For those too cheap to buy the Speer bullets, I bought a bag of 100 Prvi 286gr bullets from Graf's to see how well they shoot. I was surprised to see that they have dual cannelures, I'd assume one for the X62 and one for the X74.

I bought them for practice loads, but has anyone tried them on game?

I have shot a few hundred rounds of PRVI 9.3 bullets at targets but not at game, but as far as accuracy, they are great out of both of my 9.3x62 Blaser barrels. I have tried several different charges of Varget, and all have basically printed one hole groups at 100 yards. I have only shot the bullets at 200 yards on one occasion, and I was shot one group at 1.5" and one group at 2".

I whacked a 1600 lb steer with one between the lookers at 40 yds, folded right up and didn't even twitch.
sectioned some with an end mill for yucks , quite a bit stouter than the speer.

left to right PP286, Speer 270, Norma 286, Norma 232

pic 2

pic 3

speer on the left privi on the right

Husky commercial FN 98 with Douglas barrel

Dave,

How did you hold the bullets to section them? Love the idea ... would appreciate a pointer on how to do it.

Thanks!

Hi Mike , pretty simple actually at first we just clamped them between a couple of pieces of pallet board we had kicking around the shop in the mill vice, bullets are pretty soft and the carbide end mill whips right through them, later attempts involved drilling undersized holes in two pieces of board stacked together on end a little more than the bullet lenght deep, placing the bullet / wood combo in the mill vice and cutting through both wood and bullet at the same time. Got a pic of my buddy Doug the "Lion King " sectioning a hornady 500 .458 soft point clamped between a couple pieces of wood. A quick scuff with some green scotchbrite afterwards cleans them up pretty well.

Kewl!

Will try that approach for sure.

Thanks

Jeff and Dave,
Thanks for the info, I never thought that the jacket would be that thick or tapered that much. If the core doesn't aim to squirt out this might actually be a pretty good bullet.
Dave, I guess you didn't recover the bullet from that steer's brain housing group?

Mike,
Once you get the technique figured out lets disect a Hornady sp and Nosler partition.

got pics here somewhere.
,

front to back , privi, speer, nosler partition, hornady interlock (just barely make out the interlock rings), dont recall whats on the end

Gonna be loading for the 9.3x62mm before long so keep the pics and info coming!!

til later

Made it to the range today. Belgian action in a Swedish rifle shooting Serb bullets fueled by Aussie powder from brass made by Graf knows who and fired in the hills of W.V.
(and reported on a web site owned by a fellow from the UAE)


From the bench with iron sights at fifty yards, I believe these will work for target practice and animals in the Eastern US.

Now that's data with contributions from all over the place

So who is everyone's source for these Privi Partisan 286 grain 9.3 bullets?

jr,Graf & sons

til later

A few have been used in Australia to take game. Reports I have are that they want to loose their cores on anything challenging. On fallow deer, one projectile was recovered with its core missing, on something the size of Sambar (elk sized) they'll definately tend towards the soft spectrum. No doubt they'd be fantastic broadside on even large game, but they're not a projectile to rake something heavy with and expect premium results. I'll post a link to some 9.3 projectile testing when I can locate the site.
Cheers...
Con

Con,

I'd be curious to know how they do on large game. I've been happy with the Hornady Interlock, quartering shot on a medium sized whitetail buck last year put venison in the freezer with 0 drama.

But the Prvi bullets at $32/100 look a lot better for target practice than the Hornady's at $24/50 or the Woodleigh's at $67/50.

Luckily they hit pretty close to where the rifle is zero'd. Now to decide what bullet to use for South Africa next year where the largest animal I figure to hunt is Kudu.

Rick R,
Those that use the 9.3x62 on Sambar generally feel its too soft on that sized game animal ... add to that that most animals are taken at under 100m, heavy scrub, often moving ... sounds like elk hunting doesn't it??!!
Cheers...
Con

http://www.performancebullet.no/filer/jv_okt2004.pdf
This is a translation I pulled from an Australian forum, no info on the Prvi though ... sorry!

