If I hear you, none of those rifles are going to get much serious use.The ability of one cartridge over another Mox Nixs. Sooo whichever you can cradle that brings back the foundest memories are the two.
getting close! roger

AC ; What do YOU really Like ?. I would keep the following 9.3x74-R double rifle , Musgrave .404 Jeffrey

and Hunt with Steyr .376 Pro Hunter . As Ole Age catches up with some of us , retaining valuable Rifles

is nearly as good as Gold . Who knows you might want that extended cash some day ?.

It's the only reason I keep the Drilling as it's one of a handful of Rifles I've never shot but once !.

You and I both know there's nothing in NA that the Steyer .376 won't handle and handle easily !.

Some of us get to a point in life and realize we've come full circle, maybe more than once and it's time to

reflect on our past behavior ; by making what amends we can for past transgressions !.

If I may borrow this line from Roger ;

Old age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward !

I voted 9.3x74 Double and 375 H&H. With the first - you're good for anything in the USA and with the second the rest of the world.

quote:

Originally posted by kidd:
The .375 H&H will do anything as well if not better than the rest. So that leaves
you with your choice of the rest. It's the one that's not only fun, but pretty cool
to use and pretty functional as well as cost value. Therefore having shot both many
times over the years I would include the terrific .405 Win. Also it's in the Ruger No. 1
thats no longer available.

Just my thoughts.
See you at the range, Kidd

Well as I said above, I'm probably gonna get rid of the .375 H&H. It won't do anything the .404 Jeff won't do with the proper bullets. And like Doc said, in North America the .376 Steyr will kill anything which needs killing, (and is a hell of a lot handier to carry). I've owned a bunch of .375 Maggies over the years and though they are good guns, I've never found them particularly dominating over a lot of other good cartridges in situations where I might use a .375 H&H. Nice for the one gun man, but guess what? That's not how I am described.

And of course, that's because the rifle's cartridge is not the final determinant. It is the shooter who does everything, not the rifle. And can anyone really think I need a rifle which can do everything by itself? I need FEWER rifles, but not just one magic gun. For me, the .376 will kill just as well and handle better.

I/m probably also gonna get rid of the 9.3x74-R DR too, though as it is "on the cusp", that is not finally determined. I've had it since '77 or '78. It won't do anything more than the .376 in NA either. I seldom take it out of the house any more. I like the "feel" of several of my other rifles better, including my 9.3x62 bolt gun which I AM keeping.

The object of this whole exercize was to decide which ones to pare in a trimming down program. That means some HAVE to go. Your comments have helped me toward doing that.

As to the .405s, to be horribly honest and frank, it seems to me to be a cartridge which NEVER had a convincing reason for being. It is not a true big DG cartridge, it is not a long range cartridge of any particular note, it doesn't handle heavy for the bore diameter bullets as well as or better than several others, and so on.

As to it being discontinued, so what? If that makes it worth more, consider this....To make any money from such a rifle, a person HAS to sell it. Why not now? Should I wait until I am 85? 90? 100? If I should live that many more years, the odds of which get poorer with every passing day, what would I do with the money then that I could enjoy?

Anyway, thanks to you all for your comments and suggestions.

Pleeease, keep the SAINTED original mauser 9.3x62.

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
Anyway, thanks to you all for your comments and suggestions.

Too bad that you ,I and that moonshine country gal couldn't hang out for a day or two. roger

quote:

Originally posted by Paolo9,5x73:
Pleeease, keep the SAINTED original mauser 9.3x62.

Will do, Paolo. That's one I have on my "keeper" list.

AC, I find your perspective on hunting, aging, shooting, collecting and enjoying to be remarkably refreshing.

If I'm reading you correctly I also have to pat myself on the back for choosing the .376 Steyr way back on the first page. It's just a really good choice for what you wish to do.

Enjoy Sir and take care.

One man's meat is another man's poison.

Which is why I always keep a weather eye on the used firearms market.

Truth be told, I don't even look for a minute at new factory rifles any more.

The old and classic stuff is far more interesting to me.

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
Anyway, thanks to you all for your comments and suggestions.

Too bad that you ,I and that moonshine country gal couldn't hang out for a day or two. roger

Roger-

Hate to have to tell you this...but I DO hang out with her every day of our lives. Since she retired from her day job last October 1, she has been home every single day...our home.

If our place here closes July 8 as scheduled, we'll be moving back to AZ where I was born. First act there will be to fire up the still...second, to take the squeezins out by the pool and see if we can't finally get warm and dry again. Then, third, wander over to Usury Pass Rifle Range and see what kinda trouble I can get into there. Finally, wander around Phoenix, Prescott and Tucson areas and see which of my old acquaintances (Scott Medesha for instance) may let me in the door for at least a couple of minutes.

