tell you which dealer it is at that table!

Duckbear you are spot on! I usually hang around the entrance so I can see whats coming in before the dealers.

All I've seen so far around these parts is people placing far too much value on their wares.

There was one guy selling a Savage package gun in .270 minus the scope and clip (stolen that morning, apparently) for $325. The same package can be had for $400 with the scope and clip, new in box. What kind of deal is that? The scope might be a cheap piece of glass but better than nothing. And the clips are like $40 up here.

Same guy was trying to sell off a Ruger stainless/laminate in .338 for almost $100 more than the gun sold for originally. Seriously. I know because I owned the same one and sold it for almost $300 less than what he was asking. I was ALMOST interested. Decent gun. Disappointing price.

There were a pair of Weatherby Mark V's selling for an atrocious amount of money because "they don't make them like they used too" says the old whack job behind the table. "Yeah, they make 'em better now". No way would I pay NEW IN BOX Mark V Deluxe pricing for a pair of old, used Standards. Come on now.

There were many "sporter" ex-military guns on the tables that were in the $500 range. I mean, what? An original collectors item, maybe. But dropping a military rifle into an aftermarket stock does not instantly make your rifle a one-of-a-kind custom rifle. At least reblue the damned things before you try to sell them.

There were shotguns from the 50's through 70's selling for reasonable amounts of money, but they were nothing special to be honest. When you can buy a base model Remington 870 with extra chokes for the same or lower cost, I have to ask myself where people are pulling their numbers from. They're used, mass-produced shotguns. Not highly sought after collectibles.

There was a nice, older BRNO sitting on the table in .375 H&H, I was tempted until I flipped the price tag around... $1700?!?! Are you insane?!?! There is no way the gun was worth it, average quality bluing and regular walnut stock, far from anything special.

One guy was selling a used Blaser R93 for the cost of a new one PLUS an extra barrel. I was really scratching my head on that one.

The only guy even worth talking to was selling a few M700 XCR rifles for about $25 below what they were going for in stores, but only had a 7mm-08 and .338 RUM available. That was it, the only thing really worth looking at, that I'd really call an actual deal. Everything else was mostly overpriced garbage, or overpriced decent guns. Really disappointed that even the beat up military guns were ridiculously overpriced.

In the end, out of the $500 I brought, I spent $2 to get in, $5 on a hot dog and drink, and a $20 donation to a veterans fund. The rest will come with me to a large retailer at some point and I'll get more gun for the money than I could out of that gun show. There's so few up here to attend, too With that kind of cash, I almost always walk away with some ammo, some memorabilia, and can normally snag a .22 or shotgun.

Same here, very few gunshops or gunshows in America are value oriented anymore.

It is crazy to think of how many guns will move at 20% off what they are asking if not more.

Dad still does his tables, but he's value priced and got top quality shit. He moves a lot of guns.

same thing in SW Idaho. Had a gunshow here in Nampa last weekend. Hardly anything for sale at a "good" price. Same stuff this weekend at the Boise show. Same stuff for the same or slightly more $$$. I mentioned this to several of the regular dealers, and the response was "had to mark it up a little to cover the cost of the table...".
They all took it back home again this afternoon.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

quote:

Originally posted by 6.5BR:
D,

Being in LA also, that is exactly what I have seen here for years. I also noticed over the years many dealers having minimal turnover of inventory, due to their pricing.

Dallas has the Market Hall show next weekend, may try seeing it, will be interesting to see pricing there.

Come by and say hi I will be at A-P 7-14.
Bill

Gunshows in the last few years have basically turned into flea markets. I have seen booths selling roach clips...

Locally there is just no quality firearms on the tables..I quite going to them.

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
Gunshows in the last few years have basically turned into flea markets. I have seen booths selling roach clips...

Locally there is just no quality firearms on the tables..I quite going to them.

Ray - That is too bad, but it doesn't have to be that way for any reason other than local apathy.

