OK, we got a .45/70 BFR in the shop and are wondering who knows what the velocity possibilities are from the 7-1/2" barrel, and and what you think of it. One of the employees is trying to decide whether to buy it or not. Thanks

Tell him to buy a Freedom Arms!!!!!!!!!!
Peter.

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:
Tell him to buy a Freedom Arms!!!!!!!!!!
Peter.

That's great advice, Peter.

I have one, and it is a tack driver and about half the cost of a Freedom Arms.

Out of my 10 inch barrel I have a load at 1108 to 1115 fps with a 405 gr. bullet. I am sure I could get more , but it is a comfortable load and is very accurate.

I shot one with 7.5" barrel over a chrono several years ago using Rem factory ammo but don't remember the velocity. It had a Luepold pistol scope on top and the recoil was almost nil. I think if I were buying a larger bore wheel gun I would look for a 475Linebaugh or even a 480Ruger, as this 45/70 left me non-plussed. Maybe with good handloads I would see it from a different perspective. Who knows.

quote:

Originally posted by Luckyducker:
I shot one with 7.5" barrel over a chrono several years ago using Rem factory ammo but don't remember the velocity. It had a Luepold pistol scope on top and the recoil was almost nil. I think if I were buying a larger bore wheel gun I would look for a 475Linebaugh or even a 480Ruger, as this 45/70 left me non-plussed. Maybe with good handloads I would see it from a different perspective. Who knows.

The Rem factory fodder is rather mild, but do not discount the deadlyness of that 405 grain bullet. The only knock that I have on them is the shear size and bulk other than that I have nothing against them. They will equall and exceed a 454 at lower preuures making them more shootable. A 45-70 BFR will take any game that one would ever pursue

quote:

Originally posted by DWright:
OK, we got a .45/70 BFR in the shop and are wondering who knows what the velocity possibilities are from the 7-1/2" barrel, and and what you think of it.

The veolcity doesn't matter since it's enough to take anything in North America at reasonable ranges (say up to 100 yards).

I shot one several years ago. It was an iron sighted one and I thought accuracy was very acceptable. Recoil was less that that of a 500 Smith & Wesson Magnum.

I have a 7.5" BFR..With Garrett's 420 grain +P hammerheads they choroned 1833 fps in my Guide Hun and 1569 fps in mt BFR as well as a 525 grain cast at 1515 fps in the Guide Gun and 1300 fps in the BFR and both these loads ar under 35,000 PSI.The 525 grain lost the least velocity in anything I have measured from the Guide Gun to the BFR.

The 45-70 BFR can easily be loaded to the 43,500 SAAMI of the 450 Marlin with a 350 grain Hornady over 1800 fps.

I sure like mine...

Jayco

I really like the .45/70 BFR -- the only drawback I see is the shear size of the revolver. Unfortunately the size is necessary to house such a big cartridge. Moving beyond the mass of the gun, every one I have shot has been very accurate, and even with hot loads, easy to shoot and not abusive in the least.

The BFR 45-70 is a very pleasant gun to shoot. It is also the most accurate revolver I ever shot and shooting 1-1/4" targets at 100 yards can be done. The only limit is if you can see the target.
These are 50 yard targets and the final sight in on the right is 5 shots in 5/16" using a red dot.

quote:

OK, we got a .45/70 BFR in the shop and are wondering who knows what the velocity possibilities are from the 7-1/2" barrel, and and what you think of it. One of the employees is trying to decide whether to buy it or not. Thanks

Actually my BFR is too fast for deer with hard boolits at 1632 fps so you need to use softer for some expansion. Jacketed Hornady bullets work super. I have had mine to 1800 fps with very low pressures and recoil. But I load only for accuracy and that alone will kill anything.
I like a longer barrel with large cases so I can't comment on a 7-1/2". It is a loading experience to find the right powder and I found SR 4759 is just right.
Show me any other revolver that can put 3 shots into 1/4" or 5 into 5/16" at 50 yards and I will eat the bullets!
This revolver actually gets boring it is so accurate.
My second most accurate revolver is the BFR .475 and the only reason it is second is recoil is harder to master so 5/8" at 50 yards is good. These are .475 groups at 50 yards with a lot of different boolits.
Isn't it strange that no one else will post group pictures from the guns they recommend? Yeah, I have seen ONE accidental group but never average groups. I have HUNDREDS of targets!

