I was at the gun store today, still looking for the holy grail, and played with a few rifles. I looked at a Winchester in WSM, a Browning stainless stalker, a Weatherby and whats that used rifle in the coner? The counter guy hands me a used stainless Sako 75. I must confess I've lead a sheltered live, this is the first Sako I've ever played with. Man this thing was sweet!! I was impressed! The action was smooooth and I liked the 64deg bolt. On the down side the price was a bit high and it was a little heavy for what I'm looking for.

So tonight I looked at some of the action sites and now I'm confused. I found listings for a L61r, finnbear, model 995, hunter, hunter classic.........since I've only seen one Sako this was a bit confusing.

What I've got in mind is a 7mm 24" barrel with no sights, a floor plate model no box magazine, with the 64deg bolt. What model would that be? Also the finnbear seems to be the cheaper model. Are they good rifles?

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(that is all that needs to be said about them)

Mark, I would have to agree with Lawcop. In a production bolt action rifle you simply can't do any better. For smoothness of action, fit and finish, reliability you would have to spend SEVERAL dollars more to get an equivalent rifle, and I'll say up front that I personally favor the Steyr Pro Hunter and Savage where bolt actions are concerned. I haven't spent any time with the Sako 75 but I have with the TRG-S and if the 75 is anything like it, you won't be disappointed.

I would also agree with Orion where detachable magazines are concerned. I'll probably get flak for this statement but as far as I personally am concerned, the floorplate is about the most useless thing on a rifle there is. I would rather have a blind magazine if I couldn't have a detachable one. The old argument about being able to lose a magazine doesn't hold water either, especially when most guys carry ammo loose in their pockets to top up. When you unload you have a better chance of losing ammo when you open the floorplate than just taking a magazine out. Think about it.

[ 04-27-2003, 13:00: Message edited by: savage49494 ]

So the finnbears have a 90deg bolt. Do they have a detachable magazine?

Thats kind of a bummer, you can find some good deals on the finnbear. I also seen a few few without sights. http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?ItemNum=4208235
This is a nice looking rifle!! Can you buy a replacement light weigh fiberglass stock for the finnbear?

Mark, to the best of my knowledge the Finnbear was only made with a floorplate but perhaps one of the readers out there knows something else. The 90 degree bolt is a very good action the same as all Sako actions. Finding a fiberglass stock shouldn't be too hard. I personally favor MPI Stocks and they do make stocks for Sako. These are tough, good looking stocks and they stand by their work. They always have time for their customers and will talk about any project you have on the go. A class organization. They can be reached at (503)226-1215 or www.mpistocks.com.

[ 04-27-2003, 20:10: Message edited by: savage49494 ]

Mark

The finnbear was made during 170-1980. It is a very nice rifle and is equiped with a hinged floorplate. Some of the old coots at this forum would take an old nice sako finnbear L61R over any of the modern ones. I'm not fan of clips, they always seems to get lost or function poorly.

I would recommend McMillan or High Tech stock for the sako actions. McMillan were the ones who produced the stock for the Fiberclass rifle sako came out with in the middle of 1980. I would not eve think about a MPI since the ones I have gotten has been useless crap. Ask others and the reply will be repeated

/ JOHAN

If you want a fixed magazine with floorplate (and at a more affordable price), the L-61 or A-V Sako-actioned rifles made from the early '60's through the early 90's are probably your best bet. They are conventional two-lug bolts, meaning about an 85-88 degree bolt lift, but in many aspects they are superior to current production and can be found in mint condition for some bit less than the Model 75. If you are lucky enough to come across a pre-1972 model, it will have a slightly lighter contour barrel and a more gracefully contoured stock, for about three-quarters to a pound difference in weight.

I, of course, cannot speak one way or the other about Johan's experience with MPI.

I do have a pair of very nice rifles stocked by MPI. One is an original Newton, rebarreled by my close friend, the late Paul Marquart, to .30/338. (.30 Belted Newton it is called by some). Not only is this stock a very nice piece of work, the rifle easily shoots 180 gr. bullets into half an inch at 100 yards. Do wish I had trashed the double set triggers when building it though....

The other is a .243 Win M600, 21" Schneider medium heavy barrel built especially for "anteloping" ("desert goat numbers maintenance" to my vegetarian friends). It has an aluminium base to the butt pad, which fits inside the stock and is secured there by the rear sling swivel at the bottom...at the top by a "lip". Purpose is to be able to easily remove the buttplate to reach the space blanket, matches, compass, 5 rounds of ammo, 50' of cord, etc., stored inside. A good rifle with a good built-in insurance policy.