<<A rough translation by Erik D on NitroExpress of the 9,3mm bullet test written by Alf Martin Bråten published in Jeger Hund & Våpen" October 2004.

---------------------------------------------


"IN 99 OUT OF 100 CASES, YOU WILL KILL A MOOSE WITH ALL THE BULLETS AVAILABLE ON THE

MARKET. BUT I DON'T WANT TO WAIT FOR THAT 1 EXCEPTION, SO I CHOOSE MY BULLETS CAREFULLY.

Although an old timer, the 9,3mm has not expired from age yet. We have even recently

witnessed new creations in this caliber, such as the 9,3x66, which for all practical

purposes can be compared to the older 9,3x64.

Still, the most popular variant of this caliber is the 9,3x62, and also yet another older

variant that won't give up; the 9,3x57.

With the variations in velocities attained with these different rounds, it is obviously

difficult to make bullets that work optimally in all 3. We are after all talking about a

span in velocity difference of roughly 150m/s.



The test. I gathered together 25 different types 9,3 bullets. The test dealt with

checking the expantion and depth of penetration at 15 meters with the 9,3x66 (which was

also used to represent the 9,3x64). This was to to stress the bullets to their maximum

capabilities. I borrowed a new Sako 75 from Ing. Rolf Aaberg for this. The test medium

was a stack of wet telephone catalogues with a dry catalogue put in as #2. This is a

tough challenge, as a some lead is often lost in the dry catalogue.

Next, the bullets were tested in 9,3x62 (which also was used to represent the 9,3x74R).

The test was exactly as described above, but with about 50m/s lower velocity.

Finally, all bullets were tested to find their lowest expansion distance/velocity. Study

the results. Choosing a bullet that is known to be the toughest isn't necessarily always

the best choice. Especially if using a caliber with moderate velocity.

Do not read the expansion data as absolute, but more as a guideline. If you find a bullet

that you think would be potentially interesting for your use, then try it out yourself.

Most likely you will obtain a different velocity than I did, and thus the data will not

be identical.



My choice. And I mean MY choice. I can't pick the ideal bullet for you, as you have to do

this yourself depending on which 9,3 cartridge you use, your personal wishes, and

particular needs. It's more than enough to pick my own favorites amongst the ones I

tested. My own criteria is that it will be use for general hunting, and I demand that the

bullet doesn't fragment/seperate. I prefer more penetration over expansion diameter (the

9,3 has a relatively large diameter to begin with), and I sometimes experience occasional

long shots, so trajectory is also a factor for me. Since my barrel is 18.5 inches, the

chances of finding something suitable narrowed itself down? We'll see.

To begin with I mentioned that all of these bullets will kill a moose. At least 99 times

out of 100. So when I put aside many of these bullets, it is not because they are bad.

However, since the options are so many, and I only really need one bullet, I have sorted

them quite harshly.

The first thing I did was cut out all bullets that easily loose their core. Basically,

this is all of those that aren't reinforced in some way that makes them hold together.

This leaves quite a few still, so I continue to look. To achieve a good combination of

penetration and large expanded diameter requires a high retained wight. A glance at the

tables for retained weight (and thus penetration and diameter) in 9,3x62 shows that the

number of suitable light bullets of modern construction are quite large. I find variants

here that have just as much penetration when expanded as the traditionally heavy bullets.

And since I also appreciate a decent bullet trajectory for all around use, my choices

naturally fall on the lighter bullets.

I can for example say that my trajectory criteria is that when shooting 5 cm high at 100

meters, I don't want the bullet to shoot lower than 5 cm below my point of aim at 200

meters.

That leaves me with the PBP 220 grain, Rhino Solid Shank 235 grain, Brenneke TOG 247

grain and Barnes X 250 grains (Nosler BT is already weeded out since it is prone to

seperation). If I accept a few more cm of drop at 200 meters, I can also use the Swift A

-Frame and Woodleigh Weldcore RN SN in 250 grain.

