Greetings AR Colleagues,

Posting this here as I am reloading my Ruger Blackhawk Bisley in 45 Colt with a 7.5 barrel for hunting. I worked up some 300 grain Hornady XTP Mag bullets using Win 296 to maximum charge of 22.5 grains (absolute maximum charge according to Linebuagh and others is 23.5 grains so I could go a smidge more powder) and got decent accuracy at 25 yards of about 1 inch for three shots off sandbags with a velocity of 1178fps. Probably a good heavy hunting load for short range deer.

However, a while back I purchased a box of the Buffalo Bore Heavy 45 Colt 300 grain JFN loads (claimed 1325 fps) to test. Accuracy was poor at about 5 inches at 25 yards but the velocity was stout 1413 fps with hellaciously vicious recoil. That is a full 235 fps over my handload...but of course they are quite expensive.

So my question to the forum is to ask if anyone know how Buffalo bore is able to safely achieve those velocities? Non canister powders, duplex load, magic pixie dust?
And I would be interested in other experiences with the 300 grain Hornady XTP Mag or standard) in your Colt with heavy loads. Should I try a slower burning powder perhaps.

Thanks
Paul

I don't know what Buffalo Bore uses in their ammo but I have a load for 335 grain gas checked cast 45LC with 23.5 grains of H110 that clocks 1293 ft/sec from my Vaquero with 4 5/8" barrel. I didn't intend for this load to be this strong but the velocity wouldn't settle down until I was at near "critical mass" so to speak. This load is somewhat accurate but not as accurate as some tamer loads that I have made. It is a very stout load and not for the "faint of heart". The thing is, you don't need that much bullet or velocity to kill deer or for that matter elk. I put this load together for a bear defense load when I hunt in the mountains. If I had to guess, I wouldn't be surprised if BB used a whole bunch of H110/Win 296 for their loads.

Not sure what powders Tim Sundles using for his heavy 45 loads but I can tell you that 300 XTP has taken down a lot of big game.
You can look at Lynn Thompson's results with it on his Down Under video where he takes many buffalo, big hogs & other critters, all using Hornady factory ammo, plus he's a very good shot!

Dick

quote:

Originally posted by Dick Thompson:
Not sure what powders Tim Sundles using for his heavy 45 loads but I can tell you that 300 XTP has taken down a lot of big game.
You can look at Lynn Thompson's results with it on his Down Under video where he takes many buffalo, big hogs & other critters, all using Hornady factory ammo, plus he's a very good shot!

Dick

Yup, and those 300 grain XTP loads in .44 mag don't run very fast. Lynn Thompson is hell on wheels with a handgun!

Ammunition manufacturers have access to non canister powders that we mere mortal consumers do not. Also, Tim isn't afraid to tip a powder can; not saying his products are unsafe, but he will load stoutly.

quote:

Originally posted by MS Hitman: Also, Tim isn't afraid to tip a powder can; not saying his products are unsafe, but he will load stoutly.

Ain't that the truth! I have never chronographed many of his loads that haven't met or significantly exceeded his velocity claims!

Every time I re-read Linebaugh's discussion of the .45 Colt, I am re-convinced that nothing more than about 1100 fps is ever needed with this round.

i've read about 1100 fps being all ya need but haven't experienced it. i've done significantly better on large stuff with more velocity. there's a point of diminishing return with hardcast bullets but that's a limitation of the bullet, not physics. that said, modern loading manuals don't come close to the possible potential of most cartridges, the 45 colt and 454 are two examples of this, reloading data for the 454 is so downloaded versus 15 years ago it's ridiculous. the load manufacturers are giving a very very large safety margin, which isn't entirely bad but you can safely run up a 335gr bullet over 1300-1400 fps in the appropriate guns in 45 colt with h110 without breaking a sweat which is a great velocity to run that bullet at.

To keep adding powder to achieve more velocity is counter productive because accuracy will go away fast. Seeing results of 5" at 25 yards with loads too hot just shows the truth. Just why does anyone need 1413 fps from a .45? Why does anyone even shoot 25 yards?
This is an average 5 shot 50 yard group with a Vaquero using a cast Lyman boolit that weighs 347 gr from a mold that is supposed to be 325 gr. 1160 fps. This gun also shoots the 335 gr LBT at 1167 fps. I use 21.5 gr of 296 for both and both have done 1" groups at 75 yards.
No matter what BB loads achieve, is it worth it? My Vaquero has dropped deer to a little over 100 yards, off hand because it is accurate, not because it is made to break speed records.

That is superb accuracy using a load that won't overpower the shooter with recoil. If you need more horsepower that the above load then you probably need something other than a revolver. Good, heavy bullets at reasonable velocity (recoil) adds up to the number one secret......accuracy!
I shoot competition with a guy who is extremely fast, everyone raves about this guys speed with a revolver.....he always comes in near the bottom when the scores are tallied, anybody wonder why, you're right, he can't hit anything.....but again, he's fast!

Dick

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Every time I re-read Linebaugh's discussion of the .45 Colt, I am re-convinced that nothing more than about 1100 fps is ever needed with this round.

I believe John Taffin is of the same opinion.

I am not going to knock Buffalo Bore's ammo...if it works for you, use it. I found the recoil uncomfortable. Compared to others posting here I am no expert but for my purposes, and at reasonable handgun ranges (and for me that is under 50 yards), my handloads using Leadheads 270 gr Keith style bullets at a little over 1200 fps did a fine job on big hogs.