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Earlier this year I picked up a Remington 700 Classic in 7x57. I believe it was the first year of the annual caliber for the Classic in 1981. It wasn't in a box, but it didn't appear to have been fired much, if at all. 22" barrel. I've had it to the range a half dozen times this year trying to find a 160g bullet that it likes. I'm getting consistent 1.5 groups with Partitions, TSX, and Speer 160's. I've tried 4350 and RL19. Looking for advice, should I bump down to some 140's or 150's and see if the barrel twist is better suited? Thanks. | ||
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Carefully consider that you may wish to float the barrel and glass bed the action. It's a very fine gun so be advised that altering it may not be the best thing. If it were mine it'd be done in a heartbeat!! /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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Yup - forgot to mention that I had Hill Country Rifle in San Antonio do their accuracy package on it. I got it back from them with a target and a 1/2 group, shot with Federal factory ammo loaded with 140g Trophy Bonded. I wanted to shoot heavier bullets in it, so I've been working on 160's. Ready to give in and go to 140's. | |||
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You might first try floating the barrel temporarily by putting enough layers of electrical tape under the action fore & aft of the mag box till the barrel is floating. Then shoot the same ammo that you shot before ( hope that you kept the old targets ) & determine the effects of floating the barrel. If that shrunk the groups then float the barrel by removing that little hump in the bottom of the barrel channel at the end of the forearm.  Doug Humbarger NRA Life member Tonkin Gulf Yacht Club 72'73. Yankee Station Try to look unimportant. Your enemy might be low on ammo. | |||
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I have had excellent results(1" 3 shot groups) in my FN commercial long throated using 48.5 grains h4350 and 150gn Partitions @2720fps. This would be too hot in a weaker action but less than max in a modern one. I have noticed that mine shoots better with bullets seated longer than SAAMI specks. capt david  "It's not how hard you hit 'em, it's where you hit 'em." The 30-06 will, with the right bullet, successfully take any game animal in North America up to 300yds. Get closer! | |||
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Try H414 and the 160 Nosler or North Fork bullet at 2750 fps. I've had better luck with H414 in the 7x57 followed by IMR 4350. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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40 grains of IMR 3031, with a large rifle primer has tightened up a lot of inaccurate 7 x 57s in my experience... and the suggestion has lead to me receiving emails back, on how well it worked in their rifles... It worked wonders on two Rugers I have that are real finicky.. but they sure like that load so much, I use it with 175 grain bullets down to 139 grain bullets... | |||
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Hey Gus, Since the rifle is capable of 1/2" accuracy - if it was mine - the last thing I'd do is mess with the rifle. Sometimes a rifle just doesn't shoot a specific bullet "weight" as well as it does others. I've also had rifles where I wanted to use a specific weight, but had to use something different. Try a box of 130s, 140s, 145s, 150s or 175s with some H414. The H414 "might" even get the 160s shooting a bit better for you. Best of luck to you. | |||
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gusbus, I shoot the Classic in 7x57 too. I load 44gr of IMR 4064 with the 140gr TSX,Accubond,Ballistic Tip and SST(139) for one hole groups at 2800fps. In the 160gr TSX I load 46gr of H4350 at 2500fps with one hole groups. Howard Dietz did his "accurising" and it sure helped with consistency. In the lighter TSX, 120gr, I load 43gr of H4895 at 3000fps and one hole groups. All these loads can probably be loaded hotter but for game around here it is senseless. About the only powder that Classic has'nt liked is the Varget. 2 moa is about as good as I can get with it. I like the 4064 because it gets me the velocity I want with excellent accuracy. Good luck. Perry | |||
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Also, The Federal ammo is loaded WAY down for older actions. Over my chrony I clocked it at 2300fps. As far as twist goes the 160TSX is LONG and my Classic stabilizes it just fine. Perry | |||
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Thanks guys, I'll pick up a can of H414 and some 140's. | |||
