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| One of Us |
I have a .300 Win Mag Kimber Montana 8400. I love the gun, and the kick isnt unberable, but I was wondering if a muzzlebreak would help make it really light, or is a more pain in the but in hunting situations, when you are talking about Ear and Eye Protection and overall noise.. I presume when they say you need Ear Protection they also mean eye protection as well in hunting situations. Thanks, W. | ||
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I have Vais brakes on a few of my guns. When you are doing high volume shooting of relatively large animals such as kangaroos, feral goats etc, then they become an addition worth considering. In the field a set of baffle type ear plugs will do the job adequately of protecting your hearing. I use these, regardless of whether the gun is braked or not. At the range I use both plugs and muffs. They will cut the recoil by roughly 40%..... Verbera!, Iugula!, Iugula!!! Blair. | |||
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That sounds right. There are all those holes drilled in them. | |||
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I don't use a brake but have a moderator and it makes a big difference to the recoil in my 308. I know there is some paperwork involved in getting a moderator in the USA but it is well worthwhile especially when you consider that in most countries in the world you have an awful lot more paperwork to do just to get a rifle. It also makes a significant difference to the sound pressure levels that you and those around you are exposed to at the range. I have shot with people using a brake on a 300 Win Mag and the increase in noise levels and muzzle blast for those around is significant. From the perspective of other range users a ban on the use of such things on the range would certainly not seem out of order as they really can ruin a trip to the range for everyone apart from the user of the brake. In real terms a brake adds about 10dB to the sound levels produced by a 308, I've never seen reliable figures for any other calibre. This is a significant increase and approximately equates to the human perception that the noise got twice as loud. You will certainly need both plugs and muffs to stand any chance of taming this to a level that isn't doing you hearing damage. The first time someone shot a 300 Win Mag beside me at a range he had mounted the brake with the vent holes facing up and down rather than left and right. The ground in front of the firing point, we were both shooting prone, was soft damp grass and when he fired the first round I got covered in grass and soil thrown up by the blast. We had a good laugh about it at the time but it does give some indication of just how significant the blast is for those shooting beside you. | |||
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All I can say is invest in some good hearing protection.......  "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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If you say that the recoil is not that bad for you now then I would seriously suggest that you just perhaps put a better pad on it and learn to suck it up.. Otherwise there will be a time someday where you will be tempted to shoot it without hearing protection "wearing hearing protection all day long in the field while hunting is an annoyance" and you will pay the price. With all due respect for our Ozzie friend shooting roo's is a lot different scenario than when you are hunting for the bull elk of a lifetime and suddenly there he is trotting through the timber with a two second pause as he looks over his shoulder. Are you going to take those two seconds to put the hearing protection back on that you took off an hour ago? Nope.. Shooting roo's, well when you have shot one roo you have shot them all. And if this one hops off well there are forty more standing around looking silly waiting for you to busta cap on. Bottom line is that it will be a mistake, unless you are a paper puncher, and even then you will be forced to punch it by yourself as noone will come near you. (When I was a kid my father used to tell me that God hated a coward, I finally realized he has even less use for a fool.) | |||
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A muzzle brake certainly does work, but I don't like them. Loud, ugly, causes some problems shooting prone. For me, just drop to a caliber you can manage the recoil on. A good pad helps a ton. Good technique @ the range also does. LIFE IS NOT A SPECTATOR'S SPORT! | |||
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 At least 8 of my rifles have muzzle brakes. They really serve a purpose and the negative attributes that go with them can be somewhat controlled so that you and those around you can live with them.For example when using the big boomers at the range I come early before the crowds and try to get as far away from people as I can. Never on Sat. Or Sun.I also advise my range mates of what I intend to do. In the field no problem.  I can not bench shoot my .358 X .404 IMP without the brake. With the brake it reduces its recoil to that of a 30-06, and that's a 250 gr. bullet at 3100 fps.  rogerOld age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone.. | |||
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I agree with Fred on this one. I have shot a number of braked rifles, some of which I liked and some I didn't. They all reduced recoil to some degree, but you must make sure to check which direction the ports are cut, as that is the direction the gases will be expelled. I have shot three diferent brakes that blew the gases right back into my face, and believe me, that is more disruptive to accurate shooting than recoil. Also, as others have noted, a rifle with a brake isn't going to win you any friends at the range, and I always try make sure I have at least two benches of seperation from other shooters if I'm going to be shooting one. I'll also add that making sure the rifle fits you correctly can make a big difference. You would be surpised how much a properly designed stock can reduce felt recoil  | |||