All of these are superb bullets, and are generally suitable for my demands. But from past

experience, I know that the Barnes X leaves an unwanted amount of copper fouling in my

barrel. The Brenneke TOG looses 20% of it's lead, and is also hard to get a hold of. The

Rhino has doesn't expand at lower velocities, although the importer claims that a new

slightly softer type will soon be available. And the Woodleigh could penetrate better in

My opinion.

So I am left with the PBP and the Swift. One is as good as the other. The PBP could

ideally expand at lower velocities than it does in my barrel, but it has a better

trajectory than the Swift. So that makes it a tie.

I don't care much about price, but if you are than my tip would be the Lapua Mega, which

is the tests best resulting conventional bullet. The Nosler Partion, Normas Oryx, and the

Sako Hammerhead are the tests least expensive "Super bullets".


-----------------------------------


Some additional information about the picture texts:

Trajectory: The figures are for a range of 200 and 250 meters for each of the 3 tested

cartridge, with a standard muzzle velocity and sighted in to impact 5 cm high at 100

meters.


----------------------------------


The comment text in each bullet evaluation:

"Inntr." = Penetration
"Diam." = Expanded diameter
"Restvekt" = Remaining bullet weight
"Eksp.Grense" = Distance when velocity becomes so slow that it will not expand reliably.


------------------------------------


PBP 220grain: The tests only Norwegian produced bullet. Simply a top notch hunting bullet

for the 9,3x64/66 and 9,3x62. Monometal copper.
+Strength
+Penetration
+Diameter
-Reluctant to expand when the velocity is very low.

-------

Norma Vulcan 232 grain: Conventional lead filled bullet. Holds together surprisingly

well, but can't take too much before coming apart.
+Price
-Seperation risk
-Little penetration

--------

Rhino Solid Shank 235 grain: "Semihomogeneous(semi-monometal)" South African produced

bullet with a small portion of bonded lead in the front. High remaining bullet weight and

large diameter. A little stiff at low speeds, but the producer promises a "extra soft"

variant soon.
+Strength
+Diameter
-Reluctant to expand when the velocity is very low.

-----------

Brenneke TOG: Brenneke's new generation of bonded bullets. Expands willingly in all 9,3mm

cartridges, but looses a bit of weight.
+Balanced penetration and diameter.
-Looses some weight/some shrapnel.

-----------

Barnes X 250 grain: Homogeneous/monometal bullet that gives maximum penetration combined

with a large expanded diameter. Willingly expands at the velocities of all 3 tested

calibers.
+Strength
+Penetration
+Diameter
-Often leaves a lot of fouling in the barrel.

------

Nosler Ballistic Tip 250 grains: A conventional bullet with a solid rear part of the

jacket. It has good flight characteristics, but is a little reluctant to expand at 9,3x57

velocities.
+Ballistics
+Price
-Very varying results regarding loosing lead/shrapnel.

--------

Swift A-Frame 285 grain: The bullet has a solid partion between the top and bottom in

addition to being bonded. Looses very little lead and willingly expands. A bullet that

never fails.
+Strength
+Penetration
-None that are obvious.

---------

Woodleigh Weldcore RN SN 250 grain: This Australian is bonded and is a good choice for

those who prefer expanded diameter rather then maximum penetration.
+Strength
+Diameter
-None that are obvious.

--------

Rhino Solid Shank 250 grain: The 250 grain bullet from Rhino is simply too solid and does

not give acceptable expansion. The producer promises a "extra soft" variant will be

available soon.
+Strength
-Very unwilling to expand.

(Note from ErikD: I read a similar test in a Swedish magazine published this months, and

the Rhino 250 grain got the same results as before. Which leads me to believe that they

have not released a "softer" version yet.)

