THE ACCURATERELOADING.COM MEDIUM BORE RIFLE FORUM

Accuratereloading.com    The Accurate Reloading Forums    THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS  Hop To Forum Categories  Rifles  Hop To Forums  Medium Bore Rifles    30-06 vs. 338-06 vs. 35 Whelen??? What do you like and why???
Page 1 2 

Moderators: Paul H
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
30-06 vs. 338-06 vs. 35 Whelen??? What do you like and why???
 Login/Join
 
<Elliot Viker>
posted
I would have to say that if I was to be traveling with this gun and there was a slight chance that I would or could get it and the gun seperated, then the -06 is the only choice. Ammo is every place that you could chance to find it, and cheap in relation to many other choices, so it would be the "best" of the lot. That said, when hunting where gun and ammo seperations would not be likely to happen, I will take my 35 Whelen improved with 225 nosler's at 2830fps and lay low what is shot and hit. It is accurate and seems to het hard, and it is just cooler to shoot something that not everyone else has or has had in the past. Plus, if the bears did come into play, 250gr at 2650pfs would still reach out farther than you would ever really shoot at this type of game. But so would the 220's in the -06. Oh hell, just get one of each and you tell us what works the best.
 
Reply With Quote
Deputy Al
one of us
posted Hide Post
I will defer to your far greater experience, Ray. I've never taken a game animal with the 30 caliber 220's, and have done relatively little target work with them. They are certainly big game-accurate, and might be like a 6.5 x 54 M/S on steroids.......long-for-caliber RN bullet that penetrates deeply and works far better than its book ballistics would otherwise indicate. I do have a 30-06 (who here doesn't?), vintage 1948 Model 70.

Due to the fires nearby I have the vehicles packed and ready to evacuate--and the 30-06 is among the items that won't ride the storm out in the allegedly fireproof gun safe after we leave. The CZ will take its chances inside the safe. That's not so much a rendering of opinion on caliber as opposed to replaceability, adding in a whole lot of memories afield with Dad (now deceased) that the older rifle figured highly in.
 
Posts: 299 | Location: Yucaipa CA | Registered: 21 December 2002Reply With Quote
B17G
one of us
posted Hide Post
Funny that there are arguements over comparisons of all three of these cartridges.

The only wildcat ( if you can call it that) I own is a 338/06. You can hunt anything in North America with it; that does not have claws and can put YOU on the menu.

It do think it hits harder than a 30/06. However, what is the difference of hitting someone with a 8 pound hammer or a 10 pound hammer? Both are going to do the intended job. I can never figure a real hunter in North America not have at least one 30/06 to his name.
Sure they may be a few who don't, but a few people also drive Peugots even.

After I built a 338/06, I never saw the need to build a 35 Whelan, even tho once I thought I needed one of every caliber. Once I built the 338/06, my two 338 Mags also spend a lot of time in the gun cabinet.

Of the three, I could do without the Whelan. However, I will never knock a man who carries a Whelan afield. I have a lot more respect for it than I do most Magnums ( under 375 caliber).
It is more shootable by the average person and has more than enough punch to do the job at hand.

Just my two pesos worth.
[Razz] [Roll Eyes]
 
Posts: 2889 | Location: Southern OREGON | Registered: 27 May 2003Reply With Quote
Jerry Eden
one of us
Picture of Jerry Eden
posted Hide Post
I think the 30-06 does its best work with bullet weigths of 180 grains or less. The bullet weight argument is a mute point for a man who owns several guns. What I do now is, buy a rifle to shoot a particular bullet weight, I could care less what the bullet ranges are for a given caliber.

Now just as to bullet weights, I will give you an example. I like a 180 Nosler Partition in the 30-06. I like a 225 grain bullet in the 338-06, the 250 in the 35 Whelen, and a 270 or 300 grain bullet in the 375 H&H. The one fly in this ointment, is and I have found this to be true, the rifle dosen't like the bullet style and weight you want it to shoot.

Who I ask goes on a big hunt with just one rifle? If the buggers lose my wildcat ammo, I will shoot everything, including varmints with my 375.

