I am new to reloading. A friend of mine has been doing it for years and told me to pick it up. I have bought some IMR 4350 and 165gr Sierra Game king bullets (BT). I was wondering if anyone has loaded a similar load and if so how many grs work the best for you.
Do a test series in half-grain increments because that's the best way. Start 5 to 7&1/2% low and work your way up. If they are Sierra bullets, you can call their hotline and get a recommended load, and it'll usually be very close. Your rifle will probably not shoot another's favorite load without some experimentation, anyway. These components are a great starting place. You could try WW760 or H414 with magnum primers, too. Geo.
Posts: 305 | Location: Indian Territory | Registered: 21 April 2003
If it was me, then I'd start at the starting load and go in 1 grain increments up to the max load. Have your friend show what to look for for high pressure indicators. I would load 4 rounds of each. What you might observe would be your group size will get smaller with increasing loads to a point, then start to open up again. If you get anything in the 1" or smaller range, then be happy and load them all up there. If you want to play more, then adjust the powder charge in small increments above and below the point where you got the best accuracy. Then you can adjust the seating depth also. I usually start with the bullet seated .01" off of the lands and normally don't have to adjust it from there. The 1grain increments should be fine in a rifle case as the percentage difference is smaller than with a pistol case where you might want to go .5gn or smaller increments. I load 60-61gns RL22 and a Rem 165 core lokt in my 06's and get sub 1" groups with all of them. Have fun and be safe.
Posts: 2924 | Location: Arkansas | Registered: 23 December 2002
I'd agree with Tod, 57grs. of 4350 should give you very good results, Just got off the phone with Carroll @Sierra, and he told me the hunting load with that bullet is 46.4grs. of RE15, which just so happens to be my favorite powder, and will flow very well through a powder measure, that being said, sell or leave the 4350 for some other project and get some Re15, another good thing about it is, it's not temperature sensitive, Jay
Posts: 1745 | Location: WI. | Registered: 19 May 2003
One of the 4350's (Hodgdon, Accurate or IMR) and any decent 165 grain bullet are about the perfect match in an '06. Somewhere between 55 (start here) and 58 grains of it, assuming standard commercial brass, and you should be in great shape.
Since you are new to loading, see if your friend will help you out for a while, until you get the hang of things. Get a few different loading manuals and do some reading on techniques, what to watch for, etc..., too. Can't beat knowledge.
R-WEST
Posts: 1483 | Location: Windber, PA | Registered: 24 January 2001
I've tried a number of different powders for that bullet including H4350, Varget, Re19 and Re 22. I would not use Re15. I feel it is too fast for this weight bullet and the max powder charge doesn't come near the neck. Same with Varget. I prefer a powder that fills the case. As per the Hodgden manual my load is 59 grains H4350 but I've also got good results with Re19. Re22 seems to be a mite slow. It fills the case before reaching the velocities of the other two. Most manuals list IMR4350 a little lower than H4350 so between 55 and 58 grains ought to be good for you. I've found that Sierra gives very low charges in their manual. I think the max in their manual is around 56 for that bullet and H4350. The Hodgden manual used the same bullet and went up to 59 grains. Just goes to show each gun/pressure barrel is different and you MUST start at the starting loads. Using a chronograph can tell you when you have reached a max load even if it differs from what a manual says. If it takes X grains to get a 165 grain bullet to around 2800 fps from a 22" barrel, then X grains is your max and should be safe in your gun. Without a chronograph the safest bet is just to stick with published loads. Just my $.02!
NoCAL
Posts: 167 | Location: Woodland, CA USA | Registered: 11 February 2002
Hey NoCAL!! Did you ever get that '06 to generate the speed it's supposed to? I remember we discussed it about to death last year (or was it the year before that?? - memory's goin' ).
R-WEST
Posts: 1483 | Location: Windber, PA | Registered: 24 January 2001
R-West, I seated the bullets a little deeper, shot it on a warmer day with the same load (59 grains H4350) and BAM; 2830 fps. That's all I ever wanted. The accuracy stayed the same so I'm finally happy. I could get the same velocity out of Re19 but it wasn't nearly as accurate. I was always under the impression that seating deeper lowers pressure and might lower velocity but whatever it did, the speed is right where it should be now and I'm not arguing. I've got a 400 yard range cloes by now where I intend to shoot this spring but right now that gun is off getting the "locking bolt shroud" removed. Purely aesthetics you understand.
NoCAL
Posts: 167 | Location: Woodland, CA USA | Registered: 11 February 2002
Seating the bullets shorter decreases the size of the combustion chamber, causing pressures, and velocities, to rise, if all other factors remain the same.
What O'AL did you end up with? My '06's always seem to like anywhere from 3.24" for the more blunt R-P Core-Lokts up to 3.29" for the pointies, like the 168 B-Tips.
R-WEST
Posts: 1483 | Location: Windber, PA | Registered: 24 January 2001
You'll find that the maximum loads of 4350 with the 165 grain bullet pretty well fill the case and are compressed somewhat by the bullet. Be careful with boattail bullets. As I learned the hard way myself, when you seat them with tubular powder up into the case neck, powder kernels get trapped between the bullet base and case neck, bulging the case so it won't chamber. With boattails I stick with loads that don't fill the case above the base of the neck.
