I've looked at various internet links, including herein, and the only place I've found load data from a really trusted source is accuratepowder.com. http://www.accuratepowder.com/load-data/

I'm looking specifically for loads with 350 gr bullets, such as those made by Speer, Hornady, Swift, Woodleigh, and perhaps others.

On the accurate powder website, it looks like the best loads use their 1680 powder, burn rate which is not too fast - not too slow.

I specifically want to avoid Lil'Gun powder, and I'm reluctant to mess with H110 or W296, which are mag pistol powders.

I would consider H4198 as well.

I'm on the verge of ordering some of the Accurate 1680 and a box of the Woodleigh 350 gr RNSP.

I already have a supply of the Hornady 350 gr RN, and the reason I want some of the Woodleighs is to basically develope the same load for each, but with the Woodleigh they are bonded core.

Also, has anyone had experience with this specific bullet?

Woodleigh Bullets 450 Black Powder Express (458 Diameter) 350 Grain Bonded Weldcore Round Nose Soft Point Box of 50

https://www.midwayusa.com/prod...soft-point-box-of-50

I use 38.5 -4198 for 350 grain and 42 with 300 grain. My notes show I also use 38 grains for 400 grain. 44 RL7 with 300 grain I also use.
Lil gun is too fast to operate my rifle, which has a mid length gas system. Long gas systems don't work with most powders. I made a few for experimentation.
They don't go fast enough to warrant expensive bullets; just my opinion.

Thanks for the feedback. That's good right away.

Is that H4198 or IMR 4198?

My rifle is the carbine system.

I tend to agree with your opinion about not fast enough to warrant expensive bullets. My other experience with .458 bullets is in a 458 WM, with various reduced loads - from about 1100 fps to about 2400+ fps - 300 gr - 405 gr. The faster loads were with Barnes 350gr TSX.

Of course the SOCOM produces 1600-1750 or so fps with the 350-400gr bullets. So, that's a blessing, and I agree that premium bonded bullets are not needed and may act more like a solid at SOCOM vel.

This is a new experiment for me. There is a lot I don't know, yet. One thing I don't know is whether Canadian law prohibits an AR15 with 16" barrel.

I was just considering options. I have nearly a box of the Swift 350 gr flat nose 45-70 bullets.

Also, the reason I refer to Accurate powder website is because they have published load data for the 458 SOCOM.

They show loads using their LT30, which is apparently a new powder, which has a burn rate nearly identical to 4198. as I read it.

The LT30 they say is a single base powder, small grain, like H4198. With 350 gr bullets the data shows the loads are compressed.

Here's what they say on their website about LT30:

The second in Accurate’s line of benchrest-grade Light Target powders, LT-30 is optimized for use in the .30 BR cartridge. While still in its development phase, LT-30 was used to win numerous matches, even claiming a world record along the way. With a burn rate similar to 4198, this single-base fine grained powder is at home in many smaller capacity cartridges including the 6.5 Grendel and .222 Remington.

The 1680 has been out for several years, and it's a double based spherical powder. The loads they show are not compressed, with almost identical velocities.

Here's what their website says about 1680:

Accurate 1680 is an extremely fast burning, double-base, spherical rifle powder that is well suited for large capacity, high performance handgun cartridges such as the 454 Casull, 460 S&W and 500 S&W. 1680 is also an excellent choice for the 22 Hornet and 7.62 x 39, as well as other low capacity rifle cartridges. Made in the USA.

IMR. I tend not to use most powders invented in the last 40 years; what I used back then, still works for me.

Yes, I understand.

However, if we applied that thinking across the board, we wouldn't own a 458 SOCOM, nor be exchanging ideas through cyberspace.

BTW, I most certainly appreciate your feedback.

I would find it interesting to know some of the things you use your 458 SOCOM for, besides just fun of course like hunting - deer, hogs?

I plan on using mine for hogs, for fun of course - certainly not because the hogs are so large and fierce hereabouts that I NEED a 458 SOCOM. I already have an Armalite AR10 in 308 hog whacker, carbine with a stainless match grade barrel, which IMO is a real beast of a firearm. This isn't about need - it's about want, and why not.