Our local show is held twice a year (Fall & Spring) and is put on by our gun club. We rent the county fair grounds. We have it run for us by a local gun dealer who is a club member. At each show, we (the Club) take the first $3,000 profit, and split all profit above that with the show operator 50/50. We usually get about $9,000 free and clear for the club from each show (the operator usually gets about $6,000). We limit tables to about 275 tables per show at $60 per table, and they are all sold out months in advance, every time.

We are absolutely rigid about NO flea market items. There are no uniforms, no hunting clothes, no web goods, no jewelry, no meat snacks, no Nazi items, no leather handicrafts, no knick-knacks for women. We do allow books IF they are gun books. IF items are on a table which are not either guns, or items related directly to the care and feeding of guns (like powder solvent, bullets, powder, cases, or boxed live ammo) the vendors are told to remove those items or to leave. If they do have to leave, they will be last in line for a table in the future. If they make a scene (or show an "attitude" problem) about our enforcing the rules, they are not allowed a table at our shows again.

In exchange, we do good advertising, give all exhibtors free meals on Friday (Pizza) & Saturday (Steak) nights, & have drawings to give exhibitors cash prizes at the end of the show. We give every show patron a free ticket in a drawing for a hunting rifle (this weekend it was a Savage .270 WSM) and as second prize, for a hand-made high quality knife. Parking is free for all, and exhibitors can actually drive into the building with their rigs to set up/tear down. Security on foot patrol both inside and outside the show is intensive and 24 hours a day during the 2-1/2 days of the show.

We encourage attendees who are not exhibitors to bring their own guns and sell, swap, buy, them, in the aisles. That benefits both them and the table holders. We provide instant-check (Brady checks) with our phones directly to the State Police in the Capital city 120 miles away.

As a result, we have lots of good guns at every show....and a long waiting list of people who would like to be able to get tables at our club's two annual shows.

This year we had about 8-10 tables of just 90% plus condition military Mausers. We had tables of Weatherbys, We had a about 6 tables of just Marlin lever actions, Ditto (only more) Winchester levers. We had tables of barrels and stocks for tricking out 10-22's and 77-22's,. We had tables of Civil war vintage breech-loaders. We had a whole wall length of collectible High-Standard pistols. We had enough different 45-70's to arm a company of men for Teddy Roosevelt. We had maybe 10 tables of used scopes. We didn't have everything anyone could want, but we had plenty to make it interesting.

And we had NO flea market items, nor will we...at least unless Obama has his way with the government..

Maybe you should have a talk with your local club. It COULD run a show just like ours, and in a couple of years when the word had gotten around, it would make good bucks for improving the club facilities and everyone would have a lot better time. (Because our club is a non-profit and all our money made on the shows goes into improving club facilities, there is no income tax on the club's share.)

quote:

Our local show is held twice a year (Fall & Spring) and is put on by our gun club

Most all gun shows used to be put on that way. Then the( as we used to call them ) "wildcat" shows started showing up. They were put on by dealers & we boycoted them. In favor of the localy sponsered shows put on by the Lions club, KC's, local gun club or some other local non-profit organization.

quote:

Originally posted by MikeyB:


There was a nice, older BRNO sitting on the table in .375 H&H, I was tempted until I flipped the price tag around... $1700?!?! Are you insane?!?! There is no way the gun was worth it, average quality bluing and regular walnut stock, far from anything special.

Oh wow!! 11 years ago, at the local gunshow, I remember buying two for $700, one was even a hogback. Now CZ wants $1100 for a 375 H&H now!

And you say the moron wanted $1700 for a used one!??!!??

Houston area gunshows are typically like that, when you do find a nice gun its way over priced.

quote:

Originally posted by MikeyB:
All I've seen so far around these parts is people placing far too much value on their wares.

There was one guy selling a Savage package gun in .270 minus the scope and clip (stolen that morning, apparently) for $325. The same package can be had for $400 with the scope and clip, new in box. What kind of deal is that? The scope might be a cheap piece of glass but better than nothing. And the clips are like $40 up here.