Jerry
 
Posts: 1298 | Location: Chandler arizona | Registered: 29 August 2003Reply With Quote
whtailtaker
one of us
Picture of whtailtaker
posted Hide Post
Another answer to your question-

30-06 with 4X Banner scope

I took a Whitetail @ 542 paces using the below Ammo- in lots of open country
F E D E R A L �
No. Primer-210
No. 180- Grains/Grams-11.66
Style Hi-shok Soft Point
Caliber 30-06 Springfield
Velocity in Feet Per Second
(to nearest 10fps)
Muzzle 2700
Yds 100 2470
Yds 200 2250
Yds 300 2040
Yds 400 1850
Yds 500 1660
I hit him mid chest- lt side
it had enough punch to churn up both lungs and lodge in the lt side of his neck just below his ear-

I retreived 134 gr propeller shaped projectile-

hope this helps- I only use 180gr Ammo

good hunting
whtailtaker
 
Posts: 127 | Location: Mountains of North Carolina and Regions West | Registered: 24 October 2003Reply With Quote
fredj338
one of us
Picture of fredj338
posted Hide Post
Whttail, just curious, how did you hit your deer in the chest & lodge the bullet near the ear? Heck of a shot!
 
Posts: 7752 | Location: kalif.,usa | Registered: 08 March 2001Reply With Quote
whtailtaker
one of us
Picture of whtailtaker
posted Hide Post
I hit him mid chest-lt side
it had enough punch to churn up both lungs and lodge in the lt side of his neck just below his ear-

I guess the bullet just ricocheted till it stopped-

anyway i got the deer and the bullet back also
 
Posts: 127 | Location: Mountains of North Carolina and Regions West | Registered: 24 October 2003Reply With Quote
beemanbeme
one of us
posted Hide Post
Geez Jerry, this has been one of the most orderly, polite threads I followed for a while. Everybodies kewl. [Big Grin]
 
Posts: 2037 | Location: frametown west virginia usa | Registered: 14 October 2001Reply With Quote
Wstrnhuntr
One of Us
Picture of Wstrnhuntr
posted Hide Post
What a wonderfull little argument we've got here. Seems like the irish is comin out in a few guys... [Big Grin]

So now a 200 grain bullet from an 06 will break bones and take down critters as well as a big 338 or 358 caliber bullet just cause Joe blow says so, he been there an done that.. Well thats good to know! But just the same, if mama brownie is 15 yds away, coming right at me with 2000 lbs of whup ass fast enough to pass a speeding quarter horse, has a bad disposition and a mouth full of teeth, Id just assume have a 275 grain from a 338-06 vs the good ol 30-06 covering my butt thank you very much. But hey, what do I know... [Confused] [Razz]

On a lighter note, I (personally) like the larger wound channel that a Whelen makes on the not so dangerous critters.

[ 11-02-2003, 06:53: Message edited by: Wstrnhuntr ]
 
Posts: 10191 | Location: Tooele, Ut | Registered: 27 September 2001Reply With Quote
Idared
one of us
Picture of Idared
posted Hide Post
So now a 200 grain bullet from an 06 will break bones and take down critters as well as a big 338 or 358 caliber bullet just cause Joe blow says so, he been there an done that.. Well thats good to know! But just the same, if mama brownie is 15 yds away, coming right at me with 2000 lbs of whup ass fast enough to pass a speeding quarter horse, has a bad disposition and a mouth full of teeth, Id just assume have a 275 grain from a 338-06 vs the good ol 30-06 covering my butt thank you very much. But hey, what do I know

If mama brownie is 15 feet away I would much rather have something akin to a 404 or 458 than a 338-06 with a 275 grain bullet. A 9.3 with a 286 grain bullet would even be a bit more comfortable to me.

But aside from all this it would be interesting to know what the most common bullets used in the various rounds are. I am betting that something akin to the 210 or 225 grainer is the most often used bullet in the 338-06. As for the Whelen I would guess either 225 or 250 grain, not real sure which. If it does happen to be the 250 grainer I still maintain the 9.3X62 has an edge over it as well as an edge over the 338-06 with the 275 grain bullet. If it is nearer 225 grains then it won't do much more than the 200 grainer in the 30-06. The same will be the case for a 338-06 with a 210 0r 225 grain bullet. I can see no advantage in using 200 grain bullets in either the 338-06 or the Whelen. I have had a couple of 30-06 rifles that would get 2650 or a bit more with the 200 grain Nosler which to me is a great combination.