--------

Speer 270 grain: A traditional lead filled bullet that is cheap and generally usable at

lower velocities. However, it is not a safe bet when bone is hit.
+Price
+Penetration
-Seperation risk


-------

Lapua Naturalis 270 grain: Earlier reluctency to expend appears to have been dealt with,

because now this bullet is impressive. It gives moderate penetration, but delivers an

unusually large expanded diameter, and 100% retained weight. The length of the bullet

does steal a little case capacity though.
+Strength
+Diameter
-Long length of bullet.


-------

Swiss Jagt CDP 286 grain: Has a constuction very similar to the Nosler Partion, but is

undoubtedly more solid. This bullet has also been made to expand more easily as the years

have passed, and does well both when it comes to penetration and diameter.
+Penetration
+Diameter
-None that are obvious.


--------

Woodleigh Weldcore PP 286 grain: Bonded bullet with "Protected Point". Gives a lot of

penetration due to not so much expansion at high velocity, but gets opposite results at

lower speeds (?!?!?). Is not very willing to expand, and is thus not very suitable for

the 9,3x57 and is even a bit too stiff for the 9,3x62 also.
+Strength
+Diameter
-Reluctant to expand
-Looses a little weight/shrapnel


--------

Nosler Partion 286 grain: An old classic that has gotten a lot of competition. The

partion between the front and rear guarantees weight retention, but generally the front

part looses all it's lead. The published retained weights include lead that is often

found together with the rest of the bullet.
+Penetration
+Price
-Shrapnel



----------

Rhino Solid Shank 286 grain: This Rhino is also way too stiff, which results in no

expansion in 9,3x62. But be patient, as a "Extra soft" variant is also promised.
+None
-No expansion


-----------

Norma Alaska 286 grain: A conventional bullet with a good reputation, but can't stand up

to the more modern bullet constructions. Does not hold together well at higher speeds or

under stress.
+Price
-Risk of seperation.


--------

Norma Oryx 286 grain: A bonded bullet that stays together very well. It is soft, which

results in a large diameter at higher speeds. Works well in 9,3x57 too.
+Diameter
+Penetration
-Some shrapnel.



--------

Lapua Mega 286 grain: Conventional lead/copper bullet with a good reputation. The jacket

has a thicker portion in the middle, which locks the core to the jacket. The test showed

good results. A lot of bullet for the money.
+Price
+Well balanced diameter/penetration
-Seperation potential


----------

Sako Hammerhead 286 grain: A bonded bullet that can handle most situations. Shows

impressive penetration and diameter. It also expands willingly at all relevant

velocities.
+Price
+Penetration
-Some shrapnel.



--------

Barnes X 286 grain: Barnes X shows once again a high level of technical qualities. The

diameter and penetration is second to none. But I have too much varied experience when it

comes to copper fouling to make it my first choice.
+Penetration
+Diameter
-Copper fouling.



--------

Sellier & Bellot 286 grain: A cheap bullet of conventional construction. Can probably

kill both moose and red deer, but the core seperates from the jacket too easily. This is

probably a great bullet to use for practice. The importer can not promise any more this

year.
+Price
-Seperation risk



---------

Partizan 286 grain: It can probably kill most things, but with a very great risk of the

core seperating from the jacket. No matter what, it's the tests cheapest bullet. You can

buy 15 of these for the price of 1 of the more expensive bullets.
+Price
-Rik of seperation



---------

Swift A-Frame 300 grain: This bullet weight is best suited for the 9,3x64/66, but I have

added the data from the 9,3x62 also. It is a bullet that works under all conditions, but

low speed and moderate BC doesn't exactly help the trajectory.
+Strength
+Penetration
-Short range bullet.


--------


Rhino Solid Shank 300 grain: This bullet is in the same catagory as the previous (Swift

A-Frame 300 grain), but this one delievers a large diameter at the cost of lower

penetration. It's need for velocity to expand reliably, and to get decent trajectory,

diqualifies it from being useful in the 9,3x62.
+Strength
+Diameter
-Penetration
Short range bullet.


---------

Woodleigh Weldcore RN SN 320 grain: Actually a bullet for the old .360NE Nr2, but works

in 9,3x64/66 as an alternative in dence bush.
+Strength
+Penetration
Diameter
-Short range bullet.