Peter, show all of us. We are friends but you really need to step up to the plate.
Working with revolvers for 58 years has taught me a thing or two so if I can do this with a cheap, piece of junk, Ruger .45 Vaquero at 50 yards, can't you at least show what you talk about?
No, it is not my best with the gun, it has shot several 1" groups at 75 yards with cast boolits.

Settle down, hotrod.....

Kind of hard when no one shows anything to back up what they say. I still want to learn and after all these years I still do not know enough.
I will tell anyone everything I know in the hope it will improve what they can do even if what I have learned is not enough to make me happy.
I get out of sorts when someone recommends a boolit mold, powder, lube or primer when they do not actually know what the effect is. Every thing is the same, if something is better just show it and teach me more and help everyone else.
Keyboard shooting is just not right!
Ask me something and I will go down and test it and will tell the truth. I will show what happened. I hate blanket statements of any kind.
This has nothing to do with Freedom, it has to do with the idea that that no other gun is worth the money from one mans opinion when I can take a S&W, Ruger, BFR, Taurus, Dan Wesson or a Colt and make it shoot.
When a statement is made, show why you are right. I don't care if it is a boolit lube, if it is the best SHOW everyone.
This is what I mean. This is ONLY the difference in boolit lube. Why do you think I am pulling your chain.

Whitworth, JWP and I will show stuff but not another single poster here seems to have anything to show or help with. The three of us want to help every way we can but meet nothing but resistance.
There are a few hunters that do show and I am grateful. I might miss a few.
Stop holding back.
Whitworth tries to hold me back and he might be right but I am stubborn so forgive me.

Well guys, my attempt at humor seems to have touched a raw nerve and failed. Let me explain: the question was about buying a 45-70 handgun and I responded "buy a Freedom Arms". Now as far as I know, FA does not make a gun in 45-70. That's the joke, get it?! As to subsequent comments, here are some pictures of load development targets, most of which I have previously posted.
FA 475L mid range load:

S&W 629

Ruger Super Blackhawk:

FA 475L full house loads (5 rounds):

S&W 686:

EAA Witness 10mm:

Most of these were shot at 25 yards, except the S&W 686 which was shot at 50 yards as I recollect.
Peter.

Peter, WHY 25 yards? The very worst loads I ever made shoot almost one hole at 25. It is a waste of components.
We shoot NOTHING less then 50 and then move to 100, 200 and then to 500 meters (547 yards.)
I feel you were joking but please show that anything you recommend does what counts and how stable things are.
I don't care what it is, whether a gun or boolit or anything else. Too many boolits like the keith go to pot at 50 when they shoot very well at 25.
That is all I say, if you have a perfect lube, boolit or gun, show all, at distances where hunting takes place.
You shot very good and I like your groups but will they stay the same at longer distance?
I never recommend anything unless it works.
You did good and I can't jump on you but I read so many bad things like you should use a dead soft, hollow base boolit so it expands to fit the gun or LLA is the best lube or that hard boolits are bad and lead the bore and soft boolits are best for fast powders. I can go on for a long time with wrong things that there is no proof for.
Sorry if I rubbed you wrong but it sounded too much like a blanket statement aimed at a beginner but actually to antagonize me, only to confuse a new shooter. If he wants a Ruger, explain the ins and outs, bad and good things, same with a BFR or S&W. I will keep saying the best bang for the buck is the BFR. Notice I don't have any steeenking 25 yard targets!

bfr:
"pictures of load development targets"!
I do all my load development at 25 yards, when I have a load that shows promise, I shot it again at 25 yards. If it duplicates, then, I will shoot it at 50 yards noting any sight adjustments that are necessary, then I put it away and buy another gun!
As you can see I have a wide variety of possible hunting guns including Rugers, Smiths, as well as a semi auto in 10mm. I am not married to any bullet types. Hunting handguns are also NOT my only interest. You may want to see my posts on the Double Rifle, Benchrest and Target Shooting, Pistol Shooting, Shotgunning forums.
Peter.