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Thanks guys, The recoil is certainly not that big a deal, I just like "Supin" up my guns for fun. I definatly dont want it messing up my hunts or making me go deaf, and I only shoot on saturdays or sundays, so I think you have helped me make my decision. Thanks again, W. | |||
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Brakes are a wonderful thing. It doesnt make you more or less of a man/shooter/hunter to say you do not like recoil. Everyone is different. What you should do, is a get a REMOVABLE muzzle brake. You use the brake at the range, and you unscrew it and put a cap on it in the field. You won't notice the recoil with game in your cross hairs. I had a brake on my last gun and did just that, on at the range, off in the field. The Vais and the KDF are both good designs, I prefer the KDF because they don't protrude at all, they're in line with the muzzle. If you think every possible niche has been filled already, thank a wildcatter! | |||
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Shooters either love 'em or hate 'em. Muzzle brakes WILL reduce recoil. They also increase the noise level, but cartridges burning 80-100+ grains of powder are LOUD with or without a brake. I've had my trap and skeet shotguns ported for years, as do many other trap and skeet competitors. The porting reduces recoil which is especially good for those 500 bird 12 ga events, and properly done porting reduces muzzle jump which is good for a quick second shot in doubles events. I have KDF brakes on my .375 RUM and my .300 Wby. I also installed recoil reducers in the stocks of these rifles and Limbsaver pads. Before I did this to the .375 RUM it was VERY uncomfortable to shoot and I didn't like to shoot it. Now it is not unpleasant to shoot, even from the prone position. Last year I took my .375 RUM to the Eastern Cape for a Plains game hunt. Two of the antelope that I shot (Vaal rhebok and Black springbok) were from the prone position and neither shot was uncomfortable on my shoulder nor was the muzzle blast objectionable. Last Wednesday, I took several rifles to the range including my .300 Wby (at 10#) and my .257 AI (at 9 1/2#). The felt recoil of the .300 WBY shooting 180 gr TSX bullets at 3191 fps was not any greater than that of the .257 AI with 117 gr Sierra bullets at 2795 fps. NRA Endowment Life Member | |||
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The local shop where I trade does a big business installing brakes. They install what they describe as an ll degree forward brake. It's a circular brake with holes drilled in it, and as I understand it, the ports (holes) are tilted slightly forward. Supposedly, the angled forward ports direct the noise and blast forward. They are slightly less effective because the blast is distributed forward rather than sideways or backwards, but so is the noise. LWD | |||
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I've sold 4 rifles because of muzzle brakes. I endure one on an FAL and a 416 Rem Mag but everything else is naked on the end of the barrel. The noise and blast just turn me off quick. I hate shooting next to one too. I'll leave a range if somebody is shooting a boomer with a brake. Anything Worth Doing Is Worth Overdoing. | |||
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This works fine as long as POA/POI doesn't change. I have a removeable brake on my 404j, but after shooting the rifle awhile, recoil doesn't really bother me that much. I have had a scope kiss twice while shooting off the sticks, but that is more technique than anything else. LIFE IS NOT A SPECTATOR'S SPORT! | |||
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On a Hunting rifle muzzle brakes ABSOLUTELY SUCK. After forgetting to change out a removeable muzzle brake my ears rang for hours and I promised myself I would never hunt with one on again. I don't like wearing plugs in the field because they take away part of the enjoyment of being outdoors. I don't mind them quite as much shooting off a bench since you'll always be wearing hearing protection at a range but the muzzle blast is often more unpleasant than the recoil. If the recoil is tolerable absolutely don't ruin a gun by installing a muzzle brake. If you can't tolerate recoil it's better to go with a lighter caliber. If you just absolutely have to have one get one that you can remove to hunt with..............................DJ ....Remember that this is all supposed to be for fun!.................. | |||
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I'm resisting putting a brake on my 300 WBY. A decent pad and more offhand practice have helped deal with the recoil. A search of the Big Bore section also yielded several threads on how to adapt to hard kickers. | |||
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Muzzle brakes do work to reduce recoil. I have a removeable brake for my .505Gibbs that does reduce kick considerably and a muzzle thread protector for hunting. Rodney. | |||
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For my hard kicking rifles I have a brake on them but I take it off when hunting and use a thread cover to protect those threads. | |||
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purchase a 458 lott, dies and 500 grain bullets. also buy 2 eight pound jugs of DP-74 powder from powder valley. load up ammo with 84 grains of powder. shoot until your arm turns green every other weekend. repeat for six months. you will never flinch or complain about any other rifle again, except for maybe a 378 weatherby. i am looking to un-install the brake on my 338 lapua. thought that rifle kicked something fierce until i got full tilt Lott loads in my system. brakes make a lot of noise, especially in your high performance rounds. i have to wear plugs and muffs with the lapua, and my ears still feel funky after a day at the range. i don't like brakes anymore. | |||