But if you ever come to the area on a visit, I'll make sure you have my phone number and address. We can break out a BIG bottle of bathtub gin and two barrels of olives & crackers.

In closing, everyone has to have an objective in life. Mine will be to see if you and I can put away that whole barrel of olives.

quote:

Originally posted by analog_peninsula:

If you loved the double, you never would have put it on the list.

That is a good observation. I have lived a fortunate life where in my salad years I owned more English double rifles and original Mauser sporters than most (certainly not all, but most) North Americans have ever even SEEN.

A goodly number of the double rifles I regret selling, such as a C&H .375 Flanged Magnum...not of the class of others, but a real perfectly balanced hunting rifle. And there was that nice .577.....


But only two of all that are now gone did I ever really love.


One was a WR hand-detachable boxlock .450/.400 3-1/4". The other was a Simson .470 with clipped fences and fabulous engraving...the best Germanic style engaving I have ever seen. I normally am a "rose & scroll" man, but the two tigers drinking on one side, and the trumpeting bull ele on the other were done in such perspective, proportion and detail to compare with anything in The Louvre in my opinion.

Well, maybe when I go from East to West and back to East again.....

A-Canuck, with all due respect, I am always amazed at how everyone sees things in a totally different light. The 405 Win. originally came about in a lever action rifle. It offered a large bore heavy bullet in a lever-action which was great for the northern adventurer in big bear country. In my opinion, it is the Ruger #1 that never had a reason for being, not the 405. Had you stated it was a 405 Win. in a original M-1895 rifle, I think the poll would have ended up differently. As far as which rifles to keep, none of us can see nor feel any of your rifles nor do any of us know the history associated with each rifle. Most everyone was basing their decisions on the information given. Many people, including myself tend to be practical in judgment. I personally have seen 375 H&H ammo in some of the most unlikely places including a Cheaper Than Dirt catalogue about 2 years ago. I have never seen 376 Steyer or 404 Jeffery ammo anywhere EXCEPT at up-scale gun shops or in the big mailorder catalogues.
The 9.3X62 has been steadily gaining a following thanks in part to this and other forums.

None-the-less you are very fortunate to have the problem you perceive to have. Good luck to you and I am sure you will make wise choices in your keepers.

quote:

Originally posted by Rae59:
A-Canuck, with all due respect, I am always amazed at how everyone sees things in a totally different light. The 405 Win. originally came about in a lever action rifle. It offered a large bore heavy bullet in a lever-action which was great for the northern adventurer in big bear country. In my opinion, it is the Ruger #1 that never had a reason for being, not the 405. Had you stated it was a 405 Win. in a original M-1895 rifle, I think the poll would have ended up differently. As far as which rifles to keep, none of us can see nor feel any of your rifles nor do any of us know the history associated with each rifle. Most everyone was basing their decisions on the information given. Many people, including myself tend to be practical in judgment. I personally have seen 375 H&H ammo in some of the most unlikely places including a Cheaper Than Dirt catalogue about 2 years ago. I have never seen 376 Steyer or 404 Jeffery ammo anywhere EXCEPT at up-scale gun shops or in the big mailorder catalogues.
The 9.3X62 has been steadily gaining a following thanks in part to this and other forums.

None-the-less you are very fortunate to have the problem you perceive to have. Good luck to you and I am sure you will make wise choices in your keepers.

Rae, with all due respect, the .45-70 already existed in lever action rifles (the 1886) when the .405 came into being (ca. 1895), and fired 330 gr, 405 grain, 500 grain and even heavier bullets. Certainly it was shooting as heavy bullets as anything owners of the .405 ever thought of using, well before the .405 came to be. Further, the '86 both held more cartridges and was easier to load with rimmed rounds. And it could be "topped-up" with a shell already chambered and the bolt closed, ready for action.

The Ruger No. 1 did have a reason for coming into being....gracefullness without flattening the average man's wallet. Plus it will easily fit many times more different cartridges than the M'95 Winchester ever did, for those who like a variety of choices in such things.

Is the No. 1 equivalent to a Dan'l Fraser in terms of grace and lines? Not by any means. But it does make a nice, useful, attractive rifle for those who like single-shots, as I do. I used to collect Frasers, and can also say that the Ruger is a much more certain functioning rifle than the Frasers. I've never had a cartridge case refuse to come out of a Ruger, and I certainly have with ordinary factory ammo in the Frasers.

I too am a practical shooter. Perhaps you missed the line in my above posts where I noted that I have enough ammo and components for each and every one of my rifles to last me several more lifetimes. That is literally true. So what do I care how many places anyone has seen .375 H&H ammo for sale? I don't. And since I am going to be able to either drive my PU or fly my own (rented) light aircraft to any place I plan to hunt during the rest of my life, I don't have to worry about losing my ammo either.

