I'm going to be using either the Federal 150 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip or the Winchester 150 gr. Supreme Ballistic Silvertip in my 300 WSM for Dall's Sheep next year. I've had good success with the 150 Winchester SBST on gemsbok and kudu. Both show a muzzle velocity of 3300 fps.

Anyone feel like the Federal is the better bet?

I won't be considering a 180 gr. round.

The bullet in both cases is the same basic ballistic tip so use whichever shoots best in your rifle.

Kensco
I would use the load that shoots best at 300 yards.

In my opinnion 150 gr. bullets are to fragile for the 300's and I have seen a bunch of them blow up, including the ones you mention especiall at close range...if I was going to use 150 gr. bullets then I would cover my bet with a WW failsafe or a Nosler partition...

Just because you have had good luck with them in the past is no guarentee they will not let you down sooner or later, that has been my experience.The light bullets work fine 95% of the time, its that other 5% and murphy that ruins an expensive hunt..

The other factor is the 150 gr. bullet loses its velocity faster and the 165 and 180, even the great 200 gr. bullets will leave it behind as the distance gets further and the killing power of the heavy wind resistant bullets is also a consideration....

After years of experimenting with various .308 calibers I've reached the conclusion that the best bullet by far at any reasonable hunting distance is the 180gr Nos Part. What most don't realize is that even though lighter bullets start out faster, over long distances, the heavier bullets retain velocity better and in some cases may actually have a higher velocity at say 400 yds than the lighter bullet. Not to mention retained energy. Also if you actually calculate the difference in trajectory it is miniscual compared to what you're giving up in bullet integrity. You may want to check that out in the Federal cart tables. I see no advantage to using 150gr bullets in any 308 cal cartridge for big game. If you want to shoot light bullets with a very flat trjectory you'd be better off with the 25/06 or 270 and save on the big bag for nothing in return. Good luck.

I don't use bullets that are lighter than 180 grs. in any .300 magnum. There's no reason to. The 180s have a higher ballistic coefficient, greater sectional density, and they deliver more energy at all ranges. The 150s start out faster, but if you look at the drop and energy numbers downrange (where the game is) instead of at the muzzle, you'll see that the 180s offer a great deal more performance. The one Dall's sheep I shot at just over 200 yds. with a 180 Nosler Partition out of a .300 Win. Mag. dropped instantly, and without fuss.

Besides, Dall's sheep country is grizzly bear country, and if push comes to shove and you need to sort things out with a big bear, you'll be glad you're loaded with 180s instead of 150s.

AD

To answer your question as asked:

(""I'm going to be using either the Federal 150 gr. Nosler Ballistic Tip or the Winchester 150 gr. Supreme Ballistic Silvertip in my 300 WSM for Dall's Sheep next year. I've had good success with the 150 Winchester SBST on gemsbok and kudu. Both show a muzzle velocity of 3300 fps.

Anyone feel like the Federal is the better bet?

I won't be considering a 180 gr. round."" )

My advice to you would be, to go with the Winchester 150gr Ballistic Silver Tip.
First reason being, it's a little bit tougher than the regular BT.
Second reason, well since you're not going after an 800 to 1000 pound animal here and since you said you wouldn't be considering a 180gr. Round, I'll not try to talk you into that.
Granted sheep are tough little critters, but not that tough.
The 150 Ballistic Silver Tip should do you and the sheep just fine.

Below: FWIW
Explaination of two type of Ballistic tips has been copied from Nosler's own site.

The Ballistic Tip� Hunting bullet's polycarbonate tip resists deformation in the magazine and initiates expansion upon impact.
Fully tapered jacket and special lead alloy core allows controlled expansion and optimum weight retention at all practical velocity levels.
Heavy jacket base acts as a platform for large diameter mushroom.
Ballistically engineered Solid Base� boat tail configuration combines with the streamlined polycarbonate tip for extreme long range performance.

CT Ballistic Silver Tips;

In hunting weights, jackets have been thickened and cores hardened to blend generous expansion with judicious penetration-ideal for light and medium game at extended ranges.

[ 07-16-2003, 23:00: Message edited by: Marsh Mule ]

Pathfinder and Allen Day,

I think you are both off a little in relation to this specific caliber and factory loads. In the Winchester the 150gr round starts out at 3300 fps and is still going at 2218 fps at 500 yards. The energy is 3628 ft-lbs at the muzzle and 1638 at 500 yards.

In comparison, the Winchester 180 gr. Fail Safe leaves the muzzle at 2970 fps and is running 1932 fps at 500 yards. The energy is 3526 at the muzzle and 1493 at 500 yards.