Here's a picture of my 458 SOCOM. I assembled the upper myself. Bought the parts and tools from Brownells. I already had the receiver clamp block and I bought a new 4" forged vice off Amazon for the project. I had been wanting one for a long time anyway.

The barrel is Satern. I used a thread protector (off Amazon) instead of the break than came with the barrel. I can't stand the blast breaks produce. I can stand recoil much better in the woods. The forearm is Armalite - old style - that I've owned several years. I bought the tool for the barrel nut from Armalite, to ensure that it fit properly. I really like that old style free-float handguard from Armalite because it takes a traditional sling and the stud is threaded in a reinforced ridge inside the handguard.

That's a Leupold 1x4 sitting on top that I've had for several years. I used it on my 458 WM, but the recoil from the heavy handloads gutted it. I sent it back to Leupold and they fixed it, supposedly - yet to be seen. When I get ammo, I'll try it. The main great feature of this scope, IMO, is the eye relief. It's plenty for a hard kicker, but one has to be careful at the bench. Notice that I have it mounted way forward. The Leupold base and rings with the cantilever provides the proper positioning of the scope easily.

I watched the videos on Brownells and Midway and the assembly was simple enough.

I've owned the lower for several years, but since I sold the upper I haven't used the lower. It has a custom trigger that I had a gunsmith install. I think it's a Timney. It's very crisp anyway - no take-up. Initially it was a Remington in 30AR. I didn't like the cartridge nor the upper. It just wasn't accurate. So, I sold the upper and kept the lower.

Now, it's re-purposed and seems good. I really like the way it handles and feels. I have no ammo yet, so haven't experienced the recoil yet. But I'm having fun.

I put the camo tape on the shiny barrel today. It's gorilla camo tape (Amazon) in the same pattern as the lower. Quick and easy solution to shine stainless.

I do not shy away from new things just because they are new; I just have stocks of old powder.
I use it for hogs; it works very well, like the 45-70 it emulates.
I build my own barrels; I designed the reamer; I call it the 11.6 SPC; the commercial name is owned by the guy who developed that cartridge known as the 458 Socom.
I will email you a picture of my personal rifle if anyone wants. It has a 26 inch barrel with a brake; I have no use for those stubby ones. Personally.

Now that's interesting. The long barrel and especially the brake. I had an Encore in 45-70 once, with a break, short barrel, and hated it. Got rid of it right away. Since then I've had a very bad opinion of brakes.

I read somewhere, and it made sense to me at the time, and still does, that a long barrel on the 458 SOCOM defeats some of the qualities of the cartridge, as I understood it. From what I studied, the short barrels - 10 to 15" - and the long barrels are counter productive. The sweet spot is 16", as I understand it.

I dearly love a carbine. In the AR15, to me it's magic. One of the prime reasons I wanted a 458 SOCOM is because it was attuned exactly to the carbine platform.

Anyway, that's what I have, and I intend to explore it and enjoy it to the most that I can.

Many would say that the 308 in a carbine is just not right. I disagree with that too. I dearly love my 308 AR10 carbine (16" barrel) hog whacker. It's a DRT combo.

Building your own barrels is interesting, but way beyond something I want to do. I firmly believe that building a barrel of the quality of the Satern, for example, is way beyond my budget and capability and learning curve. I truly like it that I can pay the money and order one from Brownells, and truly expect precision and accuracy.

Post a picture of your rifle here. No need for email. Thanks

Give those Horn and speer 350's a try, they are plenty tough at the speeds a socom give.
I used both in a 45/70 on warthog,kudu, eland and everything else in those weights. Broadside penetration on big kudu with horn. 350 grn flatpoint @ 2000 fps or so. The speer seemed a little tougher jacket then Horn. The rifle was transferred to my pal in Namibia, he has used it on another hundred or two animals since.
What about Re.7? I find it does best with a good crimp to help pressures build properly, but should be one to check out.

Magine; I have no photo host since PB decided to hose everyone with their $400 a year tax.
So if you want to see it, I have to email it to you.
Yes, 16 inch might be "optimum" to some, but I still get velocity out of a longer barrel. And balance. And cool looks. It is not a rifle you carry when busting down doors in the city.
Yes, Back 40 knows; the Speer is tougher than the Hornady, so on most things it gives better penetration; goes through the things I have shot with it; deer and bear. No African experience like 40 has.
I have used RL7 but it is harder to get so I don't use it any more.
Back to Magine; the only way to "insure precision and accuracy" is to do it yourself. Myself that is. Not that I don't trust others, but the fact is, I don't.

