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I have 3 Kimbers and 4 Ruger rifles All have "Mauser" actions Not one grabs the cartrige ________________________________________________ Maker of The Frankenstud Sling Keeper Proudly made in the USA Acepting all forms of payment | |||
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mlguns, Looked up your MOS don't know them by heart - what unit did you serve with? Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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1/5 and 3/9 STA platoon. Don't take it personal if we don't agree. You asked if any previous SS can give their input first hand and not passed down where the information can get changed. I was assisting your post strictly sharing personal experience. Nothing derogatory towards anyone. If you look at every single post I have on AR you will not find one insult, profanity or ridicule at anyone's opinion. No matter how outlandish. As per your first photo. From MY view point is what I can comment on from limited clarity and function. Put a short video of the cycling and it will help everyone see and come to their own conclusions and understand your view point better. I do believe you that it works perfect. If the whole intent was to show the distance of movement. I see your point but there are PF actions, such as the Cooper repeator which controls the round under the feed lips until the cartridge has completely passed the length of the magazine without play and well into the chamber, superior to the 700. On a CRF the distance is not as important if the extractor captures the case rim early and has full control. I am going to bow out of your post gentlelmanly and do wish you and your peers well. | |||
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I have shot Rem. 700's most of my life. Approaching 70 now so for over 50 years. In that time I have had numerous failures to feed properly and failures to extract. Year before last I had two feeding bobbles shooting at one elk. I finally decided that all my big game hunting will be with Mauser CRF actions. I'll continue to use my 700's varmint hunting (prairie dogs mostly) but no more elk hunting with a 700. My favorite deer & hog rifle has been a Mark X Mauser in 7x57 for the last 35 years so that's already covered. PS. Never had a failure of any kind with the 7x57 and I've taken somewhere near 100 deer with it and about 20 hogs, all shot with handloads that are way over book maximums. I also have a 375 Weatherby and a 458 on Mauser actions, never had any problems with either one of those rifles either. velocity is like a new car, always losing value. BC is like diamonds, holding value forever. | |||
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Just noticed the photos in post #1. The first photo is of a CRF rifle with an improperly fitted extractor. I just went into my gun room and checked two of my Mausers. The cartridges are captured by the extractor before they have moved 3/4 of an inch. velocity is like a new car, always losing value. BC is like diamonds, holding value forever. | |||
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That is pretty amazing I have 3 other mausers all custom built and not one of them has captured the rim of the cartridge until beyond the 1/2 way point. All function just fine. I would love to see a picture of the captured cartridge under the extractor after 3/4 of an inch of movement. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I did NOT say 100% contact with the extractor. But they are captured enough to control the cartridge and extract it. In other words more extractor contact than a 700 Remington ever gets. If your Mausers are as you say, then you need to have the extractors properly fitted. For sure the one you posted a photo of needs the attention of a knowledgeable riflesmith. I don't post pictures. Too much time involved and I already have my plate full. I own 8 push feed rifles so I'm not totally against them. I'm just not going to take one on an expensive hunt anymore. I should have sworn off of them 30 years ago but was stubbornly holding onto my Rem. 700's. The 700's, Savage 110's and Winchester post '68 70's, Sako's etc. are normally very accurate. By far the majority of the rifles on the market today are push feed, but they will jam more frequently than a good CRF rifle. velocity is like a new car, always losing value. BC is like diamonds, holding value forever. | |||
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PS My extractors don't pick up the cartridge until over 1/2 way when feeding from the left side. But as soon as the cartridge clears the feed rails it pops under the extractor so it is controlled all the way. Edited to add last sentence. velocity is like a new car, always losing value. BC is like diamonds, holding value forever. | |||
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swampshooter, how often have you had a push feed jam? I've been using Rem M700 since there has been a Model 700 and I've never had a jam. Perhaps you're operating the bolt incorrectly? Aim for the exit hole | |||
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I don't doubt that for the newer ones. I can attest to that. But I bought 700 BDL in 270 in the late 60s and it's the single best rifle I've ever owned. Shot sub .5 MOA since I bought it, many 100 days / year hunting in the snow in the Rockies. Never a failure to feed or extract, shot warm loads in it (150g Partitions at 3000 fps) for over 30 years. Gave it to my son 5 years ago, he's got an elk, a nice black bear and 500 lb plus feral hog with it. Don't judge the past by the present ... Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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My thanks to Mike and all who have contributed to a very informative post. Great stuff!!!!!! 114-R10David | |||
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I have a couple of CRF rifles that feed like that one. Actually, they are not controlling the round properly, the Mauser's I have (mostly commercial FN) the case almost jumps up behind the extractor before it has moved 1/8-1/4 inch. Yours really isn't working as a CRF rifle should. I have a much-hunted Ruger 7x57 that is like yours, and had a CZ that was the same, but that don't make it right. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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Funny, I have 4 CRFS that all feed and function flawlessly and the case rim is never captured until the bolt is 1/2 way thru the length of the ejection port. I also find it interesting that folks refer to this being a function of the extractor...it is a function of the rails. The extractor does not grab the case head on any Mauser. The cartridge releases from the rails and "slips" under the extractor. Somebody please prove me wrong and show me a bolt that has moved 1/2-3/4 of an inch with case head now under the extractor. No animosity implied, I really want to see one. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Funny, I have 4 CRFS that all feed and function flawlessly and the case rim is never captured until at least 1/2 thru. I also find it interesting that folks refer to this being a function of the extractor...it is a function of the rails. The extractor does not grab the case head on any Mauser. The cartridge releases from the rails and "pops" under the extractor. Somebody please prove me wrong and show me a bolt that has moved 1/2-3/4 of an inch with case head now under the extractor. No animosity implied, I really want to see one. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Enfield vs CRF..a classic British Army poster from WWII.  | |||
