The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Medium Bore Rifles 338 Ultra has over 5000 Foot LBSGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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| one of us |
I have calulated the 338 RUM and found it has over 5000 FT LBs of engery in most of its loads the 300gr bullet, 225gr bullet and the 250gr bullet but is to small. What do you think? | ||
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One of Us |
I think that anything that generates 5000 ft lbs of energy and still doesnt qualify as an African DGR because of legal issues is not suitable for much else. Maybe a good Polar Bear round or ?? Ive got to wonder what kind of a future such a round has though. Ive read a lot of complaints about excessive recoil from it. Better off with the WM. | |||
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one of us |
2 years ago I was at the range. Guy sat down at the bench next to me with his Custom Remington Alaskan 338 RUM. Rifle is a Stainless Steel, synthetic stocked rifle that is pretty light. After 3 shots I realized it was time for me to go, the blast from the brake was wiping me out. Even with the brake on, the gun was still recoiling pretty good. That's the problem that I see with it and the 340 Weatherby. They are killing machines, at both ends. When you start pushing a 250 grain bullet that fast, you will pay the price in heavy recoil. I can't even imagine what the 338-378 Weatherby is like. For the guy that can handle one, my hats off to him. But leave your muzzle brakes at home... | |||
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| one of us |
I have to agree with Mr. Day. I've done very well with the .338-06 which is a solid 200+ fps less than what the .338 WM is capable of. Great round for plains game and about anything in NA as well. Seen a few hunters with their .338 Ultra's SHOOT at a few heads of game but have not seen one connect yet. True story! Shot a std Rem 700 without a brake and it was more fun than I care for. FN in MT | |||
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| One of Us |
To my way of thinking the the 338 Ultra, 338/378, 375 Ultra and 378 Wby are more of a "shooters" gun and the 338 Win and 375 H&H more of a "hunters" gun. Mike | |||
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| One of Us |
I shoot the .338 RUM, the .338 Win, and the .338-06. I like all of the them as well as my .35 Whelen. Of course I am a big guy and don't mind the kick. I am always amused by guys who shoot the .338 Win and then the RUM kicks so much more. Baloney. Barstooler | |||
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one of us |
I was at the the range with a friend and was I was shooting my 458 win. I could not get him to shoot my 458. He was shooting a 338 rum and he let me shoot it. I think I was getting abused less with my 458.  I got my first hunting rifle when I was 15. It was a 338 win. I have had two since and found them to be very shootable. It is nothing like a 338 rum. Now I have a 375 RUM and have put about 100 rounds through it and think it may very well my first breaked rifle.  | |||
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| one of us |
I agree! I've said it before and I'll say it again; If the recoil of your rifle is so unplesant that you have to use a brake on it, you're over your head!! You simply should go down in caliber!! I have a 338RUM and have NO intension to have a brake on it. I shoot it from the bench without holding the foreend of the stock, and prone without any problem. Of course it kicks, but not THAT bad!! I have several kickers including a 460wby, but none of them has a brake on them. But thats because all of them are HUNTING-RIFLES!! I already have a hearing problem, and I try to save the last bit of my hearing. And a muzzlebrake is NOT the way to go!! | |||
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| one of us |
I think calculated energy figures aren't everything. CPS | |||
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Moderator |
Quote: Bravo! Is the question will the 338U kill large game? Absolutely with good bullets properly placed. Is the question, is the 338 U equal to a big bore rifle, say a 416 Rem mag? Absolutely not, and I would much rather hunt with a 416 Rem then a 338 U Rem. | |||
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one of us |
The one advantage energy level has is that it's easy to calculate. Other things like, "What will it really do when the midden hits the windmill?", don't accomodate themselves to calculators and are thus beyond the reach of armchair bwana's. I am disinclined to pay much attention to anyone's DGR opinions who hasn't had to shoot him/herself out of a nasty situation. That's why I really don't have any such opinions of my own except that the .450 Rigby knocks buffalo down. I say this 'cause I was there and did it! I'll have an opinion of the .404 Jeff in about 2 weeks, I hope. Leavin' on the 29th . . . | |||
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| one of us |
I own a 416 Rem , 375 H&H but besides these rifles I was wondering what the 338 RUM of mine would be good for at these high engery ft lbs to hunt I know its to small for the big game in Africa but what about Alaska. Do you think Moose or the big bears at a distance. | |||
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| Moderator |