Lots of good feedback. Thanks.

From all I've read and from personal experience, I already knew that the Speer 350 gr was tougher than the Hornady 350 gr. I'm not sure how that translates to the SOCOM, but I suspect that the Hornady is the better choice, if one wants mushroom assured.

Yes, on the RL7. I've used it a lot in my 458 WM for various loads for the top vel with 300-350 gr bullets, and as I recall, without checking notes, I used it with 400 gr bullets too. I used lots of different powders with the 458 WM and I can't remember them all, but again I found the cartridge very flexible.

From what I know now, I do not believe that the 458 SOCOM is as flexible as the 458 WM, in all regards. That's why I'm looking for THE powder to serve my needs and concentrating on the 350gr bullet. Everything else will be measured in comparison. I do have a substantial stash of the Remington FNSP 405gr bullets which of course I would like to use.

I just have the notion, from some experience, that a little faster powder than RL7 would better serve the 16" barrel of the SOCOM.

I have a stash of the Accurate 2460 powder and wish I could use it with the SOCOM, but I think it's too slow, and will make a big muzzle flash from the unburned powder. It's a hunch. Been there type of thing.

dpcd, I use https://imgur.com/ for posting pictures. So far it has worked easily. I was using photobucket, but it got to be a real pain even before they required subscription.

In many aspects of life, I have found it necessary to trust others. Sometimes it works out and sometimes not - about the same ratio as everything. I've used many makes of barrels and settled on PacNor - for one thing and the prime thing, I've had zero failures with them - 100% success dozens of times can't be beat. I've read nothing but positive reviews of Satern, so for this 458 SOCOM I felt confident with the purchase.

I can't even imagine making my own barrel, any more than I can imagine making my own powder.

I do not have IMGUR. If you want to see my rifle, PM me your email. Otherwise....
You are right; the socom is limited in scope; it was made as a hammer to go on an AR platform; in a bolt action there are better choices in 458 caliber.
I use only Douglas barrels; after using most all the others,
Douglas are by far, the best, most responsive, and accurate. and very nice people to work with. And make more calibers than anyone else.
When I say, "making" I mean, contouring, threading, chambering, etc. Not actually drilling and rifling one. Douglas is best at that.

I misunderstood what you meant by "making" barrels. I thought you meant from scratch - drilling the bore and rifling and all. I've used Douglas barrels several times, also with 100% satisfaction. Now that I'm thinking about it, my success with custom barrels - the barrels themselves - has been all 100% satisfaction.

It's just that with PacNor, I could get them to contour to my specs, chamber and install a barrel which was a blessing to me because I didn't have to send the project to multiple gunsmiths to finish the barrel instillation. They even trued the action in some cases where needed, and at the least inspected it. I can remember in one case they called me and informed that the action I had sent was not a good choice, and wanted to know if I wanted to proceed anyway, or send another action, or what. That's service.

On at least three projects, I had to order the reamer for them to use. I ordered from the reamer maker they suggested, and in two examples I can think of, the reamer maker coordinated with the custom shop at Redding to have dies made which matched perfectly with his reamer specs.

With the 458 SOCOM, I think of it as the limitations of the AR15 platform are acceptable, since the platform itself has so many good attributes. It just like practically all things re firearms, one has to respect the design limitations. I don't have much use for pistols, so I look at the AR15 carbine in 458 SOCOM as my substitute for a big bore pistol - on steroids.

My favorite deer cartridge has become the 6.5 Grendel. I have two AR15 uppers so chambered and one bolt action in 6.5 Grendel. I used to have other uppers, but have traded or sold them. I gave a buddy deal on one to my Texas buddy, and that's all he now uses for deer and hogs. He demonstrated it to his buddies at his deer lease, and many of them converted as well. And his son became a 6.5 Grendel convert. The Hornady factory ammo is so accurate and reasonably priced that handloads offer no advantage.

I wish for Hornady 458 SOCOM ammo for $22 a box.

quote:

Originally posted by dpcd:
I use 38.5 -4198 for 350 grain and 42 with 300 grain. My notes show I also use 38 grains for 400 grain. 44 RL7 with 300 grain I also use.