-----------------------------------------------------------

"Bråten Exclusive"

As you can see, one of the tests bullets is designed and produced in Norway. This peaked

my curiousity and interest, and resulted in me using these PBP (Performance Bullet

Production) bullets quite a lot these last few years. Both for hunting and for testing.

Thus it is my pleasure to tell you that although I quite easily picked out a couple of

favorites amongst the tested bullets, my real favorite is a slightly different variant.

Since my 9,3x62 has a 18.5 inch barrel (I sacrificed length when I put on a moderator to

keep the overall length down), I have to accept a slightly reduced muzzle velocity

compared to a more conventional barrel length. Therefore the PBP 220 grain is a little

reluctant to expand at my preferred distances. In my opinion.

This resulted in me wanting to modify these bullets so they would expand reliably at a

lower velocity. I discussed this with Kjell Tonheim at the company Arms & Ammo (who

produce the PBP), and he shortly made up a handful of bullets designed to my wishes and

specifications.

The modification was to expand the existing hollowpoint to a slightly larger diameter in

addition to making it slightly deeper. The result was a bullet that was more willing to

expand at lower velocities (longer distance), while at the same time more material at the

end of each expanded petal lessened the likelyhood that they would break off at shorter

ranges. This variation was naturally named "Bråten Exclusive" and functions perfectly in

my rifle.

So it is fully possible to have your bullets custom made if you wish. The price however

is something you'll have to discuss with Tonheim.


----------------------------------------------------------

Test Method:

I am sometimes asked if I get the correct bullet expansion by shooting at short range

with a reduced load. This in comparison to shooting at genuine distances. With reduced

velocity, there will always be a reduction in the rate of the bullet rotation, taking

into consideration that the barrel twist is the same.

I am aware of, and find this topic worth discussing, and thus I have tried out both

methods. Up till now, I have found only negligible differences.

This time I brought the Rhino 250 grain bullet with me out in the field, after having

tested it's expansion with reduced loads at short range. The short range test showed me

that expansion stopped at around 650 m/s. The BC of this bullet is .307, and if we put

this info into the computer, with a muzzle velocity of 760 m/s we will find that the

velocity will be reduced to 650 m/s at a distance of about 150 meters.

After checking that muzzle velocity was 760 m/s, I shot at a stack of telephone

catalogues at a laser measured 150 meters. The result was 2 bullets that looked exactly

the same.

There are however some variables that can create difficulties and varied results. First

of all, you must be in full control of the velocity. A variation here will give a large

difference in the end result. Secondly, the result is dependent on an accurate BC. Then

there is the fact that different test media will show varied results to one degree or

another.

The hard part though is that some bullets can produce a reasonable amount of expansion

within a rather large specter of velocities. Thus, you end up having to use common sense

when deciding if the expansion has reached an acceptable level, and this can make the

science less exact.

Finally, in regards to expansion tests with hunting bullets, I do not claim that wet

paper is the same as live flesh and blood. But it is the most easily used and practical

that that I have available. This goes for both test methods.

So with that in mind, I would say that this test method gives a good idea of what is

happening. And knowing what is happening is good to know. Remember that Norwegian law

demands that expanding bullets be used for hunting."

(note that the last picture with two Rhino Solid Shank show that these 2 bullets acted

exactly the same using both test methods: fast/long distance + slow/short distance)

Con,
He actually did review the Prvi:

quote:

Partizan 286 grain: It can probably kill most things, but with a very great risk of the
core seperating from the jacket. No matter what, it's the tests cheapest bullet. You can
buy 15 of these for the price of 1 of the more expensive bullets.
+Price
-Rik of seperation

Looks like he's already done the testing and pronounced the Prvi Partizan bullets to be good for... plinking.

Rick R,
Yeah ... missed that ... you dont actually expect anyone on an internet forum to actually read everything?!

Perhaps for driven boar etc... it'd be an okay projectile, just not a deep digger for raking shots.
Cheers...
Con