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I use 44grs of IMR4350 behind a 175gr Nosler Partition for my custom Mauser. It shoots less than an inch consistently for 3 shots. Very slim barrel. Moves when it heats up. It's on a 1909 action and was built with 175gr bullets in mind. Used it for plains game in Zimbabwe 3 years ago and had no trouble with Kudu out to about 250yds. In my opinion the 7x57 was designed for 175gr bullets. SCI Life Member NRA Patron Life Member DRSS | |||
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I have no idea what the twist rate of your Remington is, however, I know that my CZ 550 American has a twist rate of 1x8.66, a Ruger has a twist rate of 1x9.5 and a Winchester has a twist rate of 1x10. My rifle with the 1x8.66 is the common European twist for the 7x57mm. That twist rate stabilizes the longer bullets, which generally means the more heavy 7mm offerings. In my rifle's case, I shoot only 160 grain Nosler Partitions and 162 grain Hornady SSTs. The only powder I have used is H414. The Ruger I once owned loved the Hornady 154 grain bullets and a friend's Model 70 Featherweight XTR in 7x57 loves the 140 grain and 150 grain Noslers. My buddy's rifle would shoot shotgun patterns with 140 grain bullets and H414, but put some H4350 behind the bullet and it was a half inch shooter. My current 7x57mm, the CZ will shoot honest to goodness half inch groups with the SSTs scooting out of the barrel at a chronographed 2,815 fps with the H414 powder. One day I shot a group which measured .216 inch center to center off of a sandbag rest. The barrel on my rig is 23.6 inches long. My brother owns a CZ 550 Full Stock in 7x57mm and it loves H414 powder, but hates the 162 grain Hornady SST bullets. However, stoke it with 160 grain Nosler Partition and it will keep three slugs inside a three-quarter inch circle all day long. His friend has an identical rifle in the same caliber, but it likes 162 grain Hornady SST. Go figure. Tom Purdom | |||
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I had one of those 7x57 classics years ago. Wish I still had it. It shot extremely well with 140 Nosler Ballistic Tips and 150 Nosler Partitions. I believe they were both max loads of IMR4350. | |||
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I think that the 140 gr. Accubond is the ideal bullet for that caliber. The only easy day is yesterday! | |||
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IIRC, Remington used a 1 in 10" twist rate for the 7x57 Classic. My choice for powder in that cartridge is W-760. H414 and W-760 are just different lots of the same powder, same powder yet different so load data is technically not interchangeable. I have three rifles in 7x57, a custom Mauser, a Winchester XTR Featherweight and a Ruger #1A The Mauser is a .75" rifle with factory Winchester ammo with the 145 gr. bullet. The Ruger is a 1.0" gun with the same ammo. The M70 however is the star of the show. With one exception, it shoots everything into one inch or less, and mostly less. The only bullet it hates is the Winchester 150 gr. Power Point bulk bullets. Come to think of it, the Mauser and Ruger hate it as well. I weighed a bunch of them and while the average weight was right at 150 gr., there was a plus or minus one full grain of weight. Total garbage, not even good for plinking. The most accurate bullets so far are the 140 gr. Nosler Ballistic tip and Sierra pro-Hunters and Game King on the light end and the Sierra 170 gr. round nose which sadly Sierra dropped maybe 5 or 6 years ago. I have five boxes, well four and half now, and they group into .375" as do the 140 gr. bullets. I have two boxes of 160 gr. Speer Hot Cores to try. Frankly, I see no need for a premium bullet in the 7x57 as with most bullets, velocity won't exceed 2800 FPS. I dunno if this will help, but seat a 160 gr. bullet out until it contacts the rifling, then turn the seater down about a turn to a turn and a half. keep seating the bullet a hair deeper until you find the spot where the rifle shoots the bullet the best. Like my rifles, I'd be willing to bet your rifle has the standard long throat designed for 175 gr. round nosed bullets and the fairly long jump may be part of the problem. Try either W-760 or H-414 and carefully work up the load. The 7x57 is horribly underloaded by the factories and you can say the same for the data in the manuals. It is one of my favorite cartridges. Paul B. | |||
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A 7x57mm was my very first hunting rifle many many moons ago. Since then I've settled on a Winchester M-70 Featherweight and a stack of Mannlichers, all in 7x57mm. Discovered the underloading thing years ago and switched to Norma ammo, before I learned to reload, since then my 7mm performance has improved dramatically via handloading. One big surprise has been that all of my 7x57s do better with heavier bullets, 160 grains and heavier. While shooting a little Mannlicher-Schoenauer carbine that had refused to group 140 grain slugs inside an inch and a half, I tried 160 grain Noslers and the groups dropped to three quarter inch. I am still not satisfied with my 7x57 performance, so work will go on using IMR4350, H414, and N204. On the other hand (after checking my records), on it's first time out in Texas that M70 took four deer with those "weak" 140 grain R-P cartridges, all one shot kills too. There is nothing but praise in my heart for the 7x57mm. LLS Mannlicher-Collector  | |||