Back to the loading data.

I always cross reference load data I see from unpublished sources, with two or three other reliable sources, preferably published manuals.

So, lets cross reference your loads.

For starters, IMR 4198 and H4198 are on the same line in the Burn Rate chart per Accurate Powders. http://www.accuratepowder.com/...10/12/burn_rates.pdf And they are slightly slower than A1680. I don't know how the kernels compare between IMR4198 and H4198. I think they are both single based extruded, and Hodgdon says the H4198 is small grain for metering well. A1680 is double base spherical powder, and we know it meters well.

Accurate LT-30 duplicates 4198 burn rate, and they show loads for it in 458 SOCOM in their published data. It shows the loads are slightly compressed. I don't know if that's good or not good.

Your load: 38.5 -4198 for 350 grain

Max load per Accurate LT-30 is 40.4 gr with Hornady 350 gr RN bullet for 1663 fps - compressed load.

http://www.teppojutsu.com/down...ckload_330_solid.pdf

This site doesn't show loads for the 350 gr, but they do for 330 gr. They show H4198 and IMR4198 at 39+ gr for velocity of 1748 and 1800 respectively.

Your load: 4198 38 grains for 400 grain.

teppojutsu shows 36.38 gr of IMR 4198 as max for 405gr bullet.


Your load: 44 gr RL7 with 300 grain

teppojutsu shows max 42.72 gr RL7 with 300 gr JHP bullet 99% load density.

Barnes shows 37 gr RL7 as max with their 300 gr TTSX

So, your loads seem to compare favorably with what published data I can find. At least by following std procedure to work up, your loads won't blow up my rifle. I would probably stop at the max published load.


So, what are your thoughts on compressed loads?

There are numerous loads shown on teppojutsu website, apparently compressed loads. I'm presuming that the "fill %" column means compressed when the number exceeds 100. I don't know it the "fill %" means over the top if in excess of 100 or if the reference point is the base of the bullet. If over the top, then I don't know why they would even list such loads as presumably viable. Over the top means to me that the case capacity won't allow that much of that powder to fit in there.

Once I have some empty cases, I can answer that question quickly. The reason I need the answer is because I'm specifically interested in using A 2460 powder if its not too slow, because I have lots of it. teppojutsu website shows loads for the A-2460 - 46.71 gr with 405 gr bullets, with 103 fill %.

I finally found something else interesting. I've been looking specifically for published tested load data for the 458 SOCOM. Accurate powders has such data. teppojutsu shows load data but says is from Quickload and they haven't tested them.

Anyway, I found another source:

http://shootersworldpowder.com...lInterior_072618.pdf

They have a burn rate chart which shows their SBR SOCOM 458 specific powder to have the same burn rate as 4198.

They also show 458 SOCOM load data. 34.1 gr gets 1730 fps with a 350 gr bullet.

Here's what they say about their powder:

This propellant is a high density, double base, ball powder optimized for use in the 458 SOCOM. SBR Ammunitions' extensive research and development of the 458 SOCOM cartridge had determined this powder is an excellent choice for moderate to heavy bullets in the 300 gr to 450 gr weight range.

SBR-SOCOM yields high loading densities and optimized velocities with low Standard Deviations (SD) values, not only in velocities, but in chamber pressure. The 458 SOCOM is a low pressure cartridge, operating at a maximum 35,000 psi and this powder optimizes this, producing clean and consistent performance. If you seek accuracy, the low SD with the internal ballistics performance translates into excellent accuracy across the range of bullet options.

The SBR-SOCOM spherical powder has good flow characteristics through a volumetric powder dump. Loaders will find that this powder is very consistent in weight charges, especially if one is loading for accuracy.

Due to its cleanliness of burn and incorporated flash suppressant, there is virtually no muzzle flash with SBR-SOCOM in the 458 SOCOM.

Summary:
Shooters World SBR-SOCOM Smokeless Powder is a clean burning, low flash, spherical powder that is very consistent in weight and perfomance. It’s a high density ball powder optimized for use in the 458 SOCOM.