Same guy was trying to sell off a Ruger stainless/laminate in .338 for almost $100 more than the gun sold for originally. Seriously. I know because I owned the same one and sold it for almost $300 less than what he was asking. I was ALMOST interested. Decent gun. Disappointing price.

There were a pair of Weatherby Mark V's selling for an atrocious amount of money because "they don't make them like they used too" says the old whack job behind the table. "Yeah, they make 'em better now". No way would I pay NEW IN BOX Mark V Deluxe pricing for a pair of old, used Standards. Come on now.

There were many "sporter" ex-military guns on the tables that were in the $500 range. I mean, what? An original collectors item, maybe. But dropping a military rifle into an aftermarket stock does not instantly make your rifle a one-of-a-kind custom rifle. At least reblue the damned things before you try to sell them.

There were shotguns from the 50's through 70's selling for reasonable amounts of money, but they were nothing special to be honest. When you can buy a base model Remington 870 with extra chokes for the same or lower cost, I have to ask myself where people are pulling their numbers from. They're used, mass-produced shotguns. Not highly sought after collectibles.

There was a nice, older BRNO sitting on the table in .375 H&H, I was tempted until I flipped the price tag around... $1700?!?! Are you insane?!?! There is no way the gun was worth it, average quality bluing and regular walnut stock, far from anything special.

One guy was selling a used Blaser R93 for the cost of a new one PLUS an extra barrel. I was really scratching my head on that one.

The only guy even worth talking to was selling a few M700 XCR rifles for about $25 below what they were going for in stores, but only had a 7mm-08 and .338 RUM available. That was it, the only thing really worth looking at, that I'd really call an actual deal. Everything else was mostly overpriced garbage, or overpriced decent guns. Really disappointed that even the beat up military guns were ridiculously overpriced.

In the end, out of the $500 I brought, I spent $2 to get in, $5 on a hot dog and drink, and a $20 donation to a veterans fund. The rest will come with me to a large retailer at some point and I'll get more gun for the money than I could out of that gun show. There's so few up here to attend, too With that kind of cash, I almost always walk away with some ammo, some memorabilia, and can normally snag a .22 or shotgun.

mikeyb, as a fellow Winnipegger i'm sure you've seen the dude from Kenora thats asking $900 for a USED norinco M-14???. now to my american friends who are thinking thats not so bad, keep in mind the fact that in Canada we are still importing new norinco m14's, and they retail for $399.more then twice the price of new, that must be gun that killed hitler. i think here in Canada used guns are as a rule overpriced. because of sellers looking at US prices on the internet. for example i recently aquired a Belgian Browning Auto-5 in 20 guage for $350. the gun is in like new condition and appeared to have had less then a box of shells. i then see Cabelas listing the same gun from the same year for $2000. craziness. and ditto on the military sporters. i've been trying to buy 1903 Springfield actions for custom projects, but refuse to pay $400 for a hacked down shot out wreck. ammo is overpriced too. i asked a seller how much for a box of 358 norma mag factory ammo. $120 was his answer. had to walk considering the gunstore i work for lists it a $65 a box currently.

It use to be that you could look forward to the gun show. People use to wheel and deal and you could see the same gun at a couple or three tables during the day. Even the dealers would be buying.
It seems to me that at some point things changed from cool guns to black guns and I just don't see alot of the really cool guns these days at the gun shows I get to. Alot of the guns I see are the same from month to month.

Are these the shows that the Democrats view as a loophole and want to tighten up on? (from the other thread re the 2 parties respective stances on guns)

quote:

Originally posted by kevin.303:

quote:

Originally posted by MikeyB:
All I've seen so far around these parts is people placing far too much value on their wares.

There was one guy selling a Savage package gun in .270 minus the scope and clip (stolen that morning, apparently) for $325. The same package can be had for $400 with the scope and clip, new in box. What kind of deal is that? The scope might be a cheap piece of glass but better than nothing. And the clips are like $40 up here.

Same guy was trying to sell off a Ruger stainless/laminate in .338 for almost $100 more than the gun sold for originally. Seriously. I know because I owned the same one and sold it for almost $300 less than what he was asking. I was ALMOST interested. Decent gun. Disappointing price.

