I've been reading a lot about people neck-sizing only. I don't reload for a lot of calibers, but I full length resize everything. What am I missing out on? Is neck sizing better for my varmint rounds? I was thinking about trying neck-sizing my 223. So, give me the low-down on neck sizing.

You are going to get very adament arguments for both sizing techniques.

I generally do full-length sizing ONLY on new cases before trimming them to the length of the shortest.

After that they are neck-sized only, and only around 1/2 to 2/3 of the neck.

Never had a problem and my accuracy is above average...

I don't know if you're missing out on anything except all that lube inside the neck. If you use the Lee Collet Neck Sizer

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=683388

no lube inside the neck necessary. When the case gets hard to chamber use the Redding Body Die

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=394097

to push the shoulder back.

One thing you might be missing is less runout. With the Full Length Die the expander ball always caused runout before I switched to the collet die.

I full length resize the case before the first round and neck size thereafter. I will check case length everytime to make sure it is within the limit.

The neck needs to be anneal every 6-8 reloads to restore the softness of the brass. This way the brass can be used for a long time. Some of my brass have been relaod almost 20 times.

Neck sizing provides the best accuracy. However, it works for the same gun only. You can't us the resized brass in different firearms.

Have fun and play safe always!

Danny

Neck sized brass tends to be "fatter" in the body of the case
preventing the case from sitting differently in the chamber and if your chamber is concentric to the bore (most good rifles are) then you have a better potential for being accurate.

Basically brass sized just enough to allow it to be chambered will yield more accurate shooting.

I neck size for all my bolt action rifles and only use my Full length sizer on virgin brass and again after several firings.
And I have a seperate FL sizer for each rifle I own in a specific caliber, that way the die FL die can be used to just
barely "bump" the shoulder.

Neck sized brass also stretches less and thus needs to be trimmed less often.

AllanD

quote:

Originally posted by Justin B:
... What am I missing out on? Is neck sizing better for my varmint rounds? ...

Here is what I've found about Neck Sizing:

Neck Sizing (NS)
1.Only reforms the Case Neck and is best used in one specific Chamber.
2.It has some unknown amount of Headspace which varies with each shot until the Bolt will no longer close and then the Shoulder must be “Bumped Backâ€.
3.The CenterLine of the Case and the CenterLine of the chamber are not in alignment, but become closer with each shot until the Bolt will no longer close. On Fixed Ejector rifles, the Case lays on the bottom of the Chamber. On Spring Ejector rifles, the Case is skewed to the opposite side of the Chamber from where the Ejector is pushing against the Case Head.
4.You set the Neck Sizing Die by screwing it in until it Resizes any amount of the Case Neck you desire.
5.You have shorter Case Life than P-FLR, but longer than FLR.
6.Accuracy is generally fine and gets better with each shot "until" the Case Shoulder needs to be "Bumped Back" slightly.
7.You need a Neck Sizing Die and will eventually need a Full Length Resizing Die unless you trash the Cases once they need the Case Shoulder moved back.
8.Intended for use in Bolt Action Rifles.
9.No need to Lube the cases.
10.No need to ever Re-adjust the NS Die Setting.
---

And if you want the Best possible Accuracy then you might want to try:

Partial-Full Length Resizing (P-FLR)
1.Custom fits a Case to a specific Chamber.
2.It has a slight "crush fit" to eliminate all Headspace.
3.The CenterLine of the Case and the CenterLine of the Chamber are forced to be in perfect alignment. The Case is held in Tension between the Bolt Face and Chamber Shoulder, regardless of the Ejector type.
4.You set the FL Die by screwing it in until it is about the thickness of a Nickel above the Shell Holder on a raised Ram. You Lube and Resize a Case, remove the Lube and try it in the Chamber. Lower the FL Die 1/8th turn or so and repeat the process. You might reach a point where you CAN NOT close the Bolt or where it is very difficult to close. Screw the FL Die in 1/16th turn and repeat until the Bolt closes with "snug" resistance. If you go too far, back the FL Die up 1/8th turn and try again on a different Case.
5.You have the longest possible Case Life due to Zero Headspace.
6.Accuracy is generally fine to excellent.
7.You only need a Full Length Resizing Die Set.
8.Intended for use in Bolt Action Rifles and some single shots.
9.You must Lube the cases and then remove it.
10.You may need to Fine Tune the FL Die adjustment the first couple of Reloads.
---

The really nice thing about one Resizing Method "compared to another" is that you can do it for yourself and see what works the best for you. Just make 15-18 cartridges with the same components using Neck Sizing and 15-18 more using a different Resizing Method.

