quote:

I can't imagine that milling is the simplest thing to do, considering all the thousands of front box sections that have been cut, moved, bent, rewelded, and the reworked ramps and the many custom made billet/cast pieces that are available today...but 40 thou off the rear and 50 thou off the front just isn't all that much considering the box is steel and the walls appear to be twice that thickness.

Hopefully you'll post this on the Gunsmithing forum so that you'll get a professional answer - though a few individuals already participating on this thread meet that qualification.

I couldn't tell you whether its easier to weld new pieces on the front or rear of the magazine box before or after the box has been reamed to the needed dimensions. All I can offer is the results of some conversations with my gunsmith - that being, 'when lengthening take the maximum length to the rear possible before lengthening to the front' - at least something along those lines.

I understand the cost issue. Good luck...

Thanks again, Jim...I will do that. That tip is good to know.

I did strip my 8mm and measured the thicknesses plus too a good look all around. Front = `0.078 and rear = ~0.116 average along 5 points...top, bottom, L - R and center on each. Thinning by half would give a total of ~3.41-45" opening...well beyond the 3.34" amount bandied about.

I did check a few mauser forums and one had a very good picture of it being done. I have several long end mills that will work so I will do the 8mm...already thinking about doing a 375 Ruger and also looking at the RUM and Rigby cases for wildcats...after all, I've already did a M77 Ruger in my 50 Rigby wildcat.

A larger volume case, with commensurate length and slightly lower pressures make for higher velos which translate into higher energies much quicker than just going to a heavier bullet.

There are several other possibilities I will look into as there are also caveats with the ramp being the lower recoil lug abutment and mucking about there too much could be hazardous to my health.

Not being a professional machinist/gunsmith but coming up with an "alreadybeendone" answer that is essentially correct makes a guy feel like Alz-Hymer hasn't got his hands on my azzz quite yet. LOL

Sometimes you can find one like the persian I have that was re-worked by FN years ago to accomodate a 30-06. Problem solved. Another alternative that few seem to consider is that a stamped trigger guard/mag box is slightly larger due to the thinner metal. If a guy wanted to do a rifle on the cheap that would be a workable option with little alteration needed. Also a stamped box could be lengthened with the simplest of supplies, a hacksaw, a little sheet metal and some silver solder would just about do it. Depending on bullets used and seating depth there may not be any alteration needed at all except for feeding purposes.

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:
[QUOTE] 'when lengthening take the maximum length to the rear possible before lengthening to the front' .

I agree completly with that because when you lengthen toward the front then you start fiddeling with altering the feeding ramp which can lead to serious feeding problems. The less you have to alter the forward feeding ramp the better.

quote:

I agree completly with that because when you lengthen toward the front then you start fiddeling with altering the feeding ramp which can lead to serious feeding problems. The less you have to alter the forward feeding ramp the better.

I'm all for removing metal in the rear of the box. Just make sure you check and alter the bolt stop and ejector to allow for more rear movement of the bolt.

Hey, western...that is absolutely a great idea.

I had blown off the stamped trigger guard as being garbage, but I had thought about cutting off the steel box leaving a 0.100" lip and forming a box out of 0.040" - 0.050" shim material then TIGing it on.

Your idea is much better. I will look into a stamped piece. No "button" on the stamped one also leaves room for extension to the rear also, even tho' there's not a whole lot of room for mucking about.

I'm just going nutz right now with three other projects waiting for various pieces and parts, the weather so cold I can't get into my unheated garage and my lathe so cold the stiction causes a ton of problems. I tend to get forum happy when this is going on...my bullet mold is due early next week, plus the other pieces and parts and the weather will be better also...I will be too busy to bother folks when that happens. Hahahaha

Reality and economic wise, I wouldn't do another military mauser...I would certainly buy one if I could find a reasonably priced one(NO chance of that)...A CZ 416 Rigby or a 375/416 Ruger is not much more(if any) price wise, than any of the converted M98's I've seen lately...and a he**ofalot easier and quicker to obtain.

Prices at $1300 for a CZ and $850 for a Ruger on Bud's are hard to beat even with an already converted action needing only a barrel, chamber, guard mods and bluing.

