The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Medium Bore Rifles CASE/BORE SIZE VersatiltyGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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For cartridges based on the same case there are benefits by better matching bore size to the case. .338win more versatile than 7Remmag, 7mauser more versatile than 257roberts this is not a criticism, I like both the 7rm & roberts.But there are obvoius advantages by going the larger bore size for each case. This is what has made the 338,7mauser such great cartridges. they strike a wonderful balance between bore size,bullet weight,ballistic efficiency and field effectiveness. | ||
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 Would you mind explaining the reasoning behind your statements. In what sense do you fined one cartridge more Versitile than the other.Strickly from the stand point recoil only the reverse is true especially if you are a small framed individual.Perchance are you saying that case to bore size ratio determines some sort of use factor? Will you please elaborate?  rogerOld age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone.. | |||
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I think I know where you're going with this Woodjack. My vote would be for the 9.3x64.  | |||
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Yes I am saying that bore-case ratio determines use factor.Bell took 1100 odd elephants with a 175gn 7x57 load A 162gn SST ,Barnes 140stx from the 7mauser far outshines anything you will get from the roberts for medium game.Down range figures are impressive. Checkout CPCARTRIDGE.com for some ballistic figures. If I had ashot at a Moose with a 7 mauser and 160tsx or175gn then I would chance it. Not so with the roberts. If a person cannot handle a 7 mauser, take up tennis. | |||
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A person's ability to absorb recoil isn't really relevant to the discussion, however if we are talking about cartridges based on the same case, then an 8mm or 9.3x57 should be even better than the 7mm. | |||
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wow kind of out of left field.  Based on EFFICIENCY, the 7x57 is more efficient than the roberts, but not totally outclassing it. They both are good for different ranges of game. no case/bullet combination is the end all be all. Otherwise we would all carry a 35 whelen improved and be done with it.  Bell could shoot, flat out shoot, and had unwavering confidence. I don't think he chose the 275 Rigby because of it being a devestating stopper, it got the job done well for him (with heavier than we normally load now bullets at a more nominal velocity) and he probably didn't want to kill himself with recoil shooting as much as he did. Personally I wouldn't choose either for moose. I believe that in well designed and balanced cartrdiges balancing bore size to case is not as important as bore size matched to purpose, case size being same. 257 would be a better coyote gun for at longer distances for example. probably better for pronghorn too. You did say this in the second post, that bore-case ratio determines "use factor". I think more accurate statement would be bore-case ratio lends itself to certain uses, because people decide which one to use for all kinds of reasons. Red | |||
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I know where Woodjack was going with it but he didn't state everything he wanted to. Your statements are closer DR. The 7x57 wouldn't be my choice for moose either but don't kid yourself, a lot of moose have gone down to it with appropriate bullets. | |||
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I don't doubt that, I bet a lot are taken every year with 6.5x55's in europe. They will work, I just wouldn't personally pick that if I got to take whatever I want out of my safe. And we won't tell my wife that it can be done because then the whole,"but see this one is good for "insert name of animal" that's why I need it" argument will stop working (actually I think that one stopped working a couple of guns ago).Red | |||
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Low recoil allows a rifles use by recoil sensitive people making it of course more versitile . If a feature facilitates the use of something by a larger group than it is considered more versitile.  rogerRED I think your analogy visavi 35 Wehlen is right on. Haven't seen your postings as much as before. Married life?  rogerOld age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone.. | |||
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Yup, well the house that comes along with it. I check here all the time but post less since I am focused on getting the house nice and trying to do more working on the guns myself. Garage is probably about 3 hours from being totally organized so work can begin. It is amazing how much stuff can pile up in such a short time. And then in the move my loading cabinets got tipped too far (by "helpful" people) and things fell from drawer to drawer, I am almost finished going through the second one sorting everything out. I hope to have my stock cradle up by tonight so tomorrow I can work a bit on a project. Red | |||
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You're certainly entitled to your opinion. On the other side of this story is the guy that bought his .257 Roberts as a deer rifle that can double as a fox/coyote rifle and has no interest in Moose. Please don't try to tell this guy that your 7 X 57 is a superior weapon to his .257 Rob. BTW Bell took down a ton of elephants with a .25 caliber Mannlicher too!!! /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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Depends on what you mean by "versatility". If the issue is being able to use a wide variety of loads and bullets, then you need to pay attention to case size vs. bore area. As the case gets larger with respect to bore area, it is a good general rule that the range of "well behaved" loads and bullets narrows, and barrel life decreases. In that respect, the 30-06 is quite versatile, and the 22-250 much less so. Prove all things; hold fast to that which is good. | |||
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I've always felt that the 270 was best suited to 30-06 case (30-06, 280, 270, 25-06) and the 300 best suited to the belted mag case (458, 338, 300, 7mm, 264). Seems to be most efficient when loaded to the gills with appropriate powders. MHO Without guns we are subjects, with guns we are citizens ____________________________________ There are those who would misteach us that to stick in a rut is consistency - and a virtue, and that to climb out of the rut is inconsistency - and a vice. - Mark Twain | Chinese Proverb: When someone shares something of value with you and you benefit from it, you have a moral obligation to share it with others. ___________________________________ | |||
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Oh poopy. I will now go broad side .Take your best shot; but if  were music this thread would qualify as a brass band. rogerOld age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone.. | |||
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best ballistics I can find for a roberts is 115gn ballistic tip 2400pfs/1400energy@300yds best for 7x57 found 162gnSST 2250fps/1800 energy@300yds Does that not respectably shadow the robby as well as having a higher SD?and all from the same case size .I can still use a 120 barnes for the yotes, but can just use the 162gn for all without problem. Ill give anyone 75cents for a dollar alll day till they wake up to it. Also I never stated that 7mauser was ideal for moose,just that it was a far more versatile round with its heavier slugs,SD,retained energies. Good liuck in the field | |||
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Hi gents I thought I should join in the fun. Cobra, In the woods the 9.3x57 is better than the 7x57. Whats more my 9.3 is an Husqvarna the 7x57 is a Ruger. The Huaqvqarna on a FN action puts the Johny come lately Ruger to shame. The 7x57 is a lille more versatile, what does that mean? I have shot rabbits with my 9.3, admittedly there is a little less to eat then when shooting them with a 22lr but it's dead bunnies I want not something for the table. I breed Herefords for that.  | |||
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You guys are losing me on this. Isn't it always true that bigger is better if you can handle the recoil? The 378 Weatherby is an awesome cartridge, except it beats the hell out of me!!! I guess I kind of think of this the other way around. I pick a caliber, say 7mm, and try to think of the best case that goes with it. If I don’t like recoil too much 7 mauser, 7-08 will get me in the ballpark to where the caliber is truly useful. 7 Rem or Weatherby burns a lot more powder but gives me a real flat trajectory and makes it quite a performer. 7 STW or RUM is a lot more powder/ less barrel life, yet for just a tad more velocity. If barrel life don’t mean much and recoil is no problem I may go for these too, it’s just I know they are not too efficient. Jet fighters are not efficient either, but they have their place. So the 338 may be a better round then the 7 Rem or 264 win by a certain logic. But at the same time the 340 Weatherby, 338 RUM and 378-338 would be better yet. And the 458 Win would be better than all of them. Right? | |||
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This is the medium bore column,so why are you talking 458. | |||
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