Have a buddy hand them to you without telling you which ones you are shooting and put ALL 15-18 on a single Target. If you pull one, call it and don't count it in the group.

Then shoot the next Target with the other Cartridges and see which way works the best "for you".

Best of luck to you.

For target shooting and best accuracy, NS or P/FL.
For hunting, FL.
This may meet with some discussion but when I am hunting, I will give up that .25" of accuracy for a round that chambers readidly, flawlessly every time.

Thanks for the input, I will continue to full-length or partial full-length resize my hunting rifles. I'm just looking to try different things to see if I can get a slight boost in accuracy. I think I'll try Hot Core's advice first since I have some full-length dies on-hand.

quote:

Originally posted by Justin B:
... I think I'll try Hot Core's advice first since I have some full-length dies on-hand.

Hey Justin, That being the situation, you might also want to try:

Partial-Neck Sizing (with a FL Die) (P-NS w/FL)
1.May or may not reform part of the Case Body depending on how closely the FL Die dimensions match-up with the Chamber dimensions and is best used in one specific Chamber.
2.It has some unknown amount of Headspace which varies with each shot until the Bolt will no longer close and then the Shoulder must be “Bumped Backâ€.
3.The CenterLine of the Case and the CenterLine of the chamber are not in alignment, but become closer with each shot until the Bolt will no longer close. On Fixed Ejector rifles, the Case lays on the bottom of the Chamber. On Spring Ejector rifles, the Case is skewed to the opposite side of the Chamber from where the Ejector is pushing against the Case Head.
4.You set the FL Die by screwing it in until it Resizes approximately 1/2 of the Case Neck or less.
5.You have shorter Case Life than P-FLR, but longer than FLR.
6.Accuracy is generally fine to very good.
7.You only need a Full Length Resizing Die Set.
8.Intended for use in Bolt Action Rifles.
9.You may or may not need to Lube the cases and then remove it.
10.You may need to Fine Tune the FL Die adjustment the first couple of Reloads.

It really depends on your specific Chamber dimensions and Die dimensions if this works well for you. If you go down the Caseneck too far, the FL Die will begin "resizing the Casewall" and that can lengthen the Case(Casehead to Datum point on the Case Shoulder length) to the point that you CAN NOT colose the Bolt on an empty Case. If that happens, you are very close to where you want to be for P-FLRing, so you can save that Case for it.

I know P-FLRing provides the very best accuracy for me, but a lot of people shoot excellent groups with Neck Sizing. Use whatever works the best for you.

I would recommend you go on and Lube the cases before trying this out until you know for sure the Casewalls are not being Resized. Then just the normal Casemouth Lube will suffice.

Best of luck to you.

Hot Core,
Just to be sure that I am clear on your directions (Thanks by the way):
When using a FL die, Partial Neck Sizing involves resizing only about 1/2 of the case neck, While Partial Full Length Resizing will resize most of the neck.

I guess the expander ball being pulled back up through the neck will stretch the P-FLR more than the P-NS procedure?

Hello, I shoot .223 & after I have full sized & shot my new cases I go to neck sizing and always shoot at least a little better groups. Seems quicker to neck size since all I do is lube inside neck but full size have to lube cases.

My last full sized grouped .465 @ 100yds
and same cases but necked sized grouped .451 @ 100yds with a Ruger MkII.

quote:

Originally posted by Trouble:
Hot Core,
Just to be sure that I am clear on your directions (Thanks by the way):
When using a FL die, Partial Neck Sizing involves resizing only about 1/2 of the case neck, While Partial Full Length Resizing will resize most of the neck.

