I’ve been getting the itch to get back into handgun hunting. My first venture was Hog hunting in Texas with a S&W Performance Center in 44 mag. After seeing their tenacity I graduated to a Freedom Arms Premier in 454 Casull. Now years later I’m wondering if a 454 is a bit too much for Whitetails and the like, but it would be nice to still have that power if needed for something else.

Since I don’t want to get into handloading for another caliber(s), I’m thinking:

44 Mag/44 Special
454/45 Colt
475 Linebaugh/480 Ruger

With these options I’d have a full-house load for hunting and a lighter, less-expensive loading for practice/plinking, except perhaps the 475/480 combination. The revolvers that are capable of handling the heavy loads are:

Freedom Arms 83
Ruger Super Redhawk
Ruger Super Blackhawk
Mag Research BFR

Now to go searching the market. Any thoughts?

I was enamored with an FA83 from the first time I handled one. I actually placed an order for my own that same day. I've a Field Grade 6" in 475L that I've loaded from very mild cast/TrailBoss loads through probably midway up the load charts with heavy cast, enough to make my wrist hurt after a cylinder full. The fit and finish is just incredible.

In your shoes, I'd go 45 Colt in an FA83 and have a spectrum of factory available ammunition that ranges from very mild cowboy loads to whatever torture pills the likes of Buffalo Bore can produce.

Come to think of it, I've been meaning to drag that 475L out to a treestand to try to pop a deer one of these years....

I took a Whitetail with my FA 454...pretty cool way to hunt.

Just down load the 454 as needed.

Or use 45 LC for a light load.

Biebs,

You already possess, in my opinion, the finest single action made! You would be downgrading with the other three. As has been noted by p dog shooter, one can just load it down or if you want to fire the 45 Colt case, why not just send it back to Freedom Arms and have them install an extra cylinder for that cartridge. Some folks just shoot 45 Colt in the 454 cylinder but I am not sure I agree with that as a long term solution. The reason being that using the shorter case in the longer chamber can possibly cause gas cutting on the cylinder wall. The 454 operates at a significantly higher pressure as you already know. My original loading sheet from the factory shows pressures as high as 55,000 CUP using a 300 grain Freedom Arms bullet at 1780fps (max load)
The theory is that when you use the longer case that it could cause the case to get stuck on the gas cutting ring from the shorter case during extraction. I do know if this gospel but I did talk to Bob Baker many years ago and he indicated to me that his recommendation was to get the extra cylinder. Maybe he wanted to just sell the extra option, maybe, maybe not. He seemed like a really standup guy to me when I ordered mine 454/45ACP/45 Colt. It does seem to make sense at some level I suppose, but I am not a smart enough person to figure all that out scientifically.

On a side note, It is nice to have the 45ACP, lots of factory loads for plinking and small game at close range. The other cartridges that you mentioned are good ones no doubt. I also find the Linebaugh cartridges fascinating. My question would be, in reality how much do you really gain with them and factory loads are fewer.

JP

John, ammunition is certainly a consideration. unless I want to get into handloading for yet ANOTHER caliber. The Linebaughs and 480 Ruger ammunition is quite pricey. A 44 Mag/44 Special combination seems like the best option, or 454/45 Colt if I want to up it a bit.

Jon,
I hunted NY whitetails exclusively with a 629 44 and then Super Redhawk in 454 through the 80s and early 90s.

Don’t have either of those anymore but do have an Anaconda 44 plus S&W 460 and 500.

Of all of them I’d say the 44 is the most versatile and easiest to get ammo from plinkers to hammers.

But I really like the 500.

I bought a Ruger SBH Bisley in .454 Casull shortly after they were introduced. Throats are on the large side (.456"), and the cylinder gap is too (.008"). The grips, like every every factory Bisley I've seen, are terribly fit. Accuracy is sufficient for my purposes. Prices on Gunbroker have been skyrocketing lately, however (I've seen used specimens sell in the $1,500 range).

