My Ruger M77 MKII doesn't shoot any partitioned bullet well. It loves Hornady Spire Points, especially 225 gr. I've used that bullet on whitetails, they died quickly. I've since switched to the thin-jacketed Speer 200gr bullet for deer. The exit hole is a lot larger, and the chest contents are more liquid than whole. Don't hit edible parts with that bullet. The Hornady bullet killed the deer, the Speer did it quicker. I've also tried the Sierra 215, but its accuracy didn't match the Speer or Hornady bullets in my rifle.

Interesting replies on the use of the 338 Mag. I still do not get the discussion opn the light bullets in 338. The niche of 338 is realistic range, heavy game at hunting angles. If you want to use the 180 gr bullet, Use a different calibre to take advantage of BC, do not make the 338 into a caliber it is not. I refuse to believe this crap about an X bullet doing same job as 30 extra bullet grains. The real benefit of the 210-225 Nosler is the exlosive effect of the front core and the penetration of the rear. having 175 gr of bullet left after the initial tissue destruction iswhy so many EXPERIENCED hunters use the 338 wisely.

BR

OK, I've read all the threads, and since the 338 Win is one of my favorite calibers, I might as well put my comments in too.

If you want to shoot under a 200 gr, go buy a 30 caliber.

The 200 Barnes X bullet is an amazing performer, and the 200 gr Hornady and Speer just do a great job on Deer size game.

I've never killed an animal with the Nosler partition in the 338 mag, so no comments.

The 225 gr Hornady and Speer Grand Slams will do most anything anywhere, except maybe the BIG Bears or Buffalo.

The 225 Barnes X, really is wonderful, never have recovered one,even from 1500 lb Brama Bulls.

The sleeper is the Federal Factory Classic 225 gr Sierra Pro Hunter.

MOA, velocity quoted at 2760 fps, and I am getting 2791 avg. The bullet is custom made by Sierra for Federal with a very hard antimony 3%+ core and a tapered jacket. It is maybe the toughest Sierra made.

I have not recovered any of these either, as they even went thru a Water Buck.

Certainly last, but not least, the 225 gr Federal TBBC at 2800+ is auwsome. Zebra,and Gemsbok, just shudder when hit, and fall over.

The 338 Win Mag is pretty much my "go everywhere do anything gun".

Todd, Allen Day summarized it well right off the bat.

Buliwyf

After looking at the Ruger M77 mk2 stainless rifle, there is no way we're getting that one. Action felt like it had sand in it. 338 is no doubt a great caliber though!

The .338 Win. Mag. is definitely one of my favorite calibers. I really like the 210 Partition but my present .338 doesn't. It does like 225 and 250 Hornady SPs. I'm probably in the minority but I also like the 200 Ballistic Tip, especially for deer sized game. I have a friend that has used the bullet on several Elk with good results as well but I go for the 225 Partition or Hornady.

I have only recently purchased a .338 Tikka, but I have focused on the 225 gr bullets as I like one load for each gun. I bought 200 of the Barnes X bullets when Midway had them on sale, and got to try out a couple of loads with them. 71 gr of IMR-4350 worked well, but 72 gr of RL-22 was even better! I was shocked to get several groups about 1/2 to 5/8 inch at 100 yards. And I had heard that X bullets often did not shoot well. I will stick with that load for this gun, I think. Previous loads with 225 gr Hornady's were almost as good.

[ 03-20-2003, 04:26: Message edited by: Calif Hunter ]

Todd, this is off the beaten path, but if the Ruger isn't a good fit for you consider the CZ 550 375H&H.

B

If memory serves me the only animals I have not shot with a 338 are Leopard and Elephant..I love the 210 Nosler and the 300 gr. Woodliegh RN bullets..the Northforks are excellent but I have not used them much and the 250 Nosler is a great bullet....I don't care for the 225 and 230 gr. bullets as they are neither fish nor fowl...I cannot abide by any of the Hawk bullets I tried, and I'm not fond of the Hornadys in the 338..The 350 gr. Sierra is a pretty good bullet but not a top choice of mine..The Swifts have not turned me on in the 338, as they expand perfectly but in a round smooth ball that does not kill as well on plainsgame as it does on Buffalo, it is OK on Buffalo...Woodleighs are awesome killers the the petals spread out wide and do a buzz saw effect on game, really a lot of internal damage..