Specifications and Features:
Optimized for use in 458 SOCOM
High density, Double base, Ball powder
Low Standard Deviations (SD) values
Good flow characteristics through a volumetric powder dump
Clean burning
Flash suppressed
Virtually no muzzle flash

If I was going to wring out everything, I would add Benchmark and H 322 to the mix. In the same class burn rate wise, and being a bottle neck case might work well.

Yes, there are several powders available in that burn rate range.

The issue for me is finding published load data references.

This website shows H322 and H335 for the 405 gr bullets. H335 might be the better choice, except that the burn rate chart on Accurate powders shows it to be approx. H4895. http://www.teppojutsu.com/down...quickload_405_sp.pdf

The same site, different chart for the 325 gr shows benchmark at 110 fill%. It may be too bulky. Benchmark falls between H322 and H335 in burn rate. http://www.teppojutsu.com/down...uickload_325_ftx.pdf

Anyway, these are Quickload data, and they say they didn't test them.

I'm going to order some brass, dies, etc. soon, then I can start finding out what powder will fit the case to start with. I think I have some H335 and H322, and probably several others that are on the site mentioned above.

I don't have any A-1680, yet.

I have found H335 to be very user friendly in small case, medium/large bores. #5 rem for example. I have a 336 marlin in 35 with a 16" barrel. It is no problem to get 2100 fps with H335. A marlin will let you know with a sticky lever before you get into pressure problems.
I wouldn't be afraid of working up my own load in a 458 socom. Crono each load as you go, extraction, lack of, or violent along with vel will let you know where you are at. Pressure curves being the big issue, finding which powders give you what you are looking for, and still properly work the rifle.

I primarily use H110/W296 for the Socom. I use the Barnes 300 TTSX for hunting, 300 grain conventional bullets from the various manufacturers for plinking. My upper has a 16", carbine gas, McGowen barrel. Very enjoyable rifle, lots of punch in a compact package.

From info on the 458 forum I gather that mid gas uppers need to use powders in the 4198, Re7 range to function properly.

On their burn rate chart Accurate powder shows their magnum pistol powder No.11FS on the same line as H110 and W296.

This in part is what they say about the powder:
No. 11FS is intended for full-power loads in magnum handguns and smaller capacity rifle cartridges. This double-base spherical propellant was developed with an eye toward personal defense and incorporates a flash-suppressant that substantially reduces muzzle signature in low light conditions.

It's practically a clone of H110 and W296 powder, yet they show no loads for it in the 458 SOCOM.

Your mention of the Barnes 300gr TTSX caused me to search for Barnes data, lo and behold I found it. http://www.barnesbullets.com/w...016/03/458-Socom.pdf

They don't show H110 but they do show 296 and A-1680.

IMO, the Barnes 300 gr TTSX is a very useful bullet - but expensive. I've loaded them for my 458 WM at about 1800 FPS MV, and they are very accurate in my rifle. I haven't shot anything but targets so far, but I am using my rifle with those loads in hopes of getting a hog before the weather turns warm. If I didn't already have several boxes of other suitable bullets, I would load the 300 gr TTSX for the SOCOM.

Here are pictures of dpcd's 458 SOCOM, which he gave permission to post:





It's easy to see why maybe the slower burn rate powders would better suit the barrel length.


I'll post another picture of my carbine for comparison.



The reason I chose the Leupold base and rings is to get more eye relief, besides the Leupold quality. Even as little as 1/2" matters to me on a rifle with significant recoil.

Also, I don't mean to criticize, just discuss preferences. I suppose I'm traditional, and prefer the smooth handguards, with the traditional sling stud, without all the gnarly rails. I have no intention of hanging stuff on my rifle except the sling and a traditional scope. Although I do have plans to buy an Eotech Holographic sight like this one http://www.eotechinc.com/holog...pon-sights/model-512 I think it will attach easily to the rail on top of the receiver, and the rail over the handguard not needed.

The Armalite handguard - old style - is what I gravitated to when I first got into ARs, and stuck with that style. It has a reinforced ridge on the lower inside and the sling stud threads are thus substantial.

Although I have magazines with more capacity, I prefer the short ones, because they are lighter, and don't get in the way as much, and they are enough for my needs. The one shown is four rounds, with one in the chamber. If I need more than five shots, then I've made a mistake in judgment.