AC

Sako...There is no substitute! They even chamber them in 6.5 SE - I have had four Swedes at one time, but currently have two (AV Hunters). I sold the other two because they were lefties.

Although I prefer the A series Sakos, IMHO the 75's are probably the most bang for the dollar. Buy one, you won't regret it. Also, be cautious, they're addicting.

I just bought my first Sako a used 579 in 22-250 and it is a great varmit gun.3/4" 5 shot 100 yard
groups with factory win 45 grain hp.I am not the
best shooter so for me this is good.
So when my friend was looking for a new rifle for
his girl friend,I suggested a Sako 75 SS 7mm08
With factory ammo,shooting nosler partions I shot
3 shot 1 1/4" groups @ 100 yards,right out of the
box after mounting a scope.With some handloads I
think we can get sub MOA easily.If I needed to buy
a new production rifle,it would be a Sako.
My .02
Jeff

Guys,

I became a Sako fan 4 years ago when I bought
the then new Model 75. I decided on the Stainless
Synthetic because the stock felt great and looked cool. 300 Win. I liked it so much that I bought the company-kidding.
I have the Stainless Synthetic in 7-08
and the Deluxe Hunter in 375 H&H.
Lots of African hunting and whitetailwith these and NEVER a problem. So accurate too with factory
ammo.
I am sold.
Ed

Mark, I guess you can see that Sako fans tend to be pretty loyal.

My one and only Sako is the first rifle I ever bought: an L61R Finnbear in 7mm Remington Magnum that I picked up used in 1985. It was already about 15 years old when I bought it, and I taught myself to shoot and reload with that rifle. Sako receives a fair amount of criticism for the design of their factory stocks, primarily from the "Classic" camp. Perhaps I have unusual body geometry, but nothing I've ever tried comes even close to fitting me as well as that orginal factory stock. Every time I lift this old rifle to my shoulder, the crosshairs magically appear on whatever I've been looking at.

The old L61 action is beautiful and strong. It's also incredibly smooth and precise. Perhaps people will disagree, but in my mind it is every bit as nice as the best Remington 70 or Winchester 70, and the bolt seems to cycle better. A couple of years ago a friend allowed me to try his TRG-22 in .308. With that rifle I was able to put 5 shots into half an inch at 200 metres without effort -- and the only reason that group opened up to half an inch was because I got cocky and pulled the last shot! I have likewise tried a fellow's Sako 75 Stainless .30-06, and I put three factory Federal Premium 180-grain Partitions into a little over half an inch at 200 metres. From these experiences I have to conclude that the new 3-lug Sako action works.

If I was on a limited budget today and wanted to buy an excellent rifle for the money, I would almost certainly look carefully at one of the new Savage models. However, if I had the money for a slightly "premium" rifle, I'd choose the new Sako over the competition in a heartbeat.

Good luck with your choice.

AMEN!!

Old Finnbears are becoming sought after items these days ,at least for people who know them.

I have one,it was my first -06 and it is a very good rifle.Blueing,action,accuracy. Taken many a moose and it has been a good plattform for all kinds of load tests as well.

I did the Lemon-Merenque finish for the stock and you can not tell it�s been refinished. The recipe is in Gun Digest 2001, by Nikitas Kypridemos. I think I scanned it,in case someone is interested.Lemon oil,eggwhite,beeswax etc. Lots of work but worth it.

My Finnbear kinda retired from moose hunt when I got a Grey Norwegian and discovered Marlin 1895, the nature of moose hunt changed a lot with the dawg, meaning lots of walking in brush and swampy areas. Marlin is easier to carry and faster, no long shots needed. So the Finnbear is my deer rifle now,using Sako mounts I can change between scopes without resighting.

And of course the madness goes on: I finally got a new TRG-S a couple weeks ago,338 Lapua. Pretty awesome shooter right out of the box,also ugly as hell. Finding longer range field shots as an excuse,I friggin�sold a winch out of my truck to finally get it out of the shop.

Sako had severe marketing problems, basically finnish government let them down by switching to Norincos in military area... some move. I hope the co-operation with the Italians works okay in the future.

Never met a bad Sako by now,shot plenty. If you buy an old Sako and get a new stock,do not throw the old one away! You may have a customer here.

Oh yes,this is my real name.Nothing to do with PETA.