I have more big bores than I can afford to shoot now, and I just added/built another...the only thing I need now is a good cheap double.

How about trying the Centurion Mauser 98 Commercial Hinged Trigger Guard for $78.80, available from Numerich Gun Parts Corp: http://www.gunpartscorp.com/ad/881550.htm#881550B
It’s sufficiently inexpensive, made of steel, and would give you the features you’re looking for.
I have a similar one in aluminum and just may have to purchase a new one in steel.

Also should note, the Centurion bottom metal (if true to photograph) has the shorter nose like the '09 Argentine so if you're using a stock already cut for the typical long-nose M98 milsurp bottom metal you need to fill in the gap.

Thanks Jim...Don't know how I missed that...I crawled all over Numerich's site for mauser trigger guards...that part never came up. Found a couple of ugly stamped parts, tho'.

Had the same problem before with Gun Parts...found a 50 cal barrel one day and went back the next and couldn't find it again...then someone on a 50 cal forum posted he bought a couple and there were several more available...something like $117 each...on the same day I was looking the second time.

It DOES have the longer 3.34 or more opening??? does it???? If so I will get one ordered as soon as I know for certain.

quote:

It DOES have the longer 3.34 or more opening??? does it???? If so I will get one ordered as soon as I know for certain.

I saved the item number a couple of years ago and completely forgot about it. Id found it after I'd purchased an aluminum bottom metal with 3.4" mag box (it actually measured 3.415" internally) and trigger bow floor plate release.


I can't verify whether Item #881550B has a 3.4" mag box because I haven't purchased one yet. If I can't find my extra '09 Argentine bottom metal I'll be purchasing one though.

I'd recommend phoning Numerich to verify the internal length of the box.

I emailed them and it's the first thing on my to-do list for AM tomorrow if you weren't sure, just for sure-zeez. Thanks again

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:
Hey, western...that is absolutely a great idea.

I had blown off the stamped trigger guard as being garbage, .

I have about a dozen sporters made up from millsurp Mausers and I believe two of them wear the stamped TG. To tell you the truth they look BETTER than a couple of my less worked on milled trigger guards and function just as well. I would rather have it than a blind box with a plastic trigger guard for sure. It is really not such a bad option when you think about it. I think they just have a bad rap cause most folks dont want "lesser" parts on their custom rifle. But I think some of the milled ones are pretty much butt ugly myself. YMMV.

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:

I'm just going nutz right now with three other projects waiting for various pieces and parts, the weather so cold I can't get into my unheated garage and my lathe so cold the stiction causes a ton of problems. I tend to get forum happy when this is going on...my bullet mold is due early next week, plus the other pieces and parts and the weather will be better also...I will be too busy to bother folks when that happens. Hahahaha

.

Man you sound like me. Too many irons in the fire for my own good..

Roger that...cabin fever turns my mind to mush or makes me hyper active...extra vitamin D helps.

I get some "cleanup" work done occasionally...reloaded some 8mmx57, 9.3x62 and half dozen each 50 Rigby with two bullet weights...and a few more bullet designs drawn up. Not a total waste but almost.

Can't get a line to Numerich for the trigger guard information...raining...whining...dark thoughts...see what I mean...DAMMMMMMMM

I think the .338 Federal would be a great cartridge for something like this. It would fit in the standard Mauser action with room to spare for long bullets and with no magazine or action alteration required.

Not trying to change your mind, just mentioning.

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:
Larry Root, the Herpes-Simplex of the internet....

That made me laugh.

Definitely...lots of jumping up and down over that one...

Or, the 338 RCM...basically the same ballistics as the 338-06, argumentatively speaking. Easy 3000 fs with a 200 gr depending on which bullet, throating, COAL, ETC.

I built my 338-06 back in the mid 60's but today I would do the RCM, especially on a shorter action, and not look back.

Mausers might need a bit of action massaging, I don't know...I would have done a WSM cased wildcat except I couldn't find the right excuse, and my toy just shot so well I didn't want to mess with it.

quote:

Or, the 338 RCM

I just hate those short cases in a mauser.

quote:

Or, the 338 RCM...basically the same ballistics as the 338-06, argumentatively speaking. Easy 3000 fs with a 200 gr depending on which bullet, throating, COAL, ETC.

