Was at the range last weekend testing some new loads in my .300 WBY Mag, Weatherby Mk V Ultra Lightweight.

Last week I was 2.5 inches high at 100 and about 4 inches low at 300 yards.

Yesterday my goal was to get dead on at 300 yards. I started at 100 yards, crystal clear skies, no breeze cool weather (45 degrees). I was shooting .5" groups and I raised the point of impact up to 3.25 inches at 100 yards. I proceeded to clean the barrel with a jag, patch and sweets 7.62 followed by a brush with sweets follwed by a jag and patches until perfectly clean patches were coming out of the end of the barrel.

I moved to 300 yards expecting to hit around dead on. My first shot was 6 inches high and 6 inches to the right. First thought was it was a flyer so I fired off a few more where I could not see any bullet holes through my 4.5-14x44mm Zeiss Conquest. I figured all 5 shorts were in the black circle and I just could not make them out.

I went down range to discover that one of the 6 bullets that I had shot after the flyer had hit the paper on the very upper edge of the target. I was using a big piece of paper...3'x2' with a target centered in the middle. I went back and was disgusted beacuse something happend from the time I cleaned my rifle and went from 100 (where it was shooting like a dream) to 300 where I was hitting over a foot high.) At this point I should mention that I am reloading and they were made with every bit of attention to details in regards to every variable including measuring powder charge 3 times.

At this point I moved my scope down 2 clicks where I started to hit around 7 inches high from bullseye but the group was about 8 inches (which I am used to shootig 2" groups with ease at 300 yards).

At this point I took off my bipod and anchored into a sandbag, checked to see if the scope mounts were tight...they were all very tight except for 2 screws out of the four in the rear mount that were tight but could be torqued further...I dont think it was loose enough to be moving around. They are Talley one piece alluminum rings where the base is attached to the rings and bolts directly to the receiver.) I moved the scope down 8 clicks and shot 3 about 6 inches low and 5 inches right. I moved the scope to the left about 2 clicks and up 4 clicks and shot a 3 inch 5 shot group dead on, moved to 200 yards and shot a 4 shot group 4 inches high with a groupig of about 1 inch...it was shooting well again....for now anyways

I am curious as to your thoughts as to what happend from 100 yards to 300 yards. All I did was clean it and I have done this many of times during an outing at the range and it has never affected its shooting. I did not bump the scope in any way so there were not issues there. The barrel was not hot either as I fire one shot ever 4-5 minutes to control this inthe featherweight barrel.

What are your thoughts everyone!? I am heading out west in two weeks and need to get this figured out, last thing I need is to have a monster buck and miss or worse yet wound it and end my hunt.

Thanks!

Dan

Sounds like it could be a scope problem. Maybe the erector hung up on you for a while. That can happen.

I always adjust windage only, or elevation only, and bang the flat side or top of the turret with a small, wooden screwdriver handle a couple of times after making the adjustment.

Then I shoot to check.

Then I make the other adjustment and do the turret banging routine again.

Call me superstitious.

But just for kicks, I'd check the action screws for tightness too.

I would definitely take the rifle out again a couple of times to check it out.

As I understand it, you raised the point of impact after shooting your group. Presumably you counted clicks? Remember you need a third fewer clicks at 300 yards than at 100 yards. I suspect that is the cause of your problems. Of course I was not there, but this explanation is certainly plausible, and explains the facts you have described.
Peter.

There are so many possible things that can go wrong here. More than likely it’s only 1 thing that you’re over looking.

Moving scope mounting?

Bad scope?

Poor cleaning? Copper build up can really screw things up at long range.

Something you’re not doing, like following through with your long-range shot. After all it’s a 300 Wby. The 300 can make a strong man “cry†after a number of shots (one reason I don’t own one).

I hope you can figure it out soon.

I am definitely not flynching as it has an accubrake on it and kicks like my 243! I could shoot it all day long.

I have never heard of having to bang the scope...interesting and that may be it.

In response to the cleaning...I over clean everything! Is there any way for it to be too clean!?!

You didn't mention what scope you have mounted on your Weatherby rifle but it sounds like it shit-the-bed when you changed the position of the erector tube. I have seen this happen on scopes but almost always a cheaper brand of scope but most scopes use the same type of adjustment system but the higher end ones are usually constructed of better components. All scopes can fail, but usually the higher priced scopes fail less often. BTW, you weren't by chance using a Shepherd scope were you? I have seen and heard of numerous Shepherds that have failed in the exact manner as your scenerio. If you have another scope to mount you ought to try it before your hunt cause a junk scope is not worth using on a good hunt. Good luck and hope you figure this out, and I really doubt anything is wrong with your rifle or ammo.

FullCurlHunter,

These are just questions. Things to think about on the spur of the moment.

I always "bang" the scope. I prefer to just tap it though

I would be more than a little upset if I had to “bang†a 5-14x44mm Zeiss Conquest scope! How much money did the sucker cost?