Petander, I'm sorry to hear the Finnsh government let down Sako. In my mind, Sako should be the pride of Finland. It's sad to see that the Finnish government went with Norinco , of all things. Now that is an insult!

Best no-nonsence factory rifle out there in my opinion.

Hi Mark:

I have a Sako Finnbear L-61 R action pre 72 in Excellent condition in 7MM Mag. It says Imported by Garcia Mitchel on the barrel. I have the gun for the past 25+ years and it's never even been hunting, to heavy and to pretty.

It shoots Speer 160 grn SP in sub MOA @ 100yds at 3000 FPS. This rifle has probably less than 50 rounds through it.

Blue Book Pub rates price about $1,000.00 This rifle just sits in my gun case looking pretty. Anybody have anything interesting they want to trade.... a light weight SS Kimber in 270 WSM would be nice, orrrrr a Pre 64 Winnie in a long action in near excellent condition. orrrrrr down payment on a double rifle...orrrrr... a Dakota something...hell you tell me...LOL

Regards.. Jim P.

PA: You say it is a "pre-72" but is marked Garcia-Mitchell. That is certainly possible, but unusual. Does the bolt have the third (safety) lug near the rear of the bolt more or less opposite of the bolt handle? Also, is it the Deluxe or the Standard. You say it is heavy. The Garcia-imported models used a heavier contour barrel and stock than the earlier guns, so this leads me to believe it was made after that change-over.

This is just a query arising from the last post. My Sako 7mm Rem Mag. is also Garcia, and it does not have a "safety" lug. Does anyone have an idea of its approximate age?

Hi Stonecreek:

I don't know what a third safety lug looks like to tell you the truth.

It says Garcia Sporting Arms, Wash, DC on bottom of the barrel. Serial # is 71XXX. Checkering is superfine, no ebony forarm tip, white spacer on pistol grip cap. It has one massive cross bolt in the stock under the forward part of the action. The action has the purpleish blue color with some engraving arount the bolt knob.

The Blue Book Publications, Inc book says..??? Pre-1972 Sakos utilize the L-46 469, L-57 and L-61 R actions. I have the L-61 R..???

I bought this gun exactly 27 years ago from a bank manager, and I don't think it was new then.

The action is like butter, and still has the original 3 X 9 Leuopold Scope with Weaver Mounts on it. It's like an old friend that I never use.

Regards... Jim P.

Hey mark65x55

Sako has a exelent reputation here in Norway.
Go to www.sako.fi to see the new models.

Tikka is a cheaper gun also made buy sako, the barrels are the same but the gun is made cheaper but still it's a top gun. I belive most have DM.
www.tikka.fi

Also there are a light model of both tikka and sako. Tikka has a new model coming this days called T3. It's looks like a fine gun.

I found out that the guns are also listed on: http://www.berettausa.com/product/product_rifles_main.htm

Johan

[ 05-15-2003, 01:13: Message edited by: 308winchester ]

P-17: Sako dropped the third lug that seated in the rear bridge (like a '98 Mauser) shortly after the Garcia Corporation took over U.S. distribution in about 1972-1973. A few "Garcias" were built with left-over actions with the third lug during the transition. Those actions are refered to by most as "pre-1972's", although the guns they came on were marketed later than 1972.

PA: Your gun sounds suspiciously like one of the transition models. The previous importer before Garcia was Firearms International of Washington, D.C. I have never before heard of a Garcia marked Washington D.C., so I am speculating (wildly) that yours was perhaps part of the inventory during the transition. If so, it would likely have the third lug.

All Sako Actions starting after the L-46 and L-57 were L-461, L-579, or L-61R up until the 80's when a very slightly modified action series labeled AI, AII, AIII and AV was introduced. Therefore, it's impossible to tell just from the L-61R designation whether the gun is pre or post-'72.

"Harry", who has a store in the DFW area is very knowledgeable about Sakos. If Harry is looking in, maybe he'll step in to clarify.

You gave several clues as to why you have a Garcia Post 1972 rifle but the color of the receiver and the white line spacer are two good ones.
I bet you have a Phillips head screw in the black pistol grip cap too.
The ser. # also puts it in the Garcia Post '72 era.

Harry: White spacers under the grip caps are common on pre-'72's, and I have found an equal number of straight-slot and phillips head screws on the grip caps of pre-'72's, so give us some more hints to clue us in. I would agree that the SN is on the high side for an L-61R to be a pre-'72, but the gun didn't stamp "Garcia" on itself.