Quote: I have no doubt that the 338 rum would be effective on moose at a distance, though I don't know if you want to be taking long shots at moose. Remember to multiply every yard a moose is shot by 10, for the 10 trips you'll be packing that meat out in. Not to mention that there just might be a swamp or bog that makes for some very arduous packing, or a rather long detour. Also the fact that you really don't want the moose to decide to die in a stream or pond. I would be very leary of using a 338 rum on the big bears. High velocity puts a real strain on a bullet at close ranges, and I would not want bullet failure on a big bear. It is also uncommon to shoot bears at long ranges, as it is difficult to judge the size of the bear and hide quality. Also bears have more of a chance to make it to cover. Interior grizzlies in open tundra, the 338 would have it's place. Coastal or island bears, then take the 375 or better yet 416. | |||
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| one of us |
And tundra bears aren't really that big, neither are Mountain Grizzlies. It's the rare speciman that goes over 8', and a 7 and half foot boar is more like it. For a Brown bear, as the previous poster stated, I wouldn't want the bullets moving at warp speed. I've never hunted Brown bears, but I've hunted Grizzlies twice. I'd give up some velocity and recoil, so as to get back on target quicker. Just my opinion. | |||
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| one of us |
Quote: At the same time, Paul, a well placed .338-caliber bullet may very well kill faster than a .416's that is not. In one of the videos "Love Thunder And Bull," a guy shoots a .416 on a moose, perhaps at 150 yards away. One can clearly see hairs flying off the moose's chest, through the lungs, and the moose runs around the hunter. The hunter fires his .416 one more time, and the moose drops. The moose was probably dead on the first shot, but maybe it didn't know it. We have had bears shot a couple of times at point blank with the mighty .458 Magnum, and the bear running after the shots, to later have the guide running after the bear and using his rifle to kill it. The first .458 bullet broke the bear's jaw, and the second passed through the chest, but none were lethal enough to kill the bear on the spot. | |||
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| one of us |
The .338RUM will work just fine for anything in Alaska. There are tough and not so tough .338-caliber bullets for you to choose from, and the selection is huge. I would agree with Paul that soft bullets for bear hunting would not be a good choice, but you can use Partition Gold, Fail Safe, Barnes-X (or the other X's), 275-grain A-Frame, and so forth. This will give you an idea of the most used cartridges in Alaska, so if yours is a "bigger" (I think it is), bring it: This is from the NRA's January 2001 issue, American Hunter: "The Alaska Department of Fish & Game hunter safety staff in Anchorage tallied the big game rifles sighted at the Rabbit Creek rifle range for the 1999 hunting season. The top three cartridges were the .30-06 (21%), .300 Win. Magnum (19%), and the .338 Win. Magnum (18%). These were followed by the 7mm Rem. Magnum (9%), .375 H&H Magnum (6%), .270 (6%), .308 (4%), and .300 Wby. Magnum (4%), .45-70 (1%), .280 (1%), and a host of others, including many wildcats. Comparable data are not available for hunters who live in the bush." | |||
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| one of us |
Unless the game can eat you, which does not include most of us in our hunting expereince, why???? I am at a lost of hunters obsession with Foot Pounds. All I see if the footpounds goes up, so does the recoil and for most guys, not matter what they PUBLICLY admit, shot placement consistency goes WAY DOWN. Give me shot placement and a decent game performing bullet like a Round Nose, and I'll take that with a fraction of the 5,000 footpounds. I respect others' choices, but I fail to see the logic in it. Cheers Seafire | |||
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one of us |
I haven't shot a .38rum but have played w/ a .340 abit, regularly hunt w/ a .338-06 & recently been shooting my .338x74. I like them all but really, the only reason to go to magnums is to launch bigger bullets faster & I can't figure out what you need a .338RUM for?! For big bear I want bigger holes. To each his own, but I'll stop @ the .338WM, if I need more gun it's going to be a 9.3, .375 or .404jeffery! | |||
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| one of us |
Hi The reason I bougt a 338 RUM (last saturday!)was to be able to launch a heavy (275-300 g) bullet at aprox 2700 fps with very low pressure. Something like the 416 Rigby in concept: Using the big case not for max Fps, but in a relaxed way launch a heavy for caliber hunting bullet. It just make me feel good to have a lot of margin up to the problem pressures. No risk of sticky bolt handles, no blown primers,long case life and so on:-) Br/ | |||
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| Moderator |
Quote: Ray, Fair enough, but it is a specious argument to say someone would be an accomplished shot with a 338 ultra, and unable to handle a 416, it just doesn't wash. I would take a 416 over a 338 ultra any day, simply because for that level of recoil, the 416 is undoubtedly more gun, and I prefer the big push of a big bore over the sharp jab of a fast medium bore. I would also take a 338 win mag over a 338 ultra any day, because from what I've heard, the existing bullets, premiums included, perform more reliably when muzzle velocity doesn't exceed 2700 fps. Thats not to say that at higher impact velocities the bullets can't be dramatic killers. It is to say that they can also occasionally do undesirable things. Why is it when someone misses with a big bore, it is the gun's fault? There are folks that can't hit with small and medium bores too, but somehow that is ok. There seems to be a mindset that light recoil a rifleman makes. Boulderdash, either you can shoot, or you can't, recoil is simply something to be dealt with. | |||