The 180 gr Winchester Power-Point comes a little closer to the 150 gr. round. Velocity is 2970, and 1987 at 500. The energy is 3526, and 1578 at 500 yards.

Neither 180 round matches the 150 gr. at any range between 0 and 500 in either velocity or energy.

I have the same concern as Atkinson expresses, but I've just never had a problem in my own experience.

Thanks Marsh Mule. I'm going to probably stay with the Winchester offering. I was disappointed in Dallas this past month when I went to buy the 150 gr. Federal round, just to try it out. It was unavailable at six different gun stores, including Bass Pro.

I'm with Ray, 150 gr are 'ok' but only if they are partions, Swifts, or Barnes X bullets.

But also remember, game is killed with bullet placement, AND bullet construction.

A 180 Fail Safe is a lot more bullet than a 180 gr Power Point anyday.

If you insist on the 150 gr, try some 150 Fail Safes or Federal Trophy Bonded Bear Claws.

[ 07-17-2003, 21:22: Message edited by: Terry Blauwkamp ]

The TBBC was what I originally heard the Federal 150 was going to be. I was disappointed that it wasn't. Since I'm going to have to shoot factory ammo, if anyone knows another 150 gr round that is available please let me know and I'll check it out.

Ken
www.gun-test.com/ (go to Tools and Techniques, then Ammo) has a comparision of several bullets in the .300 win mag which should give you a good idea about the .300 wsm. A real eye openner.

I wasn't able to follow your lead. Couldn't find Tools & Techniques. Matter of fact when I hit on all the gun and ammo links I found nothing related to guns or ammo.

What am I doing wrong?

The 150 gr BST will certainly take sheep but you will have to be patient in waiting for a broadside or slight quartering away shot. Winchester is now loading the 180 gr Ballistic Silver Tip in .300 WSM at mv 3050 fps. Unless you are absolutely decided on a 150 gr bullet you might shoot a few groups with the 150 and 180 BST and go with the one producing the best accuracy.

In my tests of 180 gr BSTs in wet newspaper, the core and jacket could not be seperated even after an impact at 50 ft. Does anyone know if the BST is a bonded core bullet?

Both bullets are EXACTLY the same, only difference is the color of the poly tip. If you want a tougher version, the Accubond is your answer.

John S, according to Nosler there is a difference in the common Ballistic Tip and the Ballistic Silver Tip. The Ballistic Silver Tip has a thicker jacket and harder lead alloy core.

I starting thinking there must be a difference last deer season when a hit a doe quartering away at less than 50 yds with a .300 WSM 150 BST Win factory load and the bullet exitted between her forelegs. I am glad Nosler confirmed my suspicion.

I tested the 180 Ballistic Silver Tip, 180 Sierra Game King, and 190 Sierra Match King in wet newspaper at 50 ft, 300 yds and 600 yds. The Ballistic Silver Tip is the only one that did not have a core seperation at any range. The BST jacket and core could not even be seperated by pulling, pushing, twisting, etc.

Still, if I had the option of only the 150 or 180 BST I would load the 180 if accuracy between the 2 were exactly the same.

[ 07-28-2003, 08:12: Message edited by: RuffHewn ]

RH-
I think if you'll go back and re-read their write up you will see they are doing the same things to both bullets in the "hunting" grade of BTs. The "varmint" models have different jacket thickness and core hardness. At least that is how I interpret it! I've killed several head of deer and antelope with both versions and still find their design to be too fragile for use in a magnum. I'll stick with the partitions for now, but intend to give the Accubonds a try this fall.

I would shoot whatever is best for your rifle.

John S
Ruffhewn is right.
If you'll re-read my post above, the descriptions of the Ballistic Silver Tip and the regular Hunting Ballistic Tip are taken directly from Noslers web-site.

[ 07-28-2003, 23:30: Message edited by: Marsh Mule ]

MM-
I went back and read your earlier post and then Nosler's own description. Might use a few different wordings but my own experience still tells me they aren't any different. I still maintain the only difference between these bullets is that the CTS edition has Lubalox coating and a silver grey colored poly tip. They're trying to sell basically the same bullet under two labels so they surely will use a somewhat different descriptive writeup.
In any case, they now have the Accubond which should be head and shoulders above these. I have been trying those out in my 270 and 300Wby and accuracy is every bit as good as the others. After a couple of deer and elk this fall I might know a little about what they do on game!

[ 07-29-2003, 00:45: Message edited by: John S ]