As you likely know firsthand, the Freedom Arms M83 is the king of the heap, if money is no object (as others have mentioned, FA pricing for fitting a new cylinder is quite reasonable). I have a fair bit of experience loading for one in .500 Wyoming Express. It's quite a lively piece, but that's to be expected of a round of this class. My one complaint has nothing to do with the firearm (brass is no longer produced, and the fired stuff goes for about $10 a piece on the auction sites, so now I swage my own). Also, I don't find the grip frame to be ideal for mitigating heavy recoil, though to a large extent that's a matter of personal taste.

That being said, in my opinion, the BFR is the best value on the market today, at least for a big bore single action. Fit and finish are several notches above a Ruger. Even the short cylinder models are substantially bulkier than the Rugers or FAs (which may or may not be a positive, depending on what you're looking for. Mine is a long cylinder model in .500 S&W, but I imagine a .44 Mag would be a delight to shoot). Current pricing is a bargain considering what you get, and quite possibly less than what you'd pay these days for a Ruger. After some reflection though, I'd say their factory grip frames leave much to be desired.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
John, ammunition is certainly a consideration. unless I want to get into handloading for yet ANOTHER caliber. The Linebaughs and 480 Ruger ammunition is quite pricey. A 44 Mag/44 Special combination seems like the best option, or 454/45 Colt if I want to up it a bit.

Hi Biebs,

Also neglected to mention that with the much lower pressure of the 44Mag/Special I don’t think you would have to worry about the supposed potential chamber pressure ring issue of the 454/45Colt. Folks have been using the 44’s interchangeably for decades with no issues, if you order from Bob Baker at FA it would be a interesting question to ask him though.

JP

The gun makes a world of difference in the 44, 45 Colt or 454. A Ruger Redhawk 45 Colt can handle a steady diet of the 50,000 psi "5 shot" 45 Colt loads. Not so in the SBH or Blackhawk. The cylinder is much beefier in the Redhawk.

The Super Redhawk ( or Redhawk) in 44mag or 454/45 Colt is one heck of a gun. I have a good buddie that loads his 44mag loads approaching 454. The beefie cylinder allows for it. He's taken Dall Sheep, Goats, Moose and Griz here in AK with the 44mag in his Redhawks over the years. Hot loads that you don't want to shoot in anything else except an FA or SRH.

I have a SBH Bisley Hunter 45 Colt that is a fabulous gun. I've taken a few Sitka Blacktails with it on Kodiak Island. Load was a 355gr wfn at 1200 fps, probably a 30,000 psi load. Max psi for that gun. Also good bear protection load.

A few years back I finally got a FA 454. What a gun. I took a Dall Sheep with it this last August. 240gr Hornady xtp mag at 1900fps. Put him right down at 70ish yds. This would be a fabulous load for whitetail. Hit's like a 300 wby.

The 454 in the FA will handle the 60,000 psi 454 loads that Dick Casull developed and give rifle like accuracy because of the tight tolerances. It's in a league of it's own when loaded to what it was designed for. No other factory 454 can compete with the FA. Perhaps a custom 454 built by one of the top builders might get you there but if a guy is gonna go custom. Might as well get a 50 something!

I have a Gallagher/Bowen/Rowen 500 Linebaugh and took a moose with it a few years ago.

They all have their place but truth be told. The FA 454 will do all any handgun hunter will ever need. That's the problem with the FA 454, it's the only gun a guy needs! But where's the fun in that!!

Snyd,

Super nice Bisley, love the octagon barrel, well done!!! Nice Animals as well but I am a gun guy first LOL


JP

quote:

Originally posted by JPetroni:
Snyd,

Super nice Bisley, love the octagon barrel, well done!!! Nice Animals as well but I am a gun guy first LOL


JP

What type of finish?

No turn marks on the cylinder, no bright spots from holster wear.

Every blued gun I ever owned and carried. Shows them just after a little use.

Yes, that's gorgeous!

Biebs, you may be in luck. I have several hunting handguns that I plan on selling, just haven't got around to it yet. I will post on the appropriate forum but here is the list:
1. S&W 629-1 44 mag. 8 3/8" barrel. Scoped.
2. Ruger New Model Blackhawk 45 Colt. Stainless. D&T for red dot mount. 4 5/8"
3. Ruger 44mag. New Model Super Blackhawk. 7 3/8"
4. Freedom Arms 475 Linebaugh 6" Red dot.
I will sell 3 out of the 4!
Peter

quote:

Originally posted by p dog shooter:

quote:

Originally posted by JPetroni:
Snyd,

Super nice Bisley, love the octagon barrel, well done!!! Nice Animals as well but I am a gun guy first LOL


JP

What type of finish?

