The powder situation seems to be getting slightly better, but its still quite difficult to find most pistol and shotgun powers. Who knows when the supply will truly meet the demand.

Though in these times when consumers are as hungry as they’ve ever been for their favorite powders, why in the world are the powder companies spending their advertising efforts and production resources introducing new powders?

Wouldn’t the logical business model be to have every production shift focusing all their efforts on producing what everyone is clammering for - rather than trying to convince us to try powders with little or no loading data? It seems like everyone who even knows someone that reloads is searching high and low for powder. Right now I would think the powder business is as close to a license to print money as you can get in the reloading supply world.

Is their concept to move reloaders away from some of the older powders and they are betting that people will be so starved for powder that they’ll try anything they can find? Thereby trying something new, liking it and moving away from their old loads? Or at least burning a bunch of new powder searching for loads?

Some people really enjoy the process of working up new loads, but I think most of us find it rather miserable to be pushed away from our established loads and finding the need to start from scratch with a new powder with very little data.

Thoughts?

It seems pretty stupid to me as well.

There was more than enough variety as it was.

While I agree with the above mentioned comments there are reasons for new powders and dropping SOME old ones. Many powders are manufactured by a company and then sold to another company who markets those powders. Eg Hodgdon does not make all the powder they sell under the H or IMR brands. If the manufacturer raises the price beyond what the marketer feels the market will bear they will likely drop that powder. I heard a story that that is what happened to the IMR 4007 powder. I've also heard that the 3 new powders that IMR are bringing out are completely environmentaly friendly in their manufacture and use. I'm sure many will use a powder that leaves no toxic residue in the manufacturing process. Some older powders may lag in sales,some may not burn as clean as a newer powder etc. These are all likely due to be discontinued.

I think Military usage drives the Powder manufacturing game. Our military is now using "green" bullets so Copper fouling will be a bigger problem.

When would be a better time to bring out a new powder than now?

Not to mention, there may be advantages to these new powders, such as the copper fouling, and new production techniques likely enhance the bottom dollar versus some of the older powders.

And, some people just like new and shiney.

well, another view...

if I have just invested millions in R&D for a new powder, have high demand for any powder, have plans to eventually phase out old powder...then; I would limit production of old powder and devote production resources to new powder to drive adoption of the new powder...

Hmmmm....
Wonder if we are going to see a huge advance in propellants like the advances we have seen in bullets over the last 20 years?
Could be interesting.

quote:

Originally posted by graybird:
When would be a better time to bring out a new powder than now?

Not to mention, there may be advantages to these new powders, such as the copper fouling, and new production techniques likely enhance the bottom dollar versus some of the older powders.

And, some people just like new and shiney.

That was my 1st impression, too!

What better time to bring out new reloading powders than when many reloaders are having to change and work-up new recipes because their old tried and true powders are in short supply.

What better time to introduce new powders? Let’s face it for Hodgdon and Alliant it’s all about profits and if it’s not, their stake holders will remind them. Hodgdon makes no powder themselves rather working as a master distributor reselling powders made domestically and internationally. Alliant being recently split off from ATK makes some powders and supplements their line with purchases from overseas. No doubt they are all looking at their offerings, historic sales volumes, cost to produce / obtain, supply sources and the competitive landscape.

Slow movers and expensive powders to produce / obtain are on the block. Hodgdon has said it is discontinuing production of the following by the end of this year; SR4756, SR4759, SR7625, PB, Pyrodex Pellets, IMR 4007, Winchester 780 and Winchester AA Lite. With powder in such short supply, how many will notice they are gone from the shelf? More often we are thrilled when we find something that will work. Knowing that they can sell all that is produced only pushes them toward low cost, large profit margin, high volume products and let the others ride.

As much as we like to think of the consumer reloading market as a driver, I am sure in the grand scheme of things the real market drives are large volume government contracts and ammunition manufacturer sales. Their interest in product features, offerings and cost set the tone for their R&D and product development. The downstream reloading markets gets this as “New & Improved”. Currently with supply short we often buy it because it’s what we can find and then their job of new product introduction becomes so much easier.

The world market has become so much more competitive. The expertise to produce quality powders no longer resides in North America or Western Europe. The fall of the former Soviet bloc, the rise of Asia, economic recessions and others have put product into the world market. With sagging world economies and lower overhead costs and or subsidized production costs these pricing may well be attractive. We here in the US are indoctrinated into the “Wally World” concept of looking for that low every day price. This is not unique to us as consumers but extends to corporations as well striving to improve the bottom line. Our suppliers recognize that and react to the market dynamics all too often purchasing foreign production to keep cost low rather than to invest in domestic infrastructure and the hassle that can come with it.

Unfortunately none of this is new, the Auto industry is a shining example of change. Often we can get some real quality products from it as manufacturers are forced to compete. Should the supply return to “normal” some new dynamics will be in place but supply and demand will always be a dominant factor.

I've been reloading for more than 50 years. Many of the powders I used were developed in the 30's and for WWII.
These new powders are great. Im my day The powders were IMR4895 and IMR 4064. The "others" had to be proved. The new-fangled "Ball" powders.

Todays powders are Triple based. Lower chamber pressures and the fastest velocities you will see.
Give these new powders a try before you condemn.

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktailer:
Hmmmm....
Wonder if we are going to see a huge advance in propellants like the advances we have seen in bullets over the last 20 years?
Could be interesting.

And what advances would those be? Although more manufacturers are now offering monometals, plastic points, and bonded core bullets, those have all be around for decades.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktailer:
Hmmmm....
Wonder if we are going to see a huge advance in propellants like the advances we have seen in bullets over the last 20 years?
Could be interesting.

And what advances would those be? Although more manufacturers are now offering monometals, plastic points, and bonded core bullets, those have all be around for decades.

True but they are more widely available and consistent than they have ever been.
It wasn't that long ago that it was hard to find accurate, consistent bullets. Today you can take your pick.

I believe the real reason is to give us more options in powder that is not available. That way we can have less time to reload with powders that we don't have, giving us more time to try and figure out where to find the new powders that will probably also be unavailable.

On the other hand, reloaders are notorious for hoarding, possibly the manufacturers are simply taking advantage of our weakness?

Canister powders for handloaders are but a drop in the bucket compared the market for commercial and military loading. If there are advantages to discontinuing some lines and introducing others on the commercial, military level then Hodgdons will adapt, print new labels and learn to sell them and the handloaders will likewise adapt to what is available.

In my teens and 20's I wanted high pressure and speed.

I actually enjoyed working up loads.....in the back half of my 40's not so much.

Load work up is no longer a joy so new powders and bullets equal new work....I have enough work to do already.

I learned through the years that being a handloading hoarder is not a bad thing.

Maybe advancements in technology would have occurred with or without a powder shortage. I am not so sure that one has anything at all to do with the other.