Hey Trouble, In fact, you might want to try just going 1/4 way down the Case Neck if you are trying the NS-w/FL Die. You can always turn it in a bit more if you need to.

The "Trick" is to STOP before the Case Wall begins resizing. Easy to check with a 0.0001" capable Micrometer.

The thing you have to be careful of is if you go too far down the Case Neck it will begin P-FLRing. That forces the Case Wall to a "smaller" diameter which in turn lengthens the Case.

P-FLRing resizes the entire Case neck.

quote:

I guess the expander ball being pulled back up through the neck will stretch the P-FLR more than the P-NS procedure?

It might because it takes more effort to pull it back through. But there are alot of variables that can effect it such as Annealing, Lubing or no Lube, Carbide Expanders vs. Steel Expanders, etc.

As long as you cycle the Resized Empty cases through the rifle " before " loading them, you can determine if enough has been done or if more needs to be done.

It becomes clear as you are doing it and isn't tricky to get set-up in any of the Methods. That is the nicest thing about this aspect of Reloading, all the Methods work and you can pick the one that you like the best.

Best of luck to you.

I set up my FL dies to FL resize. Then, rather than adjusting the die, I put a fender washer on the die between the locking nut and the top of the press for when I want to partial resize. Much less chance of buggering up the little screws.

Thanks Hot Core. I got it now.

If you really want to take Partial Full length sizing to a science get a MO'S gauge for your brass. I think I got mine from OK Weber but I can't find it on their website now. It's a nifty little gauge you put your fire formed brass in to determine your headspace for your chamber. Just PFL size the case back .001 or so should be perfect. About all the guys I know still shooting High Power Rifle Comp are useing them out here with very good results. Good luck

If you're considering PFL sizing I would strongly recommend that you get a set of Redding competition shell holders. You're not really "partial" FL sizing anymore, but you get the same "tailored fit" result.

As for the FL vs. PFL vs. Neck sizing question, this issue has been touched on many times before, and I have to admit that a thread just like this one put me on to my current procedure seveal years ago. It's a little more complicated (actually just one more step), but you can absolutely have the best of all worlds by first sizing the body using a Redding body die and Redding competition shell-holder, then the neck with a Lee collet die. The results are definately worth the extra step!

quote:

Originally posted by belaw:
If you're considering PFL sizing I would strongly recommend that you get a set of Redding competition shell holders. You're not really "partial" FL sizing anymore, but you get the same "tailored fit" result.

As for the FL vs. PFL vs. Neck sizing question, this issue has been touched on many times before, and I have to admit that a thread just like this one put me on to my current procedure seveal years ago. It's a little more complicated (actually just one more step), but you can absolutely have the best of all worlds by first sizing the body using a Redding body die and Redding competition shell-holder, then the neck with a Lee collet die. The results are definately worth the extra step!

Couldn't you accomplish the same thing by using the Redding Type S FL Bushing Die, and save the extra step?

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=708274

For all my rifles I only resize the brass enough just so the bolt will close with the tinest bit of resistance.

quote:

Originally posted by belaw:
by first sizing the body using a Redding body die and Redding competition shell-holder, then the neck with a Lee collet die.

Hey belaw, I switched the order around since this happened

https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tp.../568101304#568101304

quote:

Couldn't you accomplish the same thing by using the Redding Type S FL Bushing Die, and save the extra step?

Maybe. You'd spend about $10.00 more for that one die and bushing than you would for both the Lee Collet Neck Sizer and Redding Body Die. Sometimes you don't have to push the shoulder back and the Lee Collet die gets the job done with no lube at all. I tried a Redding Type S Bushing Neck Sizing Die in 30-06 once. Thought it would be the ticket, but runout was terrible, from .007" to .010". Didn't seem to be any way to adjust it so it sits on my shelf unused. Maybe just a bad die. All the Lee Collet Neck Sizers I have (5 calibers) give less that .002" runout.