That is fine except I found 25 is just too close for load work. I had too many that shot great at 25 and not good farther so I got away from it over 50 years ago.
I have had rifles, still do in fact, like the Marlin .44, that shoots tight at 50 but will not stay on paper at 100.
A revolver should shoot tight at 50 and continue to only expand groups evenly to as far as they will shoot.
That is why I will ONLY post when all is proven to work. A boolit can shoot one hole groups at 25 and MISS A DEER AT 50. If a boolit from a revolver shoots 1/2" at 50, it should be near an inch at 100, give or take a little. If it shoots 1/2" at 25, it should do 1" at 50.
I strongly suggest you only test at 50 yards to start. It might not be the gun, only your boolit, lube, powder or primer. Things can go whacko fast after 25.
Whitworth has learned this and he never shoots less then 50 unless just having fun.
I built a 1911 for a friend that will shoot 1/2" groups all day at 30 yards. I have shot several 1/2" groups at 50 yards with a Dan Wesson 1911 but when someone posts 7 yard groups it means NOTHING to me. It really gets funny. I watched a marine at Quantico shoot a 1911 to 200 meters, off hand and hit every single target. That is a man I will listen to.

OK, calm down guys; it's all good.
Looks like my buddiy is taking home the BFR, so we will see for ourselves.
I do agree with BFRshooter, in that when we test a load for a handgun, we shoot out at least 100 yards. 25 tells you absolutely nothing about how the ability to hit stuff out at any distance will do, and I to believe it is a complete waste of components. Bullets that go into one hole at 25, can take a dive or turn at 50 and be completely useless. It's only when shot at much greater distances that a load shows itself. And if it shoots straight at 200+ yards, it will certainly shoot well at just 25.

I just finished testing my 4-5/8" .44 spl at about 175 yards. Since I was able to pop a beer can a few times at that distance and kick dirt on it with the rest of the cylinder full, I figure the load will do for what I'm going to use it for. But 25 yards is useless to me except for maybe a belly gun. I truly believe that the reason most shooters can't hit anything much beyond 30 yards or so, is that they don't shoot any farther when practicing. It is amazing how many folks come into our gun shop and ask how accurate a certain revolver is. When I explain to them that I hunt ground squirrels with some of mine out around 150 yards and more; they look at me like I'm crazy, sometimes say things like " ya, well, I'd like to see that"!
If a guy wants to be able to hit stuff well at just 25 yards; then one should practice at just 25 yards, I guess.

Now, this next week, I will take home a new Ruger .44 mag stainless Hunter, and see what it will do out at 300 or so.

I thank all for their comments, and will let you know the results in the near future.
My home computer went belly up, so I will check in when I am able from the office.
Cheers!

DWright has it just the way I love to hear it. Nothing more fun then to shoot the revolver as far as you can see and to work things out to make it possible. I promote the revolver and to hear Peter stops with 50 yard sight settings only to buy another gun is disappointing with his loss of enjoyment.
Peter, if you put half the work into a revolver that you must do with other guns, you will find out that they are not a slouch and can shoot extreme distances. One revolver that can clang steel at 500 meters is better then 100 in the safe. I don't care which ones you like, just don't put them away. Spend more time with one revolver and what you learn will carry over into the rest.
I get so tired of the millions of posts about guys getting their barrels full of lead and it is because they read the old junk in gun comics and refuse to listen. Whitworth and I shot over 100 rounds of cast boolits yesterday but it had also been through a ton before and I wanted to clean the gun before we shot jacketed. I found only a few tiny flakes on the first patch and the gun was clean.
The very worst thing is when the guys with all that trouble then offer suggestions to a new shooter. They have not solved their problems so how can they help?
That and that only, is why I gripe. If you have trouble, don't tell anyone else what to do. If you have no experience, don't make suggestions.
If you don't have a load that will do 1" at 100 from a revolver, don't tell anyone how to load ammo. That applies to a gun made for 7 yards too, if it sprays bullets, don't give advise until your loads make one hole.

Heh James, will be trying out that BFR in .45-70 soon. Will let you know what I think of it. . . . . . . Cheers!

Excellent! Looking forward to hearing about it!