I picked up a Ruger in blue/wood about a year ago and is the best money I have spent on a rifle in a long time. Shooting Factory remington 225 grain corelockts it is good to go on any Elk/Deer hunt i ever plan on doing, very consistent shooter and well made .Nothing done to the gun and the trigger actually needs no work in fact best Ruger trigger I have seen come out of the factory tang safety and post tang safety , pull weight is about 3 3/4 lbs and has a wee bit of creep but nothing a good gunsmith couldn't stone out.... I plan on shooting 210 partitions, 225 hornadys,225 Nosler Accubonds thru it.

I've had my M77 MKII for a few years. I like slow powders (Reloader 22, H-4831 Short Cut) much better than mid-range (RL 19 or the 4350's) because the recoil isn't so sharp. Actually, the recoil is similar to that of a similar-weight 12 gauge shotgun firing high velocity 1 1/4 oz. "pheasant loads". Not a lot of fun off the bench, but not very noticeable when shooting game.
My rifle likes Hornady bullets best. If it didn't kick too much, my pet load with a 225gr Interlock would make a good prairie dog round. For deer, I use a Speer 200 gr spire point, it expands more than the tougher Hornady. The rifle hasn't shown much of a liking for any partitioned bullet, Swift or Nosler. It will shoot Winchester Fail Safe 230 grain bullets acceptabley, however. All bullets are seated closer to the rifling than factory rounds.
Therefore, your bullet choice isn't really up to you, it's the rifle that gets to chose what it likes.

Todd, Here's my two cents. Don't use ballistic tips in a 338. If you like x bullets try them. Maybe your gun can put two or three different weight bullets at the same point of impact or close to it. I shot a deer with a 160x a couple a years ago (when they first came out) it dropped in its tracks. A nice neat quarter sized exit hole hardly any blood shot meat, nice.

I only recently began using the .338, but I like what I've seen so far!

Using a Nosler 210gr. Partition, I killed an elk with a chest shot (through the heart) at 60yds. It did not take a forward step after being hit; it just stopped, lowered its head, then fell over backwards.


I also used it to take a red deer (also using the 210gr. Partition) at 115-120yds. with one shot (taking out both lungs and the aorta.


I like it; it won't replace my .375H&H, but it's very effective.

George

Perfect shot on that elk, George. Not much meat loss, and kills fast. I shot a moose just like that a few years ago, and the 230-grain FS broke the near shoulder bone, cut through the heart's arteries (top of the heart), broke the far shoulder, then exited. This moose was 200 yards out, and had no idea I was near. It jumped a little, and dropped like hit by lighting.

But with two broken legs, it was a pain to roll the moose on its back for skinning (I use my ATV's winch).

Ain't nothing on this continent that requires that much

"kill on both ends" power!! As one of the first posters "allen day" I think talked about stopping pigs and "an old whitetail buck" using...gr bullets....he would have been just as dead with a well placed 117 grain Sierra SPBT out of a 25-06!! Same goes for the elk and the polar bear!! Don't shoot a bull in the ass with a BBgun and expect him to fall!!! If ya'll want to shoot the big guns and endure that punishment, then so be it! Give me something I can enjoy shooting!! GHD (See ya'll n church)

Just to clarify - I do not own a 338, nor does my Dad . The plan was to buy a M77 mk2 338, but the one we looked at wasn't too impressive. Sure, the gun determines the bullet used, but a guy can still have ones he'd like to try. That is why I reload.

Groundhog Devastation: There is no way I am going moose hunting in bear country with a 25-06. Besides, the .338WM is a pussycat when compared to a .416 or a .458. These two are also used in Alaska by some folks.

With my .338 and the right bullet, I can take a quartering shot without hessitation on the biggest moose around. Sometimes they don't stand still for a broadside shot.