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Look how late this M98 gets a good hold of the rim.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v1zRYq3ML6s and this Ruger 77 CRF is just a shocker... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J4vs3k1oTHY ...  | |||
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Oh no...say it is not so...a factory mauser and the round releases from the magazine at the 1/2 way point... ...but I guess all mine are improperly adjusted because they don't capture the round with 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZZphk6JWfQ ...oh wait...this one is bad too Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I just can't understand why there are no further comments after viewing the videos??? Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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No surprise with the Ruger. It is not a true Mauser. Nevertheless, as I am now stating for the third time, the benefit of the long Mauser extractor, including the one on the Ruger, is in EXTRACTION. And it is a huge benefit to have in both military and civilian firearms. Perhaps we should stop calling them CRF actions and start calling them positive extraction actions. And maybe the title of the thread should be changed to, "CRF - useful if you want strong, reliable extraction". . | |||
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This is pretty old discussion, been hearing this for at least 60 or more years but in those 60 or more years I have decided the control feed, "when properly timed such as Eagle 27 describe" as opposed to just wallowing out the rails and calling it good, is the better for DG and anything else for that matter. No argument here as I speak for myself and my reasoning, and I made up my mind long ago. But it bothers me not for anyone to hunt DG with a pushfeed, I just don't think its the best option. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Has the Winchester 70 hybrid extractor been a success? It seems the best of both worlds to me. I have never had a problem with the Sako Finnbear but did once jam a Mauser 98. I had neck sized some cartridges and this stopped my pushing the bolt forward. Innocently, I bumped the bolt handle, at which the cartridge jumped ahead of the tight extractor. Then, pushing the bolt home, I had this slightly large case lodged firmly in the chamber and nothing to pull it out with. | |||
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Well I only ever got long Claw extractor design actions like the M70 cause It allowed me to control the force/speed of the ejecting case....(spring plunger ejectors annoy me sometimes) I owned a few older SAko AVs with the split-lug blade ejector where I could do the same, Looking back, those SAkos never let me down!... moving to M70s was not necessary and just a waste of time and effort. | |||
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Mike this is true of the Navy at Crane and the Marine Corps at Quantaco. New non Remington 700 clones generally come with the M16 style extractor. Which can not be timed correctly to a original 700 without cutting a notch on the forward bottom right corner of the receiver where it is open on the top. This is the reason so many 700 clones come with that little notch there. Very few have adressed this issue. It is the reason the majority of the military rebuilt 700s do not add a Sako or M16 style extractor. Unless some other means of re-orienting the expelled round is worked out. | |||
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How can one compare a Marine Sniper to hunting Dangerous Game and since when has the US gov. ever been right for that matter. If I were to seek information on hunting DG then I would go to the source that does that, such as Saeed or some well know PH's such as Roy Vincent who hunts and builds rifles or a host of other such as Alaskan Master guide Phil Shoemaker (458 on AR). These are the folks that are in the know..Marines are best at shooting folks under certain condition that only recently applied to hunting and I believe that to be less than sporting, neither of which have much use for a CFR or even a second shot, or so they tell me. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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reliability under life threatening situations is the same. the military sniper has been required to engage multiple targets within short periods of times (i.e. seconds) for the last 30 years or more. don't know of any military or police sniper would say an unreliable feeding and extracting rifle would be acceptable Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Well the 303 SMLE worked OK  Two things about CRF. Firstly the amount of case rim gripped is smaller than it looks. Much that claw is a lead in. In fact the CRF extractor has to be limited because otherwise the rim would not slide under the extractor. CRF is also farm dependent on case quality and dimensions. A protruding primer is a problem. A burr on the rim. Extractor groove that is too large in diameter. As far as PF being only there for cheapness then consider the most common expensive rifles such as Weatherby, Sako, Sauer and Blaser, all PF. PF also tries to twist the case as the bolt is lifted. Notice when you pull a cork from a bottle you both twist and pull. I grew where we were chasing and shooting kangaroos and pigs. Lots of shooting in shitty conditions. Commonly used Sako, the Post 63 M70, M17s converted to 270 and M98s converted and 303/25 on SMLEs. The PFs were best. As a side note 30/30s were a poor choice as too hard to reload when bouncing around in the bak of a vehicle. On plus of the CRF I like is when spotlight shooting. You have the bolt pushed forward but not turned down. CRF lets you just pull the bolt back but PF of course needs the bolt tuned down and hence rifle is loaded and cocked. Personally I think under all conditions the most reliable system under all conditions is the in line or centreline feed PF. | |||
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What do you call a Rem 700 that will only shoot 1.5" groups at 100 yards? Winchester Match Grade ... Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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Did you guys know the 30-06 is a better caliber than the 270??  Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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| One of Us |
I guess that makes it easier to unload without a hinged floorplate. I have been looking at the M98 again and note what Michael says about the lead in. The extractor/guide rib is in fact very flexible and would easily snap over misplaced rims had Mauser made the hook thicker and steepened the angle on the front of it. Were I to convert one to a magnum, I'd consider that angle when opening out the face. There is plenty of room in the cartridge extraction cannalure, so why were they so prissy about an angle that should be irrelevant when a cartridge is fed properly? I guess it is something to do with not touching the metal ahead. | |||
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I know the point you are making but I don't think it is a really valid. The difference is the CRF is generally promoted as being better and PF is simply a cheap alternative. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Medium Bore Rifles CRF - useful if you change your mind 3/4 of the way thru = CRCYM
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