I have looked at this conversion a number of times but never "pulled the trigger" -- sorry.
It sure seems on paper like it has a lot to offer, and yet I don't often hear of it in use, nor have I seen anyone shoot one and I worked almost two years at a shooting range.
Anyone here running a Rowland on a regular basis?
This was an informative article, but it is 16 years old.

https://loaddata.com/articles/...60%20Roland%20LR.pdf

Bill, with the 10mm available now and in the original full-house loads as a factory round, there's not much need to go thru hoops feeding a Rowland.

Jon, as a dedicated handloader and bullet caster I just hate to shoot any factory ammunition, so for me that part of the Rowland equation would be the same if I were running a 10. I know a lot of guys are just the opposite.

Biebs: From Buffalo Bore Ammunition 10mm 220 grain bullet 1200fps. 460 Rowland 255 grain @ 1300 fps.

Bob, if a revolver is an option, a Buffalo Bore load puts out a 270gr bullet at 1,550 fps, so there's that. And of course you have your 454 Casull, 480 Ruger, 460 S&W and 500 S&W, 475 and 500 Linebaughs, etc. Pick your poison :-)

My list for a self defense handgun. Many fit this list.

1: you have to carry it.

2: It has to fire when you need it to.

3: It has to be reasonably accurate.

4:It has to have enough power to get the job done.

5: If it is in a caliber you can afford to practice with all the better.

When it comes to defending ones-self against bears.

Handguns have proven to be highly effective.

The biggest factor is. Having it with you.

Being willing to shoot the bear to stop it.

Just for info, here are my favorite hunting loads for .460 Rowland. I don't push it to max:

Hornady XTP 230 at 1353 fps
Ares RN FP 250 (coated hard cast bullet) at 1253 fps
Lehigh Xtream Penetrator 200 gr at 1424 fps

Pistol is based on STI2011 platform. Standard capacity 14 round magazine has installed two springs for ultimate reliability, so 12 round capacity is left.

When I change it from .45 ACP to .460 Rowland, I have to:

1 - Change barrel
2 - Put heavier recoil spring
3 - Change rear sight by 12 or 18 clicks (it doesn't change left/right, just up/down)

The gun is easy to shoot, it is not raising up, recoil is just backward, not upward. You can fire all 12+1 rounds extremely fast and accurate. But Jesus, it is loud!

Why not .460 Rowland:

It's muzzle brake makes such a mess around they will not allow me to shoot it in some indoor ranges (but they will let me with .500 S&W). Last time after two fired shots that sound canceling carpets or what on walls started to release threads flying all over the place.

Fired cases fly so far so it is hard to collect them for reloading. Also mix easy with .45 ACP cases and not easy to recognize at the first look.

If I want .460 Rowland just the most practical way, I would like to choose high capacity FNX-45 Tactical + .460 Rowland kit.

Jiri

Dang, Jiri, you don't shy away from big bores, do you?
The thing that has struck me about the Rowland just reading and watching Youtubes is that you get a quantum increase in power without an objectionable increase in recoil -- and it is of course the combination of heavier spring, compensator and the weight of the compensator. The increase in noise and muzzle blast is not surprising but I had not really considered it.
Your loads look very useful.

Veselé Vánoce!

Bill:

If interested, summarized loads (without loads development) here: https://docs.google.com/spread...PNc/edit?usp=sharing

I like big bores, small bores...but feeling from shooting big bores just last longer ;-)

BTW the same data for .500 S&W if interested: https://docs.google.com/spread...G_E/edit?usp=sharing

Merry Christmas!

Jiri, thanks for sharing your data. I messed with an X-frame Smith in .500 with the compensated 8 3/8-inch barrel and found it surprisingly controllable with 400-grain cast loads. But it was just so darned heavy -- like trying to lug around a Colt Walker.

Bill, at 83 oz, the X-Frames really push the definition of a handgun. I have rifles that weigh that. I've never had an interest in them.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Bill, at 83 oz, the X-Frames really push the definition of a handgun. I have rifles that weigh that. I've never had an interest in them.

I have a 460S@W why the price was right.

I shot enough 500S@W's to have a good understanding.

Great hunting guns.

My limit for power really stops at about 300grs at about 1500fps.

My limit for some what easy carry S@W N frames Ruger Redhawks.

I am torn between power and controllability. A 1200fps 240 or 300gr allow for a lot faster follow up shots then a 240 over 1400fps or a 300 in the 1300fps range.

