hey guys. just started reloading. after navigating through some problems with some lee dies (replaced by rcbs) i have a question. in the current hornady book, it list overall length of a 8x57 mauser with a 195 grain bullet at 3.250. is this right? it seems like too much of the bullet is out of the shell case, plus the cannelure is nowhere near the mouth of the brass. is the hornady book wrong? is it a typo? i need help, please!

That is probably correct - the 8x57 is a long-throated bugger by CIP spec, and even American reamers have rather long throats. At that OAL, the bullet is still mkaing full contact with the neck, so don't worry about the cann sticking out - its only cosmetiically displeasing, nothing more.

BYF, COL is determined by three major factors: Magazine length for function, neck tension, and contact with the actual rifling. Depending upon the actual usage for your reloads you control what is best for your rifle. As a general rule of thumb, the further out (longer)the better, however as we get actual contact with the rifling pressures will begin to rise. But seating to deeply is worst offense in my opinion. Good luck and welcome to AR

cool. thanks guys. i was worried there for a minute! i knew about the bullets touching the rifling, resulting in high pressures. that's one of the reasons i asked. knew i could find an answer from one of the pro's on AR. thanks a lot, i appreciate it. 308 sako, like the ram mounts! thanks again!

Another thing to consider. If you really want to crimp into a cannelure, corbin makes a roller that will roll them into the bullets. Of course that is only if you REALLY want to crimp into one...

All of the M98Ks that I have are throated for an O.A.L. in the neighborhood of about 3.150" with the bullets I have tried. (Nosler and Sierra) It will vary some with different bullets, but seldom more than .025"

Try this;

Take a fired case and bring a resizing die down onto the case until you just feel the neck being reformed.

Try to insert a bullet.

Keep experimenting until you get the neck sized to a point that will allow a bullet to be seated with some resistance with your fingers. You should just be able to seat a bullet with your fingers with difficulty.

Now, "smoke" the shank of the bullet, just barely seat it into the case, @ this point you want to mke sure the O.A.L. is long enough to jam the bullet into the lands, then chamber the cartridge.

The smoked shank will tell you if the grip of the lands have pulled the bullet back out of the case.

Try this several time until you are sure that you are getting the true length of your throat.

An O.A.L. about .010" shorter than the length that contacts the lands should be a good place to start.

Hello,
I would find me some bullets without the cannelure and as a rule of thumb, "one caliber in the neck..." If it is a 308, 323, 375 diameter bullet you are shooting, see if that amount of bullet will fit in the case neck and still feed in the mag, be reasonably close to the lands and grooves and you are good to go. Again, old rule of thumb and not perfect for all cases and would prefer determining the "jump" and seating accordingly.
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dsiteman

If you want to know the OAL you need for any bullet in any rifle..take a wooden dowl and insert in down the barrel from the muzzle to the closed bolt face..and then mark it at the muzzle with a ballpoint pen....NOW put a bullet (bullet only) and push it just snugly into the lands in the chamber..then with the same dowell inserted in the muzzle, push it down until if makes contact with the bullet then mark it on the dowel at the muzzle...NOE measure the distance between the two marks...then seat your bullet about .015 deeper in the case, check to see if it will fit in the magazine, if its too long for the magazine the the magazine itself will determine seating depth, which is usually the case anyway except in custom rifles...

PS on the above...You must do this with every bullet make or weight that you intend to use as all bullets have a different shape..

Ray ,, The ol' dowel trick? ... I heard that only works with a special rare, very expensive, precision dowl made from manzanita wood from a island off the coast of new mexico.

Finally, a system I can understand!

that sounds like a good way for OAL. I been dicking around with candles, black ink and gauges all night, and have come up with some screwed numbers, to were I dont trust my self.

thanks ray. i've heard of, and seen, guys "smoking the bullet". this seems like a much easier way. will go to lowe's, menard's, or home depot and pick a dowel up. thanks again everyone!

You guys are making it to complicated. You dont need dowels ,smoke,ink, witchcraft, dead chickens, or mirrors.

the only grip I have about my Remmington MNT rifle is that the darn Mag is so short I am limited to loading at least .04 off of the lands with ballistic tips or sst's. Any sugestions???? Beats me why a gun maker would cause such a problem.