Did you try going back and shooting it at 100 yards again?

quote:

Originally posted by FullCurlHunter:
Ie cleaning...I over clean everything! Is there any way for it to be too clean!?!

More than a few people don’t know how to clean copper out of their rifle.

Not necessarily "too clean," but if a rifle's built up a bit of copper in the bore (as it will) and then you totally remove it, it has to build back up again and that can cause small ballistic variations.

It's not hard to damage a barrel's crown with careless cleaning with a rod from the muzzle, and that can throw things WAY off.

quote:

Ricochet

Good point Ricochet

Full Curl, I'd bet a lot that your rifle just didn't like the cleaning aspect. I did notice that you said that you had done it before without noticeable negative effects previously though...so maybe not--I have seen a lot of rifles that didn't like the cleaning so much, I don't clean to squeaky clean anymore very often, until accuracy is falling off.

Just a thought--good luck getting her dialed back in.

Did you make any parallax adjustments to your scope? I had a 6x18 Redfield that changed the point of impact 8 inches from 100 up to 200 yds. when I moved the adjustment. They made it right when I sent it back. When I moved it back to 100 yd. setting the scope was right back on at 100. The rifle was a Sako 6PPC.

It is actually more of a couple of taps than bangs. I don't overdo it. But I like to think it keeps the erector springs honest.

I'll second MRlexma's opinion and method. I've had more than a few instances where the movement was "helped" by a few "taps". Sometimes recoil doesn't do it btw.

JPK

thanks for the suggestions. I am hoping it was just a matter of not taping the scope and that my scope didnt go to crap...

Towards the end it started to group again but after quite a bit of clicks to bring the point of impact down.

I am heading out to the range Monday evening, I will let you know what I find out.

Again, thank you again for your suggestions.

I agree with mrlexma-your scope adjustments did not make accurate changes. As he said, the erector may have hung up and/or jumped more than it sholud have. If it is shooting as you wish now, go back to the range, fire a couple of rounds at 300 for confirmation, and leave it at that w/o making any more w &e adjustments.

In my experience, shooting at ranges like 300 and 400 yards really tells you if your shorter-range points of impact are going to be where you want them. Ballistics tables notwithstanding, I have discovered that a rifle zeroed somewhat high at a short distance like 100 yards can be a lot futher off in both windage and elevation at the longer sistances than you are anticipating.

However, like you, one MOA added at 100 to a rifle that is dead on but -3" @ 300 should have resulted in a center bull at 300..... But, I have had scopes in which a marked graduation on the adjustment dial gave twice or more of a change than it was supposed to. Some of these were good scopes, too.......

You did say you checked, and tightened, scope mount screws. I agree with you that it is not LIKELY that those two you torqued a little more could have been loose enough t cause your problem, BUT.. who knows? Along the same lines, did you check the tightness of the guard screws?

I would not suspect that scope yet. Those Zeiss scopes are as good as any, and better than most.....

My brother won a 270 Weatherby Mk V Ultra light at a FNAWS dinner a couple of years ago. We experienced the same problem you are describing. I reload for the family and we tried everything, even switching out scopes. The gun now just sits in the safe. Let me know if you find the answer. Good luck.

I’ll get back to my “copper thing†now. I don’t get overly concerned about copper in the rifling down the barrel, “copper happensâ€. Sometimes it helps and sometimes it doesn’t. It’s the copper build up in the throat that screws things up in my experiences. I’ve knocked chucks of copper out of the throat of a 270 Wby that the owner assured me that he knew how to clean a rifle.

I’m wondering if the mounts aren’t screwed up, like mount screws are to long and are bottoming out before they truly secure the mounts?

Just a bad scope? Who knows.

One thing I do know is that FullCurlHunter is running out of time.

i had a 257 that could cut dimes at 100 yards. i shot 3 deer with it one weekend ( one at at 330 yards) the next summer it wouldnt shoot for crap and the first group was 7 inches high 4 inches right. that was with factory ammo from the same box as the last year. weatherbys are odd. like ladies they need to be held and talked to and stoked to shoot well.

Just wat I need, another high maintenance woman in my life...

I will let you all know what happens tomorrow at the range.

My hopes, 3.5 high at 100, 4 inches high at 200 and dead on at 300...

My dreads, my dream hunting rig will have to be barried

I've never used Sweets but I thought you had to run a patch wet with gun scrubber through the bore after you're done cleaning to neutralize the copper solvent. Then patch it dry.

Maybe you don't have to with Sweets. I honestly don't know. But that step would help if there is any question of active residue.

The scope bump suggestion is no joke. Some scopes need it more than others.

I feel for you FullCurlHunter. Without being there or having our hands on the rifle, no one here knows what the problem or problems are. Everyone here is trying to help but without being there, we’re all just guessing.