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Hey Yes, No, and nobody that I know, or Hunt with would. Comparing Arrows and Bullets is irrelevent from a Killing perspective. They simply Kill differently. Might as well include Strangling, for those that Hunt REAL close.  Comparing a Bowyer to a Rifleman is only comparable from the relative proximity to the Game. There are occasions where we all get real close to Game, sometimes on purpose and sometimes by pure luck and/or circumstances way beyond our control. To go afield thinking a person will be close enough for a (constantly unpredictable moving) Head Shot is the sign of a true Rookie/Beginner. And a great way to wound and loose Game. It is far wiser to take an Adequate Cartridge for tougher shot situations at long distance and then be able to use them on the easy shots, up close, if they present themselves. It is a bad concept for a Hunter to intentionally go with an Inadequate Cartridge.  | |||
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Aren't you the same character the sez the .270 Win. is to light for deer?  Let's see how long it takes for your little leg humping buddy to respond..  yes, It is the indian every time when it comes to hunting and not the arrow! That is a point seen by some here but missed by most.. Personally I don't care what you use to hunt elk/moose with as long as you hunt with care.. | |||
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Years ago, while employed with one of BC's resource management agencies in remote north-central BC, "Ingenika Camp" to be precise, I met an American who lived there and evangelized the local aboriginal population. He and his wife were very decent, humane people and they lived in one of the tiny log huts built by the aboriginals and hunted with them for meat, all year. He had ONE rifle and it was a Remmy .25-06 and he did very well with it on the large strain of Moose that are found in that area. The actual aboriginals used, as has largely been the case, .30-.30s, .303B Lee_Enfields and .22lr. rifles for killing Moose and with great success. The fact is that these hunters knew their quarry, stalked to within 25 yds. and shot the animals in the ear while the gentleman with the .25-06 used lung shots with factory ammo. They had lots of time, were calm and proficient and these "little" guns worked just fine, for them. My smallest bore hunting rifle is a .264WM, shooting 140NPs at 3250, I have three P-64 Fwts in .270Win. shooting 150NPs at 2900 and two Brno 22s in .280Rem. shooting 150/160NPs at 2850-2900 and ANY of these WILL humanely kill Elk and Moose as I have witnessed many times. I would use a .25-06, with 120 NPs if that was all I had and/or I was very sensitive to recoil, however, I am built like a "linebacker", used to heavy rifles and prefer a .338WM-250NP or 9.3-286NP for Elk as I usually hunt in heavy cover and the bigger bullets will make larger holes, thus allowing greater blood loss and consequent "hypovolemic" shock. I was born, raised and have spent my entire 65 years in some of the best Elk country anywhere and have shot nice bull Elk and seen many others shot with quite an array of rifles. So, I base my opinion on actual, extensive field experience and, yes, again, while not my first choice, I would hunt Elk and Moose with a .25-06 with appropriate bullets. | |||
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Did you know Francis? | |||
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I have a close friend by that name, but, I cannot recall the name of the guy I mentioned as this was almost 40 years ago. When, were you there? | |||
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My brother and his bud taught at Ingenika and Grassy Bluff (?) in the mid 80's.. They had a great time and lots of stories to tell.. Francis (native) was often involved in their little adventures..  | |||
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No, I was there and in other northern BC postings in the early '70s and left the BCFS for good in 1974. I have not been back to Ingenika and have only stopped for gas at the junction to MacKenzie, I do not really care for that area and just drive through enroute to the Alcan Highway region. | |||
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The 25-06 was Bob Milek's favorite elk round. He killed a pile of elk with it. The only easy day is yesterday! | |||
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Well said and I'm quite sure all reasonable and accurate. I had a rh 25-06, got rid of it because of its configuration and intend to buy a lh someday. I'm just sure I'll never use it here for moose as I live in bear country and allready have a small stack of moose size rifles but I'd sure like to carry it down south for deer. Last septembers shot on a 65"bull was quartering toward me at 180yds or so. A 120g .25 cal TSX would have worked fine. Like it was said previously and was noted largely was ignored, its the indian and not the arrow. | |||
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Great post Dewey. I've hunted elk since 1973 with a 270 shooting 150g NPs at 3000 fps and none of them were bullet proof. Since my youngest son is now the proud owner of my handed down 270, I'm going to have to make do with my 375 Weatherby or 500 Jeffery this elk season. I don't think the elk will be any deader if I get one this year ...  Chuck Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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I wouldn't buy one for elk hunting, and if I planned to make a habit of elk shooting I'd trade up, but if I was going on one elk hunt and had a 25-06 I'd get some TSXs and go hunting. | |||
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I wouldn't judge the suitability of a round based on what it can do on a perfect broadside heart/lung shot. Its what it can do reliably on a quartering shot when the bullet encounters shoulder bone or rumen before reaching the heart/ lung that counts, particularly on a big animal like an elk. Perhaps this is less important for someone who lives in elk country and has lots of hunting days - he/she can afford to pick their shots and pass up opportunities; but how many people on the last day of their 10-day adventure have the discipline to also do the same? | |||
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+1 Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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As usual, the shot placement is more important than the caliber. However, I believe the North American battery consists of two rifles, one in the .26/06, .270, etc. class and one in the .338+ class. Assuming that one has both rifles, I would use the heavier one on bull elk and moose and be content to use the lighter one on cow elk and downwards. Sarge Holland's .375: One Planet, One Rifle . . . for one hundred years! | |||