I built my 338-06 back in the mid 60's but today I would do the RCM, especially on a shorter action, and not look back.

200 grain at 3000 fps is what the 338 Win Mag was rated for its first 2-3 decades, before they dropped it to 2950.

The 338-06 and 338RCM have considerably less capacity, though they are excellent rounds.

What is the real world advantage of the 338 RM over the 338 06? I think I have a good idea but would like to hear other opinions.

I would venture 100 yards. Another good one to have a look at is the 338 SABI.


http://www.sabirifles.co.za/338sabi.htm

JonP...I don't think there is "a real world advantage" in either...just personal preference.

One is used in a long action and the other in a short action. Ballisticly they are identical, nitpicks aside.

Opinions are like backsides, we all have them and we sit on them more than we need to.

The RMC would work well in a stock M98 because of the mag box length...and as Grenadier said...lots of room for long bullets.

Your right about the capacities 416 Tanzan...but that is for factory/reloads using factory/reloading manual dimensions.

You want a bit more velocity, just seat AND throat for a longer COAL...my 338-06 hits 2750 fs with several powders with a 225 gr Hornady SP...basically due to a Weatherby length throat and seating the 225 out to 3.55" which is 0.240" PAST the crimping cannelure...well past the 3.31" COAL listed in the Hornady manual, and only 50 fs slower than the 338 WM in Hornadys manual.

I can hit 100 fs more with select powders and a bit over the pressure limits, but I don't do that kind of stuff anymore.. That 0.240" length difference translates into ~5.5 grains more volume. That's about 8% more volume...shades of Ackley hey.

I/you/anyone can also do the same thing with a 338 WM...or the 338 RCM IF they know HOW to do it safely...but it's NOT for amateur's, and I don't recommend doing it when you're seeing double.

I shoot 225 gr Hornadys with 4320, RL-15, WW748 or Varget and 220 gr Noslers with the same powders...match primers, benchrest prepped brass, etc. Those are the only bullets/powders out of just about ALL the various brands and weights/powders, that I've tried over all these years, that CONSISTENTLY put 5 rounds into one ragged hole at 100yds.

See why I don't want to mess with this good thing. Hahahahaha

Pick your poison whatever it be and enjoy it.

Whatever we humans have, we're not satisfied...we want more...something different...something Jones has...something NO one has...ad nausium, ad infinitum.

ME TOO.

The .338-06 is a grand cartridge and I used it extensively over the years until I tried the 9.3x62...

Comparing the 338-06 or the 35 Whelen to the 9.3x62 is like comparing "darn" to "cuss'en", simi quote from Pierre van der Walts book, African Dangerous Game Cartridtges..He is correct, a properly loaded the 9.3x62 trods on the heels of the .375 H&H with 320 gr. bullets at 2450 FPS; 286 gr. bullets at 2525 FPS; and 250 gr. bullets at 2700 FPS (2800 is doable apparantly). The 9.3x62 is the most powerful of the beltless 30-06 length rounds suitable for a 98 Mauser according to Finn Aagard, again I agree.

Not to take away from the 338-06, it was one of my favorite elk rifles for years, and would still suit me just fine.

True, true...I built mine for Elk and Muley's using a long discontinued Speer 270 gr...the reason for the long throat...now we gott'um up to 300 gr....I have a box of Berger's to try soon...and the 320's when I can find some.

I have Mr. Finn's article on the 9.3 x 62 stuffed in a 3 ring binder with other 9.3 data, loads and targets.

Since I chopped my H&H's barrel down to 21" and lost about 200 fs...it ain't so hairy-legged next to the 9.3.

The 9.3 has a long history going back to what...1905 and a reputation for getting the job done without fuss or muss and on the cheap...I LIKE that...and I like my VZ24 conversion. The only things it gets to poke at are squirrels and the odd 'yote in the wrong place.