I own a Browning Stainless Stalker in 338 Win Mag. It likes the Remington 225 Core-Lokt bullets the best, with Federal Premium TBBC 225gr close behind. It has more than adequate weight, sectional density, and velocity for flat shooting out to 300 yards/meters for the Americas and plains game. I have had offers to buy it while at the range and the answer is no. It has enough power to do just about anything short of dangerous game. That is where I pick up the 416 Rigby!
Happy Hunting,
Jeff

When you consider how many Mule deer have been killed with all kinds of 100 grain bullets from a 243 winchester it kind of makes this entire disgussion seem redundant. It is entertaining though. I do believe the 338 WM is a fabulous Elk/Big Bear caliber though.

The 338 is king in my book. 180 gr. @ 3208 and 210 XLC at 3100. Too many people swear by the 210 Nosler Partition to ignore it. A fellow up north here last year shot a large elk with his dad's handloaded 338 Winnie and 210 NP's at around 320 yds. and pancacked it. 180 ballistic tip chums a deer inside under 80 yds. As my buddy says " the 338 ain't no catch and release gun". I agree with him.

In my opinion I would take the 300 RUM over the .338 Win Mag because there isnt nothin in North America or even Africa that caliber cant take with 200-220 grain bullets. Ive owned my .300 RUM for about 3 months now and I love it. I can consistently hit pop cans at 600 yds. As for recoil I got a Slimline muzzle break installed and its no more than a .270 Win. and there isnt much more noise. I have a Leupold VX II 3 x 9 x 50mm on top and its the perfect rifle for anything from moose to varmints. And from the accuracy ive seen while shooting side by side with a .338 the .300 RUM is alot more accurate at farther distances. Good Day!

My .338 Mag Browning Composite Stalker with my Leupold 2-7 kills elk with a 210 gr Nosler Partition as though they were struck by lightning!!! My biggest to date, a 7x6 from Arizona (public land) was literally blown over. This shot was somewheres between 175 and 200 yds and the animal was huge. My load drives the 210 at 3050 fps and gives me .75 MOA accuracy. I will never be without a .338 again. In fact I've got a .300 RUM that I'm going to sell because the recoil is more severe than the .338. It's just too close in power to keep it. Anyone want to trade for a .270WSM or .270 SAUM ???

bowhuntr

TrapShooter: I fair comparison would be shooting a .300RUM next to a .338RUM.

The .338WM is closer to the .300WM, except that the .338WM benefits from heavier bullets from 230-grains to 300. The .300WM is an excellent cartridge with bullets lighter than 220 grains.

KK,
300 grs.....thanks for the heads up, thick finger problem.

Ray Alaska,
I have heard so many good things about the 230 gr. Failsafe in the 338, that I guess I'm going to have to give it a try...Ross Seyfried told me here while back that it was an awsome bullet and he has used it on about everything, including Cape Buffalo...Several others including yourself have praised it....

Ray Atkinson: I have use the 230-grain "Lubalox" coated FS with great success, but I haven't used the Molybdenum coated FS. I already ran out of the Lubalox coated ones, so I plan to use 225-grain Barnes XLC this year. I don't want to coat my rifle's barrel with Moly from the new FS bullets, at least not for now.

The closest I have killed moose with FS bullets was three years ago. This moose was barely 100 yards away, so I was a little apprehensive thinking that at such a close range a lung shot was not the best idea. I though the bullet would pass through without much resistance, but before I had reloaded the chamber for a second shot the moose was dropping on its side. It was a shot a little high through the lungs, and the moose took maybe two steps. The moose sprayed blood and covered the ground at the far side, like a garden hose. I have never seen so much blood spray out of a moose like that.

The rest of the moose I have killed have been from 200 to 300 yards. One thing for certain; A 230-grain FS out of my .338 at about 2,800 fps will break both shoulder bones on moose at 200 yards. I shot a moose that way a few years back, and the FS exited. I have only recovered one FS so far, and this one was from a quartering away shot. My hunting partner found it stuck on the hide at the far side.

All this discussion of premium bullet performance is very interesting. I have a question which is related but slightly off topic. I've never owned a .338, but I do have a .300 Winchester Magnum. I'm an avid handloader, but I tried a few 180-grain Winchester Supreme factory loads in .300 Win. Mag on paper at 200 metres. Over the chronograph, my speeds were averaging around 3,150 feet per second and I put five shots into a little over an inch. This load was rivalling my "paper-punching" load with 190-grain Sierra Matchkings! The next time I go moose hunting, I'll be sure to use this load.