There were a pair of Weatherby Mark V's selling for an atrocious amount of money because "they don't make them like they used too" says the old whack job behind the table. "Yeah, they make 'em better now". No way would I pay NEW IN BOX Mark V Deluxe pricing for a pair of old, used Standards. Come on now.

There were many "sporter" ex-military guns on the tables that were in the $500 range. I mean, what? An original collectors item, maybe. But dropping a military rifle into an aftermarket stock does not instantly make your rifle a one-of-a-kind custom rifle. At least reblue the damned things before you try to sell them.

There were shotguns from the 50's through 70's selling for reasonable amounts of money, but they were nothing special to be honest. When you can buy a base model Remington 870 with extra chokes for the same or lower cost, I have to ask myself where people are pulling their numbers from. They're used, mass-produced shotguns. Not highly sought after collectibles.

There was a nice, older BRNO sitting on the table in .375 H&H, I was tempted until I flipped the price tag around... $1700?!?! Are you insane?!?! There is no way the gun was worth it, average quality bluing and regular walnut stock, far from anything special.

One guy was selling a used Blaser R93 for the cost of a new one PLUS an extra barrel. I was really scratching my head on that one.

The only guy even worth talking to was selling a few M700 XCR rifles for about $25 below what they were going for in stores, but only had a 7mm-08 and .338 RUM available. That was it, the only thing really worth looking at, that I'd really call an actual deal. Everything else was mostly overpriced garbage, or overpriced decent guns. Really disappointed that even the beat up military guns were ridiculously overpriced.

In the end, out of the $500 I brought, I spent $2 to get in, $5 on a hot dog and drink, and a $20 donation to a veterans fund. The rest will come with me to a large retailer at some point and I'll get more gun for the money than I could out of that gun show. There's so few up here to attend, too With that kind of cash, I almost always walk away with some ammo, some memorabilia, and can normally snag a .22 or shotgun.

mikeyb, as a fellow Winnipegger i'm sure you've seen the dude from Kenora thats asking $900 for a USED norinco M-14???. now to my american friends who are thinking thats not so bad, keep in mind the fact that in Canada we are still importing new norinco m14's, and they retail for $399.more then twice the price of new, that must be gun that killed hitler. i think here in Canada used guns are as a rule overpriced. because of sellers looking at US prices on the internet. for example i recently aquired a Belgian Browning Auto-5 in 20 guage for $350. the gun is in like new condition and appeared to have had less then a box of shells. i then see Cabelas listing the same gun from the same year for $2000. craziness. and ditto on the military sporters. i've been trying to buy 1903 Springfield actions for custom projects, but refuse to pay $400 for a hacked down shot out wreck. ammo is overpriced too. i asked a seller how much for a box of 358 norma mag factory ammo. $120 was his answer. had to walk considering the gunstore i work for lists it a $65 a box currently.

Yes, I believe I have seen said rifle. I double checked Marstar prices and noticed it's almost 3 times the cost of a new Chinese M14. Unless he's done major upgrades (like replaced the entire barreled action with a Springfield M14) it is so horribly overpriced it's not even funny. I might buy one new in box from Marstar because they shoot alright and hey, my hunting guns are not to be used for killing post apocalyptic mutant zombies, so it's good for that.

I find some ammo deals, but it's mostly dealer seconds. I bought a brick of American Eagle .22 ammo for $4 once because the guy who pulled the brick out of a larger box had poor boxcutter control and slashed open a few of the 50-round individual boxes by accident. I once saw a guy selling .460 Weatherby Mag ammo individually as "collectors items" for $40 a pop... But I have TONS of .303 ammo (decent Federal hunting stuff) that I got for cheap. So it's hit and miss.