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I do not understand why so few people use suppressors. A good suppressor only adds two inches to the length of the rifle and very little to the weight but the difference to muzzle blast and recoil is impressive! Apparently, the good ones often improve accuracy by virtue of stiffening the barrel, being mounted on two points on the barrel. It can also make the difference between getting sworn at or not by your shooting companions. Although, I do have some buddies who think temporary hearing loss from muzzle blast is funny!  Regards 303Guy | |||
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Here in the States the answer is simple. They are usually illegal. You can apply for a special license but you have to pay a $200 tax stamp, undergo a FBI background check and get signed off on by your local county sheriff. Not all Sheriffs will do so and they aren't permitted in all in others. It makes complete sense to me to not have my hearing damaged by being able to use a suppressor on my hunting rifle but unfortunately I'm prevented to do so by stupid gun laws..............................DJ ....Remember that this is all supposed to be for fun!.................. | |||
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I used to think about getting a brake installed on a rifle until my friend bought a .300 mag. Holy cowis the blast and noise rediculous. I believe it's an Answer brake. It is absolutely brutal. I can't be anywhere but behind him when he shoots at his home range. You need plugs and muffs. I told him if it was mine I would cut the damn thing off w/ a bandsaw. | |||
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Maybe everyone elses ears are more sensitive then mine. I honestly don't remember the blast being so unbearable as to comment like some have here. Forgetting to take the brake off when hunting is your own fault, and had nothing to do with the brake. They work, plain and simple. Go to the range on a slow day so you don't bother anyone else, wear hearing protection. Remembering to remove the brake when hunting should be easy....after you double check your zero at camp, if you do so, take it off the rest of the trip. How hard is that? Even without a brake, ANY gun shot without protection is not healthy for your hearing. Heck I even fired my gun with a brake without muffs on one time and I didnt even notice it being anyworse after shooting then with normal guns. If you think every possible niche has been filled already, thank a wildcatter! | |||
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...............................DJ ....Remember that this is all supposed to be for fun!.................. | |||
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Correct me here, every three decibels is a doubling of the sound pressure! So a ten decibel difference is 300% more noise and if I am not mistaken, hearing damage rate is also logrithmic! Unfortunately, suppressors are also 'somewhat' ugly, especially the 'full' ones.  Hah! My buddy forgot his bolt this weekend!  Regards 303Guy | |||
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I have a Hi Tech Custom brake on my M70 Fwt in 300WSM. Helps make the gun shoot like a 243. With this brake the noise to the shooter is actually less to the shooter than without it (although that's hard to measure since I always use muffs at the range). The noise and blast is quite offensive to anyone nearby, so I set up at the range at least two tables away. Baring that, I take the brake off for practice. However, my hunting load that groups 3/8" at 100 and 3/4" at 300 with the brake, then becomes 1 1/2" and about 5" respectively and about 5-6" from normal POI without the brake, while not-as-accurate practice loads become patterns rather than groups. If you're hunting with a muzzle brake, you really have to warn anyone close before shooting. Mike | |||
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You'll never feel the kick when shooting at game, so that's not an issue. Obviously, you're being punished at the bench, because any significant recoil is hard on the shoulder from the benchrest position. INSTEAD of spending your money on a muzzle brake that will devalue your gun and make it a piriah for others, spend a similar amount on one of the excellent recoil-absorbing benchrest devices currently available on the market. You can use it with any gun, and it will make your sight-in and load development a delight. | |||
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There are some brakes that don't exit gas downward so the prone thing can be eliminated. They do exit gases to the sides so the noise is redirected where, especially bystanders get the noise. There are some in stock recoil reducers that can be effective, but they will increase the overall weight by half a pound or more. If its just absolute recoil reduction you're interested in, get a brake and a good recoil pad. Some brakes will reduce recoil more than 50% for some high pressure rounds. Wear ear protection. That being said, shooting a 378 Wby without a brake in the prone position is a truly chilling thought. | |||
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I use a brake for range work with good hearing protection. When my load is worked up and accuracy is there remove the brake fire a couple for check POI and hunt without it. I don't wear hearing protection when I hunt and "Damn" muzzle brakes hurt the ears  . Will never hunt with one ever again.just my 2 cents You don't have to be the best shot....Just the last shot. | |||