As I stated above I think the only reason to own either a 338-06 or 35 Whelen is because you really want one. That is a good enough reason as far as I am concerned, but I don't know that they can really be justified otherwise, especially with both pretty much having to be something other than a factory rifle. As someone else said it is pretty hard to lose with anyone of the three unless you are trying to sell one. I am sure you can sell five 30-06s for every 338-06 or Whelen to the average John Q Public shooter. Probably even more.

[ 11-02-2003, 07:38: Message edited by: Idared ]
 
Posts: 845 | Location: Central Washington State | Registered: 12 February 2001Reply With Quote
Ray, Alaska
one of us
posted Hide Post
Idared:

Believe it or not, most bears in Alaska are being killed with all around guns that are much smaller than large calibers such as the .416, .458, etc. The most popular cartridges nowadays are the .30-06, .300WM, and .338WM, but years ago the .30-06 was the big kid in the block, and it killed bears back then.
 
Posts: 2448 | Location: Alaska | Registered: 25 May 2002Reply With Quote
Carson
one of us
posted Hide Post
I have to say I don't have a 30-06. I do have most of it's off-spring and cousins however, .25-06, .35 Whelen, 9.3x62, and it's shorter replacement the .308 Win. I have branched out a bit for my largest "efficient' medium bore, the .375 H&H as a short action cartridge, the .376 Steyr. I too read Elmer Keith as a sprout. I guess Elmer was an "America First" kind of guy, since the 9.3x62 was out there before the .35 Whelen. I still like to re-read Elmer's encouter with the big brown bear with his .35 Whelen. Kind of like how I felt getting my first elk cow with the .35 Whelen and my first water buffalo with the .44 Special. There are newer cartridges out there granted, but the new powders and bullets have brought new life to the older rounds and made them shine anew. Love that .375 H&H as my "heavy" mid-bore too.
 
Posts: 51 | Location: Dickson, TN | Registered: 24 November 2002Reply With Quote
Wstrnhuntr
One of Us
Picture of Wstrnhuntr
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Idared:
[QB
"If mama brownie is 15 feet away I would much rather have something akin to a 404 or 458 than a 338-06 with a 275 grain bullet. A 9.3 with a 286 grain bullet would even be a bit more comfortable to me."

True!

"If it does happen to be the 250 grainer I still maintain the 9.3X62 has an edge over it as well as an edge over the 338-06 with the 275 grain bullet."

I would make the case that either the 338-06 or the Whelen are better compared to the 9.3X62 than the 30-06 is in terms of breaking down dangerous game. Its been said that the 9.3X62 is better compared to a 375 H&H than the whelen or the 338-06, I beg to differ, the 375 is on another plateau. I would be more inclined to put the 9.3 in the same class as a 338 WM, from a power standpoint that is. And the reason that the 9.3 is so highly touted is because of A) its efficiency with heavier bullets. and B) a slightly larger powder capacity. None of those virtues apply to a 30-06 whithin the context of this thread, but the first certianly applies to the 338 and the Whelen.

"As I stated above I think the only reason to own either a 338-06 or 35 Whelen is because you really want one. That is a good enough reason as far as I am concerned, but I don't know that they can really be justified otherwise, especially with both pretty much having to be something other than a factory rifle."

"Justified"?? Who needs justification for any chambering? They all work and it would really suck if the only chambering in the world were the 300 win mag. Different strokes for different folks, justification be damned. The statement that "the only reason to own one is because you really want one" is completly relative and can be applied to any chambering depending on your point of view, its an empty and meaningless position.

[/QB]


[ 11-02-2003, 19:47: Message edited by: Wstrnhuntr ]
 
Posts: 10191 | Location: Tooele, Ut | Registered: 27 September 2001Reply With Quote
redrider
one of us
posted Hide Post
WOW!!!

This is the biggest thread I have ever started, how cool is that. That's what it's all about, the exchange of ideas and oppinions.

I own an 06 as my primary gun (JC Higgins by Husqvarna, sub MOA) and a M-100 in 284 as my second. I think that I like the 25, 30 and 35, for no other reason than it seems like a nice spread.