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Funny,After a rotten war like this,how hard it is to leave- Duncan Grinell-Milne | |||
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Be careful with some of these hot loads for the 7x57. I have a feeling the Rem may not have that long throat like the CZ's and Rugers do. My old Model 70 certainly didn't and the loads for it in my Ruger were 150fps+ slower, so a major difference in the amount of powder needed. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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My old Steyr Mod M likes the 140gr Sierra pro hunter w/ IMR4064. 2900'/sec and sub MOA. You may want to give this combination a try. Regards, Rick John Deer tractors and Sako rifles....just doesn't get much better. | |||
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It's a misconception that a fast twist will only shoot heavy bullets good and overstablize lighter ones. I have more then one fast twist caliber and they shoot lighter bullet more the just good. Pick a bullet and weight you like and want and try them. It is true that most the 7x57's are throated for longer heavier bullets so the closer you can load to the rifling the better some of them will shoot. There are those that do take the long bullet jump into the rifling and shoot quite well. Max | |||
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Norma cases, Fed 210 43 grains Norma 202 powder and a 175 grains Hornady Interlock. Works wonders.. /C | |||
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For deer-sized game, the 140-grain bullet is plenty. However, I believe the twist in that rifle is fast enough to do good work with all bullets up to 175-grain. One of my most accurate 7X57mm loads is the Nosler 150-grain BT with 50 grains of IMR 4350 and Fed 210 primers in R-P cases. MV is right at 2700 FPS from my 22" Ruger No. 1A barrel.  "Bitte, trinks du nicht das Wasser. Dahin haben die Kuhen gesheissen." | |||
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Try the 140 grain NPs. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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There's certainly nothing wrong with this line of thinking. However, when used with lighter bullets, the 7X57mm is no different in performance compared to any similar diameter bullet of like weight and construction driven at comparable velocities from some other cartridge case..... A 150-grain Nosler partition bullet at 2800 FPS from a 7X57mm performs the same as a 150-grain bullet at the same velocity from a .270 Win or .280 Remington. The .008" difference in bullet diameters has no influence on terminal performance at all. "Bitte, trinks du nicht das Wasser. Dahin haben die Kuhen gesheissen." | |||
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Aah Deguello.....at times you amaze me and in this diatribe you are dead on target. The 7mm is actually IMHO a 140gr lover and as such, my 7mm Mauser loads comprised of IMR4064 with a nice 140gr sierra atop. My old Steyr Mod M loves this mix.....pretty fast too.....2920'/sec....Well fast enough that the dead deer don't care. Regards, Rick. John Deer tractors and Sako rifles....just doesn't get much better. | |||
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ALF. I'm inclined to agree with you. However, I think you do the American bred 7x57 a bit of a disservice.. My Winchester M70 Featherweight does have a 1 in 10" twist rather than the faster twists of European rifles, but guess what? it shoot the 170 gr. Sierra round nose bullet into .375" all day long. I'm still trying to increase the velocity a bit, but they do the original 2300 FPS of the early stuff like Bell shot. I'd like to speed that up a tad, but Sierra dropped those bullets from their line about 5 or 6 years ago, so I have to be careful with my hoard. I would like to reach a reasonably accurate load of about 2500 FPS with that bullet for hunting elk. My rifle is a real sweetheart regarding accuracy. So far, the only bulet it won't shoot worth a damn is the 150 gr. Winchester Power Point bulk bullets. I've found in weighing 100 of them, that there is a plus of minus one full grain from the mean weight of 150 grains which I find totally unacceptable. The Hornady 175 gr. round nose bullet is also an under one inch bullet in my rifle, but that gun will not shoot any 175 gr. spitzer worth a damn. That's OK, I'll use them in my .280 Rem. which absolutely loves them. I also have a Ruger #1 and a custom FN Mauser in 7X57. The Mauser is used strictly with the 145 gr. Winchester factory load so far. I think the twist rate is also 1 in 10" on that one, although it might be 1 in 9.5". I haven't done very much with the Ruger since I got it back from Ruger. It had a very bad barrel with a 2.5" long throat and would not shoot anything resembling groups. Ruger replaced the barrel and now it does show promise. My problem is too many projects and too little time. The more I shoot the 7x57 the more I like it. Paul B. | |||