Ditto for the .404. Ammo for me is a non-problem. Plus, I can use it with 400 grain bullets if and when the occasion ever arises.

As to the popularity of the 9.3x62... It has only recently become somewhat popular in the 'States, but in much of the rest of the world (except South America) it has been a "standard" since the first decade of the 20th Century. My first one was a "Manton, of London, Calcutta & Nairobi". For some years it ruled as the number one most popular medium bore in Africa because of the inexpensive availability of Mauser rifles. It reportedly once seemed like danged near every farmer was armed with either an 8 m/m Mauser or a 9.3x62, and ammo could be bought in most stores which sold anything having to do with guns.

Still, I have something on the order of 4,000+ Norma bullets at hand for mine and approximately three bushels or so of .30-06 brass which make great cases for it with little effort.

Note, please, that I have not said the .405 is "worthless" or anything like that. Nor do I feel that way about the .375 H&H. The .405 I just see no need for so long as I have the .404, and the .375 is no particular advantage to me in North America. The .404 Jeffery and the .376 Steyr will do everything I would ever want to do with the .405 or .375 H&H belted rimless magnum...and in the case of the .376 in a much handier, less bulky, lighter, rifle.

So, those are the two that as a practical person will get my preferences among those four cartridges.

Thanks for your well wishes.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
As to the popularity of the 9.3x62... It has only recently become somewhat popular in the 'States, but in much of the rest of the world (except South America) it has been a "standard" since the first decade of the 20th Century. My first one was a "Manton, of London, Calcutta & Nairobi". For some years it ruled as the number one most popular medium bore in Africa because of the inexpensive availability of Mauser rifles. It reportedly once seemed like danged near every farmer was armed with either an 8 m/m Mauser or a 9.3x62, and ammo could be bought in most stores which sold anything having to do with guns.
-----------------------------------------------
I am quite aware of the 9.3X62s popularity in the world especially among European hunters.
I was in a bit of hurry when I made my post and neglected to state that I was referring to it's popularity here in the U.S and north America. Since I am your typical narrow minded American, it was pure short-sightedness on my part.

My hat is off to you on your hoarding of ammo for each caliber! I simply hope you never forget to bring enough or misplace any of it on any of your future hunts.

Although I did not participate in your poll, I must admit I probably would have voted for the 404 J. as well. It would be a toss up between the 375 and the 404.

quote:

Originally posted by Rae59:
My hat is off to you on your hoarding of ammo for each caliber!..

Well, thank you for the damning with faint praise. I do not intentionally ever hoard. When I buy a gun chambered for a cartridge new to me, I buy enough ammo to last me a looooong time. I do that not to have a "hoard", but to save valuable time and prevent needless trouble.

The result is, I don't have to run somewhere and buy ammo when I decide I want to go shooting. I don't have to wonder whether the kind I like will still be available, either locally or anywhere else. I don't have to do anything except pick a couple of boxes more off my shelves and enjoy the rifle. That has always been my policy and always will be as long as I am buying new-to-me stuff. It just plain simplifies owning the rifles, and I can (at least barely) afford to do it, so why not?

I am still shooting ammo I bought up to 45 years ago, so I hardly think it is harming the supply situation for anyone else. If anything it may have helped others out by giving the factories a tiny bit more profit in producing cartridges of their ilk, thus helping motivate them to make more of it.

quote:

I simply hope you never forget to bring enough or misplace any of it on any of your future hunts..

I doubt that I will. I did that once earlier in my life (on a moose hunt when trying out the then-brand new.444 Marlin cartridge). I tried to learn from that mistake and ever since have been very careful to both put enough ammo in my kit, and to keep track of where it is....

But as I am not worried about it, no one else need fret on my behalf. I'm a big boy. I can cope with the results of my own errors.

Thanks for your concern.

BTW, I think you'd really enjoy my .404. It is a true bespoken custom bolt rifle, six years between order and receipt. A tad light in weight for the caliber, but as one doesn't shoot dozens of rounds in a short span of seconds with it, not light enough for the recoil to harm a fly. It also handles exceedingly well (for me) as it fits me very well. And it is accurate.

quote:

Although I did not participate in your poll, I must admit I probably would have voted for the 404 J. as well. It would be a toss up between the 375 and the 404.

And if you could handle my .375 Magnum Mauser and my .404 Jeffery, I truly believe you would likely choose the .404, as I have.

Best wishes,

AC

seems obvious to me: the 375H&H and the Double Rifle 9,3x74R. But, that's because I have both and do not plan to part with either barring an absolute financial calamity.

Rich
DRSS

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
seems obvious to me: the 375H&H and the Double Rifle 9,3x74R. But, that's because I have both and do not plan to part with either barring an absolute financial calamity.

Rich
DRSS

And for you it would be the right choice. For me it would probably not be, as I have other rifles that on direct comparison I like better.