No turn marks on the cylinder, no bright spots from holster wear.

Every blued gun I ever owned and carried. Shows them just after a little use.

That pic is right after I got it back from Bowen. After having the gun for a few years I had sent it back to John Gallagher (RIP) for a few things and while he had it the cancer took hold of him and he died. Bowen finished it up for him. Originally it was matte blue finish, this is a higher polish. It hasn't seen the inside of the Thad Rybka holster since I got it back but it will eventualy. So, that's the "shiny new" pic. Here's a better one!

Synd, you've certainly "been there, done that" with big bore revolvers!

Synd,


Really like how there is an integral buttress on the barrel to give the front end of the ejector rod housing support. Super nice detail. I also like the front barrel band that Hamilton Bowen does on his Nimrod model. But yours is the way to go if one does not want a banded barrel.


JP



Formerly JPaul

quote:

Originally posted by JPetroni:
Synd,


Really like how there is an integral buttress on the barrel to give the front end of the ejector rod housing support. Super nice detail. I also like the front barrel band that Hamilton Bowen does on his Nimrod model. But yours is the way to go if one does not want a banded barrel.

JP

Formerly JPaul

There is an interesting background story to that barrel. John Gallagher(RIP) made that barrel and also made octagon barrels for his friend Hamilton Bowen. Years ago, John Linebuagh had some heart problems which resulted in some hefty bills. John Gallagher made a bunch of octagon barrels in various calibers and was selling them as a fundraiser for John Linebaugh. I was gathering parts for my custom 500L and I got wind of it over at the Single Action Forums. A member there was handling all the sales. I contacted him but the barrels were gone. He suggested I contact John Gallagher directly to see if he perhaps had any left. John had one left... 5.5" .510. Just what I wanted. Integral ERH lug and site base. I went ahead and had him do the build. It started life as a Blackhawk 50th Ann. Ed. 44 mag. flattop. Plowhandle grip frame. John G did the Bisley conversion, etc. Rob Rowen who studied under Roy Fishpaw did the Dall Sheep grips from a Ram I killed in the Brooks Range.

A storied piece for sure.

Synd,

Great Story with that one, a fine example of top shelf craftsmanship by some of the best, and something to be proud of.

JP



Formerly JPaul

Wow Snyd, that's pretty impressive considering the open (long range) country you shot the deer and Ram in. How long were those shots?

I imagine there was some stalking involved.

Tony

I wound up getting a Ruger Super Redhawk in 454 Casull/45 Colt. I wanted to be able to use heavy loads, but also have a light and cheap plinking/practice load, which the 45 Colt provides. The size and weight of the revolver should help mitigate the heavy recoil of full-house loads.

Good choice I have been thinking about one also.

What length barrel did you get.


Personally I limit my handgun loads to a 300gr bullet at 1500fps or so.

Sure my 45-70 my 460S@W can shoot them faster. But I don't like it.

Plus a good 300gr bullet at that speed even a bit lower well shoot through feet of flesh.

I wanted the 7 1/2" barrel to optimize ballistics. It will be a hunting gun, not a carry piece.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
I wanted the 7 1/2" barrel to optimize ballistics. It will be a hunting gun, not a carry piece.

One doesn't carry hunting handguns.

I carry my 7.5 inch red hawk in a custom chest rig. I even have carried it in a strong side pancake suspenders required.

In cold weather one can conceal about any thing if one wants to.

My BFR 460 10.5 and my 14" contenders in a chest rig.

Jon, congratulations on choosing the Super Redhawk in .454. Very versatile revolver.
Are you going to mount a scope on it?
I agree with P. Dog that a chest rig is the way to go with the larger hunting handguns.

Bill, I like to use open sights with hunting handguns. It makes it more challenging, like bowhunting. To me, if I needed to scope a handgun, I'd just use a rifle.

