Hi all,
I really want a new toy, something more than my .300 WM. I want something kind of unique though. Like an 8mm Rem. Mag., 9.3X62, .358 STA or .375 RUM. I want it above .30 cal. and suitable for elk, moose,and other large game to 300 yards. Any other suggestions? Thanks.

Hmm,

Let's see, how about in no particular order, a 338-06, 338 Win Mag, 35 Whelen, 375 H&H, 404 Jeffrey, 416 Taylor, 416 Rigby, 458 Lott, 505 Gibbs...or what the hell, why screw around...600 RGB Belted Nitro Express, (and welcome to the 600 club)?

Of the caliber range you mentioned:

If your balls and pocket book is small

375 RUM

If you have big balls and can spend a few dollars

378 Wby

The rest is not worth thinking about

Mike

350RM ?

olivier

330 Dakota in one of their rifles - they are gorgious firearms.

350 Rigby I can almost gurantee you'll be the only one on the block with one, likely the only one at the range with one. The case is a tad larger then the 358 Norma, feeds slick, and looks cool. The only downside is the bloody pricey Bertram brass, but the alternative is de-belting H&H cases, cutting down their rims, deepening the extractor groove, sizing, trimming and fireforming. After having done the above to 50 odd cases, the bertram brass isn't looking so bad after all.

Johan,

If you have any info on how I can get ahold of the elusive Hornbear, I'd gladly get some. The upside of Bertram is it is stocked in the US, I'm not sure the same is true of Hornbear. At $3/case for Bertram it makes converting H&H brass sensible, though still a PITA! If I could get the Hornbear for less, and good brass to boot, then that would be the way to go.

how about a 338-378 weatherby

Just a good old 375h&H would do the job well I reckon, or a cz 550 in .416 Rigby.

Seamus -- I have shot all extensively and owned some of the following several chamberings larger than .30 cal --- .338 Win, .338 Lapua, .340 Wby, .358 STA, .375 H&H, .378 Wby. I am a accuracy nut that likes one hole groups, and as my buddies say, speed and more speed. I have two .340's and two .358 STA's that so far outshine everything else in the bunch mentioned. What I am refering to is sustained average speeds with consistant accuracy, not just an occasional good group. The .340's with a 225 gr. North Fork or Barnes XLC at 3150 fps. One STA with a 270 gr. North Fork at 3000 fps. another STA 50 to 100 fps slower, each with excellent accuracy. The STA's with a 225 gr. North Fork at 3200 fps and a 250 grainer at 3100 fps. Those .358 STA numbers far surpass the .375 H&H, and approach the .378 Wby, with a bullet with better S.D. My purpose is to hunt Alaska with an adequate stopper, and then use it as a plains game rifle for Africa to go along with a .416 Rem for the larger game. Well that is my .02 worth.

You must have a .375 H&H. It's the all time classic game cartridge.

http://webpages.charter.net/375magnum/index.htm

phurley,

That 358 STA gets a 250 gr out at 3200 fps? I am looking at Nosler #5 and it shows a max velocity of 2898 fps for that cartridge!

Using an internal program for my .375 Improved I get 2900 fps max with a 24" bbl!

As long as I have all the letters and numbers of a keyboard here at my disposal I will give my secret of how I get one hole groups. I only fire one shot.

Now tell me how you get that extra 300 fps?

Re: 358 STA...Different.

Layne Simpson who developed the cartridge wrote an article on it in Handloader 177(??) He quoted maximum velocities of 2981 with one load but most at about 2850-2950 out of a 24" tube.

Seamus: Want something different? how about practical??

Try this......338-08 = Nosler 210 @ 2600, Nosler 225 @ 2475 out of 22"-24" bbl. Nice light, short action rifle, say 6.5 lbs or so....Less recoil than a 300 magnum....Only about 5" drop @ 300 when zeroed @ 250.

Very tangible benefit of a fatter bullet in a pleasant rifle to shoot and carry. Maybe not sexy on paper but verrrrry effective.

Course....if you want to make a lot of noise, and impress folks at the range, then clearly a bigger,faster better,cartridge will be....uhhh....
well...bigger, faster,........better???

JimF

go with the 9.3x62 or 35 whelen you will not be sorry

8X68S?

Don Martin29 -- You referred to the 250 gr. at 3200. What I actually said was a 225 gr. at 3200 and the 250 gr. at 3100 fps. Those books do not show a 270 gr. North Fork at 3100 either do they. That is what I have shot on occasion, but the average is more like 3000 fps. The books do not tell the whole story for a cartridge, they are a very good reference to start from, and I have found some of the max loads just that, particularly the Hornady book. I have the Nosler book quite low in most loads, I can usually beat it considerably. That is the beauty part of reloading, sometimes you just have to sit back and say "go figure", for instance when more powder produces less speed. There seems to be a point of diminishing returns at a certain point. Good shooting.

JimF -- The reason I bought the two STA's I now shoot, was that Layne Simpson research. The gun guru's publish only the very safe data to the public. I have found that by fire forming the superior ammo factory brass, I can then get an additional 3 grains of powder in the case, with a bit of compression. I have two rifles, one a Winchester from the custom shop, the other a custom with a Dan Lilja barrel, on a Winchester action. The Lilja barrel will shoot all loads from 50 to 100 fps faster than the Winchester. I am not guessing at the speeds, I have two chronys and an Oehler 35P, that I use extensively. I have just started to use the Oehler, just to be sure the chronys weren't blowing smoke. I chrony all rounds fired until just prior to a hunt, when I practice away from the bench. When I give a bullet speed here, it is an average from many rounds fired. That .358 round is awesome indeed, I marvel at it each and everytime I shoot my rifles, both which have 26 inch stainless barrels with muzzle brakes. Good shooting.

