O.K., all you olde tyme benchresters and varmint shooters...

Will you PLEASE dig into your forgotten loading notes and see if you can come up with some loading data for the original lot of pre-1962 Hodgdon's Ball C in the .222 Remington? (It was also known as "Hodgdon's Western Ball" powder.) Any bullet make or weight will do.

The one printed load I have found is a max of 26.0 grs with 52/53 gr. bullets. Based on that, it seems the original Ball C was a lot like the current W-844, or maybe even W-846. Anybody know what it really was? (As it was mil-surp from pull-down, it likely WAS either W-844, W-845 or W-846. Would be nice to know...)

Thanks

AC

[ 03-30-2003, 01:39: Message edited by: Alberta Canuck ]

I have a 1958 Lyman cast bullet handbook and it lists one load only for Ball C powder and that is 22grs with their 225438 (45gr) gas checked bullet (no velocity listed). All of the early data and articles I have (prior to 1962) show loads with 2400, 4198, 4227, 3031. This powder hit the market somewhere around 1956-7 and was called Western Ball Powder Type C and was said to give some fine results in cartridges suited for 3031. Hope this helps. I currently use 24.3 grs of BLC2 behind 50-53gr bullets

Canuck,

I bought 50 lbs of that Ball C1 about 1956 or so. The loading data from Hodgdon was wrong and all of the max loads were way too hot. I had a .222 Rem in a 722 and I settled on 23 grs with 50 and 55 gr bullets. I recall being on a farm and firing a shot and the case would not come out of the recessed bolt. I had to hammer the case sideways to get it out.

It did the same thing in the 30/06 with 125's.

I still have some of that junk around and I am glad its almost gone. We went three ways in the club on the 50 lb keg and one of the guys only had a 270. He fired a few shots and asked me to take it back so I ended up with 2/3's of the keg.

That soured me on ball powder. Nothing since has changed my mind.

If what you have burns like what I had then I would use 4198 data.

It does not light well so it's no good for cast bullets either.

Thanks for the info, guys...

What I have is indeed marked Western Ball (Type C) on the original Hodgdon cans it is in. Have about 12-15 lbs...haven't counted then in a few years.

Have it mainly because when IMR 4320 briefly was reported going off the market about 8-10 years ago, a friend dug up a bunch of 4320 for me...and mixed in with those cans were these cans of Western Ball (Type C).

I do know that a lot of benchresters used the original Ball C-(1) successfully, because for numerous years after Ball C-(2) came out there were ads in shooting journals from benchresters wanting to find some more of the first lot (the Ball C-1) for their .222s.

Anyway, there was NO WAY I was going to try to stuff 26 grs. of either lot 1 or lot 2 into a .222 Remington case. I suspect that would be about max or even a tad over in some .223 Remingtons with 53 gr. bullets, let alone a .222...

Thanks again,

AC

[ 04-01-2003, 00:36: Message edited by: Alberta Canuck ]

Here is some .222 Rem data from my Accucron Chrono dated 3-2-69. 23.0 grs Ball C lot #1, 55 gr Hornady SX, 2963 fps, ES 46 fps, Rifle Rem 700 24", case Super X, primer 6 1/2, temp 70F, head expansion .0002" average. The velocity is insrumental at 14'.

The Remington 50 gr factory load made 3083 fps on the same day.

With the 50 gr Sierra Blitz 24.0 grs of Ball C 1 made 3150 fps with an average head expansion of .0001"

I won my class in a bench rest match with that rifle and the Sierra bullet so it shot well. The only thing lacking about the load was long range killing power on woodchucks. I got a few at 295 yards but that was a big stretch.

Savage99

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[B]That soured me on ball powder. Nothing since has changed my mind.

So after you got soured on ball powder, you won a bench rest match with the said powder, and nothing since has changed your mind...

The rifle shot just as well with IMR 4198 but I was stuck with over thirty pounds of it and it was useless in the 06 and 243. I did wear out the previous .222 in a 722 and bought a 700 instead of getting a new barrel.

It's a dirty powder and it's reputation is as low as can be as it was a jammer/looser in Vietnam.

[ 04-01-2003, 21:08: Message edited by: Savage99 ]

Thanks for the data, Savage99. Will give it a try.

BTW, it wasn't Ball C (1) that was a loser in Vietnam; must have been Ball C(2). There was no Western Ball C [Ball C(1)] made in the 60's. The stuff sold by Hodgdon as Western Ball C was pull-down and/or surplus from W.W.II.

The loser in 'Nam is reputed to be a ball powder made by dissolving old stick powder stock, then processing it in what amounts to a low-speed centrifuge and adding other nitro stock and burning stabilizers to get ball powder. However, that reputation may be wrong as well. Winchester was the company that reportedly did that, and when I inquired recently they said they had never heard of ANY company using surplus stick powder as feed-stock for making ball powder.

Anywho & whatever, again thanks for the load data.

AC