Hi Biebs,

Great choice on the Super Redhawk. In my opinion, the strongest of the double action revolvers available. Nice to see you went with the 454/45 Colt combination setup as well, best of both worlds in regards to power and target loadings in factory form. I think you will have a better selection of factory loads for the 45 Colt verses the 44 Special cartridge. And let’s face it, the 454 with full pressure loads will do whatever needs to be done with a hand gun.

JP



Formerly JPaul

Yes, and the extra weight and beef of the Super Redhawk will make the heavy 454 loads easier to handle. I'm doing 325gr hardcasts at 1,325 fps now.

Jon, I took 325 GC hard casts over as much 296 as I could stuff in when my dad and brothers and I went fly-fishing on a tributary of the Stikine out of Wrangell. This was a Redhawk stainless 5 1/2 inch in .44 Magnum in an inexpensive Uncle Mike's Cordura shoulder holster. Rig carried well and I was relieved not to have to use it as the brown bears there were huge and could be on you in 20 feet along the creek bed. We would see their huge footprints on top of ours of each previous day.
That load was not much fun to shoot.
Your Super Redhawk will be kinder to your hand, I would bet!

Put those big ugly Hogue rubber grips on.

They make such things easier to handle.

George

quote:

Originally posted by georgeld:
Put those big ugly Hogue rubber grips on.

They make such things easier to handle.

George

Yes they do.

Besides my single 6 I do not believe I have wood grips on any of my handguns.

A bullet in that weight range at around 1300fps is a very good killer.

The bears I have shot and known to be shot with a 44 315gr WFN hard cast at that velocity haven't argued much.

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Yes, and the extra weight and beef of the Super Redhawk will make the heavy 454 loads easier to handle. I'm doing 325gr hardcasts at 1,325 fps now.

Biebs,

That should definitely get it done, nice.

JP



Formerly JPaul

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Yes, and the extra weight and beef of the Super Redhawk will make the heavy 454 loads easier to handle. I'm doing 325gr hardcasts at 1,325 fps now.

Congrats on acquiring a fine firearm. FYI, the 240gr Hornady XTP mag pushed into actual 454 territory would be devastating on whitetail. It's one reason I chose it to kill that Dall sheep. I loaded it to 1900fps in my FA 454. Mushroomed and killed like a rifle round. Put him right down and was not a CNS shot. That's the great thing about the 454. you can go "heavy and slow" or light and fast. My moose hutning load is a 340gr at just over 1500

quote:

I loaded it to 1900fps in my FA 454. Mushroomed and killed like a rifle round. Put him right down and was not a CNS shot.

I have thought about loading some 185 or 200 gr JHP's in my 460S@W at max velocity.

To shoot varmints with.

Should blow them up just fine.

Biebs, rather funny you picked up a Ruger SRH - I just found one in .480 Ruger - a cartridge I've wanted for ages.

Fun times and definitely looking forward to some hunting this year with it!

Rob, I like the 480 Ruger as well, but I wanted a cartridge where I could substitute lower power and lower cost ammunition without having to reload. The 45 Colt in the 454 accomplishes that.

If you want a lighter load, your gun might handle the 475 Linebaugh? :-)

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
I’ve been getting the itch to get back into handgun hunting. My first venture was Hog hunting in Texas with a S&W Performance Center in 44 mag. After seeing their tenacity I graduated to a Freedom Arms Premier in 454 Casull. Now years later I’m wondering if a 454 is a bit too much for Whitetails and the like, but it would be nice to still have that power if needed for something else.

Since I don’t want to get into handloading for another caliber(s), I’m thinking:

44 Mag/44 Special
454/45 Colt
475 Linebaugh/480 Ruger

With these options I’d have a full-house load for hunting and a lighter, less-expensive loading for practice/plinking, except perhaps the 475/480 combination. The revolvers that are capable of handling the heavy loads are:

Freedom Arms 83
Ruger Super Redhawk
Ruger Super Blackhawk
Mag Research BFR

Now to go searching the market. Any thoughts?

Just use 45 Colt ammo for deer.

You're right, it works just fine on Texas whitetails.