But the smashing power of the faster loads is tempting. I seen my 315 gr WFN hard cast shot at 1320fps shoot through 4 feet of bear. In the chest out the back ham.

Follow up shots are a lot slower with them.

quote:

I am torn between power and controllability. A 1200fps 240 or 300gr allow for a lot faster follow up shots then a 240 over 1400fps or a 300 in the 1300fps range.

This is the reason I will prefer .460 Rowland over anything else for wild animal defense - controllability.

12 rounds accurately fired in a second, each round with adequate power. You can also mix load Hornady 230 XTPs and 250gr HCs for example.

Jiri

BTW I am not sure how good or bad could be 7.5 FK pistol.

Jiri

quote:

12 rounds accurately fired in a second

Do you mean 12 rounds fired at a second per round. 12 rounds in 12 seconds.

Not 12 rounds fired in one second.

I don't mean that literally. You can fire those 12 rounds very fast. At least from my pistol, which is equipped with huge muzzle brake and really short reset on trigger. A lot faster than 1 second for round. I am not talking about bull's-eye accuracy at 25 meters. This tool is also equipped with surefire flashlight. Made with night (wounded) wild boar tracking in mind.

Jiri

quote:

Originally posted by Jiri:I don't push it to max:

Hornady XTP 230 at 1353 fps

Jiri

Clearly, you're into 45 Win Mag territory here with a much shorter COAL. WinMag pressure is pretty salty at 40,000psi, so you're somewhere North of that. Maybe pushing 50,000psi in a 1911 design......but I guess it works, so far. Would I shoot it? Hell, yeah! Hold my beer and watch this.

Tony

quote:

Maybe pushing 50,000psi in a 1911 design

Hi TonyRumore

I use for .460 Rowland CCI 300 primers. So standard large pistol primers. They will tell you that you are going over - primers start to flatten.

There is no 800-X powder in QuickLoad, but VV N105 is there.

So I compared real world data with QL estimation of velocity and pressure. So I have an idea where is my territory and how primers look at those pressures. So when developing loads, I inspect primers very carefully for signs of excessive pressure.

Here I have to say I am NOT in flat primers territory. It just start to shape flat some way.

I also used .45 Super as source for load data development.

tl;dr: I am maybe pushing some loads up to 40k PSI, but not 50k.

Jiri

I use a G21 in 45 Super with 9" barrel, spring and guide rod changed. Empties land about 3 feet out. Buffalo Bore 250 gr rf, running fast.
Be Well Brother Bill, Packy.

Packy: What weight bullet and velocity in comparison with 460 Rowland?

230 JHP - 1360 fps
185 JHP - 1490 fps
200 cast HP - 1433 fps

I converted my Colt 1911 years ago and have never switched back.

Randominator, how has the little Burris Fastfire held up on your Rowland? Any idea of your full-house round count through the Colt?

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Randominator, how has the little Burris Fastfire held up on your Rowland? Any idea of your full-house round count through the Colt?

According to my records, I have somewhere between 300 - 400 rounds through my Rowland with full house loads.

quote:

Originally posted by Randominator:


230 JHP - 1360 fps
185 JHP - 1490 fps
200 cast HP - 1433 fps

I converted my Colt 1911 years ago and have never switched back.

Almost the same velocities as I have.

How is your 1911 controllable when shooting follow up shots?

Jiri

quote:

Originally posted by Jiri:

quote:

Originally posted by Randominator:


230 JHP - 1360 fps
185 JHP - 1490 fps
200 cast HP - 1433 fps

I converted my Colt 1911 years ago and have never switched back.

Almost the same velocities as I have.

How is your 1911 controllable when shooting follow up shots?

Jiri

The brake helps a lot as far as recoil goes. I've never done any rapid shooting with this gun.

I managed to import a conversion kit into Canada a few years ago, of course I can’t hunt with it. But I spent a couple of years playing with it definitely something I would use to hunt with.

I have a 460 Rowland and can get the same a JIRI 230 at about 1300 from a compact Glock so roughly 44 mag power from a compact semi and recoil is not bad with a muzzle break. It actually a fun gun to shoot.

I have some guns that throw brass quite a ways if I let it, but instead I put up a target stand with a USPSA target on it, stapled up high & let the fired brass hit that & most of them fall right at my feet. Haven't seen anyone mention this, maybe I missed it if they did. I know some guys like to use a brass catcher, I would rather hold a bushel basket myself.
Dick