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| one of us |
I really don't see the point in comparing the 338 RUM to 375's and 416's. In my mind it has a completely different purpose. It shines the brightest when one wants to hit something really hard at long range with great accuracy--along with doing everything else you'd normally do with a 338. The way I see it, the 338 Win is sort of a "big" 30-06--just on a larger scale. It'll do pretty much anything you want and do it well. The 338 RUM is sort of like a "big" 300 Win. It can't really do anything the 30-06 can't do, it just does the same with a bit more authority and does it better at extended ranges. You can use heavier bullets at the same or higher velocity and still have a reasonable trajectory. Just my way of looking at things. | |||
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| one of us |
I have a friend that hired a guide to go grizzy bear hunting well he took his girl friend with him on a ship going up the coast to Alaska and when they saw a grizzy the ship would anchor and put a small boat over the side for my friend and his guide to hunt the bear. Well my friend got his grizzy with a 250yd shot with a Lapua Mag first shot he hit the shoulder then two more just behind the shoulder. It's a real nice mount from the waste up. This friend also went buffalo hunting out west and shot a buffalo with his Lapua. He shot it in the heart but the big buffalo just stud there until some other buffalo got close to it and knocked it on its side. Thats when he knew it was dead. | |||
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| one of us |
Before I purchased my first .338 I heard horror stories about the recoil. The stories simply weren't true. I have only shot one 338 Ultra Mag but did not find it to kick as violently as some have reported. However, I don't think I will rush out to trade my .338 Win Mag in for one any time soon either as I am very happy with the one I have. I am a great fan of .338 anything and shoot mine regularly. If I were going to buy a .338 today I would have to give the Ultra a very close look. | |||
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| one of us |
I prefer the 338 Win. over the RUM..Not much on the newer calibers, maybe I am sot in my ways and feel like all that extra velocity and energy is best used to destroy bullet integrity and penitration, much needed on big bad animals... Velocity and energy in excess is about like anything else in excess, moderation is the winner...a 416 of course is head and shoulders over a RUM and remember the 220 Swift has about the same "energy" as both the 416 and 300 RUM... I suspect if you used a good bullet of very heavy construction and a premium, the 300 RUM would lay low the mighty Cape Buffalo with aplomb, but it might also at some point get you tossed into the top of a Baobab tree...Be my guest, I can't say much as I have shot Buffalo with a 8mm Mauser and .308 and a 338 win...they worked, but not a good choice to make if you have an option, I didn't except to sit at camp with the ladies, rather get gored. | |||
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| one of us |
I've been wondering in recent years what the big deal is with upsized cases for the "old standard"calibers. Seems to me that if a .338 Win Mag won't do the job, one might consider a .375. For the most part I think the RUMs are unnecessary. If you're really looking for 5k+ lb-ft of energy and ballistics like a .338, try a 350 br Barnes X in a .416 Rigby launched at 2700 fps = 5670 lb-ft of energy. In most of North America you probably don't need that much energy and the .416 just might be a little heavier that the .338 ... 10.5+ lbs with scope versus 8 including scope ... something to consider when you have to hike it up a mountain. Both approaches work well when used where they are needed. The .416 simply stunned a nice Gemsbock in RSA (he staggered a few feet and collapsed) ... and the .338 has always done well with Elk. | |||
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| One of Us |
A new co-worker of mine was telling me a few days ago about his new RUM. How the "pussies" told him how bad it would kick, and that it really doesnt. Eventually he got to the part about how his 18 year old son, although a big guy for his age, flinches. I would have laughed out loud if I didnt feel so bad for the kid. Testosterone sells like a muther, but it dont mean squatt in the field. | |||
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| <allen day> |
Over the years, I've listened to all sorts of tough-guy claims about taking recoil from the biggest cartridges on the planet without so much as a cough or a flinch, and most of that lip service comes from guys who really don't shoot all that much throughout the year, or so it seems. We open up our rifle club every year for two weekends prior to deer season, and assist paying guests to sight-in rifles, etc. Some of the pilgrims who turn out are long on wind about how accurate their howitzers are, how well they can shoot them, how the recoil means "nothing" to them, and on and on ad nauseum. When you get down to the nut-cuttin' though, and those windbags start shooting, their shot-to-shot reactions and their targets often tell a completely different story. Some of the really young kids who come out with 6mms, .270s, .308s, and .30-06s turn out superb performances and put those phony stud muffins to shame. They totally outclass them! "Don't call him a cowboy 'til you've seen him ride......." AD | ||
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