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And even then you can't hunt with them in most areas. I live in a very gun friendly county in Texas. Our sheriff will sign off on whatever you want: suppressor, short barrel, full auto, which are all legal in Texas provided you get the federal paperwork. Like I said, very gun friendly. But our hunting regulations prohibit their use for game animals. LWD | |||
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This one works very well on a 338RUM, no blow back, not very loud and no one at the range seems to mind  reduces the recoil to somewhere between a light 30-06 and a standard weight 300 win mag. This one will send a puff of air into your face and is loud  It is detachable and reduces the recoil of a standard weight 338 win mag to about the recoil of a standard weight 30-06. I can shoot a 300 win mag all day long but when I shoot the 338's it hurts my old shoulder without a brake. ____________________________________ There are those who would misteach us that to stick in a rut is consistency - and a virtue, and that to climb out of the rut is inconsistency - and a vice. - Mark Twain | Chinese Proverb: When someone shares something of value with you and you benefit from it, you have a moral obligation to share it with others. ___________________________________ | |||
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I recently had one made and installed on a short barreled tactical style rifle, Tika T3, and the difference it makes in recoil is in the area of 50% Caliber is 308 and am not recoil sensitive, but primary purpose of this brake is to control muzzle flip. Scope reticle stays on target whether testing loads from the bench or in prone/sling position. It does it's job very well indeed, but this rifle not intended for hunting, but plan on "harvesting" a number of doe with it in a couple months. Very few if any hunters in the area I hunt and not sure if the deer will mind it or not. | |||
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Have a look under 'Gunsmithing - Shrouded Muzzle Breaks'
Regards 303Guy | |||
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I shoot skeet and have been a winged bird shooter for years, from .410 to 10 gauge. I shoot 3000 plus round through all sizes of rifles each year. I will state that if you fire a gun of any size without ear protection, you are an idiot. I shoot from my private benchs three days a week, weather permitting, therefore have no problems with complaints about brakes. I have brakes on all my rifles above .300 Winny, starting with a .340 Wby up to 50 BMG (not mine but my nephews and son-in-laws). The brakes work, no doubt about it, my .416 Rigby kicks about like my unbraked .300 Winny. I hunt with mine because I work up a load that I don't want changed by screwing a straight cover on that would change the POI. Because of my skeet shooting for years, it is no problem to use plugs in the field at the point of the shot. I also contend that the braked rifle is more accurate than the unbraked rifle, because of the stabilizing affect of the added weight on the barrel, but that is another debate. If you don't like brakes, that is fine with me, as for me, I will take my braked rifles and shoot to my hearts content. When I shoot from the bench I use plugs and muffs and my hearing is perfectly normal, according to my audiologist I visit yearly. Good shooting. phurley | |||
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Brakes work, most all of them as its simply a matter of displacing shock waves.. As to hearing, after listening to all the ya ya about that, it occured to me that you always use ear protection at the bench and target shooting anyway so what difference does it make. The other thing is most of the nayseekers hunt without ear protection and end up damageing their ears with rifles without brakes..The brake is a little louder, but does no more damage to the shooter than any big bore rifle that is too loud to start with..The brake can be a little worse on bystanders, but use a little descretion and its not a problem and remind them that the good Lord gave'em fingers not to eat with but to stick in their ears!  I don't use a brake anymore, but brakes taught me to shoot big bores without flinching and I ended the sessions shooting the gun a few times without them and eventually quite using them, it works quite well... Then too you can take them off and on and just use them for testing, working up loads, practicing etc. Take them off to hunt..Thats pretty simple IMO...So forget the noise guys, they just have not thought things out and are jumping to conclusions that will lead you down the yellow brick road Dorothy!! Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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 Oh Ya ! roger  Old age is a high price to pay for maturity!!! Some never pay and some pay and never reap the reward. Wisdom comes with age! Sometimes age comes alone.. | |||
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Not so sure 'bout that! Muzzle breaks are anti-social, no doubt about it. See how many shooters start moving away from a breaked rifle at the range? Everebody wears hearing protection at the range. But there is the shrouded muzzle break, so .... Regards 303Guy | |||
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Personaly, I refuse to use a muzzle break. If the recoil is more than I can take I will shoot a lesser caliber rifle. There are some rifles I simply will not shoot. A frend bought an ultra light weatherby in 300 weatherby mag. I aint shooting it. No fun to me. But I would shoot a standard weight MK 5 in the 300 weatherby. I would prefer to carry the extra weight then use a break. The new ones might not damage the shooters ears, but what about those around him. Use them if you want But Not me ...tj3006 freedom1st | |||
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If I send you the KY jelly you can put that muzzle break somewhere more useful than on the end of a hunting rifle On a rifle intended for range use? Different story | |||
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