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:

quote:

Originally posted by Paolo9,5x73:
Pleeease, keep the SAINTED original mauser 9.3x62.

Will do, Paolo. That's one I have on my "keeper" list.

Good onya Mate you have made the right choice

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Rae59:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
My hat is off to you on your hoarding of ammo for each caliber! I simply hope you never forget to bring enough or misplace any of it on any of your future hunts.QUOTE]
Hoarding here is a tright remark. Some invest instocks and bonds. I must addmitt I'm heavy inTax free bonds. But I consider one of my better investments to be in fire arms, ammo, and components. Although I recognize that AC can take care of himself I see that he has prudently put his money where it reaps large dividends in finance and enjoyment. My lates investment went south today. My beautiful brand new S&W mod 17. 22lr Had a reverse tapper in one of the cylinders. Bad investment? Maybe .We'll see. Some folks may say " Who cares?"
AC If you need some Bell .404 unformed cases I,ve hoarded a few I can part with. roger

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:
AC If you need some Bell .404 unformed cases I,ve hoarded a few I can part with. roger

Thank you, Roger. Right now I am in the process of renting a moving van to move my loading equipment, ammo, components,lathe, machine tools, and rifles, pistols, shotguns to AZ.

If you still have that brass once I get an address there, I'll contact you and see what we can work out. Until then I've got so much stuff to carry, I don't dare take on any more.

As it is, I am going to be selling a WHOLE BUNCH of powder locally up here in the swamp , er...Cascade foothills. Not selling any primers though....... I'm gonna take them come Hell or High Water (well, maybe not high water in AZ, but a good chance of a bit of Hellish warm weather until about mid-October).

Thanks again,

AC

AC, you keep mis-interpretting what I write. I wasn't damning anybody for hoarding. I hoard and I am damn proud of it. Which reminds me of a joke I'm going to PM you.
P.S. I'm not really concerned whether or not you forget your ammo or your rifle on a hunt, I was just trying to be polite.

Very difficult choices here!

I'd keep the 9,3x74R double ... they are wonderful rifles in the field and good for essentially anything in North America.

The .404 would be the second keeper. Better than a .375 H&H in Africa and easy on you to shoot.

The 9,3x62s would really pain me to send away I must admit.

Hope this is choice you don't have to or want to make!

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
I need to start narrowing down my medium bore rifles a tad.so will want to keep one, maybe two, and get rid of the rest. Have my own ideas as to which ones, but I may have left some things out of my thought(?) process. I do not ever wish to hunt outside NA again.

So, which of the following would you keep?

(I have a several-lifetime supply of ammo and loading components for each of them.)

I would say keep the .375 Holland.

These are medium bores, so it's not like you're going to use them for long range sheep hunting. They'll sack anything big NA has to offer. And if you do find the deal of a lifetime for africa the .375 will do the deed.

Sell everything else and go hunting.

quote:

Originally posted by TwoZero:
I would say keep the .375 Holland.

These are medium bores, so it's not like you're going to use them for long range sheep hunting. They'll sack anything big NA has to offer. And if you do find the deal of a lifetime for africa the .375 will do the deed.

Sell everything else and go hunting.

They are indeed medium bores. And the .404 is at least as capable as the Holland for North America, especially with the 300 grain Barnes monometal variety of bullets, which it likes very much and of which I have a goodly number.


And, should it ever go back to Africa, the .404 Jeffery is more capable than the .375 Holland on that turf as there are any number of 400 grain bullets the .404 handles well, which are better suited for whatever hazardous animal one might unexpectedly encounter in the African bush at arm's length.

On the other hand, the Holland will not kill anything in North America any deader than the .376 Steyr will, or any quicker either. And because they ARE medium bore rifles, they are intended for kinds of game which are generally shot within 150 yards or less. I am not a person who shoots at Brown Bears at even that distance, let alone farther. Thirty or forty yards is more my style.

If I hunt pronghorns or deer, elk, etc., I can use one of many smaller-bored rifles. For varminting, I'll use a relatively high-velocity miniature. I don't need to own only one rifle and try to make it stretch around all the bases when I'm up to the plate.

I already have these rifles, so it costs me absolutely nothing to speak of to keep them. As I said before, I have no intention of selling them all, just to reduce their numbers somewhat. If I want to go hunting, I have the means to go wherever I wish.

What I don't have is the desire to visit the nations or support the tourist industries of nations which hate my country and countrymen, or which breed, support, or coddle those who do.

That's how I see it right now, anyway.

quote:

Originally posted by Alberta Canuck:
What I don't have is the desire to visit the nations or support the tourist industries of nations which hate my country and countrymen, or which breed, support, or coddle those who do.

That's how I see it right now, anyway.

Salute!!!!!!