Dad has a pre 64 M-70 that I would like to screw a 25 bbl to, he has owned it for over 30 years and never shot it once!!! Took it in on a trade. He loves his M-99 that much. I told him that it would bug me too bad to own a gun and not shoot it, at least sometimes.

Gramps has an old O3 Springer that could be cool with a 35 bbl. He made the stock himself and there has never been a stock that fits my hands like that 'ol 03. Our hands must come out of the same mold. Then I'd have the 25-30-35 thing going.

Again, I think all the replys are neat. Thanks for the exchange.

Redrider.

p.s. 30-06 is God's calliber. [Wink]
 
Posts: 82 | Location: seattle | Registered: 14 January 2003Reply With Quote
NotRicochet
one of us
posted Hide Post
quote:
p.s. 30-06 is God's calliber.
LOL!
 
Posts: 424 | Location: Bristol, Tennessee, USA | Registered: 28 September 2003Reply With Quote
<eldeguello>
posted
quote:
Whereas the 30-06 is probably not the ideal caliber for any north American big game, it will do the job on anything except the BIG bears.
While I would agree with anyone who maintains that there are a lot better choices for big bear shooting than the .30/'06, to imply that it will not work satisfactorily on them with the proper bullets and shot placement is just flat WRONG!!! There was a doctor's wife in Faibanks AK in the '60's who killed Polar bear with a .270 using Nosler 150-grain Partition bullets; One of the biggest coastal brown bears ever killed (+-1600 pounds)was shot with a Win. M 95 in .30/40 Krag caliber; and Eleanor O'Connor killed her elephant with an '06 using 220-grain solids! [Big Grin]
 
Reply With Quote
Idared
one of us
Picture of Idared
posted Hide Post
quote:
The statement that "the only reason to own one is because you really want one" is completly relative and can be applied to any chambering depending on your point of view, its an empty and meaningless position.
Most people have to have a reason for owning something or there would be no sense in owning it. This is what I call justification. Obviously you dislike the term but I feel it is an apt word for the circumstance in question. Maybe you have a better word to describe it. If that reason is you want one, fine, it justifies having it. On the other hand more or less duplicating something that has been around and worked well since the turn of the century probably in the truest sense of the word is without real need or reason unless it fulfills your own wants or desires. Call it what you will, this is the way I see it.

To answer the original question I like the 30-06 best and the reason why is that it is a good reliable round with up to and even a bit past 180 to 200 grain bullets. I really haven't found any cartridge with larger bullets in the parent 30-06 case that performed that much better than the 30-06 did. If I want to shoot 250 to 300 grain bullets in something there is a 338 Win Mag and a 375 sitting in the safe. But, seeing as how the original question deleted the big bears the 30-06 would perform admireably, and has been for more years than most or all the folks on this board have been around. It may be boring but it is also dependable. [Wink]

However if you desire a 338-06 or a 35 Whelen, buy it. It won't bother me because I know I am not missing out on anything because I have tried them already. I do abmit to not trying 275 grain bullets in the 338-06 though, so perhaps I did miss something. If so, I'll take your word for it. [Smile]

It's no secret that the 275 grain Speer bullet was one of Elmer keith's all time favorite bullet. But while talking to him he talked mostly about using it in the 338 Win Mag or his 338-378 KT. Yes, I also told him that I did have a 270 for shooting coyotes. He remarked that was about all the 270 was good for. Matter of fact he didn't hold the 30-06 in much better standing so I was forced to buy a 338 Win Mag. At least that is how I justified having to have the 338. [Big Grin]
 
Posts: 845 | Location: Central Washington State | Registered: 12 February 2001Reply With Quote
Atkinson
one of us
posted Hide Post
I am amazed that some would think the 338 with a 250 or 275 gr. bullet at say 2400 or a 220 gr. 30 caliber bullet at 2400 would make much difference on anything coming at you...thats 30 or 55 grs. of bullet difference, doesn't sound like much to me...the same shot placement would produce the same result IMO...