So my question is: can anyone tell me about the comparable effectiveness of a load like this with one of the premium .338 loads you've been describing? I'm not about to trade in my trusty .300, but I am curious.

And I too send best wishes for the Canucks in the Playoffs!

I can see I forgot to mention that the 180-grain .300 Win. factory load in question was loaded with Failsafes.

my thoughts on the 338mag- I use 225 hornady spire points. they shoot into 3/4" at 100 yards and hit like a freight train. I had a frontal shot on a bear at 40 yards, and hit him just over the head (I was above him). the bullet traveled about two feet through his spine. there were no bone pieces larger than than your little finger, in a hole I could put my arm into. I never did find the bullet in all that mess.
the recoil is not all that bad, about what a 12 guage kicks.
all in all, a very good cartridge for large game, imho.

I shoot a 300 H&H and a 338 and have killed a lot of game with both...The 300 may best it for long range, but not enough that I can tell it..I like the 200 gr. Nosler in the 300 H&H...

I suppose when it comes down to the nut cutt'en I'll take a 338 loaded with 225 gr. North Forks or for mean stuff a 300 gr. Woodleigh RN soft and solid.....I just like the 338 better than the 300's, but thats no flame on the 300 H&H, it'll sure do the job.

The 300 gr. Woodliegh will shot through a moose, Eland or Elk from stem to stern...and make a big hole coming out...

P-17: It would be hard to come with a good comparison between a 180-grain bullet for the .300WM and a 225-grain or heavier .338WM bullet. But at least in theory, the one FS bullet with the highest SD has the potential of greater penetration. You are very lucky to have such an accurate rifle, because most FS bullets do not produce great accuracy. The .300WM, as well as the .30-06, and the .338WM are the most popular cartridges in Alaska.

Someone I correspond with from Canada gets somewhere around 1" at 200 meters with his .338's, but both rifles have custom barrels. He uses 225-grain A-Frame bullets on the heavy side, and somewhere around 180-grain bullets for deer and such. He has used the 225 grainer on grizzly with great success.

I am happy to have an accurate .300 Winchester Magnum. The best part is that I achieved this by having my gunsmith screw an E.R. Shaw barrel into my 1917 Enfield action. That Shaw barrel is one of the cheapest barrels money can buy, but boy does it shoot!

Todbartell,
Stick with the .338 Win. You will shoot things and they will fall down. Because you can actually hit with a .338 win. and there is no difference in killing powere don,t worry too much about velocity either.
The light wieght X bullets penetrate at least as good as the 210 Nosler in the real world. They also penetrate about as well as a .30 180grain Nosler.
Unless I am mistaken, penetration and killing power are why your Dad bought the .338 so step up to the pump and put a big nail under the hammer.
Recently I have stepped up to a .338 RUM (actualy 5 of us have), and we have begun experiencing messy kills with the 225 Nosler and explosive tears in game with light X bullets. The last kill was a 65lb buck shot stern to stem with a 175Grain X Bullet at 3450 fps. Heart, lungs, liver, and half of the gut bage were sprayed in a ten foot radius. This is the first messy X bullet kill we have seen (yeah it was me). Interesting enough the little fellow made it 60 yards before tipping over.
The guys that like the fast .300 Rum etc. can keep them.
Keep the bullet wieght up and the game may bounce 20-30 yards but there is almost no meat damage at .338 win velocitys.

Jamie

P-17
Accoring to a moose hunting guide that I spoke to the .338 250 combo is much more effective. to Quote him "if you get a .300 you better keep shooting." That was almost 20 years ago and I never have looked back.
That was before failsafe/X bullets ect. though.
Exellent load in your .300.

I just brought my .338 home and since I'm going to be moving soon, I'm looking for ammo over-the-counter. I've picked up two boxes of Winchester 230grn. Failsafes. As Ray mentions, Seyfried really likes them, has anyone else had any experience with them?

JLHeard,

Those 230 grain failsafes didn't shoot worth the darn in my 338 Winnie, but that was before I had some work done to it.