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hey guys im thinking of a freedom arms 454 and plan on using some 45 colt for light/medium cast loads have any of you had any experience with the 45 colt in the 454 and how good is the accuracy. i haver a ruger 44 mag in a sbh hunter and a 41 mag in a smith and wesson hunter both shoot very well with cast medium loads many tks for your time ken | ||
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45 Colt loads work perfectly out of the FA 83 in 454. I shoot them in mine regularly. Now I am talking about 45 Colt +P loads  _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Unless the .45 Colt loads are fairly hot you will likely need to change front blades out if you want them to shoot to point of aim. xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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Changing blades is no big deal. If you reload, no real need to use .45 Colt brass. Just adjust your loads to what you need done. If ignorance is bliss; there are some blissful sonofaguns around here. We know who you are, so no reason to point yourselves out. | |||
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No big deal but a front sight blade costs $21 plus shipping from FA. I know, now if I could only find those I ordered.  xxxxxxxxxx When considering US based operations of guides/outfitters, check and see if they are NRA members. If not, why support someone who doesn't support us? Consider spending your money elsewhere. NEVER, EVER book a hunt with BLAIR WORLDWIDE HUNTING or JEFF BLAIR. I have come to understand that in hunting, the goal is not the goal but the process. | |||
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I own several 454's, most of them FA's, and have never had a problem shooting .45's from the same guns. You should be aware, however, that the .45's will leave a "ring" in the cylinder that should be scrubbed out before using the gun for the high-pressure 454's again. This "ring" can increase already high 454 pressures to dangerous levels if not removed. The best plan is to have separate cylinders for each of the two chamberings or, as I do, just dedicate specific guns to each of the two chamberings. When you get bored with life, start hunting dangerous game with a handgun. | |||
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I have never seen this so called ring present a problem even when the I shoot the 45 Colts and 454 loads back to back _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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It was a common practice -- and acceptable -- to shoot .38 Specials in your .357 or even .44 Specials in your .44 mag. Don't know when the practice became dangerous. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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I shoot lots of 45LC +P loads out of my 454 Casull. I use cut down 454 brass with the small primers so I can also use these loads in my Marlin 1894 CB rifle. Awesome performance. The accuracy of my FA is amazing. Most accurate revolver I've ever owned. I've never seen this "ring" that folks talk about.  | |||
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the fredom manual reccomends you buy another cylinder from them to shoot 45 lc If your gonna be dumb, you gotta be tuff. | |||
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Yes they do. But is that just another way of extracting $350.00 from a customer, or is there really a need for another cylinder? The FAs do have tight chambers, but I don't see using .45 Colt ammo in a .454 as being problematic. Ruger's .454 is referred to as a .45 Colt and .454. BFR calls their .475 a .480 Ruger/.475 Linebaugh. And, as I posted earlier, it has been a common practice for a very long time to shoot .38s in a .357 or .44 Specilas in a .44 mag. Not a new a new concept in the least. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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"Yes they do. But is that just another way of extracting $350.00 from a customer, or is there really a need for another cylinder? The FAs do have tight chambers, but I don't see using .45 Colt ammo in a .454 as being problematic. Ruger's .454 is referred to as a .45 Colt and .454. BFR calls their .475 a .480 Ruger/.475 Linebaugh. And, as I posted earlier, it has been a common practice for a very long time to shoot .38s in a .357 or .44 Specilas in a .44 mag. Not a new a new concept in the least." The 454 is a different animal than the 357, the 44 Mag, etc. -- the pressures are considerably higher for the 454 and therein lies the potential for problems. The nominal 454 pressures are 60K+, whereas the 357, for instance, is around 35K. As you say, the FA cylinders are very tight; the shorter 45 rounds will leave a carbon ring when fired from the 454 cyclinder; and this carbon ring makes a tight cylinder even tighter. Does this mean that shooting a few 45's in a 454 will automatically result in a blown gun the next time a 454 is fired? Of course, not. What it does mean is that the practice does inevitably result in the shooter reducing the safety margin designed into the gun and in an unpredicatable way. Not generally a good practice, particularly since a few scrubs with a brush after shooting the 45's will maintain the safety margins. Each to his own, but I wouldn't attribute FA's recommendations to greed -- those recommendations make good sense. Bob Baker isn't one to play games and he's not playing them here. When you get bored with life, start hunting dangerous game with a handgun. | |||
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Any crud in front of a short case just makes it hard to chamber a full length case. Never seen any harm, just clean the cylinder. The only thing I have found is that shorter brass is never as accurate yet still shoots fine for most purposes. Jacketed bullets are almost no problem at all. Lead can expand into the space in front of a short case and then has to enter the smaller throat, peeling off some lead if the boolit is too soft. I do not see any dangerous situation, only an accuracy one. Build up lead at the spot in front of a short case and you can't chamber a long one anyway. Who needs 60,000 psi in a .454? | |||