Now, I love and shoot big bores and the 338 is probably my favorite caliber for most stuff and I have shot some big stuff with it, but the 220 gr. 06 bullet has a hell of a lot of SD and penitration, its a virtual torpedo and unstoppable....I have a world of respect for it, many elephants are shot every year with the old 30-06 and I have seen it do wonders on big bad dangerous game...

Those who defy its power have not used it apparantly and are drawing their conclusions from summation I suspect....

As suggested above why we should pay attention to someone who says they have used it is about the best way I know to come to a logical conclusion rather than someone who has never shot anything with either caliber... At least that makes since to me or else I'm just wasting my time passing my experience on to others...
 
Posts: 42348 | Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | Registered: 04 June 2000Reply With Quote
6MM
one of us
posted Hide Post
I was out with a couple of my young boys this afternoon checking out the 35 Whelen before deer season opens tomorrow. I was checking my 250 grain Hornady / R15 handloads. Something was not quite right as two shots would be touching at 100 yards and then the third would be about 3 inches away - sometimes high left, then 4 inches low left. Very puzzling!

Thought maybe I was flinching. Forgot to load a fresh round, pulled the trigger and "click". Everything stayed rock steady - I did not flinch.

Then we noticed that the scope had bluing scratched off in front of both rings. Seems the scope was sliding forward under recoil. I tried to push the scope out of position by hand but could not make it budge.

Kept on firing and the scope kept sliding along. The boys thought this was rather impressive. We finally ran out of room for the scope to slide after about an inch and 6 more shots!

Back home we checked over the mounts and found one of the four scope ring screws was barely loose (Millet angle lock rings). The other three were totally torqued down. That fourth screw could be tightened about 1/16 turn. The boys can't wait to go hunting with the Whelen this week.

Thats why I like the Whelen. Special memories for me and at the same time seeing some young children hooked on hunting and being out in the field.Never had that kind of fun with my 30-06.
 
Posts: 31 | Location: Nipawin, Saskatchewan, Canada | Registered: 16 September 2002Reply With Quote
Wstrnhuntr
One of Us
Picture of Wstrnhuntr
posted Hide Post
I happen to like all three quite a lot, but there is a real and tangible difference in them. Especially between the 30 cal and the other two.

As far as the 30 being most usefull and the others being neither fish nor foul, that is strictly personal opinion. Personally, I have no use for the 338 WM. It is simply more power than is nessesary in this part of the country. The way I look at it, the 30-06 case is better proportioned for the larger bores and that makes some damn fine Elk medicine.
Hows that for justification?? [Smile]

As I mentioned before, a larger bore is more efficent with more lead. If we are going to compare the 30-06 to a 338-06 then lets try it with 200 grain bullets across the board. 2600 fs vs 2800 fs is roughly what you end up with from that angle, and that equates to a fairly flat shooting 200 grain bullet from the 338. Moreso than the .30 even with its slightly higher sd. Put the affore mentioned 150 grainers in the 30-06 and that is all the deer load anyone could ever ask for. Nothing wrong with that either, but it sure aint the same as 250 grain load.. [Wink]
 
Posts: 10191 | Location: Tooele, Ut | Registered: 27 September 2001Reply With Quote
Smoker*
one of us
posted Hide Post
Hey redrider,

What can you say about 3 cartridges that, with the right bullet can take anything that walks, flies or swims. All three are perfectly adequate for such a wide range of game.

However, that being said, I am very partial to the .35 Whelen. Currently available bullets range from 150 grs. to 310 gr. Since I am a reloader, I have tried this entire scope of slugs (at the range) and if used according to intended purpose, they are all excellent (on paper).

With a 280 gr. Swift bullet, I believe that this rifle is at it's best, at least it is in my rifle.
At an average of 2,547 fps this bullet carries a tremendous amout of horse power.

That's my opinion.

Good shooting,

Smoker
 
Posts: 178 | Location: Pennsylvania - USA | Registered: 17 September 2003Reply With Quote
  Powered by Social Strata Page 1 2  
 

Accuratereloading.com    The Accurate Reloading Forums    THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS  Hop To Forum Categories  Rifles  Hop To Forums  Medium Bore Rifles    30-06 vs. 338-06 vs. 35 Whelen??? What do you like and why???

Copyright December 1997-2023 Accuratereloading.com


Visit our on-line store for AR Memorabilia