I loaded some rounds for the season and when went to check them they sounded very weak, the barrel of the t/c contender was very smokey and had lots of unburned or barely burned powder. after about 4 rounds I decided to stop.
I've loaded this particular combination several times before at it performed fine. I got new powder and primers, but they were the same kind as I used before.
the load is 44 mag. 325 gr LCMN beartooth, 24 grs. W296, and winchester large/magnum pistol primer.
Did I get bad primers or powder? I don't know what to think. Any advice or help would be appreciated
If the problem had been your primers,I don't think you would've had anything but misfires.By the way,that load sounds mighty hot.But back to the subject....Have you stored your powder in a poor envirment?Have you left it in a powder measure reservoir for any length of time?I've heard of cases of that making the powder go bad.
I am surpised about the primers. For all hot loads using H110 or W296 i have only used CCI-350 primers. For those large charges of slow burning (well, at least slow burning in a pistol) the Win primer just didn't get it. I had the same experience when i loaded some of these loads using the Win primer vs. the CCI. Recoil was lighter, LOTS of unburned powder and serious velocity loss. Cold temperatures will also make a big difference.
I have also see this with old powder that absorbed moisture.
mike
------------------ NRA Life Member
America, Love it or LEAVE IT!
Posts: 1574 | Location: Western Pennsylvania | Registered: 12 September 2002
When I started working with HEAVY loads for my .41s' I changed over to CCI 350s' from Win primers. Found that the Wins just didn't cut it with the increased powder levels. You say that you got "new" primers, that means fresh and not different brand, right? Same with the powder, right? If that is the case I'd check case length they may need to be trimmed. If they are a bit long it will effect your crimp. If that is OK I'd think about using CCI 350 primers. BE SURE that you back off your 24gr load and work back up with the CCIs'. BTY your 24gr of 296 although hot really isn't HOT but you are real closed to critical mass GO SLOW.
------------------ Handgun Hunter LOVE THOSE .41s'
I would switch to a faster powder or a more easily ignitable one. I have always used Vihtavouri N110 in my heavy 44 loads, and never experienced problems with unburned powder ( and thats with a skimpy 5,5" barrel). As a little plus you will probably get a higher velocity before pressure rises to an uncomfortable level. In the issue regarding primer, I can only say as all the others, use CCI magnum pistol ! Thats the best of the lot. If you want data for loading the Vihtavouri powder, just check their website. Good luck! and don�t forget to be on your watch for signs of high pressure!
quote:Originally posted by Made in Sweden: I would switch to a faster powder or a more easily ignitable one. I have always used Vihtavouri N110 in my heavy 44 loads, and never experienced problems with unburned powder ( and thats with a skimpy 5,5" barrel). As a little plus you will probably get a higher velocity before pressure rises to an uncomfortable level.
Sorry guy, but you got that bassakwards.... Faster powders build pressure faster and will not give the higher velocities. Slow burning (harder to ignite) powders will give you the highest velocity for the lowest pressure.
mike
Posts: 1574 | Location: Western Pennsylvania | Registered: 12 September 2002
Yeah I know that slower powders will produce higher velocitys at lower pressures, and that a slow powder often will be harder to ignite, but compared to the W296 I have always had the experience that the N110 will burn more efficiently and leave less unburned residue after shots with comparable velocity. Its just something I have noticed after trying lots of heavy loads in the 44 mag. I guess the W296 is comparable to the N110 i terms of burnrate, but from my point of view it seems like the Vihtavouri is somewhat more thorough when it comes to burning the entire charge. But then again this problem we are discussing might have something to do with weak primers and overloading. Thanks for staying awake!
quote:Originally posted by mssmagnum: Sorry guy, but you got that bassakwards.... Faster powders build pressure faster and will not give the higher velocities. Slow burning (harder to ignite) powders will give you the highest velocity for the lowest pressure.
quote:Originally posted by Made in Sweden: Yeah I know that slower powders will produce higher velocitys at lower pressures, and that a slow powder often will be harder to ignite, but compared to the W296 I have always had the experience that the N110 will burn more efficiently and leave less unburned residue after shots with comparable velocity. Its just something I have noticed after trying lots of heavy loads in the 44 mag. I guess the W296 is comparable to the N110 i terms of burnrate, but from my point of view it seems like the Vihtavouri is somewhat more thorough when it comes to burning the entire charge. But then again this problem we are discussing might have something to do with weak primers and overloading. Thanks for staying awake!
I have never had a chance to try the Vihtavouri powders. No one around here stocks it and i am not going to pay the $17 hazmat fee to get a pound.
I do want to try it and will as soon as i find it at a local shop. I hate to think about how much of the H110 & W296 i have burned over the years...would probably fill a 55 gallon drum!
mike
Posts: 1574 | Location: Western Pennsylvania | Registered: 12 September 2002
Thats a pity!! you not beeing able to try the Vihtavouri ! You should really try it out over the 300 grain slugs. I load them with 20,6 grains of the N110 wich transformes into a velocity of around 1400 fps. And thats within normal pressurelimits in my 5,5" Super Blackhawk. The load is published in Vihtavouris online manual so I guess its not to hot (wich probably means that I have the chance for some extra velocity if I care to try a bigger charge). If there is any chance of me helping you to some N110 (or any other thing thats easier to come by here in Sweden) just let me know. /Peter
Thanks! I am sure one day i will find it in my travels. I have noticed from the data i have seen that it produces higher velocity with lower pressures.
Sounds like a good one.
mike
[This message has been edited by mssmagnum (edited 11-17-2001).]
Posts: 1574 | Location: Western Pennsylvania | Registered: 12 September 2002
"Slow burning (harder to ignite) powders will give you the highest velocity for the lowest pressure."
This statement applies to rifles where the long barrel gives enough time to burn the charge effectively. In a short pistol barrel, part of the slow powder will simply been thrown out unburnt producing a considerable muzzle flash and decrease in accuracy.
Go for a faster powder. Even N110 is too slow for my cal .50 gun. I tried RWS P805 (just to find out if my theory is right) - good results. As P805 is in the Bullseye area, this is a bit extreme, and you may be happy with Blue Dot or W540. No need for VV powders.
What I do not like is the small amount of powder in the case. I tried a filler, but no improvement, only a safer feeling.
Posts: 367 | Location: former western part of Berlin, Germany | Registered: 25 August 2001