Posts: 1325 | Location: Bristol, Tennessee, USA | Registered: 24 December 2003
I have owned and loaded for about a dozen .30-06 rifles, using a variety of powders over the past 36 yrs. I dislike to constantly experiment as I have 32 rifles to "feed" and it gets time consuming.
I have never found that the slower powders such as HH-4831 and RE-22 will match the results shown in many loading manuals-this after extensive chrono tests with different chronos and rifles.
My favourite '06 load is the Nosler Partition-180 gr. over 57 grs. IMR-4350 with mag primers. I loaded just about 1000 rounds of this last year for my 5 .30-06 rifles and it shows sub-MOA accuracy with NO pressure signs during last summer"s hottest weather, this in both Win. and Fed. nickle brass. One needs to "work up" to these loads as they are functional MAX and the effort is worth it for hunting all game in Grizzly country. If, interested, start at 52 grs and go up a grain at a time, I use three round groups, two groups of each and I test in the hottest weather-it works.
R-West, I can't remember what the OAL is now. I'll measure some when I get home but then I'm off for a duck hunting trip all weekend. I post the measurements then.
NoCAL
Posts: 167 | Location: Woodland, CA USA | Registered: 11 February 2002
"I have never found that the slower powders such as HH-4831 and RE-22 will match the results shown in many loading manuals-this after extensive chrono tests with different chronos and rifles"
RL 22 matched the data presented by Nosler to the 'T' in my old Hart 24" heavy barreled 06, making 2876 fps using 180 gr Nosler Ballistic tips-- same barrel length as Nosler's 24".
One of the reasons those speeds aren't matched by sporters is the length and dia of the throats... more gas goes around the bullet before the seal is accomplished.. and being normally 22" in length. #22 and #25 by Alliant match the speeds quoted in manuals in the 270 Win too using only 22" barrels BTW.
My Marlin Sporter makes 2820's to 2840's again 22" bore shooten #22 with 180's [Sierra]. This clocked at 70 degrees using 210Match and 250Magnum primers.
Posts: 1529 | Location: Central Wisconsin | Registered: 01 March 2001
I was refering ONLY to the bullet I used, the 180 Nosler Pt. and all of my rifles have been factory barrels in various lengths from 20"-24"; the five I now have are a Pre-64 FWT, two Brno ZG-47s, a Browning Safari and a Mannlicher-Schoenauer. The Win. will do about 2760 with 4350 with fabulous groups with the Nozzie, but, would not touch 2700 with RE-22 or H-4831.
You are right about the custom barrels, I have had Harts, Shilen and SGW and shot various others; the tight quality control and custom chhambering definitely make a difference, But, my '06s give 2725-2775 with my load and average under a M.O.A., so, I'm content. I very seldom use a .30-06 for anything, but I "need" them, you know how that is....
I share your enthusiasm for the Re-22 in the .270, I get 2900+ from my pair of Pre-64 FWTs and the newer barrel will put 3 into .5" at 100 yds, consistently, these are 150 Partitions.
The differences in our rifles and loads may be frustrating, at times, but, they also make this interesting!
I am sorry, my friend, I have never shot a 130 gr. bullet in a .30 cal. rifle in my life. I have shot 150 factory loads, but, that was 30+ years ago. I prefer heavy, premium bullets for the hunting I do and tend to buy conponents in bulk and load a large supply at once as I have the storage space. In your hot, humid climate this is probably not a good idea as ammo deteriorates more rapidly under such conditions, or so I am told by friends who lived and hunted in Africa.
I am sure someone here is shooting the bullets you want to use and can help out.
Quote: Can't help you with a 130gr load, but I do have a great 125gr Ballistic Tip load for you:
51gr H4895 WLR Primer Winchester case 3.255" OAL
5-shot group = .590" Biggest spread was vertical, making a perfect cross (Church style). There's only 4 distinct bullet holes visible.
Someone ran Quickload for me (23" barrel) and it gave about 2950fps. This should be a great load for deer.
Gonzo, Do you really think a 125BT bullet is 'great' for deer? No doubt it would kill a deer , but how far are you going to have to track that sucker when that bullet blows up on the shoulder of the deer, I'd think that Nosler might have intended that bullet be used for vermin and such. I remember an article in a past Guns&Ammo where Bob Milek was guiding this fellow he called "Nimrod" that used that same bullet on an antelope hunt, after the bullet hit the antelope, it led them on a merry chase of about a mile, if I remember correctly, and when they finally found the 'lope' it took 2 more shots in the neck to put him down for good, save the 125s for yotes not lopes. Jay
Posts: 1745 | Location: WI. | Registered: 19 May 2003
I'll say up front that I have never put, or seen put, this bullet into a deer. But I will say that at the speed I'm talking about it should be a reasonable bullet for deer. Muzzle fps is less than 3000fps, so why not?
I don't know what the other guy was using, but of course a 300 Ultra Mag would vaporize this little bullet.
Posts: 557 | Location: Various... | Registered: 29 December 2002
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