[ 09-01-2002, 17:33: Message edited by: phurley ]

I'll put in a vote for the .376 Steyr or its parent cartridge, the 9.3x64 Brenneke. Otherwise, I think the .375 H&H is the way to go.

Another vote for .338 class of cartridges I shoot a 338 ultra mag with a 26in tube and get an honest 2960 fps average mv over my cronograph with 250s. But all said the 338 win can handle any job outside of africa that I ever can imagine.A 375 H&H in a Dakota or model 70 classic would be sweet though. Hmmmm I wonder if she would notice.

The 358 STA is indeed an awesome round. Reloading is cost effective too. There is a Wide selection of affordable bullets & cases are easy to form.

[ 09-01-2002, 18:53: Message edited by: Bear Claw ]

The .358 STA is just another pipe dream that will fade. But it goes bang and with the wide range of premium bullets available in all calibers it will work.

I object to the posting of "one hole groups" and velocities that are over maximum for common sense use. When I went to bed last night I had the concern that I should reread that hurleys post as the velocity might not be 3200 with the 250 and sure enough it's 3100 which is still out of line!

The comment that the .358 STA is somehow far above other cartridges does not make sense today.

And for that matter a case based on the RUM's would at least get rid of the belt. No thanks. I don't want either.

As I said I have a .375 Improved. I can't imagine how a .358 STA would outperform it or for that matter be a lot different? Well I can shoot factory ammo in mine. Seen any .358 STA factory ammo around?

Lane Simpson writes in Nosler #5 that he loads the .358 STA to 2900 fps with the 250 gr. It's amazing that my keyboard has all these numbers at the top! Is yours like that?

[ 09-02-2002, 00:51: Message edited by: Don Martin29 ]

Wildcat junkie, some time ago I wanted you to consider the 8x68S. It seems you did not like it, even in shortened form. What happened to you ;-)

Hermann - still in search of a 8x68S

Don Martin29 -- I did not change my post, I simply asked you to read the original post correctly, I also assumed you could do that. As far as posting groups and speeds, I also assumed that is the reason we are all here, discussing each others methods and results and learning from that. Seems like I am doing a lot of assuming. As far as my opinion as to the comparing the STA to the .375, I assume I am still free to express my opinion, as you are yours. I will not piss on your opinion, if you will not piss on mine, let us just agree they are different. I would invite you to shoot with me anytime you wish, and see with your own eyes the Oehler tapes, as they are shot. You can also buy all the factory ammo you can afford from Superior custom ammo of Sturgis, South Dakota. Good shooting.

[ 09-02-2002, 17:51: Message edited by: phurley ]

Yoo..!
You should get a .378 Wby Magnum,,that's what i'm thinking of. It is special,,without doubt. The Stallion you could call it because of the recoil !!But if you're going to have one the recoil will be much less to worry about, now that they got the same barrel countor as the bigger .460 Wby,, and the muzzle jump won't be so unpleasnt as before,,but it will be expensive. Or you could rebuild & rebarrel some other rifle.I think i will get a custom rifle in this cal.Besides the ballistics are truly impressive. You could get 3100 fps wiht the slowest powders available,,f.ex H-870,,and that is with a 300 gr.bullet !!You could try lost river bullets or GS custom bullets if you are patient enough,he,he !Then you can send those 265 gr. bullets to a velocity of 3250 fps,,flatshooting,,,indeed. You could also send those 270 noslers to 3200 + fps with ,loong barrel and slow powders !With a properly built rifle 10 pounds+,,recoil wont be as bad as the previous weatherby rifle wihout brake,,,and talking of brakes,,your ears will fall off !!
But to end this with some words from the A-square book,,it says,"with proper bullets this cartridge is the engine of destruction as it was always billed to be". I do agree. By the way,,,when i get one i plan to shoot at big ice blocks in the winter to see the effect.
P.s i hope others on this foru m will give me some advice,,"shooting- objects"or other "fun-targets".

Per".378 destruction"

Paul H

You got mail
Don't blaim me for spending all your savings on new gadjets

Cheers
/ JOHAN

Ahunter (Herman), actually WJ has been diligently at work putting together an 8 X 68S, and his enthusiasm is such that he has me on the same trail. - Dan

Seamus,I got both 8x68s and 9,3x62, for longer distance you should go for the 8x68s.
johan

9.3x64 or a 340 Wby both are great.

Shoot a ,378 Wby before spending money,,,absoluteli vicious recoil. Not for me.

Wanted something unique, you said? .325 Westley Richards. Be the first kid on your block...

I'll second the 330 Dakota recommendation. It is definitely a little bit unique, it is based off of the 404 Jeffery case, has no belt, and will function in an '06 length action--provided the bolt has a magnum bolt face. The one I have is based on a longer Sako 75 action in order to achieve the bigger bolt face, but I do want to get one in an '06 length just because....it is damn powerful, very flat shooting and mine is very accurate.

A lot of 1000 yard guys use it due to it's stated 'inherent accuracy' I don't know about that, but I have read about a lot of 1000 yard guys using it. Lay in about 200 pieces of brass and you should be good to go, standard RCBS dies are available, as well as the brass at Midway and other places--I really like mine, an absolute hammer on big hogs and a couple of other big critters it has come across!