I think it would do just as well using a WSM case and I thought about doing a 9.3 x 120, using a 45-120 case...in my delusional illusions...stub barrel and NEF frame. THAT would be a trip. ):>O

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:
I emailed them and it's the first thing on my to-do list for AM tomorrow if you weren't sure, just for sure-zeez. Thanks again

You're welcome. Let us know what they say.

The B&M boys have done a 9.3 on the WSM case. Not too much press on it as they seem to be focused on bigger bore cartridges but the Aussies die one with a 35 cal and named it the 35 Sambar. 250 @ 2700 in a 24" barrel. One has to get to some heavyweight bullets in the 35 to match the SDs of the heavy 338, 9.3 and 375 cals which must kill powder space until you get to the Norma Mag or a wildcat like the STA of which I have ever seen only one on a M70.

Well...so far I've stuck out so many times I've worn a path from the dugout to the plate.

This is e-commerce...no one knows squat except part numbers.

This dial up takes so long to get anything done I just said scre-wit and ordered the steel hinged trigger guard from E-SARCOINC...69.95..10 bucks cheaper than Numerich and probably the same brand...I'll post the dimensions when it gets here.

Right-on bluefish...the Sambar has been around a while...I have a Marlin 336 in 356/358 Win and thought about re-chambering to 35/300 WSM but never found the round toit to doit.

That size case makes for mighty thin chamber walls in the square threaded 336. Would do OK in the VEE threaded 450 Marlin action especially if you made the barrel OD a bit larger.

You will loose some capability due to lower pressure limitations, but gain over the standard 356/358 case volume by a good 28-30%.

Will be working on the 9.3x62 CZ I inherited from the late FIL. Did recently find an Interarms in 338-06 for a very reasonable sum. Barrel unmaker known but is 24" with a .630 outside muzzle diameter. At least on the phone, the action sounded crisp and Mauser-like.
It has the cross-pin safety.

What say you all? Jump on this one?

I would say "what is reasonable" for what action??? Do you even know what you heard was the actual rifle. I need to SEE...there are so many scams and maggots out there I wouldn't believe my momma if I couldn't SEE IT, FEEL IT AND SHOOT IT.

I have pictures and a serial number and a 3 day inspection upon receipt.

Well, then...what could be better or go wrong???

indeedy

quote:

Originally posted by Atkinson:
The 9.3x62 is the most powerful of the beltless 30-06 length rounds suitable for a 98 Mauser according to Finn Aagard,
again I agree.

I was under the impression that 9,3X64 Brenneke, was the most powerful[comercial] belt-less 06 length cartridge for the std.M98,
[at least during Mr.Aagards time]..then came the Dakota cartridges, 375 Ruger,..and now 'fat' Rigby based .338 Norma Magnum!

I like using Medium length M-48 Yugo actions to build 308 based cartridges on. It is still more than enough room to seat bullets out as much as you want with a 51mm case, or with a 57mm case for that matter with a little shorter throw.

quote:

Originally posted by Grenadier:
I think the .338 Federal would be a great cartridge for something like this. It would fit in the standard Mauser action with room to spare for long bullets and with no magazine or action alteration required.

Not trying to change your mind, just mentioning.

Just how "good" are the Yugo receivers as to fit and finish? And also the Turkish offerings?

I've shied away from those because of the negativity associated compared with pre-war German/Austrian made receivers.

I want to do a few calibers on WSM cases using a M98 or similar receiver.

Prices what they are and the dearth of those "primo" actions makes finding an also-ran "good" one much more attractive or just going with a commercially available controlled feed action/complete rifle.

FWIW...SARCO came through with an answer for their M98 steel hinged trigger guard...3.40" front to back.

Now I need to order another one.

quote:

Originally posted by NONAGONAGIN:
FWIW...SARCO came through with an answer for their M98 steel hinged trigger guard...3.40" front to back.

Now I need to order another one.

Very good to know.
Once received, please let us know the quality of the product.

Right...and some close-up pic's.

One day of sun and more rain/snow on the way...That's OK...the lakes are looking like mud holes, and the fish are getting sunburned.

quote:

Right...and some close-up pic's.

Yep!