Greetings, all!

I'm trying to make .25-20 WCF brass by resizing .32-20 brass, and am not having much luck. So far I've tried Remington, Winchester, and Starline brass with the same results- longitudinal folds along the neck.

So far I've tried using a .25-20 sizing die (Lee), tried using the seating die as an intermediate step, tried bumping it down a little first by using a .30 carbine size die... I even tried building a tool with three rollers tapered to match the shoulder profile, mounted on ball bearings and held on a plate in the chuck of a lathe while the case was fed into it held in a shell holder mounted to the carriage (this was a disaster, by the way!).

I've tried different lubricants- vegatable oil... RCBS case lube... even 100% STP. No help- the brass is still trying to fold over itself at the neck.

If anybody can offer any suggestions, I'd be forever in their debt.

Porosonik.

Looks like it might be your dies.
I grabbed just a random piece of fired 32-20 brass and ran it into an RCBS sizer, no annealing or anything, and got a perfect 25-20 case.

My Redding dies form .32-20 cases into .25-20s in a single pass using Imperial sizing wax. Don't use too much of a liquid lube. You might try using the seating die before the sizing die, the former are usually larger and stress the brass less. You are using NEW brass, right?



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So far I've tried both virgin and once fired brass. I guess it could be the die... I've never had a problem with Lee before, but that doesn't mean I don't have a problem with this one.

Since it looks as though everyone's out of stock on .25-20 form/trim dies, I think I'll look around and see if I can find a .270 or 7mm size die and cut it down so that I can use it as an intermediate step in the process. .32 to .25 is a pretty big step to make in one pass. It looks like I'm trying to push too much brass into too small of a circumference all at once, and the excess finds it easier to fold over on itself than to extrude forward.

Thanks for the input- I'll keep working on this and report back!

Porosonik.

OK- found an RCBS .25-20 form/trim die at Midsouth.... waiting for delivery.

Porosonik.

That should do the trick with ease.

I hope so. Over the years I've squeezed down all sorts of different cases; .30-30 to .30 Herrett, .30/06 to .25/06, .45 Colt to .44-40 etc- and never encountered anything like this.

Now that I think about it, I've always used Pacific or RCBS dies for necking. Might just be a case of different surface finish.....

Porosonik.

quote:

Originally posted by Porosonik:
I hope so. Over the years I've squeezed down all sorts of different cases; .30-30 to .30 Herrett, .30/06 to .25/06, .45 Colt to .44-40 etc- and never encountered anything like this.

Now that I think about it, I've always used Pacific or RCBS dies for necking. Might just be a case of different surface finish.....

Porosonik.

You can easily change the surface finish. Have a machine shop or someone with a lathe polish it with 500 grit wet or dry paper wet with a light oil.

The usual trim die has a neck about .005 larger than a neck die.

Sounds like a worthy home shop project- I'll give it a try.

Porosonik.

you do know the rims on 32-20 brass is thinner than the rims on 25-20 brass is...
you know... headspace.

SAAMI standards list the rim dimensions of 25-20 and 32-20 as exactly the same.

The 1911 vintage M1892 I have is already a little on the long side headspace wise, it'll almost close on the no-go gauge- but not quite. Not having any issues with losing cases, but I'm going to try headspacing on the shoulder and see how it works out.

Porosonik.

This is a bottle-necked case, for handloaders the rim is there just for extraction purposes. Both my .25-20s headspace on the shoulder and case life is unlimited, even with loads a bit above the SAAMI limit. I neck size all brass and so far (20+ years with both firearms) have had no chambering issues with an M1894CL and BF pistol.



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it may show that.
but i absouluely positively have to go find 32-20 brass for my 30 carbine revolver.
or i have to file down the case head on 25-20 brass to allow the cylinder to rotate.
kinda sucks as i have a couple of 25-20's and no 32-20.

Gentlemen, we have SUCCESS!!!

The Brown Truck delivered my new RCBS .25-20 trim die this afternoon, and I put it to work straight away. Formed 100 starline .32-20 into .25-20 with a loss rate of only 5%,and that was because I was using a little too much lube on the first couple dozen.

I learned a couple of things: a). this case is very susceptable to lube denting. b). this denting occures on the neck, and not on the shoulder like other cartriges I'd formed. And c). while necking down, even the slightest lube dent on the neck is an invitation to overlapping. Lesson learned!

It turns out that lubing about every fifth case with just the residue left on my fingertips (using cannola oil) is plenty of lube. I didn't loose any more cases after switching to this.

By the bye, regarding the rim thicknesses, the new Starline .32-20 brass I have mics .059" to .060", while the once fired Winchester cases mic .061" to .062". Close enough for Govt. work. Also, I mic-ed some M1 Carbine reloads I had lying here- they mic .352" just ahead of the extractor groove, and the Starline .32-20 brass mics .347". Should fire form out ok to make a rimmed .30 carb. as long as the rim will fit between the frame and the cylinder.

I'm happy now. Time to order up a bunch of brass and get busy!

Porosonik