Besides, I consider my rifle first and foremost a hunting rifle. And I think in Georgia, the regulations limit the capacity of semi-auto rifles to five rounds. Although I've never seen an enforcement officer out here, sometimes I walk in plain sight of the road, and ya never know who may drive by. I don't want unnecessary attention.

Also, I prefer a crisp trigger pull, with no take-up. So, I had the original trigger replaced. I can't remember the brand now, but it may be a Timney. It's crisp. The charging handle is ambidextrous. I believe Remington used DPMS lowers on their 30AR experiment.

Today I started with the handloads for the 458 SOCOM. I was expecting it to be relatively easy. So far it's been tricky.

I ordered powder, primers, brass and Redding dies from Graf & Sons and bullets from Midway because they were on sale.

The powder is SBR SOCOM and the bullets are the Barnes 300gr TTSX. I tried to get the components and dies that would be as close to a sure thing as I could find.

I did find out that the rifle is accurate, but I expected that.

The problem is feeding. I haven't yet got it to feed reliably. One thing I found out quickly is that the bullets will contact the lands if seated even slightly long.

I tried four different bullets, two Barnes 300 gr, Hornady 350 gr RN, and some Remington FN 405gr. None fed reliably.

So, perhaps tomorrow, I'll go back to the Barnes 300gr TTSX, since they were designed specifically for the SOCOM.

Also, with the Redding dies, two die set, I had to seat the bullets with the die backed way off the roll or tapered crimp, then remove the seating stem completely from the die, then reset the die so the crimp would do its job.

It's kind of awkward and slow, but gets it done. A three die set would be better. It looks like I need to get a third die just for crimping. That way once I find my load, I can set each die properly. I see that Lyman makes a four die set, with a go-gauge, which I'm considering.

As I said, I'm pleased with the accuracy it demonstrates. I only tested the 405gr for accuracy so far. And the recoil is not nearly as bad as I expected.

The feeding is a bit of a mystery. IMO it should be feeding properly. I'm not sure where to focus my attention in correcting this issue. Could it be the magazine? I'm using one that I got from Brownells that is made for the 450 Bushmaster and supposedly the 458 SOCOM. It's a single stack of course, and based on my attempts today it looks like all I can get in the magazine are four rounds, and it will not seat under a closed bolt. So that means I can't put one in the chamber and four down. I'm limited to four. I'll be shopping for another magazine.

Here's something interesting, perhaps relating to my feeding issues:

It's a one-star review of Hornady two-die set for the 458 SOCOM, off Graf website.

https://www.grafs.com/retail/c...oduct/productId/6768

Watch Out Hit or miss dies for 458 SOCOM
By John F. on Sep 29, 2012
Good day,
Please beware w/ these dies and the 458 SOCOM. Been a solid Hornady customer and have always received peak performance from thier products.......Until now. I saw the die reviews and called hornady techs to ensure problems mentioned in the other reviews were fixed.

Hornady swore that the problems were no longer an issue. Bought the dies....in March 2012.

Built my reloads......Constant jams, bolt lock ups, and ejection problems w/ my RRA. Thought the problem was the weapon. RRA worked w/ me for 3 months, sent parts, and was awesome. Had same problems w/ Corbon ammo. Called Hornady and Corbon and discussed. Both said undoubtedly was the RRA rifle. Worked w/ RRA and Tech there asked if I was using an SRB case guage. Said no and bought one.

Surprise! None of my reloads were w/in spec (neither was the corbon ammo). Passed my discovery to Hornady and my 3 months of wasted time. Was asked a million questions on reloading techniques. Provide 5 page write up and sent in resizing die w/ spent brass (at my expense). Another two months wasted.

Hornady wrote back that die was in specs and said all they did was polished the die. Insinuated nicely, I was not using dies properly and my error (been reloading for 45 years and never have had a problem).

Funny thing. Now resized cases just barely meets specs...Still tight in case guage. Note: All reloads and factory ammo meeting case guage specs.....Feed and eject perfectly.

I told Hornady after all the trouble I went through and the fact they swore the problem was not their dies, they should do something for time and trouble. Basically told me nicely..my fault..their dies were perfect....