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For Paul B and ALF. When you guys get my age and have monkied with the 7MM Mauser as much as I have.....you will be even more impressed. Those that say it is the "ballistic twin" of the 7mm-08 just make me laugh. I present my pride and joy, Steyr Mod B, set triggers 1/2 stock purchased many years ago. It has the factory mounts/rings and a fine Zeiss 3-9-40 atop and has taken game from elk to Roe Deer on 3 continents. She is retired now cause the darn thing is too valuable to take afield. Besides, I'm having fun building custom Mausers.....next up.....a 7MM Ackley! Regards, Rick.  John Deer tractors and Sako rifles....just doesn't get much better. | |||
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Oh, I forgot to add, the 7mm Mauser has more Elephant kills than all the other cartridges combined for all time.....not a fair comparison, however, at the turn of the century there wasn't a more leathal bolt action rifle on earth! Also if you look at the picture of Jack O'Connor on last years Midway catalog.....he's holding his wife's 7mm Mauser not a .270. Nuf said. Regards, Rick. John Deer tractors and Sako rifles....just doesn't get much better. | |||
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gsbus, In my 7x57 I like H414 and 160 grain Accubonds. They shoot beautifully and this load can do whatever you want with a 7mm Mauser. I have tried many different combo's and I keep coming back to this one. ALF, Nice 7x57's. Does Musgrave still manufacture rifles? BigBullet "Half the FUN of the travel is the esthetic of LOSTNESS" Ray Bradbury https://www.facebook.com/Natal...443607135825/?ref=hl | |||
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A ton of good advice and information from other members. For baseline accuracy testing, I always use Sierra bullets, usually with the respective "accuracy load" listed in their manual. This should give you a good indication of accuracy potential with your rifle in this bullet weight. | |||
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ALF Those are all beautiful rifles, especially the BRNO style with DST's and butterknife bolt handles! My current batch of 7X57mm's consist of a Mannlicher Schoenauer carbine, a Ruger No. 1A, a Ruger M77 (old style), and a Venezuelan FN Mauser Model 1924. ALL have long throats, and the Ven. and M/S are rifled 1/8.75", the Rugers 1/9.5". I realize that quick-twist rifling often will not shoot the lighter bullets too well, but ALL these do, and also do very well with the 160 and 175-grain. I have "standardized" on the 175-grain Nosler Partition bullet with 54 grains of RE 22,in R-P cases with Federal 210 primers. This is an excellent load in all four rifles, but I have begun to fool around with the Remington 150-grain PSPCL with 50-52 grains of IMR 4350 for the Mannlicher-Schoenauer. The reason for this is I think the 175 NPJ is overkill for whitetail deer.     Now, however, I've gone 'round the bend' slightly, and am using my recently-completed .73-cal Jaeger flintlock for all hunting. It fires a .735", 600-grain pure lead round ball at 1500 FPS with 150 grains of Swiss FFg.......   "Bitte, trinks du nicht das Wasser. Dahin haben die Kuhen gesheissen." | |||
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ALF, You have to be proud of that very fine collection of 7X57's. Thanks for sharing. I only have 3, a Mod. 98 sporter and 2 Winchester Fetherweights but, I'm still hoping to find a Mannlicher-Schoenauer carbine one day. Heck, I'd even like to find a CZ so chambered. | |||
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Joe Dean: A gent who posts fairly regularly on his forum said he might be willing to part with his CZ 550 Full Stock in 7x57mm a few months ago. He posts as Thomas Jones. You might do a search and private message him. Also, there was a dude in Minn. who had a stockpile of new fullstock CZ 550s who was selling them for a damn good price. | |||
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First, thanks Alf for making my Steyr look like a piece of junk....rolleyes.....next for jnemmers (tough handle) accuracy only? Please check out this pic from 4 weeks ago....Sierra bullets are deadly too!  John Deer tractors and Sako rifles....just doesn't get much better. | |||
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Sierras work good for deer, but they are not hard to kill with almost any rifle. They may be the best for normal deer hunting. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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