But overall it seems like the market, at least in this area, is badly out of alignment price-wise. Sucks. Still kicking myself for not grabbing an XCR. I kinda want one now

I think you can find deals at the gun shows but you need to be aware of how much most things have gone up. Yes there will be people who will try to get a premium for what they have. Your job is to be smart enough not to pay to much.
The other side is what you want to look fore, the person who doesn’t know what replacement cost is for an item. I just recently bought 2 cases of Rem. 148gr 38 SP Match from someone at 1/3 the replacement cost. Fortunately I just picked up a S&W Mod 52 to shoot it up.
Yes I think there are bargains to be found especially in high quality and out of production items.
I know I am looking foward to Market Hall in Dallas this weekend.
Bill

Not getting cheaper in SeMo it's like some have said above their stuff is gold and yours is shit!

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
Not getting cheaper in SeMo it's like some have said above their stuff is gold and yours is shit!

Don't let it bug you. Make them a decent (fair) offer in line with what you feel their stuff is truly worth and move on.

What you are seeing is what one sees when speculators begin to find out the hard truth about their "investments" in any field. Speculators, who try to hop on "profit-bandwagons" without prudence, without deep knowledge of the goods, and without application of considerable thought, always end up paying too much. And inevitably speculative "bubbles" burst. They are left holding the bag, with a sour taste in their mouth, and in an even more sour frame of mind. They often try to hide all that by being rude or treating others as if afflicted with some social disease.

They will eventually come to realize they need to get what they can salvage from their unwise past indulgences, and invest more smartly the next time....unless of course they can get the federal government to bail them out, as AIG stockholders are now.....

It is all part of learning the basics of business. People have the right to MAYBE turn a profit BECAUSE they take a risk when they invest. Some risks do not pay off. That means they need to take a loss as part of the learning process. Next time they will evaluate the risks more carefully to maximize their chances of deserved profit.

You saw it in the dot.coms, and in the housing market, and will inevitably in the gun market as well.

Sure, the congenitably intellectually challenged (modern-talk for "stupid") move from one bubble to the next, never learn, and blame society for their failures. But those who are even a little brighter don't have to do that.

To invest means to evaluate, determine how much risk they can afford to carry, and ONLY buy into any venture accordingly. That both forces the market into the realm of "real value" and allows the prudent to remain solvent while having at least some of the things he/she needs/wants.

Risk is lower when there is a real need for the goods or services, and when the perceived market can afford to buy them. Speculation, on the other hand, is putting in real money in the "hope" that something will sell for an even higher price, despite strains on the ability of would-be purchasers to pay for them, and no real need for them to start with, other than maybe ego satisfaction for the purchasers.


In such times one can make good buys by being present as speculators take their necessary lumps along the learning curve road.

As my friends who own pawn shops say, "One doesn't make money selling things. He/she makes money buying them....CORRECTLY".

Ther is a pawn shop owner that is at every show I go to...he seems to never moove guns and prices his used guns at or slightly higher than a new one and is a DICK to boot..I have never heard of anyone buying from him EVER!!

How he keeps showing up time after time year after year with the same attiteud and junk I can't figure out.

Ted-

I am not sure what your comment on the pawn shop owner at the shows you go to is intended to convey. There are many dick-heads in every walk of life. My quote of the pawn shop owners who are my friends was posted solely to bring attention to the fact that buying wisely is the secret to success in business...whether the gun business or any other.

If a person buys well, he can mark the goods up by a reasonable amount and still undersell his competitors. It makes the goods effectively sell themselves. That makes his customers happy and him happy.

Anyhow, there are good pawn shop owners and crumby ones; nice guys, and slime-balls. The trick is to recognize the difference and proceed accordingly.

Best wishes to you. I hope the gun shows in your area improve, and that you find a way to best use them to your satisfaction. Perhaps you might even find a way to help organize one or more good ones per year, to help make them better.

AC

Howdy,

Lots (almost too many) gun shows here around central PA, USA. Very few "good deals" IMHO.

Best place to find the best deals are in local newspapers and local internet gun postings.

As far as deflation - depends on the rifles that I have seen - around here the newer M70's have lost the luster of a few months ago. I personally enjoy sporterized 03A3's and they seem to be showing up all over the place - decent workmanship (both metal and wood) can be had for 350-500.