I'm very disapointed. Going to buy the Redding Dies now and no longer use Hornady products due to the very poor customer service. They're great talking to you, but if their fault....will not admit and will not compensate......Very sad 30 + years of buying Hornady products...…

Lessons learned for other SOCOM owners:
1) Buy a case guage first and ensure all ammo meets specs
2) RRA is awesome for customer service - even when not their fault!
3) Corbon ammo was out of spec, but they will take care of you
4) Listen to the reviews even though you have had good luck w/ a company and their products.....Hornady too bad for you in the future!

=================================================


This may be the remedy:

https://www.midsouthshooterssu...-458-socom-4-die-set


DESCRIPTION
MSR Precision Die System 458 SOCOM Die System with Gauge

by Lyman Reloading

Product Overview

Midsouth now offers the Lyman MSR Precision Die System 458 SOCOM. The MSR set of dies has been specifically designed to support reloading for the Modern Sporting Rifle (MSR). Each set comes complete with a Taper Crimp Die to ensure a solid crimp on the bullet, a Small Base Sizing Die to ensure your cases are within SAAMI standards, a seating die for seating bullets and a neck expanding M Die. The M Die will allow you expand the neck for use with flat base bullets that can be hard to align with opening the neck area. This kit will be everything you need to get started reloading 458 SOCOM.

Specifications and Features:
3 Die Set
Precision Machined High Grade Steel
M Expanding Die

================================================

https://www.lymanproducts.com/...sion-die-system.html

Here's what Lyman says on their site:

Lyman’s MSR Die Sets are the only die sets engineered specifically for MSR ammo and are a must for anyone reloading for a modern sporting rifle.
• Ammo Checker cartridge “Go” gauge included with each set
• Available in 223/5.56, 6.8 Rem. SPC, 300 AAC Blackout, 224 Valkyrie, and 308 Winchester 3 die sets and 450 Bushmaster, 458 SOCOM, 9mm, and 50 Beowulf 4 die sets
• Small Base Size die for smooth chambering
• Separate Taper Crimp die for tight bullet grip
• Packed in a sturdy, clear cover storage case
• Black finish matches your favorite “black” rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by hogfarmer:

my socom loading procedure is:

1. Any semi auto brass that's picked up in the dirt is De-primed and tumbled to clean the inevitable dirt.
2. The brass is lubed and run through the Lee size die sans expander button to set the shoulder.
3. Brass goes through the Hornady sizing die because I prefer the neck tension.
4. Tumbled again to clean lube.
5. After priming and filled with appropriate powder charge, bullet seated with the Hornady seating die.
6. Lee FCD to crimp the round.
7. Load magazine and hunt for hogs.

I just ordered a Hornady die set and the Lee factory crimp die. I'll try again to develop some loads that feed right, using a combo of the Hornady, Redding and the Lee FCD. I think it's obvious that I need to split the operation into more stages -

Not counting the cleaning, tumbling, case length trimming as needed, cleaning up any burrs on case mouth, priming, and powder charge ---

The part involving the dies:

1. sizing - plus probably spent primer removal this stage
2. neck sizing
3. seating
4. crimping

Well, I might as well post photos of my 458 as well...

It looks like you have the scope mounted with plenty of eye relief, unless that shadow is tricking me.

I used to turn my nose up at ARs, then I found out how accurate they are and fun too.

There are several things I haven't been able to adjust my preference to.

One is the adjustable stock. I tried one, and didn't like it. So, I use the fixed stocks - I think they are called A2. I also prefer green and camo.

Another thing is the sling. I still use the more traditional sling and attachment studs. I do use the rubber type wide sling with the grippy material, which stays on my shoulder far better than others. I haven't learned to like the military type slings.

Also, I never like the aspect of the AR having the long magazine. It gets in my way. So, I use the low capacity mags.

I prefer a smooth hand guard, without all the rails, and a low profile gas block without rail. It's a much cleaner look and more fun to grip. All those knobbies just annoy me, and I have no need to be hanging stuff off my rifles other than scope and sling.

Anyway, I like the AR, but still cling to hunting rifle traditional.

The ARs are real fun to shoot, accurate beyond expectations, and I like it that I can keep on target after the first shot, and not break concentration by having to work the bolt. But honestly there has been only one time so far when that came in handy. It was the rare occasion when I shot one hog, DRT, and one or two others hesitated to leave long enough for another quick shot - a twofer.

