I have been working on a couple loads for this season in my 270 win. and 45-70.

The 270 was loaded with 58 gr. IMR 4831 with a 130 gr. speer boattail, remington cases and CCI large rifle primer. It was shot in a pre-64 model 70 with a 24 inch barrel, the scope is a burris 3x9. The quesiton I have is about velocity adn accuracy. I shot it through the chronograph and got 3136 for an average with a std. deviation of 11 fps. Is this too fast? I shot some regular cor-lokts off the shelf and compared cases and primers. the handloads and facotry cases looked the same. I didn't see any pressure signs. I'm just curious b/c in other firearms I don't get close to what I expect, much less more. 2nd the grouping was at about 1.7" what should I try to get it more accurate/

The 45-70 is in a ruger #1 with a 22" barrel with a 4x leupold. The throoat was lengthed so that I could seat the speer 400 gr. bullet out to the 2nd canular. The question I have is difference b/t two loads. One load is 400gr speer and is other is with the Barnes origianl 400 gr sptizer. They are both loaded with 54 grs. of RL 7. Neither displays any pressure signs. The issue is the barnes load shoots 4" higher than the speer. the speer averaged 1970 fps and the barnes avg. 2031 fps. I don't know why they are shooting so differently is this common any on got any advice?

Any advice is welcome, thanks.

another note, i shot the 2 400 gr bullets into wet packed news print. The 400 gr speer was not recovered and the barnes peeled back to the jacket and weighed about 108 grs.

The original factory-spec. MV for the .270/130 grain load was 3140 FPS. No, your load is NOT TOO FAST. Using IMR 4831 it is probably lower in pressure than if you were using IMR 4350 to get the same MV. But it does sound like your grouping could be improved. Try working up a little, and down a little, from your present load in 0.5-grain increments to see if a slight change will improve your grouping. Watch closely for pressure signs if you go up a little!! Also watch closely for a TREND in the group size. If a 0.5 to 1.0 grain change seems to be opening the group, stop and go back the other way! (My MOST accurate .270 load has been 55.5 grains of IMR 4350 with a Nosler partition 130-grain bullet, but it is not as fast as your 4831 load.)

As to your .45/70 loads, I also have a Ruger No. 1 in .45/70. What you observed between two makes of bullets is not exceptional. I found that mine is very sensitive to differences in bullet weights and velocities as far as point of impact is concerned. For example, mine shoots a hot load of a 400-grain Barnes Original SS to 24" above the POI of a 300 grain Barnes Original SS @ 100 yards!! In addition, the 400 grainer makes 1.25" groups, and the 300 is all over the target....

[ 08-09-2003, 18:34: Message edited by: eldeguello ]

With the 270 The main thing i would try is first switching types of bullets, type of bullet is the major accuracy factor, then play with the bullet seating. The powder charge is only like 5-10% of the accuracy equation. (this is all aside formt he gun itself.) For hunting bullets I would try the new accubond and interbond, for absolute accuracy nosler ballistic tip or matchkings

I have a mod 70 win featherweight that will get
1/2" groups with the Hornady 130 SST if I use
H-4350 or 1-2" groups with Imr-4831 but muzzle
velocity is only about 50 fps slower with the
H-4350. I use 55.5 gr. H-4350 over Fed 210 primers
and seat to 3.237" OAL. I worked this load up from
54.0 grains and it is about max for my rifle. Actually this bullet expands better if not at max
speeds. Even at 3,000 fps or less it will often
pass through a deer's chest but destroy everything
inside and they usually fall to the shot. The accuracy is what I want but IMR4831 is still a
good choice if you find the optimal charge weight
for your gun. You might try loading from 56.0 to
58.0 grains of IMR4831 in 0.5grain increments at
3-5 round each and find a better group but 1.7"
is too big unless it's at 300 yards. With a little
work your .270 should get less than 1" AT 100 yds.
I enjoy loading and shooting my .270 so it's not
like work to me. Also try some 140 Hornady Interlocks if you get the chance, they shoot even better in my gun. BLR7

I see the same with my #1 in 45-70. I thought that it might be due to recoil effects from different weight bullets, but since you saw different POI with the same weight bullets I wonder.

If you remember that the time the bullet is traveling down the barrel, the whole barrel is going back and up with recoil, and the barrel is also whipping in a harmonic vibration, then it is not surprising that the same grainage bullet will behave differently. The two bullets are in the barrel different lengths of time. the two bullets cause different pressure spikes adn different barrel harmonics.

In my early daze of shooting factory loads, I used to place a silvertip first in the barrel, followed by corelokts or roundnosed, with no thought of how the different grainages would hit differently. Miracle that I killed two dozen deer before I ever knew the first thing about internal ballistics.

You may find that slower velocity may make a higher impact point onthe target due to more barrel time for the muzzle to raise before the bullet exits... then again, the opposite can also be true.

have fun and keep asking...

IMR 4831 is the powder that MADE the 270, and your loads are safe...right near MAX. Mine shoots Nosler Ballistic Tips the best, but every rifle is different. In the field, the 1.7 inch group is fine for deer out to 300 yards and at that point factors not under your control will dominate the probability of a good hit anyway.

The fun accuracy game with the 270 is varmint loads in the 90, 100 or 110 gr range. The shapes and lengths of these bullets are quite different from brand to brand and Sub MOA can usually be found in 270 with some fun tinkering.

Happy hunting!

It doesn't sound to me like you are over the redline. I get about that out of my .270 with very moderate primer flattening, so I think you are getting a good full-house load going.

I'd play with seating depth with your Speers first, then if that doesn't tighten up your groups, I'd try a box of the Hornady 130 spire points (a consistently accurate and inexpensive hunting bullet). H4831 is also a great powder for the .270, but experiment with seating depth first. Usually you'll get the best results with something close to the longest OAL that will feed through the action. Usually, but not always.

Have fun--it's a great cartridge.