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I call BS on the need for a different cylinder. I have shot a lot of 45 Colts HARD cast bullets in mine (325 grains at 1400 FPS and have NO carbon ring or lead builder up. It is just another way to extract extra money out of one that is not needed IMHO _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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OH, OH, are you finally admitting Freedom only wants more money? I, too, have never made sense of an extra cylinder. And to charge $21 for a sight blade and near $100 for a trigger spring change, don't you think you are dealing with greed? I have a lot of Ruger and BFR front sights---FREE, FREE, FREE! I wound a new Freedom trigger spring in 15 minutes to get a 1-1/2# trigger---FREE, FREE, FREE! No, I will never stop goading you about a $2500 gun that needs more money spent on it. At that amount of money, the gun should come with two grips, a perfect trigger, a scope base, drilled and tapped, a scope, two cylinders, three sight blades and a lifetime repair and postage warranty. You should also get a leather holster, a jacket and a cap. HEE, HEE,  you left yourself wide open! | |||
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JWP is 100% correct and if you think Baker is not playing greed games, you have fallen prey! Yes, John and I have a lot of disputes but he knows what he is saying. Our disputes are friendly. | |||
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Business is business. They found a market to feed shooters wants and desires, and have been successful at it. If they are excessivly over priced, then people will stop buying. I think they should look at building a slightly larger(in height and length) frame for the 475 and 500WE. They would probably see a renewed interest in their guns. my 2 cents | |||
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Was wondering what took you so long. "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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Bob Baker posted the following in the Freedom Arms forum on GB Outdoors:
If you are interested you can read the entire thread here. To me, this is only an issue for non-handloaders anyway. I see no reason to fire .480 Ruger loads in my FA .475 LB or .45 Colt loads in my FA .454 Casull. Just load them down to the desired velocity level.  Again, I don't buy factory ammo so this is a non-issue for me. | |||
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I agree and a transfer bar system in the FA 83 would be about perfection I have about 8 FA 83's, there are fine weapons just not perfect, but very close _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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my buddy has run many many 45 colt rounds through his FA454 and there is a small small ring that has come up on the cylinder wall and it causes brass to slightly hang up if the 454 loads run through are hot enough. now before we go accusing bob of just wanting our money, don't you think that with the stupid lawsuits they've gotten stung by due to pure user negligence that somehow stuck, and if he'd seen even one damaged cylinder he'd recommend against a practice that could cause another retarded lawsuit and damage to the company? they've gone far above and beyond on little nitpicky warranty (should i say preference work) for me that i doubt wanting more money is the motivation | |||
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Proper care and maintenance is always the key. A lesson in proper care and maintenance will not leave a ring in the cylinder. Why don't they simply educate their customers instead? _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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If you are switching ammo, you just have to keep it clean. This isn't rocket surgery..... "Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming. Semper Fidelis "Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time" | |||
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This is correct, yet I still have a question regarding Bakers "etching" of the chamber. The guns are stainless and I know some of the gun steels can still rust but what about the fouling, etc, in the bore? Will the bore get etched? | |||
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I am always carefull to thouroghly clean my chambers if I shoot .45 colts in my FA .454. I don't think anyone has said the ring is anything more than fouling and it only makes since that it would foul with the short brass. DRSS NRA life AK Master Guide 124 | |||
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the issue on his cylinder is not the issue on his cylinder, it's cutting of the metal. it happened, and he's kept them incredibly clean. that said, the FA instruction manual clearly says alot of things and that didn't stop that moron from getting a jury of idiots to find against FA for HIS mistake. like i said, i don't expect bob to condone anything that could lead to another lawsuit. | |||
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+1 The issue really dates back to 22 shorts in a LR chamber- Sure there were rings formed-- cleaning was the issue much more so than throat erosion ever was- DuggaBoye-O NRA-Life Whittington-Life TSRA-Life DRSS DSC HSC SCI | |||
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I can not accept the premise of metal cutting with low pressure .45 Colt loads in the .454. Hundreds of billions of .38 specials in the .357, .44 specials in the .44 mag, .480's in the .475 and all of the other guns that can shoot many case lengths have been shot forever with no damage. I don't think I could imagine the numbers of .45 Colts shot from .454's with no trouble. Carbon and maybe some lead that will clean out. A hard boolit or a jacketed with a clean powder will leave NOTHING in front of short brass. If the Freedom chamber is being cut, they need to throw out the steel! THERE IS NO DANGER OR DAMAGE CAUSED BY SHOOTING SHORTER BRASS IN ANY REVOLVER! CLEAN THE CHAMBER! Does anyone want to buy a .45 Colt cylinder for their .454 Freedom? I can make one for about $350!  I can also bend a new trigger spring in 15 minutes but that will cost $100. You want a new sight? How about an arm and a leg? A boat and a swimming pool is a hole in the water that you pour money into, sound familiar? | |||
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I don't buy the flame cutting in the cylinder claims. Flame cutting happens to the top strap when the gas is aiming in at 90 degrees. The gas in the cylinder is not attacking at 90 degrees. Why is there no ring in front of the .454 brass? _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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