I like that changing uppers is simple, and cleaning is simple. I like it that I can assemble from parts, especially the upper.

It's only a ten round magazine, lol...

I recently ordered two E-Lander magazines from Brownells listed as holding 15 rounds of 5.56 ammo, for use in my 458 SOCOM. I read that the 20 round mag for 5.56 is supposed to hold 7 rounds of 458 SOCOM. I may order some of those later after I see how these work out.

https://www.brownells.com/aspx...id=222107&pid=118985

Go to the 458SOCOM forum.

The magazines arrived and thy seem to be working. They feed. They hold five cartridges.

Also the Hornady dies arrived a few days ago, so I worked up some loads using the SBR powder, CCI mag large pistol primers and the 300 Barnes TTSX. The dies worked as expected, which is perfectly.

I also ordered the Lee factory crimp die and it also works as expected - perfectly.

So far, so good. It sighted in easily, fed and ejected as it's supposed to do.

I'm going after hogs.

Upon further testing I'm not happy at all with the feeding.

So, I ordered two of these:

https://www.chambertactical.co...g-bore-follower-new/

AR Big Bore Follower for single stack - centered.

The rifle seems accurate enough, and the recoil is not bad at all. It just won't feed right.

Also, I don't like the 1x4 Leupold installed. I'm going to change that for more magnification.

quote:

Originally posted by Magine Enigam:
Upon further testing I'm not happy at all with the feeding.

So, I ordered two of these:

https://www.chambertactical.co...g-bore-follower-new/

AR Big Bore Follower for single stack - centered.

The rifle seems accurate enough, and the recoil is not bad at all. It just won't feed right.

Also, I don't like the 1x4 Leupold installed. I'm going to change that for more magnification.

Have you tried Lancer mags?

quote:

Have you tried Lancer mags?

I tried these:

https://www.brownells.com/maga...7.aspx?sku=100027895

E-LANDER - AR-15 MAGAZINE 5.56MM

I also tried one of these because Brownells recommended it:

D&H INDUSTRIES, INC. - AR-15 12.7x42MM MAGAZINES

https://www.brownells.com/maga...DZZ_450%2bBushmaster

I don't recall who told me to use Lancers, it was either Marty ter Weeme or Ernie Bray. It was good advice, in my rifle they have been flawless. It also helps me differentiate between cartridges. I use Lancers for the 458, Magpuls for 223 and metal PRI mags for the 6.8s. Each type works well with its respective cartridge, and helps prevent embarrassing mixups.

You're right on the lancer magazines. I have not had a failure to feed since I started using them. Lots of fun to shoot this gun at the range. One of my closest shooting friends still won't shoot it. Told him it wouldn't kick as much as a 12 gauge and he still won't shoot it. Be Well. Packy

Okay - which Lancer mag?

I see that they offer several.

Here's an example from Brownells:

https://www.brownells.com/maga..._5xzzx56%2bmm%2bNATO

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The problem seems to be that the rear of the cartridge is still stuck in the magazine lips while the front is jammed at an angle. The cartridge wont release from the magazine to allow it to engage the bolt face.

Sometimes it feeds. When the cartridge aligns it chambers, so I know the ammo fits the chamber.

The good part is that it ejects most of the time - when fired, but it won't eject when manually cycling the whole cartridge.

Before buying another magazine with the same old 223 follower, I'm trying these followers that center the cartridge and elevate the front of the cartridge a little and hopefully allow the cartridge to slip the grip of the lips at just the right time.

I don't want to start bending or grinding on the mag lips. That's a sure way to ruin them, if not successful.

Lancer L5 AWM, they make them in different colors and capacities.

quote:

Lancer L5 AWM

I found these:

https://tromix.com/product/lancer-magazines/

And there are some on ebay, but I'm not sure they are Lancer.

The google search showed several sources, but most were out of stock.

I found some four-round mags in stock:

https://www.ebay.com/p/458-SOC...r-L5-AWM/14023034727

https://shopwilsoncombat.com/A...uctinfo/TR-458LMAG4/

A purchase from Tromix is safer. Tony is one you can have absolute trust in. I enjoy going to his site just to see all he has available. Packy