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It's a xxxx Adequate Coyote rifle." - Elmer Keith ----- Since it is all about Shot Placement, a person might as well get out the old, trusty, never-fail Red Ryder, load her up with BBs and go Kill all the Elk and Moose they want. Even "Head Shots" would be acceptable with it.  | |||
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Isn't strange how a 270 shooting 150g Nosler Partitions at 2900 fps (factory) has the same downrange energy and sectional density as a 30-06 shooting 180g (2600 fps factory) Partitions, but the 270 is only good for varmints and the 30-06 is somehow a magical round that can kill anything? When people ignore reams of real world experience, and ballistics, I just want to hand them a Palin for President button ... but they probably already have one. Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by chuck375: Isn't strange how a 270 shooting 150g Nosler Partitions at 2900 fps (factory) has the same downrange energy and sectional density as a 30-06 shooting 180g (2600 fps factory) Partitions, but the 270 is only good for varmints and the 30-06 is somehow a magical round that can kill anything? Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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They could also be supporters of "BamBam", being a Canuck, I cannot say which is worse! | |||
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Have not seen any moose taken with a .25-06 but can say quite honestly I have no doubts about the .25-06 being capable of taking elk. It is better than a .243 and it's been successful. As has the .257 Roberts, the little brother to the .25-06, and the 6.5x55 has taken plenty of moose. The main point will always be the main point. Know your abilities and perform within them. Shotplacement kills more than the rest of the issues we always beat to death. I favor a .338 WM with 250gr Woodlieghs or Partitions when hunting where it's thick and usually my 7mm RM in more open country. Personal preference isn't always just based on what works. | |||
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I really liked Dewey's post. Perhaps Vapo can start a 9 page thread on "hypovolmic shock".  | |||
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All you have to do is to get ALF and Warrior to post on your thread....the rest happens automatically.....  /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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I used the 25-06 for deer for about 6 years shortly after it was commercialized and found it difficult to get adequate penetration for the variety of shots you get on deer. On a perfect broadside shot no problem, but anything else big problems. I solved this by going to the 115 gr nosler partition. But that was on deer. Never having used in on elk or moose I would think on a perfect shot it would be adequate, but you couldnt take a less than perfect shot. | |||
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I never shot a moose with anything and probably never will.  The few elk I've shot where shot with the .300 Win. Mag., .35 Whelen and .375 H&H. Not sure I'd want to shoot either anumal with a 25-06 although I believe in the hands of a very good shot it would work just fine.However, a very good riend of my who went to his final reawrd way too early in life had a shoulder ruined in a car wreck. he gave me his pet 30-06 about 35 years ago and he did all his hunting after his accident with a custom 257 Robt. he built up on a Mexican Mauser action. I know he never went after moose with that rifle but he had family in Idaho that had a good sized ranch and he would do his elk hunts on the place. Jerry was a crack shot with that little .257 Bob and every year he brought home an elk for his winter meat. Usually got a couple of nice Mule deer too when they still allowed two deer. Dunno what ever happened to that neat little .257 Bob but I sure would have loved to get that rifle. It's been 35 years since Jerry passed and I still miss doing our deer hunts up by Battle Mountain Nevada. Paul B. | |||
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Why would you deliberately distort my post by inserting a misspelling of the term I used? I see no point in your comments and doubt that anyone else does. | |||
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I have not read through all these responses but I would think a 25-06 with a good bullet like a Swift, NP, NF or TSX would be just fine if you could be selective with your shots ( behind the shoulder or a spine shot. If you are compelled to bust a shoulder or shoot one through the hip then you might want to shoot something a little larger. You might be surprised how easy it is to penetrate about any animal with a behind the shoulder shot and how effective it is and it is a large target. I have heard untold times on this forum that my bullet blew up on the shoulder. Why did you shoot it on the point of the shoulder? Not necessary unless you are trying to break an animal down and what few fail to mention is that the shoulder is smashed along with the bullet. | |||
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I seriously enjoyed your post. I though it was right on. I was joking about hypovolemic shock. we recently had a 9 page thread on hydrostatic shock....inside joke to those that were involved in it. This wasn't a shot at you or your post and I didn't mean to spell it wrong. I messed up while bolding it. | |||
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Certainyl better than a 243, but not ideal for larger game iMO, unless you are shooting really close w/ very good premium bullets. No room for error at all w/ smaller bores. LIFE IS NOT A SPECTATOR'S SPORT! | |||
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Personally, A 270 is what I would consider a minimum caliber that "I" would feel comfortable with for Elk or Moose. And frankly I wouldnt even try that, because Ive got better options. With my current battery I wouldnt use anything less than 7mm. My favorite Elk round is probably my 35 Whelen. As for the 6.5 Sweede on Moose and comparing it to the 1/4 bore, I believe scandinavian Moose are relativly smallish compared to N.A. Moose and much easier to kill than a bull Elk, and also I like the 6.5 bullet selection much better than 1/4 bore for larger beasts. Actualy, I would use a 6.5 on such critters if circumstances nesscitated. But I would want some large, high SD slugs coming out the business end. If all I had was a .257 cal, Id try to borrow something more suitable. AK-47 The only Communist Idea that Liberals don't like. | |||
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There are a lot of elk that would rather see you guys shooting big magnums ... Chuck Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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