Adios

Sport

quote:

Originally posted by raybass:
Houston area gunshows are typically like that, when you do find a nice gun its way over priced.

Exactly; same thing here. So, like Ray said, I just quit going to shows.
The VERY best place to buy guns at the right price is right here on AR, or on one of the other Forums. I just bought a Mickey Coleman rifle yesterday off another Forum. They guy delivered it to my house too.. New rifle, unfired, at a very good price too.

Don

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
...As my friends who own pawn shops say, "One doesn't make money selling things. He/she makes money buying them....CORRECTLY".

I used to frequent one outside the Main Gate at Cherry Point in Havelock, NC back in the `70s that had about anything you could possibly want.

Asked him about a 243Win M77 Ruger and he said he didn't have any. Said he had something I might like though. Brought our a new suede gun case with the fake sheerling interior. Opened it to find a 243Win M77(just liked I'd asked for), leather Cobra sling, box of cartridges with 3 gone and a K3-C3(El Passo) Weaver on it. Got the whole thing cheaper than a new one with a damaged stock over at Bullseye Gun Shop.

Did a lot of trading with the guy and we both always ended up happy.
-----

Got a Half Inch Drill and a set of Thin Blade Micrometers at one in Orangeburg, SC long ago. Got a great deal on both items. So, I'd say it depends on the Pawn Shop you go to.

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
Not getting cheaper in SeMo it's like some have said above their stuff is gold and yours is shit!

Don't let it bug you. Make them a decent (fair) offer in line with what you feel their stuff is truly worth and move on.

What you are seeing is what one sees when speculators begin to find out the hard truth about their "investments" in any field. Speculators, who try to hop on "profit-bandwagons" without prudence, without deep knowledge of the goods, and without application of considerable thought, always end up paying too much. And inevitably speculative "bubbles" burst. They are left holding the bag, with a sour taste in their mouth, and in an even more sour frame of mind. They often try to hide all that by being rude or treating others as if afflicted with some social disease.

They will eventually come to realize they need to get what they can salvage from their unwise past indulgences, and invest more smartly the next time....unless of course they can get the federal government to bail them out, as AIG stockholders are now.....

It is all part of learning the basics of business. People have the right to MAYBE turn a profit BECAUSE they take a risk when they invest. Some risks do not pay off. That means they need to take a loss as part of the learning process. Next time they will evaluate the risks more carefully to maximize their chances of deserved profit.

You saw it in the dot.coms, and in the housing market, and will inevitably in the gun market as well.

Sure, the congenitably intellectually challenged (modern-talk for "stupid") move from one bubble to the next, never learn, and blame society for their failures. But those who are even a little brighter don't have to do that.

To invest means to evaluate, determine how much risk they can afford to carry, and ONLY buy into any venture accordingly. That both forces the market into the realm of "real value" and allows the prudent to remain solvent while having at least some of the things he/she needs/wants.

Risk is lower when there is a real need for the goods or services, and when the perceived market can afford to buy them. Speculation, on the other hand, is putting in real money in the "hope" that something will sell for an even higher price, despite strains on the ability of would-be purchasers to pay for them, and no real need for them to start with, other than maybe ego satisfaction for the purchasers.


In such times one can make good buys by being present as speculators take their necessary lumps along the learning curve road.

As my friends who own pawn shops say, "One doesn't make money selling things. He/she makes money buying them....CORRECTLY".

I know what you mean. I wish I had a buck for every "PRE BAN" AR I have had draged by the tables and how it was worth more than current producton stock. I just thank them for sharing and wish them good luck.
Bill

quote:

Originally posted by Sport Fulton:
Howdy,

Lots (almost too many) gun shows here around central PA, USA. Very few "good deals" IMHO.

Best place to find the best deals are in local newspapers and local internet gun postings.

As far as deflation - depends on the rifles that I have seen - around here the newer M70's have lost the luster of a few months ago. I personally enjoy sporterized 03A3's and they seem to be showing up all over the place - decent workmanship (both metal and wood) can be had for 350-500.

Adios

Sport

We used to have too many gun shows here too. Now there are only two per year that draw any attendance in this immediate area of Oregon. Our good club shows put the "wildcats" and their flea-market type shows out of business.

The Portland area 180 miles north of here has still not learned that lesson. They used to have a great show at the Portland Expo grounds, twice per year. Then the greed began to dominate the area market. They started having up to one show per week somewhere in the greater Portland area!! As a result, the shows all turned mostly into flea market stuff (there is, after all, only so much good stuff out there). Then most people quit going and all the shows suffered. They are still suffering. But, eventually, if they use their heads, the Portland area clubs will get together and put on one or two Good (carefully self-regulated) shows per year, and run them themselves using club volunteer labour. Then good buys will come back, and so will the customers.

We have proved that in our area. We were at the point where we saw a gun show about once a month within a 30-mile radius of this small city. And they were becoming the kinds of shows you guys have been describing. So, we took actions to improve the quality of our shows, and to carefully limit their numbers.

For just one instance, we reserve and pay for the fair grounds more than a year in advance for late February (just before Varmint season really begins), and September (just before most Oregon big-game seasons). The "wildcats" can't go head-to-head with those shows, and that's when most of the best customers are really "hot" to attend and buy. Good customers attract good sellers and high quality goods.

Over about a 3 or 4 year span, all the wildcats died and the quality of things available at our shows started to noticeably improve. Now they are pretty darned good, even despite state government now requiring that ALL guns sold at the shows undergo "instant check" throughout the state. Hopefully we can continue to improve them.

But it does take work. Just complaining won't change things. Local clubs have to pull together, get volunteers to help, and actually have putting on GOOD shows as a primary goal. If we benefit the sport, it benefits us, individually and at the club level too.

Funny thing about that, eh?

Shows? Shows? What the heck is that? Be glad you don't live in L. A. County CA. roger

Several years ago I was in Oregon and went to a greta show in Salem and a nice one near Portand. Great prices and so many HiStandards and Colt single actions I nearly fainted. Very nice folks too. The best show in Florida is the Lakeland Rifle and Pistol Club show in Lakeland. they do 3 or 4 a year and they are sold out in advance.
Very much like what Alberta describes. Lots of old collectible stuff. I bought a nice Smith Model 1 from 1868 there for $200 a few years ago.

Thanks Dr.Duc for reminding me of the Salem, Oregon shows. They have a couple put on by their club about twice per year too. We coordinate ours with theirs to keep theirs and ours as far apart date-wise as possible. They are approximately 120 miles north of us, so we generally don't hurt each other. The quality of their shows is good enough that they are putting the hurt on the Portland metro area wildcat shows, and may eventually wake the Portland clubs up to where those clubs unite their show efforts and finish the wildcats off.

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:
Shows? Shows? What the heck is that? Be glad you don't live in L. A. County CA. roger

Roger, my friend - Don't recall if I ever mentioned it to you, but when I left home in the middle of my college freshman year (on my 16th birthday), I moved myself to L.A. Made my own fake I.D. and went to work first with Bell Telephone as a "frameman" in south L.A., then with Parker Aircraft in Inglewood as a machinist. Joined the Long Beach NG unit (Combat Engineers) still with fake I.D. Lived the whole time in Watts! Went R.A.(Regular Army), got sent to the Pacific, and never returned to L.A. County. Once was too much, even back then. Large number of pretty good/nice people there, but just too much humanity and two many phonies on too little land to make it long-term attractive to me.

The Red Gods kept calling me away.

As far as most shows go...there are better buys at the local Cabelas...if you know what you are looking at and its fair value. Many times I got the sales person at Cabelas to drop the price by several hundred dollars...perhaps 20% or so. If you don't ask...you can't get. The guys at the shows...don't even waste your breath to ask them to drop the price...even by a lousy 50 bucks. Most are just egotistical assholes that think they have what everyone wants. I go to only one or two a year anymore...and that is usually at the insistance of a bud or two.